House of the Dragon: The Lord of the Tides
October 10, 2022 9:01 AM - Season 1, Episode 8 - Subscribe

Six years later. With the Driftmark succession suddenly critical, Rhaenyra attempts to strike a bargain with Rhaenys.

Best watched with a negroni sbagliato with prosecco in it.
posted by jeoc (31 comments total) 1 user marked this as a favorite
 
This is a show that really loves a dramatic throne room entrance.

Good on Viserys for showing up for the daughter he saddled with all this difficulty. I was wondering if the detante between Alicent and Rhaenyra was real or some kind of game they were playing. I think it was real on some level, but Viserys's confusion about who he was talking to at the end of his life will probably negate that.

Alicent's kids are the worst. Just real shitheads. Do we think they killed/poisoned the serving girl that Aegon raped? Or just gave her the afternoon off?

It was nice to see that Daemon's daughters seemed generally pleased about marrying Rhaenyra's sons.
posted by jeoc at 9:07 AM on October 10, 2022 [2 favorites]


The special effects this week were astonishing. When Viserys took off his gold mask and you could see his jaw moving through the hole in his face when he spoke - gruesome. The beheading scene was cool too. Did he really think he'd walk out of there alive after he said that?

I think they poisoned the servant girl, in the guise of giving her the 'morning after' drink.

For me this was back to form, and with two episodes left, now that Viserys is dead it's all going to kick off. After last week's disappointing, hard-to-see episode, I enjoyed this one very much. But where was Larys Strong in all the scheming and plotting that was going on?

Also, this remains the Best Theme Music Ever, although, unlike my previous (placid) cat, my current (psycho) cat will not allow me to hold him in my lap and use his paws to conduct the music.
posted by essexjan at 9:28 AM on October 10, 2022 [3 favorites]


This episode was mostly better than most of the others. But Daemon chopping that dude's head in half and everyone just goes to dinner after like it's no big deal? Come on people.

The minimizing of Ser Cole continues. Is he even still part of the King's Guard? The only time we saw him was when he was training the one-eyed Targaryen (Aemond?). Larys also notably absent.

Was it just me, or did the new actors playing the Strong Brothers look much younger than the new actors playing the Targaryen Brats? Especially the younger one -- kid looks barely older than the previous actor.

Trying to decide on a new nickname for Viserys, which is better: King Phantom of the Opera, or King Harvey Dent?
posted by Saxon Kane at 10:00 AM on October 10, 2022 [4 favorites]


Alicent's kids are the worst. Just real shitheads. Do we think they killed/poisoned the serving girl that Aegon raped? Or just gave her the afternoon off?

I think they poisoned the servant girl, in the guise of giving her the 'morning after' drink.

I think Alicent let her go, but both the actress who played the servant girl and Olivia Cooke really made that scene work. I was holding my breath waiting for Alicent to something terrible the whole time.

So many affecting moments: Viserys struggling to walk to the throne, Daemon helping him gently, Alicent taking Rhaenyra's arm at the dinner and asking her to stay, and Rhaenyra promising to return- I liked this episode a lot! Also Aemond and Daemon with their mutual "I see you" moments.

God's bless him, Viserys really did try this time, but it's too little too late for this family.
posted by ishmael at 11:48 AM on October 10, 2022 [3 favorites]


Alicent: How can you keep carrying on like this, especially on a day like today?

Aegon: Why? What is it today?

Ron Howard: If Aegon had checked his calendar he would have thought twice about asking his mother that on Slapping Day.

[Alicent slaps the taste out of Aegon’s mouth.]

Ron Howard: But he hadn’t.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 11:59 AM on October 10, 2022 [10 favorites]


Also, Viserys in his gold mask makes for a fun nod to his eponymous however-many-times-great grandson.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 12:01 PM on October 10, 2022 [11 favorites]


I was surprised by how badass a moment they made what is essentially a frail man walking to his seat.
posted by yonega at 1:49 PM on October 10, 2022 [7 favorites]


Also, Viserys in his gold mask makes for a fun nod to his eponymous however-many-times-great grandson.

I wondered if we'd see what was underneath, but of course, Checkhov's Mask did indeed fall.
posted by entropone at 3:11 PM on October 10, 2022 [1 favorite]


This episode was much less terrible than the last one. It was... fine? I didn't hate it.

But JFC the time jumps are ridiculous. I'm a book reader, and I can barely follow what's happening to whom. Who are all these new actors? Why does Aemond look so much older than his mother? Aemond looks 30 now and his nephews look like they're still in high school? While Daemon, Criston Cole and Otto Hightower still look like they haven't aged a day. And new Aegon looks completely different from old Aegon, while also looking like the same age as the last actor? You can really tell that Nina Gold, the genius casting director who worked on Got (and Rome, among other shows) did not work on HOTD. The casting is an absolute mess.

As I said for Episode 7, the show is dedicated to a GOT s8 style speedrun, and ignoring all the plot holes brought up in the last episode. For example: where the hell did Laenor's dragon Seasmoke go? Is Seasmoke ever going to be mentioned again, or will he drop into the Plot Abyss along with Laenor?

Also re: the death of Vaemond, I think this post on Tumblr raises a good point:

And you know, the thing with making the Velaryons Black is now the optics are loaded when nothing is being done about them, as in, a Black man is trying to keep his family name from being colonized and appropriated by an entitled white woman and her family and gets murdered for it and we’re just … not doing anything about that.

My favorite ASOIAF blogger Dwellordream's thoughts are here. I did like the attempt at rapprochement between Rhaenyra and Alicent, and Paddy Considine and Olivia Cooke were amazing, and a shout out to Eve Best too. They really elevate the material.

I just do not understand the pointless rush. It's like the showrunners don't have faith that their material will hold people's interest unless they have some boffo set piece every five minutes.
posted by suburbanbeatnik at 3:17 PM on October 10, 2022 [9 favorites]


"That really was a Hattori Hanzo sword"
posted by lalochezia at 4:52 PM on October 10, 2022 [16 favorites]


I actually really like that time is moving a long at a rapid pace in this show and we're not dealing with some glacially slow pacing.
posted by yonega at 5:48 PM on October 10, 2022 [2 favorites]


suburbanbeatnik: That's a really good point about the racial optics. #Westerossowhite

lalochezia: *chef's kiss*
posted by Saxon Kane at 5:56 PM on October 10, 2022


I think they poisoned the servant girl, in the guise of giving her the 'morning after' drink.
I very much agree - was even foreshadowed episodes ago, with the warning that it had to be brewed special-like or it could be deadly.

Why does Aemond look so much older than his mother? Aemond looks 30 now and his nephews look like they're still in high school? While Daemon, Criston Cole and Otto Hightower still look like they haven't aged a day. And new Aegon looks completely different from old Aegon, while also looking like the same age as the last actor?

I've managed most of the other changes just fine, but I found this all so very disorienting. Especially as new-Aemond looks older than Aegon, his older brother, whilst also looking like Ramsey Bolton.

Trying to decide on a new nickname for Viserys, which is better: King Phantom of the Opera, or King Harvey Dent?
Doesn't really matter now, though, seeing he's breathed his last.

I must admit to some amusement at the realisation that the upcoming Epic Clusterfuck is ultimately triggered by poor Viserys fucking up, again, right at the end.
posted by coriolisdave at 5:58 PM on October 10, 2022 [5 favorites]


coriolisdave: But they will sing the songs of Old King Two-Face for generations to come!

Oh and yeah, all the aged-up boys looked way off from their purported age ranges, particularly when compared to Cole, Daemon, Otto, Larys, older Alicent and Older Rhaenyra not aging at all. Hell, even the head of the Kingsguard hasn't aged at all, and he was already bald, white-haired, and wrinkly in the first episode which is, what, 16 years ago?

Can't really tell regarding the casting of the older princesses (Daemon's kids) because I think they've had about 8 minutes of screen time all season.
posted by Saxon Kane at 6:17 PM on October 10, 2022 [2 favorites]


and I can barely follow what's happening to whom. Who are all these new actors?

Pity those of us with face blindness. A dozen or fifteen characters, pretty much all speaking in the same accent and register, played by mostly unfamiliar, constantly recast performers, with people given hairstyles and costuming in their various families to resemble one another as much as possible.

I enjoyed this episode but the very first thing I did after watching it was to read a recap of it so I know what the hell happened in the episode I just saw.

I am glad Aemond the Dickhead lost an eye last episode because at least I can tell him from his brother now.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:18 PM on October 10, 2022 [8 favorites]


I think they poisoned the servant girl, in the guise of giving her the 'morning after' drink.

When Alicent gave her the bag of money for her trouble, I thought "how is the girl going to explain that to her family" and then they brought the drink and I thought "yeah, I don't think that is going to be a problem." I wonder how many girls they've handed that same bag of money to?
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 8:32 PM on October 10, 2022 [3 favorites]


The thing with the Velaryons is that there's more than one of them, they have unique and differing motivations, right? Corlys views the name as worthy, in of itself, and that maintaining the fiction that his grandsons are of his blood is more important because the history books won't report otherwise unless they break that pretense. The granddaughters gravitated towards their cousins ever since Viserys' son stole their mother's dragon and beat all four of them in the sand. So they seem happy with the betrothal. At least their children will carry actual Velaryon blood, so Driftmark would drift back, eventually.

Which isn't to say that Vaemond isn't absolutely right. I think the post-episode is also right, though: he's one of those truth-speakers that isn't particularly likable, and thus has suffered lack of success until this fateful opportunity- which he then lost by the throne's diktat. But by speaking the truth about royal scions, like Ned Stark, he failed the game of thrones and then suffered the same greatest loss of all.
posted by Apocryphon at 9:47 PM on October 10, 2022 [2 favorites]


The servant girl was dead as soon as Alicent said "I know you won't."

Later when another servant girl asked after her, in response she got a hug that looked like an "oh dearie, haven't you heard?" kind of hug.
posted by whuppy at 11:19 AM on October 11, 2022 [1 favorite]


The servant girl was dead as soon as Alicent said "I know you won't."

Later when another servant girl asked after her, in response she got a hug that looked like an "oh dearie, haven't you heard?" kind of hug.


I would not be surprised to discover she is dead, but it's kept ambiguous. Unfortunately, this is another plot thread the show will probably end up dropping.
posted by suburbanbeatnik at 11:31 AM on October 11, 2022 [3 favorites]


She moved to Essos to work as a maid for Laenor and Qarl.
posted by Gary at 2:51 PM on October 11, 2022 [5 favorites]


I’ve watched the last two episodes without benefit of subtitles. Even cranking the volume I can’t make out several whispered lines per episode—am I supposed to be able to understand what they’re saying?

Also, who was the girl going to visit Daemon’s old girlfriend near the end of the episode?
posted by skewed at 8:05 PM on October 11, 2022 [1 favorite]


You're not alone - I can't watch it without subtitles at all.

That girl was one of the Queen's serving lasses, has been seen pottering about in the background when secret chats are being had
posted by coriolisdave at 8:18 PM on October 11, 2022 [3 favorites]


Laenor and Qarl

Man I hope that's an intentional pun and they're working at the Essos Wildfire Plant
posted by Apocryphon at 10:29 AM on October 12, 2022 [7 favorites]


Just a few random things...

They must have a hell of a candle budget, but couldn't they steal the lenses Kubrick used in "Barry Lyndon" so we could see things?

Could HBO have some way to use alt subtitles as footnotes to explain who some of these folks are?

Slightly off topic, but Direct TV sucks. I can watch high def, which has an OK picture (too much compression) but they somehow skip every other caption, or I can watch in SD, lower picture quality but complete captions. Argh.
posted by Marky at 5:03 PM on October 12, 2022 [2 favorites]


Could HBO have some way to use alt subtitles as footnotes to explain who some of these folks are?

This is something Prime Video does well (in browser, at least) - when you pause it they display charactor and actors names, and sometimes loredrops*.



* this was especially useful when watching Wheel of Time

posted by coriolisdave at 5:12 PM on October 12, 2022 [1 favorite]



Man I hope that's an intentional pun and they're working at the Essos Wildfire Plant


*DIES*
posted by lalochezia at 5:07 AM on October 14, 2022


Man I hope that's an intentional pun

Laenor = white black
Qarl = black white
posted by Saxon Kane at 7:52 AM on October 14, 2022


Next season they will be replaced by Ser Bertram and Lord Ernst
posted by Saxon Kane at 7:53 AM on October 14, 2022 [1 favorite]


They already mentioned Grover Tully, who has grandson Elmo, and great-grandchildren Kermit and Oscar.
posted by Gary at 3:03 PM on October 14, 2022 [1 favorite]


Similar to the issues with overly dark scenes in modern tv, the quality of audio mixing is usually very poor these days too so I usually watch shows with subtitles so I know what is being said. I’m not sure how I’d have kept track of all the characters if I wasn’t reading their names too, it helps it all sink in more.

That servant girl is 100% dead, hence the consoling hug given to the other one that asked her whereabouts.

I though it was a nice touch having a seemingly genuine rapprochement between Alicent and Rhaenyra before Viserys’s confused ramblings at his end quietly tore it all apart again. To be blunt, the story needed that extra layer of tragedy to give it a bit more interest I think.
posted by chill at 12:00 AM on October 17, 2022


I was surprised by how badass a moment they made what is essentially a frail man walking to his seat.
I think there could be a half length edit of this episode which just edited out Viserys painfully getting about. I'm not saying it would be better.

At this stage the attention to textural elements like costume and choreography, seem to be the parts of the show that are done most fastidiously. I'd be tempted to hand the overall direction of the show to these people and see where it went. (but not the wig people).
posted by rongorongo at 4:27 AM on October 28, 2022


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