Ahsoka: Dreams and Madness
September 27, 2023 2:38 AM - Season 1, Episode 7 - Subscribe
Hera must face the New Republic, while in a galaxy far, far away a reunion takes place.
I'm pretty much convinced now that this show is in fact an extended trailer for Unannounced Thrawn Project*.
There is one episode left and the pacing remains weiiiiirdly slow and it continues to studiously refuse to answer so many critical questions. "What will become of Hera's career?" was maybe at the bottom of that list.
I mean, look, I'm enjoying it and I'm glad it was made and all of that. And it's not like I expect tight pacing and a reliable balance of tension/catharsis, because Star Wars so seldom does. My issue is this: if I'm right and these 8 episodes really are all about ginning us up for some other thing, then this show's gonna feel so disposable on rewatch.
(* = Unless there WAS such an announcement and it somehow missed all of my channels of information?! …If not, I'm wagering it's coming very soon, maybe before the finale.)
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 4:48 AM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
There is one episode left and the pacing remains weiiiiirdly slow and it continues to studiously refuse to answer so many critical questions. "What will become of Hera's career?" was maybe at the bottom of that list.
I mean, look, I'm enjoying it and I'm glad it was made and all of that. And it's not like I expect tight pacing and a reliable balance of tension/catharsis, because Star Wars so seldom does. My issue is this: if I'm right and these 8 episodes really are all about ginning us up for some other thing, then this show's gonna feel so disposable on rewatch.
(* = Unless there WAS such an announcement and it somehow missed all of my channels of information?! …If not, I'm wagering it's coming very soon, maybe before the finale.)
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 4:48 AM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
That was fun! I liked the Noti's tortoise-vehicles.
Nitpick: if she was following a training routine from Anakin, shouldn't it just have been with one lightsaber?
There's a lot left to wrap up for one episode, so I guess a lot of it is just going to get unresolved. I hope we find out what Baylan Skoll was after and it doesn't just end with him walking into yet another ancient ruinded temple.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 5:40 AM on September 27, 2023
Nitpick: if she was following a training routine from Anakin, shouldn't it just have been with one lightsaber?
There's a lot left to wrap up for one episode, so I guess a lot of it is just going to get unresolved. I hope we find out what Baylan Skoll was after and it doesn't just end with him walking into yet another ancient ruinded temple.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 5:40 AM on September 27, 2023
Sabine uses the Force to keep her wings sharp and her smoky eye on point. Not so much as a smudge!
I am preemptively annoyed that the show clearly has zero intention of tying up any of its loose threads. They couldn't have known what would happen to Ray Stevenson but he's just so wasted here. Who knew a dude that big could have such balletic grace? We're not going to learn what it is that's calling him and what he's planning to do. He's the standout character of the show and they're giving us so little.
The Ezra and Sabine banter and silliness during the fight was perfectly fine but a lot better in the animated show. She finally blew somebody up! I was starting to get worried.
posted by orrnyereg at 5:46 AM on September 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
I am preemptively annoyed that the show clearly has zero intention of tying up any of its loose threads. They couldn't have known what would happen to Ray Stevenson but he's just so wasted here. Who knew a dude that big could have such balletic grace? We're not going to learn what it is that's calling him and what he's planning to do. He's the standout character of the show and they're giving us so little.
The Ezra and Sabine banter and silliness during the fight was perfectly fine but a lot better in the animated show. She finally blew somebody up! I was starting to get worried.
posted by orrnyereg at 5:46 AM on September 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
Also, what are we meant to infer from the episode title? What dreams, whose madness?
posted by orrnyereg at 5:50 AM on September 27, 2023
posted by orrnyereg at 5:50 AM on September 27, 2023
The trial mentions Gideon's attack on Mandalore, so this puts the timeline past the end of season 3 of The Mandalorian.
Also, what are we meant to infer from the episode title? What dreams, whose madness?
I think this is a reference to a phrase Baylan used before they traveled to the new galaxy and he saw all the witchcraft, space whales, etc. for himself. I'd have to go back and watch to be sure. So now he is in the midst of the dreams and madness and some of it seems to be calling him deeper to ... something?
posted by mikepop at 6:36 AM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
Also, what are we meant to infer from the episode title? What dreams, whose madness?
I think this is a reference to a phrase Baylan used before they traveled to the new galaxy and he saw all the witchcraft, space whales, etc. for himself. I'd have to go back and watch to be sure. So now he is in the midst of the dreams and madness and some of it seems to be calling him deeper to ... something?
posted by mikepop at 6:36 AM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
I’ll say that some aspects of the New Republic are really confusing to me. Does the chancellor chair every court-martial? Or only for high-ranking officers? And is the defense council not answerable to the chancellor? What the hell is going on there?
This is one of those Catch-22 things, it's not clear how this oversight committee is working, but we really don't want to waste too much time to have it explained either. As far as I can gather, this is essentially some kind of executive oversight committee that operates adjacent to the defense council. I don't think this was supposed to be a court martial, either, but a court martial referral would come out of it but for a certain Senator Organa.
I'm pretty much convinced now that this show is in fact an extended trailer for Unannounced Thrawn Project*.
It was announced! There's going to be an Heir to the Empire (title?) film that wraps up all the Thrawn stuff. What hasn't been announced, or at least not clearly, how many seasons of X shows might take place before that concluding movie. Carson Teva chiming in about Mandalore from Season 3 was 100% intended to make sure folks understood these threads are all connected. I think a grand plan fell apart when Rangers of the New Republic was cancelled and Filoni and Favreau were left scrambling to insert bits and pieces (mainly into Mando Season 3). I think Mando Season 3 is going to be considered a prelude, Ahsoka chapter 1, and then well, something something movie.
Nitpick: if she was following a training routine from Anakin, shouldn't it just have been with one lightsaber?
Anakin oversaw her transition from one lightsaber to two pretty early in the Clone Wars. I honestly can't remember if the transition was really commented upon in the tv show or not. Essentially, his training wasn't about a specific style of lightsaber fighting so much as preparing her for eventualities and hardening her mentally to deal with what she might have to face. In Tales of the Jedi, which are a series of fantastic animated shorts, there's a scene where Ahsoka is in the temple demonstrating her skills to Kenobi, Yoda, and others, looking like a true boss, deflecting and slicing remote droids like no one's business. After she finishes everyone is like, "Wow," except Anakin who's just, "Yeah, this isn't how the real world works, we need to practice with Clones."
I am preemptively annoyed that the show clearly has zero intention of tying up any of its loose threads. They couldn't have known what would happen to Ray Stevenson but he's just so wasted here. Who knew a dude that big could have such balletic grace? We're not going to learn what it is that's calling him and what he's planning to do.
I'm expecting a lengthy final episode that will probably break down everything regarding Baylan. There's going to be a two prong finale here: 1) Thrawn leaving and the heroes trying to stop him and/or catch a ride with him back to their galaxy and 2) Baylan's adventures into madness and dreams. I may be writing with a lot of expectation and optimism here, but it seems like Baylan's journey from the character's own perspective is coming to a definitive end one way or the other. I also agree, the tease of what he's been angling for has been a little frustrating and undermines the stakes a little as we come up on the finale. We know he's got plans, big enough that he's basically told his padawan "see ya later kid" but that's it. I think we would've benefited from a few more crumbs.
Overall, I really enjoyed the episode. Eman Esfandi IS Ezra Bridger, oh my gosh, it's like someone worked some Night Sister dark magick and made the animated character come to life. It's clear Esfandi put in his homework on how to recreate the character and his ability to use the Force when push came to literal shove, was pretty amazing. Especially when he was handling Shin, well, bare handedly. It's clear that Ezra has graduated to the level of Jedi Knight since we last saw him, perhaps because being marooned in a distant galaxy allows one to focus inward on their constant ally, the Force.
I appreciated the confirmation that Sabine thought Ahsoka was dead, which to me was a major element of her decision to give up the map to Baylan back in episode 4. I also continue to love Sabine using her beskar armor defensively against Shin's lightsaber, it's just a cool ass move.
The episode ended like Thrawn had purposefully taken actions to guide Ahsoka away from Chimera and his own plans and forced her into actions that ate up her ability to have time to stop him. I don't think that line was drawn as clearly as it could've been, but I appreciate seeing an effort to start pulling into view the strategist mentality. Also, I guess his forces weren't going to shoot down Shin if Baylan wasn't present? Wasn't that the original command? Wipe out all the Force users? I was 100% ready to see an Order 66 turn around on Shin that never happened.
Also, what are we meant to infer from the episode title? What dreams, whose madness?
Yah. Not super clear. Obviously, perhaps dreams might be Sabine and Ezra being reunited, an expectation of going home/being rescued...and madness? Maybe whatever is driving Baylan, but we weren't given that info. Hrm.
posted by Atreides at 6:47 AM on September 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
This is one of those Catch-22 things, it's not clear how this oversight committee is working, but we really don't want to waste too much time to have it explained either. As far as I can gather, this is essentially some kind of executive oversight committee that operates adjacent to the defense council. I don't think this was supposed to be a court martial, either, but a court martial referral would come out of it but for a certain Senator Organa.
I'm pretty much convinced now that this show is in fact an extended trailer for Unannounced Thrawn Project*.
It was announced! There's going to be an Heir to the Empire (title?) film that wraps up all the Thrawn stuff. What hasn't been announced, or at least not clearly, how many seasons of X shows might take place before that concluding movie. Carson Teva chiming in about Mandalore from Season 3 was 100% intended to make sure folks understood these threads are all connected. I think a grand plan fell apart when Rangers of the New Republic was cancelled and Filoni and Favreau were left scrambling to insert bits and pieces (mainly into Mando Season 3). I think Mando Season 3 is going to be considered a prelude, Ahsoka chapter 1, and then well, something something movie.
Nitpick: if she was following a training routine from Anakin, shouldn't it just have been with one lightsaber?
Anakin oversaw her transition from one lightsaber to two pretty early in the Clone Wars. I honestly can't remember if the transition was really commented upon in the tv show or not. Essentially, his training wasn't about a specific style of lightsaber fighting so much as preparing her for eventualities and hardening her mentally to deal with what she might have to face. In Tales of the Jedi, which are a series of fantastic animated shorts, there's a scene where Ahsoka is in the temple demonstrating her skills to Kenobi, Yoda, and others, looking like a true boss, deflecting and slicing remote droids like no one's business. After she finishes everyone is like, "Wow," except Anakin who's just, "Yeah, this isn't how the real world works, we need to practice with Clones."
I am preemptively annoyed that the show clearly has zero intention of tying up any of its loose threads. They couldn't have known what would happen to Ray Stevenson but he's just so wasted here. Who knew a dude that big could have such balletic grace? We're not going to learn what it is that's calling him and what he's planning to do.
I'm expecting a lengthy final episode that will probably break down everything regarding Baylan. There's going to be a two prong finale here: 1) Thrawn leaving and the heroes trying to stop him and/or catch a ride with him back to their galaxy and 2) Baylan's adventures into madness and dreams. I may be writing with a lot of expectation and optimism here, but it seems like Baylan's journey from the character's own perspective is coming to a definitive end one way or the other. I also agree, the tease of what he's been angling for has been a little frustrating and undermines the stakes a little as we come up on the finale. We know he's got plans, big enough that he's basically told his padawan "see ya later kid" but that's it. I think we would've benefited from a few more crumbs.
Overall, I really enjoyed the episode. Eman Esfandi IS Ezra Bridger, oh my gosh, it's like someone worked some Night Sister dark magick and made the animated character come to life. It's clear Esfandi put in his homework on how to recreate the character and his ability to use the Force when push came to literal shove, was pretty amazing. Especially when he was handling Shin, well, bare handedly. It's clear that Ezra has graduated to the level of Jedi Knight since we last saw him, perhaps because being marooned in a distant galaxy allows one to focus inward on their constant ally, the Force.
I appreciated the confirmation that Sabine thought Ahsoka was dead, which to me was a major element of her decision to give up the map to Baylan back in episode 4. I also continue to love Sabine using her beskar armor defensively against Shin's lightsaber, it's just a cool ass move.
The episode ended like Thrawn had purposefully taken actions to guide Ahsoka away from Chimera and his own plans and forced her into actions that ate up her ability to have time to stop him. I don't think that line was drawn as clearly as it could've been, but I appreciate seeing an effort to start pulling into view the strategist mentality. Also, I guess his forces weren't going to shoot down Shin if Baylan wasn't present? Wasn't that the original command? Wipe out all the Force users? I was 100% ready to see an Order 66 turn around on Shin that never happened.
Also, what are we meant to infer from the episode title? What dreams, whose madness?
Yah. Not super clear. Obviously, perhaps dreams might be Sabine and Ezra being reunited, an expectation of going home/being rescued...and madness? Maybe whatever is driving Baylan, but we weren't given that info. Hrm.
posted by Atreides at 6:47 AM on September 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
orrnyereg: They couldn't have known what would happen to Ray Stevenson but he's just so wasted here
The scene where Ahsoka tries to connect with Shin felt like a reshoot to me. I suspect that the original idea was to have Shin die and Baylan Skoll continue as a character into whatever comes next, but Stevenson’s passing meant they had to rejig the ending.
posted by Kattullus at 7:50 AM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
The scene where Ahsoka tries to connect with Shin felt like a reshoot to me. I suspect that the original idea was to have Shin die and Baylan Skoll continue as a character into whatever comes next, but Stevenson’s passing meant they had to rejig the ending.
posted by Kattullus at 7:50 AM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
That would make Stevenson's "Go do something great for the new Empire, kid!" comment kind of a weird send off though.
I don't think it's impossible to run with the presumption that Stevenson's character was just going to run the length of the season. There's been a growing sense of inevitableness with Baylan that he is moving toward some fateful event or act. He's reminiscing about the past, providing his padawan one last lesson, and so on. This is a character that I think does not expect to be alive for much longer, which in a way, makes it hit harder given Stevenson's passing.
posted by Atreides at 10:13 AM on September 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
I don't think it's impossible to run with the presumption that Stevenson's character was just going to run the length of the season. There's been a growing sense of inevitableness with Baylan that he is moving toward some fateful event or act. He's reminiscing about the past, providing his padawan one last lesson, and so on. This is a character that I think does not expect to be alive for much longer, which in a way, makes it hit harder given Stevenson's passing.
posted by Atreides at 10:13 AM on September 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
Yeah, until that scene between Ahsoka and Shin I thought that was the deal too, but something about how it’s shot, with no shot of them together on screen, except for those really strange shots across Ahsoka’s shoulder, which look like she’s being played by a stand-in, makes it feel like a reshoot. I suspect other scenes have been altered to change her and her master’s story.
All that said, it’s just speculation, a feeling based on that one scene.
posted by Kattullus at 10:36 AM on September 27, 2023
All that said, it’s just speculation, a feeling based on that one scene.
posted by Kattullus at 10:36 AM on September 27, 2023
Trusting your feelings in Star Wars? Is that a thing?
(Definitely be worth tracking what info they release to see if this was a reshoot. It's also possible that it 100% is a reshoot, but not connected to Stevenson's passing, too.)
posted by Atreides at 11:20 AM on September 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
(Definitely be worth tracking what info they release to see if this was a reshoot. It's also possible that it 100% is a reshoot, but not connected to Stevenson's passing, too.)
posted by Atreides at 11:20 AM on September 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Also, I love how Thrawn just takes these losses and pretends they’re victories, and everyone around him believes him
I hadn't thought of it that way, but it's a bit like Marco Inaros in The Expanse, though with far more class and style... he does seem to roll with things intelligently not emotionally, recalculating how to regain tactical advantage. Plays the OODA game well.
posted by kokaku at 12:47 PM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
I hadn't thought of it that way, but it's a bit like Marco Inaros in The Expanse, though with far more class and style... he does seem to roll with things intelligently not emotionally, recalculating how to regain tactical advantage. Plays the OODA game well.
posted by kokaku at 12:47 PM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
Does the chancellor chair every court-martial? Or only for high-ranking officers? And is the defense council not answerable to the chancellor? What the hell is going on there?
I paused the court-martial scene at the end to look up Paul Sun-Hyung Lee's age. 1972, and sure enough he saw Star Wars in the theater at age 5. Because I don't know why Carson Teva would be the only pilot sitting in the gallery. I don't know why you would need to send C-3PO to personally deliver that message. But I do know Carson did look very happy to be talking to C-3PO.
posted by Gary at 3:01 PM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
I paused the court-martial scene at the end to look up Paul Sun-Hyung Lee's age. 1972, and sure enough he saw Star Wars in the theater at age 5. Because I don't know why Carson Teva would be the only pilot sitting in the gallery. I don't know why you would need to send C-3PO to personally deliver that message. But I do know Carson did look very happy to be talking to C-3PO.
posted by Gary at 3:01 PM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
Does the chancellor chair every court-martial? Or only for high-ranking officers?
It's not a court-martial. This is clear when, at one point, Senator Shitsticks does the "AHA! SHE MUST BE COURT MARTIALLED" bit.
There is one episode left and the pacing remains weiiiiirdly slow and it continues to studiously refuse to answer so many critical questions. "What will become of Hera's career?" was maybe at the bottom of that list.
... if I'm right and these 8 episodes really are all about ginning us up for some other thing, then this show's gonna feel so disposable on rewatch.
Yeah, this and Mando and most everything else set post-ROTJ is all a lead in to Filoni's Thrawn movie. The point of the Hera scene was not "but her career" but rather to underline how ill-prepared the New Republic is to fight this emerging threat - through lack of preparation, by being undermined by Imperial sympathizers,etc.
posted by coriolisdave at 4:02 PM on September 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
It's not a court-martial. This is clear when, at one point, Senator Shitsticks does the "AHA! SHE MUST BE COURT MARTIALLED" bit.
There is one episode left and the pacing remains weiiiiirdly slow and it continues to studiously refuse to answer so many critical questions. "What will become of Hera's career?" was maybe at the bottom of that list.
... if I'm right and these 8 episodes really are all about ginning us up for some other thing, then this show's gonna feel so disposable on rewatch.
Yeah, this and Mando and most everything else set post-ROTJ is all a lead in to Filoni's Thrawn movie. The point of the Hera scene was not "but her career" but rather to underline how ill-prepared the New Republic is to fight this emerging threat - through lack of preparation, by being undermined by Imperial sympathizers,etc.
posted by coriolisdave at 4:02 PM on September 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
And, as much as people get down on how much all the post-RoTJ / pre-TFA stories are pointless because "somehow Palpatine returns" makes all the drama about the New Republic ... pointless? No!
Damnit, I will gladly watch hours of stories about how the rebellion wasn't prepared to win, wasn't prepared to take over responsibility, has to deal with the mess the Empire left behind, has to deal with Imperial sympathizers, you name it. I _loooooooved_ those episodes in Mando S3 where they were showing us Dr. Pershing and Kane and the hulks of ISDs. It's all the stuff I wanted out of the latter Matrix movies that I didn't get, the nitty gritty about establishing a new political body and everything that goes on with it.
posted by Kyol at 6:35 PM on September 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
Damnit, I will gladly watch hours of stories about how the rebellion wasn't prepared to win, wasn't prepared to take over responsibility, has to deal with the mess the Empire left behind, has to deal with Imperial sympathizers, you name it. I _loooooooved_ those episodes in Mando S3 where they were showing us Dr. Pershing and Kane and the hulks of ISDs. It's all the stuff I wanted out of the latter Matrix movies that I didn't get, the nitty gritty about establishing a new political body and everything that goes on with it.
posted by Kyol at 6:35 PM on September 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
I guess I'm the voice of "but muh canon novels" but I'm so curious if Filoni considers Claudia Gray's truly excellent Bloodline canon he'll use. It would be super interesting to get some of that plot into the theoretical Thrawn movie too. It also engages with the machinations of the imperial remnant faction...I guess if they do that they've got to give a real actor the job of playing Leia though, which might be too tall an order. Threepio did a great job as a Leia surrogate in this but I don't think he could keep it up.
Then again I don't think Filoni is actually capable of cramming that much story into a feature length film so maybe I hope he doesn't even try.
I feel like I should have enjoyed this episode more than I did. It felt very disjointed to me - like there was a lot to like but it didn't hang together, and the whole time I was thinking, oh man, there's just one episode left. Honestly watching this in the wake of Andor makes it so much harder to enjoy - we know how devastating and subtle Genevieve O'Reilly can be playing this exact same character but this show gives her so much less to do. Her performance in this episode felt wooden by comparison.
The New Republic is such a joke. Like the dog that caught the mailman.
posted by potrzebie at 7:50 PM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
Then again I don't think Filoni is actually capable of cramming that much story into a feature length film so maybe I hope he doesn't even try.
I feel like I should have enjoyed this episode more than I did. It felt very disjointed to me - like there was a lot to like but it didn't hang together, and the whole time I was thinking, oh man, there's just one episode left. Honestly watching this in the wake of Andor makes it so much harder to enjoy - we know how devastating and subtle Genevieve O'Reilly can be playing this exact same character but this show gives her so much less to do. Her performance in this episode felt wooden by comparison.
The New Republic is such a joke. Like the dog that caught the mailman.
posted by potrzebie at 7:50 PM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
thrawn said in the previous episode that he was sending the jedi after bridger as a distraction, to make them use up time while loading the cargo. His main goal has pretty clearly been to get whatever that is back to the other galaxy. I never saw him as someone who made it up as he went along, and am surprised by that interpretation. I've always seen him as "evil sherlock holmes" - but then, I suppose many people have interpreted sherlock as a bumbling fool who aggrandizes his accomplishments. Eh, I'm more in the mood for smart villains than evil villains. It's not so fun to watch egomaniacs these days.
posted by rebent at 9:49 PM on September 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by rebent at 9:49 PM on September 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
I never saw him as someone who made it up as he went along, and am surprised by that interpretation
Yeah, I agree - I think what it is is that he is playing strategy with layers of tactical success built in.
His ultimate goal is to get back home with his belly full of undead stormtroopers and something something evil.
To do that he needed to ensure his escape - killing Soka and the others would've been icing on the cake, but ultimately delaying them is sufficient.
posted by coriolisdave at 9:56 PM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I agree - I think what it is is that he is playing strategy with layers of tactical success built in.
His ultimate goal is to get back home with his belly full of undead stormtroopers and something something evil.
To do that he needed to ensure his escape - killing Soka and the others would've been icing on the cake, but ultimately delaying them is sufficient.
posted by coriolisdave at 9:56 PM on September 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
Yeah, Thrawn is pretty clearly a dude who just always has plans B, C, and D in his back pocket plus half a dozen "break glass in case of emergency" contingency possibilities just in case. He never tells anyone what the plans are so he can be like "ah yes, my plan, worked out impeccable as usual" without disclosing that he got to plan D before everything fell into place. But the plans are all Plans - he's never improvising. That's how the Jedi ever get the drop on him, they're consistently able to do stuff he couldn't have anticipated.
Is this vaunted cargo some or all of whatever it is Baylan thinks he's seeking on Peridea? I'm just picturing him getting to some ancient temple and the weird spheres he has to manipulate to activate the doomsday device are all in Thrawn's trunk as he speeds away
posted by potrzebie at 11:14 PM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
Is this vaunted cargo some or all of whatever it is Baylan thinks he's seeking on Peridea? I'm just picturing him getting to some ancient temple and the weird spheres he has to manipulate to activate the doomsday device are all in Thrawn's trunk as he speeds away
posted by potrzebie at 11:14 PM on September 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
I paused the court-martial scene at the end to look up Paul Sun-Hyung Lee's age. 1972, and sure enough he saw Star Wars in the theater at age 5. Because I don't know why Carson Teva would be the only pilot sitting in the gallery. I don't know why you would need to send C-3PO to personally deliver that message. But I do know Carson did look very happy to be talking to C-3PO.
Paul is the stand in for every Star Wars fan. It's been awesome seeing him get to play Carson and get bigger opportunities as that character. I think him holding back Chopper in this episode may now be one of my favorite Carson moments, tbh.
I guess I'm the voice of "but muh canon novels" but I'm so curious if Filoni considers Claudia Gray's truly excellent Bloodline canon he'll use. It would be super interesting to get some of that plot into the theoretical Thrawn movie too. It also engages with the machinations of the imperial remnant faction.
Chronologically, we're about ten to fifteen years (I think?) away from the events of Bloodline (which is one of Claudia's best Star Wars books - HUTTSLAYER [spray paints on side of van]). If I could snap a finger and make a wish happen, I'd definitely want Tony Gilroy to adapt it, based on how well Andor's first season went and its New Republic politics. Incidentally, I think when it comes to books we're technically in a gray area. We had Wendig's Aftermath Trilogy and Freed's Alphabet Squadron Trilogy, as the two biggest installments and then whooosh....not much until the pre-TFA stuff (like Bloodline, which ironically was written ahead of TLJ - supposedly Rian Johnson exchanged notes with Claudia on aspects of pre-TFA New Republic).
However it is, they are going to need to recast Leia because it was one thing to recreate Peter Cushing 30 years after his death, it'd be another to recreate Carrie Fisher (again x2 - it was nice that Billie Lourde played her mother, but just recast Lucasfilm!). Truly, all the original heroes should just be recast if we're going to create more stories based on this era that are of a vein that they would naturally be involved in.
Is this vaunted cargo some or all of whatever it is Baylan thinks he's seeking on Peridea? I'm just picturing him getting to some ancient temple and the weird spheres he has to manipulate to activate the doomsday device are all in Thrawn's trunk as he speeds away
I think the best bet is that the cargo are basically Dathomiri dead or something that the Mothers are going to resurrect to restart their empire in another galaxy with...but it would be kind of funny if Baylan is left patting down his pockets and cussing.
posted by Atreides at 6:35 AM on September 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
Paul is the stand in for every Star Wars fan. It's been awesome seeing him get to play Carson and get bigger opportunities as that character. I think him holding back Chopper in this episode may now be one of my favorite Carson moments, tbh.
I guess I'm the voice of "but muh canon novels" but I'm so curious if Filoni considers Claudia Gray's truly excellent Bloodline canon he'll use. It would be super interesting to get some of that plot into the theoretical Thrawn movie too. It also engages with the machinations of the imperial remnant faction.
Chronologically, we're about ten to fifteen years (I think?) away from the events of Bloodline (which is one of Claudia's best Star Wars books - HUTTSLAYER [spray paints on side of van]). If I could snap a finger and make a wish happen, I'd definitely want Tony Gilroy to adapt it, based on how well Andor's first season went and its New Republic politics. Incidentally, I think when it comes to books we're technically in a gray area. We had Wendig's Aftermath Trilogy and Freed's Alphabet Squadron Trilogy, as the two biggest installments and then whooosh....not much until the pre-TFA stuff (like Bloodline, which ironically was written ahead of TLJ - supposedly Rian Johnson exchanged notes with Claudia on aspects of pre-TFA New Republic).
However it is, they are going to need to recast Leia because it was one thing to recreate Peter Cushing 30 years after his death, it'd be another to recreate Carrie Fisher (again x2 - it was nice that Billie Lourde played her mother, but just recast Lucasfilm!). Truly, all the original heroes should just be recast if we're going to create more stories based on this era that are of a vein that they would naturally be involved in.
Is this vaunted cargo some or all of whatever it is Baylan thinks he's seeking on Peridea? I'm just picturing him getting to some ancient temple and the weird spheres he has to manipulate to activate the doomsday device are all in Thrawn's trunk as he speeds away
I think the best bet is that the cargo are basically Dathomiri dead or something that the Mothers are going to resurrect to restart their empire in another galaxy with...but it would be kind of funny if Baylan is left patting down his pockets and cussing.
posted by Atreides at 6:35 AM on September 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
I think him holding back Chopper in this episode may now be one of my favorite Carson moments, tbh.
If we get to the end of this and Chopper hasn't straight-up murdered anyone/thing, I'm going to be quite disappointed.
posted by mikelieman at 1:55 PM on September 28, 2023 [8 favorites]
If we get to the end of this and Chopper hasn't straight-up murdered anyone/thing, I'm going to be quite disappointed.
posted by mikelieman at 1:55 PM on September 28, 2023 [8 favorites]
I had kinda figured that Baylan's endgame was to gain access to the time-traveling / life-beyond-death World Beyond Worlds, and that Ezra was his ticket, but after this episode, not so sure.
I really like adult Ezra. He's a fantastic mix of weird castaway, serene Jedi, and the animated kid we remember. kudos to Eman Esfandi.
posted by Sauce Trough at 4:16 PM on September 28, 2023 [6 favorites]
I really like adult Ezra. He's a fantastic mix of weird castaway, serene Jedi, and the animated kid we remember. kudos to Eman Esfandi.
posted by Sauce Trough at 4:16 PM on September 28, 2023 [6 favorites]
Esfandi is really nailing Ezra's vocal mannerisms, it's very impressive.
posted by suelac at 4:23 PM on September 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by suelac at 4:23 PM on September 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
Finally Sabine tossed a bomb!
And for Ray Stevens: 13! 13! 13!
posted by oldnumberseven at 7:46 PM on September 29, 2023
And for Ray Stevens: 13! 13! 13!
posted by oldnumberseven at 7:46 PM on September 29, 2023
However it is, they are going to need to recast Leia because it
Millie Bobby Brown. Come on.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:22 PM on October 2, 2023 [6 favorites]
Millie Bobby Brown. Come on.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:22 PM on October 2, 2023 [6 favorites]
I think him holding back Chopper in this episode may now be one of my favorite Carson moments, tbh.
We really should thank him for preventing war crimes that day.
Millie Bobby Brown. Come on.
You know, I actually really like this idea. She looks similar enough to young Carrie Fisher, and she certainly can act. I'm onboard.
posted by Fleebnork at 9:59 AM on October 3, 2023 [2 favorites]
We really should thank him for preventing war crimes that day.
Millie Bobby Brown. Come on.
You know, I actually really like this idea. She looks similar enough to young Carrie Fisher, and she certainly can act. I'm onboard.
posted by Fleebnork at 9:59 AM on October 3, 2023 [2 favorites]
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I’ll say that some aspects of the New Republic are really confusing to me. Does the chancellor chair every court-martial? Or only for high-ranking officers? And is the defense council not answerable to the chancellor? What the hell is going on there?
But yes, these last couple of episodes have really hit for me. I care about the characters and I understand the stakes, and I’m not just watching because I’ve got nothing better to watch, which is kinda how I got through the first episodes.
Also, I love how Thrawn just takes these losses and pretends they’re victories, and everyone around him believes him. History is full of people like him. Heck, the present too, and the show really demonstrates what a catastrophe that kind of behavior is.
posted by Kattullus at 4:43 AM on September 27, 2023 [6 favorites]