Mr. Robot: eps1.9_zer0-day.avi
September 2, 2015 9:26 PM - Season 1, Episode 10 - Subscribe
Another huge discovery for Elliot surrounding his family and fsociety, Tyrell's world starts to close around him and Angela has a rather unexpected visitor.
And we're back for the finale after waiting a week due to a real life tragedy. Lots of TV critics said on twitter following the decision to delay that the delay was the right move and now having seen it too... They were absolutely right to wait a week. The scene was earned in the context of the show but outside it... They were right.
As for the show itself: Those maniacs! They blew it up! They blew it all up!
And we're back for the finale after waiting a week due to a real life tragedy. Lots of TV critics said on twitter following the decision to delay that the delay was the right move and now having seen it too... They were absolutely right to wait a week. The scene was earned in the context of the show but outside it... They were right.
As for the show itself: Those maniacs! They blew it up! They blew it all up!
That finale was certainly ambitious. I'm really interested in where they go from here. It's exciting but disconcerting that they can really go any number of ways because I can't predict it and it could be very easy to misstep in the next season. Still I really enjoyed the whole thing from start to finish, I keep telling everyone "it's on USA and it's ACTUALLY A GOOD SHOW" in disbelief. Watching a night with Royal Pains following Mr. Robot might actually be great.
posted by crashlanding at 9:43 PM on September 2, 2015
posted by crashlanding at 9:43 PM on September 2, 2015
I was wondering that too about the Ashley Madison bit. Very topical!
I thought this was a little anticlimactic for a season finale, not really addressing several threads I thought would be addressed. The Times Square bit sort of had me thinking he might be in a Matrix-style virtual reality or something, and the scene with Tyrell's wife again gave me the suspicion that Elliot and Tyrell are the same person. I like some ambiguity in my entertainment, but this seems a little like it just ended in the middle.
Fortunately there is a second season coming...
posted by whir at 9:46 PM on September 2, 2015 [3 favorites]
I thought this was a little anticlimactic for a season finale, not really addressing several threads I thought would be addressed. The Times Square bit sort of had me thinking he might be in a Matrix-style virtual reality or something, and the scene with Tyrell's wife again gave me the suspicion that Elliot and Tyrell are the same person. I like some ambiguity in my entertainment, but this seems a little like it just ended in the middle.
Fortunately there is a second season coming...
posted by whir at 9:46 PM on September 2, 2015 [3 favorites]
The stinger makes me incredibly hopeful we will see plenty more of Whiterose next season. Given what we were shown that makes an already fascinating character seem much more important than I would've thought from what we got before now... But also what a great role that is likely to be for BD Wong.
Also, we have an answer to the Ashley Madison question. Sepinwall's review is up (he really liked it). But he also did an nice interview with Sam Esmail. Esmail says the line was in the original script, he cut it as being "too much," and then the news happened so back in it went.
"it's on USA and it's ACTUALLY A GOOD SHOW"
As an enormous fan of Hannibal, I know this feeling. It was a constant refrain particularly in that show's first season. "YES, I KNOW WHAT THE PREMISE LOOKS LIKE ON PAPER AND IT'S ON NB-fucking-C, JUST WATCH IT."
posted by sparkletone at 9:50 PM on September 2, 2015 [6 favorites]
Also, we have an answer to the Ashley Madison question. Sepinwall's review is up (he really liked it). But he also did an nice interview with Sam Esmail. Esmail says the line was in the original script, he cut it as being "too much," and then the news happened so back in it went.
"it's on USA and it's ACTUALLY A GOOD SHOW"
As an enormous fan of Hannibal, I know this feeling. It was a constant refrain particularly in that show's first season. "YES, I KNOW WHAT THE PREMISE LOOKS LIKE ON PAPER AND IT'S ON NB-fucking-C, JUST WATCH IT."
posted by sparkletone at 9:50 PM on September 2, 2015 [6 favorites]
The harpist was playing "Nearer, My God, to Thee", the song they played as the Titanic sank, and as featured in Ted Turner's end of the world video for CNN.
posted by Small Dollar at 10:36 PM on September 2, 2015 [15 favorites]
posted by Small Dollar at 10:36 PM on September 2, 2015 [15 favorites]
Was there a memo in Showrunner Monthly telling everybody to add a stinger this season? Ahhhhhh!! Killing me!!!
posted by pearlybob at 4:31 AM on September 3, 2015
posted by pearlybob at 4:31 AM on September 3, 2015
Michael Christopher seems to have a lock on the plutocratic-CEO-pulling-society's-strings roles. His part as the man at the top of E(vil) Corp closely matches his role as the head of the fictional U.S. intelligence branch that was the setting of the sadly neglected AMC drama "Rubicon" of a few years ago.
As far as finales go, I was a little disappointed. The utter disappearance of Tyrrel makes for an interesting lead into next season, but at the cost of some satisfaction this season. I did like the way Elliot's delusions are becoming evident to others.
All in all, a terrific show, tech carping aside. I'm particularly glad I got to see it from its first air date, rather than coming to it in progress. Makes me feel culturally relevant again.
posted by hwestiii at 4:42 AM on September 3, 2015
As far as finales go, I was a little disappointed. The utter disappearance of Tyrrel makes for an interesting lead into next season, but at the cost of some satisfaction this season. I did like the way Elliot's delusions are becoming evident to others.
All in all, a terrific show, tech carping aside. I'm particularly glad I got to see it from its first air date, rather than coming to it in progress. Makes me feel culturally relevant again.
posted by hwestiii at 4:42 AM on September 3, 2015
I love the songs chosen for this show. Sound & Color is one of my most frequently played songs, but that scene just gave it a whole new perspective.
posted by numaner at 6:01 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by numaner at 6:01 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
Almost forgot, any show that can legitimately work in Jim Carroll Band's "People Who Died" can count me as a fan.
posted by hwestiii at 6:20 AM on September 3, 2015 [13 favorites]
posted by hwestiii at 6:20 AM on September 3, 2015 [13 favorites]
As far as finales go, I was a little disappointed.
I think if the show hadn't been insta-picked up for a second season before it even aired, I'd have been very annoyed at least. In fact, if the show had been on the bubble and ended up not getting renewed, I think it would've nearly tanked the season for me.
As is, I'm........ Willing to allow this. Making that your finale before you're sure you've got a second season coming takes some serious balls though. It's an unusual choice and not entirely unexpected given things Esmail's said about how this season was basically a lot of exposition and backstory and the ~real Mr. Robot~ plot kicks in starting now. But man, this could've gone really wrong if the show wasn't getting such great support from USA.
posted by sparkletone at 6:42 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think if the show hadn't been insta-picked up for a second season before it even aired, I'd have been very annoyed at least. In fact, if the show had been on the bubble and ended up not getting renewed, I think it would've nearly tanked the season for me.
As is, I'm........ Willing to allow this. Making that your finale before you're sure you've got a second season coming takes some serious balls though. It's an unusual choice and not entirely unexpected given things Esmail's said about how this season was basically a lot of exposition and backstory and the ~real Mr. Robot~ plot kicks in starting now. But man, this could've gone really wrong if the show wasn't getting such great support from USA.
posted by sparkletone at 6:42 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
So how did y'all read that scene with Mrs. Wellick? I found it intensely creepy, and intense in a number of other ways too. Her demeanor... I could see reading it in a way that provides evidence to the handful of people I've seen theorizing that Tyrell is another side of Elliot. I still really, really don't buy that. My guess as the episode started properly after the title card was that he was dead in some messily public way and Elliot was going to be left trying next season to figure out what happened... Though I will say it took quite a ways into the stinger for me to be sure that it wasn't Elliot who'd gotten out of the limo at the Diogenes Club/Illuminati Dinner Party or whatever the hell that was.
But I think Lady Macbeth here has definitely seen/talked to Elliot before. I think she was taking Elliot's confusion due to memory loss as him trying to fish her for info the same way she was doing to him.
posted by sparkletone at 6:48 AM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
But I think Lady Macbeth here has definitely seen/talked to Elliot before. I think she was taking Elliot's confusion due to memory loss as him trying to fish her for info the same way she was doing to him.
posted by sparkletone at 6:48 AM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
Earlier in the episdoe, Elliot went to Evil Corp and talked to Tyrell's assistant. She didn't recognize him. Everyone at AllSafe knows both Tyrell and Elliot. They're not the same person.
Either she saw Elliot/Mr Robot with Tyrell during this last blackout (she said she last saw her husband three days ago) or she already knows something about him from Tyrell's previous meetings with Mr Robot.
posted by cnelson at 7:12 AM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Either she saw Elliot/Mr Robot with Tyrell during this last blackout (she said she last saw her husband three days ago) or she already knows something about him from Tyrell's previous meetings with Mr Robot.
posted by cnelson at 7:12 AM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Todd VanDerWerff also has an interview with Sam Esmail up.
posted by sparkletone at 7:39 AM on September 3, 2015
posted by sparkletone at 7:39 AM on September 3, 2015
I really enjoyed this show. To my mind, it takes its place alongside War Games and Sneakers in the pantheon of "hacker movies that don't make cringe". My only reservation is, in general, I tend to dislike the "unreliable narrator" device. It's barely a step above "it was all a dream". Fortunately, this show has enough going for it, I'm hoping I can continue to overlook this weakness. But I really dislike the idea of Mr. Robot being a schizophrenia hallucination or whatever. I mean, presuming the show gets renewed for another season, are we gonna be treated to a season of Elliot Tyler Durdening it up, throwing himself against walls and shit? Ugh, so not enthused about that.
posted by panama joe at 7:45 AM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by panama joe at 7:45 AM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
Liked but did not love this episode. The might have cleared up SOMETHING. This is also the first episode I watched on TV with commercials so that might have had something to do with it.
Tyrell was the man in the mask this time, right?
posted by shothotbot at 9:05 AM on September 3, 2015
Tyrell was the man in the mask this time, right?
posted by shothotbot at 9:05 AM on September 3, 2015
Is Tyrell's baby the one who will go on to found the Tyrell Corporation?
posted by shothotbot at 9:06 AM on September 3, 2015 [9 favorites]
posted by shothotbot at 9:06 AM on September 3, 2015 [9 favorites]
Tyrell was the man in the mask this time, right?
I don't have the episode handy, but I thought that was Elliot. The eyes looked Rami Malek's. But also since Elliot's now accepted the existence of this other side of himself as not being as separate from him as he thought, instead of seeing Christian Slater in the mask he finally sees himself.
posted by sparkletone at 9:31 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't have the episode handy, but I thought that was Elliot. The eyes looked Rami Malek's. But also since Elliot's now accepted the existence of this other side of himself as not being as separate from him as he thought, instead of seeing Christian Slater in the mask he finally sees himself.
posted by sparkletone at 9:31 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
I started off the episode certain that Elliot and Tyrell were separate people, but doubted heavily after the scene with lady Macbeth -- had to rewatch. But deeper analysis of the relationship of Elliot and Tyrell to Allsafe leads me to believe that Gideon has interacted with each character on their own terms and in their own spaces so the 2 cannot be one. Also Elliot would not have had to fake his way into steel mountain if he were Tyrell.
I think this series is made to be rewatched. Perhaps there is a scene in an earlier episode, maybe even the first, where Elliot is interrupted by a knock at the door, and everything we've seen thereafter is fever dream of a disillusioned hacker who never leaves his chair.
So who's at the door?
Darlene, returning with Elliot's meds?
Angela, coming to enlist Elliot to take down the cabal?
Elliot's mom?
Lenny?
Christa, the shrink, alerted by Lenny that the feds are looking into him?
We should let the dust settle and then do a second round of fanfare as a rewatch to pick up on the clues these past few episodes have dropped for us.
posted by OHenryPacey at 10:01 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think this series is made to be rewatched. Perhaps there is a scene in an earlier episode, maybe even the first, where Elliot is interrupted by a knock at the door, and everything we've seen thereafter is fever dream of a disillusioned hacker who never leaves his chair.
So who's at the door?
Darlene, returning with Elliot's meds?
Angela, coming to enlist Elliot to take down the cabal?
Elliot's mom?
Lenny?
Christa, the shrink, alerted by Lenny that the feds are looking into him?
We should let the dust settle and then do a second round of fanfare as a rewatch to pick up on the clues these past few episodes have dropped for us.
posted by OHenryPacey at 10:01 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
Boardwalk Fail (good on them making the video a real thing, down to the URL and user name; though it looks like the "posted" date is "1 month ago").
posted by filthy light thief at 10:25 AM on September 3, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by filthy light thief at 10:25 AM on September 3, 2015 [7 favorites]
I honestly thought the man in the mask this time was Tyrell. His speech cadence seemed to match Tyrell's, and it would explain why Elliot could watch the video in Times Square and have no memory of recording it/be livecasting it himself.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 10:34 AM on September 3, 2015
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 10:34 AM on September 3, 2015
have no memory of recording it
Why would Tyrell want to get in on fsociety in this particular manner? The simplest explanation Mr. Robot persona recorded it during the blackout period. Elliot's just not seeing Christian Slater in that scene because he's understanding that it's been him in the videos before now.
posted by sparkletone at 10:51 AM on September 3, 2015
Why would Tyrell want to get in on fsociety in this particular manner? The simplest explanation Mr. Robot persona recorded it during the blackout period. Elliot's just not seeing Christian Slater in that scene because he's understanding that it's been him in the videos before now.
posted by sparkletone at 10:51 AM on September 3, 2015
AV Club review is up. The writer mentions that since they didn't write about the pilot or second episode they'll be revisiting those at some point soon.
posted by sparkletone at 10:55 AM on September 3, 2015
posted by sparkletone at 10:55 AM on September 3, 2015
I noticed that a news report in the background of one of the scenes described fsociety's hack as having encrypted E-corp's data (with AES-256). This got me thinking — why would a hack that is supposed to destroy data replace it with encrypted data rather than just overwriting it with random data?
Sure, it could be explained away as something like the data storage was designed to be encrypted so the the hack just arranged for storage/backup keys to be destroyed rather than actually overwriting the data. However, a more interesting possibility occurred to me. Deploying encryption maliciously is a feature of ransomware, which encrypts a victim's data and then demands money in return for the decryption key. This suggests the possibility that someone holds a decryption key for E-corp's data. I wonder if this might be White Rose?
posted by RichardP at 11:49 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
Sure, it could be explained away as something like the data storage was designed to be encrypted so the the hack just arranged for storage/backup keys to be destroyed rather than actually overwriting the data. However, a more interesting possibility occurred to me. Deploying encryption maliciously is a feature of ransomware, which encrypts a victim's data and then demands money in return for the decryption key. This suggests the possibility that someone holds a decryption key for E-corp's data. I wonder if this might be White Rose?
posted by RichardP at 11:49 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
I wonder if this might be White Rose?
My money's on Wellick. What was the course of events from last episode? His wife expresses her, er, disappointment with him, he goes to Elliot, who reveals the fsociety plan to him, and then we jump to the beginning of this episode where Elliot comes to in Wellick's car. Somehow Wellick adapted the fsociety plan to hold the data hostage in order to get back in with Evil Corp and therefore his wife.
posted by axiom at 12:33 PM on September 3, 2015 [5 favorites]
My money's on Wellick. What was the course of events from last episode? His wife expresses her, er, disappointment with him, he goes to Elliot, who reveals the fsociety plan to him, and then we jump to the beginning of this episode where Elliot comes to in Wellick's car. Somehow Wellick adapted the fsociety plan to hold the data hostage in order to get back in with Evil Corp and therefore his wife.
posted by axiom at 12:33 PM on September 3, 2015 [5 favorites]
But I think Lady Macbeth here has definitely seen/talked to Elliot before. I think she was taking Elliot's confusion due to memory loss as him trying to fish her for info the same way she was doing to him.
Tyrell was working with "Mr Robot." There was that scene in Tyrell's car, when Tyrell basically blackmailed Mr Robot into continuing to work with him. So I think that Joanna recognized "Mr Robot" when Elliot showed up, and was wondering if Mr Robot had killed Tyrell or gotten him killed. Elliot was also afraid that Mr Robot had "disappeared" Tyrell, so imo that would even be a petty sensible theory for Joanna to have.
I think Elliot was right that she was fishing for something -- I think she was fishing for clues as to what "Mr Robot" wanted, so that she could use that knowledge into manipulating him into giving her back Tyrell.
My theory as to the connection between Elliot and Tyrell is that (very early on in the series) Mr Robot and Tyrell banded together to take out E Corp's CTO. Mr Robot wanted revenge on him for the business decision that had led to Elliot's father getting leukemia, and Tyrell wanted him ousted so that he could take his job -- so their interests were basically aligned.
It looked like Tyrell in the fsociety mask to me, but I couldn't really tell. Those eyes were creepy as hell, though. Utterly insane. (The reason I don't *think* it was Elliot was because I think RM's eyes are more almond-shaped than were the eyes of the person behind the mask, and because the way the masked person spoke didn't have Elliot's cadence. But like I said, it was hard to tell).
Deploying encryption maliciously is a feature of ransomware, which encrypts a victim's data and then demands money in return for the decryption key. This suggests the possibility that someone holds a decryption key for E-corp's data. I wonder if this might be White Rose?
I think it might have been Darlene? She's the one who supposedly did the encryption, and I think she's also working *some* kind of angle that hasn't been revealed yet. I don't think this is her end game.
Was the party that Darlene was organizing maybe a diversion for something else? Were *all* the riots/celebrations or even the economic meltdowns just a diversion for something else?
I have no doubt that Elliot really genuinely cares about changing the economic system. Trenton seems to genuinely care about it, too. It seems like the rest of fsociety is at least interested in the idea and want to be ~revolutionaries~, and don't really have ulterior motives beyond that. But Darlene is more mysterious imo. When she wanted to go ahead with the Steel Mountain hack even though the Dark Army had pulled out and the data wouldn't really be lost, it got me wondering about what her goals actually were. Darlene isn't stupid, and even though she can be sort of impulsive, she actually seems more driven and mission-oriented than any of the rest of them. I find it hard to believe that she'd have been so desperate and thoughtless as to go through with that futile hack just out of impulse. She must have had *some* kind of agenda or plan that the Steel Mountain hack was a part of, but that she couldn't reveal to the rest of fsociety.
When Angela was getting suspicious of why Darlene was suddenly all up in Elliot's life now, even though they apparently hadn't ever been close, that also made me wonder about Darlene's motives. If Elliot's unraveling started when Darlene came into town, then does that mean that it was Darlene who was the driving force behind him (them?) starting fsociety in the first place?
I mean, I think she genuinely cares about Elliot, but I also think that she ultimately cared more about the hack going through than about his well-being. When she found him basically psychotic in Jersey and took him back to his apartment, it seemed to me like she was just trying to patch him up in order to keep him on board with the hack, rather than really try to get him straightened out. It seemed to me like she was more-or-less practicing field medicine, especially since she kept pressuring him to stay involved in the hack regardless. She responded to him the same way even in this episode, when they were wiping everything back at the arcade. It's clear he's really unwell, he's been missing and he looks horrible, but she didn't seem especially interested in any of that or to be worrying about him at the party. She also reacted similarly to his whole drug withdrawal thing, imo -- I find it hard to believe that Romero would have been so much more aware of Elliot's drug addiction or that he was showing up strung out than Darlene was, but as long as the mission kept going, what else was going on with her brother just didn't seem that important to her. Likewise, she didn't really get involved with whatever was going on with Shayla. I do think she cares about her brother, but I think that her priority is her mission, and what she ultimately cares about when it comes to Elliot is his usefulness to her mission. And I'm not sure that her mission is the same as fsociety's mission.
Her connection with Cisco and The Dark Army (and that malware CD that Cisco gave to Ollie) is mysterious, too. She's fsociety's main connection to Whiterose. Also, what was with her assignation with that rich guy who she stole the gun from? They didn't seem like they were dating or anything, imo, but it did seem like he knew her well. It seemed to me like they were old friends? And she was vague and slippery when Trenton was asking her about why she was involved in this whole hack. Then she was vague and slippery again when fsociety was asking her what she thought would come after the hack.
There's just something fishy about her imo.
posted by rue72 at 12:45 PM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Tyrell was working with "Mr Robot." There was that scene in Tyrell's car, when Tyrell basically blackmailed Mr Robot into continuing to work with him. So I think that Joanna recognized "Mr Robot" when Elliot showed up, and was wondering if Mr Robot had killed Tyrell or gotten him killed. Elliot was also afraid that Mr Robot had "disappeared" Tyrell, so imo that would even be a petty sensible theory for Joanna to have.
I think Elliot was right that she was fishing for something -- I think she was fishing for clues as to what "Mr Robot" wanted, so that she could use that knowledge into manipulating him into giving her back Tyrell.
My theory as to the connection between Elliot and Tyrell is that (very early on in the series) Mr Robot and Tyrell banded together to take out E Corp's CTO. Mr Robot wanted revenge on him for the business decision that had led to Elliot's father getting leukemia, and Tyrell wanted him ousted so that he could take his job -- so their interests were basically aligned.
It looked like Tyrell in the fsociety mask to me, but I couldn't really tell. Those eyes were creepy as hell, though. Utterly insane. (The reason I don't *think* it was Elliot was because I think RM's eyes are more almond-shaped than were the eyes of the person behind the mask, and because the way the masked person spoke didn't have Elliot's cadence. But like I said, it was hard to tell).
Deploying encryption maliciously is a feature of ransomware, which encrypts a victim's data and then demands money in return for the decryption key. This suggests the possibility that someone holds a decryption key for E-corp's data. I wonder if this might be White Rose?
I think it might have been Darlene? She's the one who supposedly did the encryption, and I think she's also working *some* kind of angle that hasn't been revealed yet. I don't think this is her end game.
Was the party that Darlene was organizing maybe a diversion for something else? Were *all* the riots/celebrations or even the economic meltdowns just a diversion for something else?
I have no doubt that Elliot really genuinely cares about changing the economic system. Trenton seems to genuinely care about it, too. It seems like the rest of fsociety is at least interested in the idea and want to be ~revolutionaries~, and don't really have ulterior motives beyond that. But Darlene is more mysterious imo. When she wanted to go ahead with the Steel Mountain hack even though the Dark Army had pulled out and the data wouldn't really be lost, it got me wondering about what her goals actually were. Darlene isn't stupid, and even though she can be sort of impulsive, she actually seems more driven and mission-oriented than any of the rest of them. I find it hard to believe that she'd have been so desperate and thoughtless as to go through with that futile hack just out of impulse. She must have had *some* kind of agenda or plan that the Steel Mountain hack was a part of, but that she couldn't reveal to the rest of fsociety.
When Angela was getting suspicious of why Darlene was suddenly all up in Elliot's life now, even though they apparently hadn't ever been close, that also made me wonder about Darlene's motives. If Elliot's unraveling started when Darlene came into town, then does that mean that it was Darlene who was the driving force behind him (them?) starting fsociety in the first place?
I mean, I think she genuinely cares about Elliot, but I also think that she ultimately cared more about the hack going through than about his well-being. When she found him basically psychotic in Jersey and took him back to his apartment, it seemed to me like she was just trying to patch him up in order to keep him on board with the hack, rather than really try to get him straightened out. It seemed to me like she was more-or-less practicing field medicine, especially since she kept pressuring him to stay involved in the hack regardless. She responded to him the same way even in this episode, when they were wiping everything back at the arcade. It's clear he's really unwell, he's been missing and he looks horrible, but she didn't seem especially interested in any of that or to be worrying about him at the party. She also reacted similarly to his whole drug withdrawal thing, imo -- I find it hard to believe that Romero would have been so much more aware of Elliot's drug addiction or that he was showing up strung out than Darlene was, but as long as the mission kept going, what else was going on with her brother just didn't seem that important to her. Likewise, she didn't really get involved with whatever was going on with Shayla. I do think she cares about her brother, but I think that her priority is her mission, and what she ultimately cares about when it comes to Elliot is his usefulness to her mission. And I'm not sure that her mission is the same as fsociety's mission.
Her connection with Cisco and The Dark Army (and that malware CD that Cisco gave to Ollie) is mysterious, too. She's fsociety's main connection to Whiterose. Also, what was with her assignation with that rich guy who she stole the gun from? They didn't seem like they were dating or anything, imo, but it did seem like he knew her well. It seemed to me like they were old friends? And she was vague and slippery when Trenton was asking her about why she was involved in this whole hack. Then she was vague and slippery again when fsociety was asking her what she thought would come after the hack.
There's just something fishy about her imo.
posted by rue72 at 12:45 PM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Let's also remember that in a past ep Darlene donned the fsociety mask and did a broadcast while Elliot was working the hack on Gideon's phone, so it wouldn't be that unusual for Wellick to don the fsociety mask on Elliot's behalf.
rue72: My theory as to the connection between Elliot and Tyrell is that (very early on in the series) Mr Robot and Tyrell banded together to take out E Corp's CTO. Mr Robot wanted revenge on him for the business decision that had led to Elliot's father getting leukemia, and Tyrell wanted him ousted so that he could take his job -- so their interests were basically aligned.
Yep, that was pretty much my theory after watching Episode 8, which I posted about here.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 1:35 PM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
rue72: My theory as to the connection between Elliot and Tyrell is that (very early on in the series) Mr Robot and Tyrell banded together to take out E Corp's CTO. Mr Robot wanted revenge on him for the business decision that had led to Elliot's father getting leukemia, and Tyrell wanted him ousted so that he could take his job -- so their interests were basically aligned.
Yep, that was pretty much my theory after watching Episode 8, which I posted about here.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 1:35 PM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Two things keep really bugging me about this episode:
posted by iamkimiam at 1:36 PM on September 3, 2015 [4 favorites]
- When Elliot and Joanna meet on the street in front of her house, I'm convinced she already knows him. Her "Can I help you?" is too familiar, too perky. She also knows he's not ok/normal ("did he seem strange to you, last time you saw him?"), she's adjusting, and she's trying to find out which version of Elliot she's talking to ("What did you say your name was?"). When she says something in Swedish to him, and he (somewhat unconvincingly, imho) says "I don't understand what you're saying", her reaction is just priceless. She almost rolls her eyes as she kisses her baby's head. Gosh I wish I knew what she said.
- Why are there no pictures of Elliot's sister alongside his not-real family? And why does his mom look pregnant? There is just no way Darlene is ~8 years younger than him.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:36 PM on September 3, 2015 [4 favorites]
Also, in episode 8, Tyrell told Joanna that he'd had his eyes opened to the true power available to him by looking up, not ahead, and referenced a small-time hacker he'd met already (Elliot), which is when she asked "Oh, and what's above us?"
"God," blurts out Tyrell, tears in his eyes (see Filthy Light Thief's comment):
It's interesting to see Elliot and Tyrell face (personal) world-shaking events at the same time. We know Elliot is delusional, but Tyrell is really crazy (remember the bit where he told his wife they were looking in the wrong direction when plotting their ascent of the corporate latter, and he pretty much called Elliot god?).
So really, I have zero doubt that Wellick could be behind that fsociety mask. I'd have to see significant evidence to convince me it's anyone BUT Wellick, actually.
One other thought: Joanna Wellick's large eyes, artificially plumped lips, overcoat and "pick up the baby and hold him between myself and my interrogator" move instantly reminded me of how predators and prey interact in the wild. When hunted by a larger predator, many marine animals artificially inflate their size or put physical barriers between themselves and danger. She telegraphs her role very well, and I admire the shorthand of communication the show's accomplished with minimal dialogue written for her character.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 1:42 PM on September 3, 2015
"God," blurts out Tyrell, tears in his eyes (see Filthy Light Thief's comment):
It's interesting to see Elliot and Tyrell face (personal) world-shaking events at the same time. We know Elliot is delusional, but Tyrell is really crazy (remember the bit where he told his wife they were looking in the wrong direction when plotting their ascent of the corporate latter, and he pretty much called Elliot god?).
So really, I have zero doubt that Wellick could be behind that fsociety mask. I'd have to see significant evidence to convince me it's anyone BUT Wellick, actually.
One other thought: Joanna Wellick's large eyes, artificially plumped lips, overcoat and "pick up the baby and hold him between myself and my interrogator" move instantly reminded me of how predators and prey interact in the wild. When hunted by a larger predator, many marine animals artificially inflate their size or put physical barriers between themselves and danger. She telegraphs her role very well, and I admire the shorthand of communication the show's accomplished with minimal dialogue written for her character.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 1:42 PM on September 3, 2015
Also, I absolutely, completely and positively Do Not Buy that Angela would work at E Corp. She wouldn't do it on principle. When you're that pissed off, and you've had a lifetime of misery at the hands of another, being offered a lavish gift from them would be an absolute dream … so you can turn around and say FUCK YOU and stomp on their charity. It's the stuff of revenge fantasies. I don't think Angela cares about money so much that she would sink that low. Her pride would have her at fast food joints flipping burgers and wearing 29 pieces of flare before she'd sell out to the Evil Corporation that killed her mother. At the very least.
If they're trying to back up the idea of her being like the rest of them — under the clutches of the invisible hand — then they've really missed that mark. Which is what the shoe salesman was getting at, I suppose. Which she double-downed on by threatening to buy the Prada's. I don't know, it's all so weird.
At any rate, working for E Corp would totally screw with her legal case, wtf? She's definitely smarter than that.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:45 PM on September 3, 2015
If they're trying to back up the idea of her being like the rest of them — under the clutches of the invisible hand — then they've really missed that mark. Which is what the shoe salesman was getting at, I suppose. Which she double-downed on by threatening to buy the Prada's. I don't know, it's all so weird.
At any rate, working for E Corp would totally screw with her legal case, wtf? She's definitely smarter than that.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:45 PM on September 3, 2015
Does anybody feel like the entire show itself is a manipulation, a hack? It's these cobbled homages to other shows, other characters … it even borrows the theme songs and lines. I'd love for somebody who knows film better than I do to make a list of all the allusions that have been littered throughout the episodes. So far I've got Fight Club (obviously), but also Pump Up The Volume (which featured the Pixies and Christian Slater), American Psycho, Heathers (this finale especially, also, Slater again), the Matrix, Memento, 12 Monkeys (especially this episode, holy cow).
Even Mr. Robot is doubling back on itself in weird, allusory ways… most notably for me are the Times Square scenes. And the carnival. And the circular front of the E Corp building.
I just can't shake this idea of some meta message about realness/authenticity, narration/identity construction, "awakening" … but I can't quite articulate any of it.
posted by iamkimiam at 2:04 PM on September 3, 2015 [5 favorites]
Even Mr. Robot is doubling back on itself in weird, allusory ways… most notably for me are the Times Square scenes. And the carnival. And the circular front of the E Corp building.
I just can't shake this idea of some meta message about realness/authenticity, narration/identity construction, "awakening" … but I can't quite articulate any of it.
posted by iamkimiam at 2:04 PM on September 3, 2015 [5 favorites]
iamkimiam, Angela WOULD work at E Corp for one reason (actually, two reasons):
1. Her father's crippling debt, which was telegraphed with all the subtlety of a Wile E. Coyote cartoon in episode 5 or 6? One of those, not sure which. We saw literally dozens, if not hundreds of "final notice" mailings falling from every desk drawer and kitchen cubby when she spent the night at his home.
2. She's essentially blackballed now within the tech security industry and said as much in a previous episode. If Angela could find another job that paid enough to help out her dad, she would've taken it. Mom's dead, Elliot's unreliable and/or missing, Ollie is now her ex-boyfriend and she doesn't have anywhere else to go, and being young with no savings is a real bitch for a woman in that situation. Not a lot of alternatives for sweet little Angela (at least, not any that drive the plot forward).
TL;DR: principles don't pay the bills, but with enough patience and insider access, you can pull off some very sweet revenge. This appears to be why Angela took the offer: the chance to burn Terry Colby and bring EvilCorp down from the inside much, much later.
Unfortunately, Angela's still enough of a naif to miss that she's being used as a pawn by White Rose/whatever the hell Illluminati crew WR and ECorp belong to, as referenced in the Finale's stinger.
A+ job by BD Wong as White Rose, holy crap. Love it!
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 2:22 PM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
1. Her father's crippling debt, which was telegraphed with all the subtlety of a Wile E. Coyote cartoon in episode 5 or 6? One of those, not sure which. We saw literally dozens, if not hundreds of "final notice" mailings falling from every desk drawer and kitchen cubby when she spent the night at his home.
2. She's essentially blackballed now within the tech security industry and said as much in a previous episode. If Angela could find another job that paid enough to help out her dad, she would've taken it. Mom's dead, Elliot's unreliable and/or missing, Ollie is now her ex-boyfriend and she doesn't have anywhere else to go, and being young with no savings is a real bitch for a woman in that situation. Not a lot of alternatives for sweet little Angela (at least, not any that drive the plot forward).
TL;DR: principles don't pay the bills, but with enough patience and insider access, you can pull off some very sweet revenge. This appears to be why Angela took the offer: the chance to burn Terry Colby and bring EvilCorp down from the inside much, much later.
Unfortunately, Angela's still enough of a naif to miss that she's being used as a pawn by White Rose/whatever the hell Illluminati crew WR and ECorp belong to, as referenced in the Finale's stinger.
A+ job by BD Wong as White Rose, holy crap. Love it!
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 2:22 PM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]
She almost rolls her eyes as she kisses her baby's head. Gosh I wish I knew what she said.
I asked on another site, and someone there said that the translation was "if you did anything to him, I'll kill you." Can't vouch for whether that's correct, though, because I don't speak a word of Danish.
Also, I absolutely, completely and positively Do Not Buy that Angela would work at E Corp. She wouldn't do it on principle. When you're that pissed off, and you've had a lifetime of misery at the hands of another, being offered a lavish gift from them would be an absolute dream … so you can turn around and say FUCK YOU and stomp on their charity. It's the stuff of revenge fantasies.
Angela is the same woman who, when she found out that her fiance had cheated on her and set her and her father up for identity theft, told him she was sorry and started kissing him -- so that she could then go on to use his computer to infect AllSafe with malware and get real power over him (and revenge on him) that way. She's also the woman who was able to sit there and take the CTO's disgusting "suck my balls" speech, and still maneuver him into doing exactly what she wanted -- which imo was to take some revenge on him by forcing him to expose himself as responsible for her mother's leukemia, while also getting herself access to even more power. She's got sang froid and ambition, imo, and likes her revenge served cold. She knows how to use leverage. I wouldn't count out that she's got a plan for this E Corp job that will put her in the power position over E Corp. I don't know what the hell E Corp was thinking when they put her in the PR department of all places (wouldn't she be someone they'd be trying to keep AWAY from the microphones and cameras!?!), but I assume that she wanted to be there for a reason.
She's also the same woman who turned on Darlene and asked her why she was even worried about Elliot, when they were looking for him in the Queens Museum. When she felt humiliated and angry because Elliot had (inadvertently imo) shown her up at that high level meeting with E Corp, she ignored him until he apologized and promised to do better. He nearly cried in that scene. She knows how to go for the jugular, even with her friends. I really doubt that E Corp successfully bought her loyalty with some stupid job.
TBH, I think that Angela is the only character tough and tenacious enough (and sneaky enough) to take the job at E Corp with some kind of long-term, very dark revenge plan in mind -- and to actually stick to that plan. She's just a lot less volatile and more patient than any of the other characters, imo, so her story has more of a "slow burn" to it. The whole "beat the beast from the inside" thing sounds like such stupid BS -- but hey, maybe Angela can actually do it.
Also, in episode 8, Tyrell told Joanna that he'd had his eyes opened to the true power available to him by looking up, not ahead, and referenced a small-time hacker he'd met already (Elliot), which is when she asked "Oh, and what's above us?"
I thought of that scene with Tyrell, when Mr Robot told Elliot that Elliot was supposed to be his god. It made me wonder whether Tyrell saw Elliot as his god, too, because Tyrell is also an imaginary friend of Elliot's.
But now that I've read your take on it, I agree that what's really going on is that Tyrell just got a taste for playing god (himself) when he murdered Scott's wife. *shudder.*
I wonder how Elliot would (will? did?) react to finding out about that murder. I don't really think that Elliot would truck with Tyrell strangling women to death (tbh, I don't really think Elliot would truck with Tyrell paying homeless people to let him assault them or with Tyrell playing god, either), but I don't know what he would really be able to do about it?
I also wonder what Tyrell has on Mr Robot/Elliot?
Why are there no pictures of Elliot's sister alongside his not-real family? And why does his mom look pregnant? There is just no way Darlene is ~8 years younger than him.
Going back to your other point, I think that the images of his family that Elliot was seeing were sort of cobbled together and not necessarily real memories of his or from one specific moment in time. That mental image of his mom might have been from a picture taken of her from any time in her life, not necessarily from when Elliot was eight. For all we know, that mental image of his might have come from a photo of her that was taken when she was pregnant with Elliot himself.
At that point, it seemed to me that Mr Robot was telling Elliot that Elliot had made up these "imaginary friends" (like Mr Robot himself) because he couldn't stand being so lonely. Maybe Elliot didn't need to create an imaginary Darlene, because actual!Darlene was still in his life?
What I actually thought was weird was that kid!Elliot was included in that fake!family. Who concocts an "imaginary" version of his own childhood self in order to not feel so lonely? But it seems like Elliot has lost his sense of who he is, and is wondering whether he exists, and misses "himself" -- so maybe kid!Elliot is his Elliot-stand-in, just like Mr Robot is his dad-stand-in?
posted by rue72 at 2:24 PM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
I asked on another site, and someone there said that the translation was "if you did anything to him, I'll kill you." Can't vouch for whether that's correct, though, because I don't speak a word of Danish.
Also, I absolutely, completely and positively Do Not Buy that Angela would work at E Corp. She wouldn't do it on principle. When you're that pissed off, and you've had a lifetime of misery at the hands of another, being offered a lavish gift from them would be an absolute dream … so you can turn around and say FUCK YOU and stomp on their charity. It's the stuff of revenge fantasies.
Angela is the same woman who, when she found out that her fiance had cheated on her and set her and her father up for identity theft, told him she was sorry and started kissing him -- so that she could then go on to use his computer to infect AllSafe with malware and get real power over him (and revenge on him) that way. She's also the woman who was able to sit there and take the CTO's disgusting "suck my balls" speech, and still maneuver him into doing exactly what she wanted -- which imo was to take some revenge on him by forcing him to expose himself as responsible for her mother's leukemia, while also getting herself access to even more power. She's got sang froid and ambition, imo, and likes her revenge served cold. She knows how to use leverage. I wouldn't count out that she's got a plan for this E Corp job that will put her in the power position over E Corp. I don't know what the hell E Corp was thinking when they put her in the PR department of all places (wouldn't she be someone they'd be trying to keep AWAY from the microphones and cameras!?!), but I assume that she wanted to be there for a reason.
She's also the same woman who turned on Darlene and asked her why she was even worried about Elliot, when they were looking for him in the Queens Museum. When she felt humiliated and angry because Elliot had (inadvertently imo) shown her up at that high level meeting with E Corp, she ignored him until he apologized and promised to do better. He nearly cried in that scene. She knows how to go for the jugular, even with her friends. I really doubt that E Corp successfully bought her loyalty with some stupid job.
TBH, I think that Angela is the only character tough and tenacious enough (and sneaky enough) to take the job at E Corp with some kind of long-term, very dark revenge plan in mind -- and to actually stick to that plan. She's just a lot less volatile and more patient than any of the other characters, imo, so her story has more of a "slow burn" to it. The whole "beat the beast from the inside" thing sounds like such stupid BS -- but hey, maybe Angela can actually do it.
Also, in episode 8, Tyrell told Joanna that he'd had his eyes opened to the true power available to him by looking up, not ahead, and referenced a small-time hacker he'd met already (Elliot), which is when she asked "Oh, and what's above us?"
I thought of that scene with Tyrell, when Mr Robot told Elliot that Elliot was supposed to be his god. It made me wonder whether Tyrell saw Elliot as his god, too, because Tyrell is also an imaginary friend of Elliot's.
But now that I've read your take on it, I agree that what's really going on is that Tyrell just got a taste for playing god (himself) when he murdered Scott's wife. *shudder.*
I wonder how Elliot would (will? did?) react to finding out about that murder. I don't really think that Elliot would truck with Tyrell strangling women to death (tbh, I don't really think Elliot would truck with Tyrell paying homeless people to let him assault them or with Tyrell playing god, either), but I don't know what he would really be able to do about it?
I also wonder what Tyrell has on Mr Robot/Elliot?
Why are there no pictures of Elliot's sister alongside his not-real family? And why does his mom look pregnant? There is just no way Darlene is ~8 years younger than him.
Going back to your other point, I think that the images of his family that Elliot was seeing were sort of cobbled together and not necessarily real memories of his or from one specific moment in time. That mental image of his mom might have been from a picture taken of her from any time in her life, not necessarily from when Elliot was eight. For all we know, that mental image of his might have come from a photo of her that was taken when she was pregnant with Elliot himself.
At that point, it seemed to me that Mr Robot was telling Elliot that Elliot had made up these "imaginary friends" (like Mr Robot himself) because he couldn't stand being so lonely. Maybe Elliot didn't need to create an imaginary Darlene, because actual!Darlene was still in his life?
What I actually thought was weird was that kid!Elliot was included in that fake!family. Who concocts an "imaginary" version of his own childhood self in order to not feel so lonely? But it seems like Elliot has lost his sense of who he is, and is wondering whether he exists, and misses "himself" -- so maybe kid!Elliot is his Elliot-stand-in, just like Mr Robot is his dad-stand-in?
posted by rue72 at 2:24 PM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
The party was to saturate the room with DNA and fingerprints.
Michael Christopher seems to have a lock on the plutocratic-CEO-pulling-society's-strings roles.
He also looks a lot like the fsociety mask.
posted by tilde at 8:08 PM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Michael Christopher seems to have a lock on the plutocratic-CEO-pulling-society's-strings roles.
He also looks a lot like the fsociety mask.
posted by tilde at 8:08 PM on September 3, 2015 [3 favorites]
Boo! I'm annoyed by this episode. I was really hoping they'd wrap the story up and secretly hoping that this would be the final episode of a really brilliant dystopian TV show and it'd come to a tidy conclusion and we would be done with our happy memories of something special.
Instead everything's left open for speculation. And anything is possible. Because if previous shows like Lost or Heroes are any warning, the writers don't really know who Tyrell is either. A show like this can totally fall off the rails once the primary show creator runs out of brilliant planned story. Instead they leave a zillion loose ends they can pick up next season. I mean, what if it turns out Tyrell is really the Smoke Monster? Perhaps Mr. Robot is the polar bear. Not only will that kind of plate-spinning writing be disappointing, it will cheapen the brilliance that was most of this show so far.
The saving grace for me in this final hook episode is they brought back BD Wong. I thought he was too big a talent to waste on only one episode. Also Michael Cristofer was delicious as the CEO of Evil Corp, in his smug confidence of power. I loved him in Rubicon and he's great here.
Fingers crossed the writers have enough gas in the tank to spin a whole second season. And double-triple crossed they wrap up the show when they run out of story, rather than inventing increasingly implausible story to extend the life of the show to a poorly conceived third or fourth season.
posted by Nelson at 8:16 PM on September 3, 2015 [6 favorites]
Instead everything's left open for speculation. And anything is possible. Because if previous shows like Lost or Heroes are any warning, the writers don't really know who Tyrell is either. A show like this can totally fall off the rails once the primary show creator runs out of brilliant planned story. Instead they leave a zillion loose ends they can pick up next season. I mean, what if it turns out Tyrell is really the Smoke Monster? Perhaps Mr. Robot is the polar bear. Not only will that kind of plate-spinning writing be disappointing, it will cheapen the brilliance that was most of this show so far.
The saving grace for me in this final hook episode is they brought back BD Wong. I thought he was too big a talent to waste on only one episode. Also Michael Cristofer was delicious as the CEO of Evil Corp, in his smug confidence of power. I loved him in Rubicon and he's great here.
Fingers crossed the writers have enough gas in the tank to spin a whole second season. And double-triple crossed they wrap up the show when they run out of story, rather than inventing increasingly implausible story to extend the life of the show to a poorly conceived third or fourth season.
posted by Nelson at 8:16 PM on September 3, 2015 [6 favorites]
Also I thought it was hilarious they never got to the gun in the popcorn machine, the one so carefully framed in two or three episodes. Perhaps BD Wong was Chekov's Gun.
posted by Nelson at 8:24 PM on September 3, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by Nelson at 8:24 PM on September 3, 2015 [6 favorites]
MetaFilter: That way, people just think you're the local douche.
posted by detachd at 8:49 PM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by detachd at 8:49 PM on September 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
I've read that this was originally planned as a film but ran long, so it got broken into a TV series with presumably two seasons.
Definitely agree that thinning the plot to add seasons would ruin the whole experience.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 9:33 PM on September 3, 2015
Definitely agree that thinning the plot to add seasons would ruin the whole experience.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 9:33 PM on September 3, 2015
I've read that this was originally planned as a film but ran long, so it got broken into a TV series with presumably two seasons.
It was initially developed as a movie, but I don't know about the "ran long" part. However, his plan hasn't been just two seasons at any point. In the interview with Todd VanDerWerff that I posted earlier Esmail says that the plan is 4 or 5 seasons and that he wants to do to get to the ending he has in mind (which apparently is basically the same ending as the initial movie idea). He's been very, very consistent about that to date.
This isn't going to be a series that gets strung out endlessly.
posted by sparkletone at 7:03 AM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
It was initially developed as a movie, but I don't know about the "ran long" part. However, his plan hasn't been just two seasons at any point. In the interview with Todd VanDerWerff that I posted earlier Esmail says that the plan is 4 or 5 seasons and that he wants to do to get to the ending he has in mind (which apparently is basically the same ending as the initial movie idea). He's been very, very consistent about that to date.
This isn't going to be a series that gets strung out endlessly.
posted by sparkletone at 7:03 AM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
Thanks for the reassurance that Esmail has a plan. I sure hope so, because I've loved most of the story so far. I particularly liked the filler B stories, things like busting his dealer's scary boyfriend out of jail. I think Malek is a hell of a great actor and those smaller stories gave him a chance to really fill the character out. More like that wrapped in a longer plot about Evil Corp and Malek's unbalanced personality would be great.
I hope they tone down Elliot's craziness a little bit, let him find some peace. I've had real life friends have reality breaks similar to his and it's just scary and tragic, not entertaining. I also hope they flesh Darlene out more. She seems like an important anchor for the story but her character has been a bit one dimensional so far.
Bah, I'm picking nits, negotiating what I want from the next years of Mr. Robot. What's best about this show is the odd emotional presentation of it, the sense of dread and alienation while also making us so sympathetic with the protagonist.
posted by Nelson at 8:01 AM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
I hope they tone down Elliot's craziness a little bit, let him find some peace. I've had real life friends have reality breaks similar to his and it's just scary and tragic, not entertaining. I also hope they flesh Darlene out more. She seems like an important anchor for the story but her character has been a bit one dimensional so far.
Bah, I'm picking nits, negotiating what I want from the next years of Mr. Robot. What's best about this show is the odd emotional presentation of it, the sense of dread and alienation while also making us so sympathetic with the protagonist.
posted by Nelson at 8:01 AM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
It looks like this show is really going to show us a full meltdown of the financial sector and its aftermath. I've been hoping they'd go down this road. I imagine that season 2 will be set over a backdrop of societal collapse.
posted by One Second Before Awakening at 8:16 AM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by One Second Before Awakening at 8:16 AM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
Or alternately, they'll use the improbable plot device of how the worm encrypted all the data instead of just wiped it. And the encryption key will become the new Holy Grail everyone looks for. Or maybe Tyrell will wrest it free out of Elliot's skull and become the savior of the world. Or maybe fSociety will use this power they have to rule the world itself. Or maybe White Rose will steal it and force everyone to operate with watchwork efficiency.
posted by Nelson at 8:21 AM on September 4, 2015
posted by Nelson at 8:21 AM on September 4, 2015
There's definitly something going on Mrs. Wellick... all sort of weird sound and visual stuff and talking in tongues. That has to mean something.
I'm sure there soemthign more to the Boardwalk video... I think it's highly suspicious that the two skateboards cross in the forground just as Ellito falls, like they are covering something. I've only watched it like fifty times so I might be missing something.
Still like how the direction the show is going (ie total meltdown of both the society and Elliot). Bring on S2.
(Oh and I dug out Pump Up The Volume and re-watched it the night before.... Slater looks about 14, but is was 25 years ago...)
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 8:53 AM on September 4, 2015 [3 favorites]
I'm sure there soemthign more to the Boardwalk video... I think it's highly suspicious that the two skateboards cross in the forground just as Ellito falls, like they are covering something. I've only watched it like fifty times so I might be missing something.
Still like how the direction the show is going (ie total meltdown of both the society and Elliot). Bring on S2.
(Oh and I dug out Pump Up The Volume and re-watched it the night before.... Slater looks about 14, but is was 25 years ago...)
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 8:53 AM on September 4, 2015 [3 favorites]
I'm sure there soemthign more to the Boardwalk video...
Sure. Maybe it turns out the video was be faked. Or has steganographic data in it. Or viewing it online triggered some event in the Internet. Or maybe nothing at all happens with it and it's never mentioned again.
That's my complaint with this last episode. It planted like 15 teasers, open plot devices that they can then spin into new stories. There's no way to know which will amount to anything and it all feels a bit arbitrary right now. In the past this kind of writing has led to some terrible Lost TV. I hope Mr. Robot stays on the rails and has a coherent story with a middle and end. Breaking Bad did that very successfully and it was so rewarding. The Wire did that well in a season-to-season way, with varying quality but at least it was coherent and closed.
posted by Nelson at 9:20 AM on September 4, 2015 [6 favorites]
Sure. Maybe it turns out the video was be faked. Or has steganographic data in it. Or viewing it online triggered some event in the Internet. Or maybe nothing at all happens with it and it's never mentioned again.
That's my complaint with this last episode. It planted like 15 teasers, open plot devices that they can then spin into new stories. There's no way to know which will amount to anything and it all feels a bit arbitrary right now. In the past this kind of writing has led to some terrible Lost TV. I hope Mr. Robot stays on the rails and has a coherent story with a middle and end. Breaking Bad did that very successfully and it was so rewarding. The Wire did that well in a season-to-season way, with varying quality but at least it was coherent and closed.
posted by Nelson at 9:20 AM on September 4, 2015 [6 favorites]
Did anyone else notice that the titlebar on the ill-fated Live Press Conference actually said 'E Corp' instead of 'EvilCorp'? Up until this point, everyone in the narrative had been actively using the term EvilCorp *and* there were many incidences of "EvilCorp" actually being presented in text as a way of flagging the narrative revisionism being done, a signpost that even what's being seen should be doubted in some fashion. Have there been other moments since the original episode where EvilCorp was actually referred to AS 'E Corp' that I've missed?
posted by FatherDagon at 12:39 PM on September 4, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by FatherDagon at 12:39 PM on September 4, 2015 [4 favorites]
I think that's because we're viewing E Corp through Angela's and the audience's eyes and ears, instead of Elliot's — he said in Episode 1 that he felt so strongly about E Corp's evilness that he can no longer see or hear it any other way. Would be interesting to go back through and scan for this, for clues to what's Elliot's perspective (and what's not).
posted by iamkimiam at 12:55 PM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by iamkimiam at 12:55 PM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
Yeah it's definitely related to that, however I was fairly sure that the EvilCorp moniker was being used even in scenes where Elliot wasn't actually present, indicating that the entire narrative was suspect, not just Elliot's own experiences. Time to dig through the entire season again...
posted by FatherDagon at 1:11 PM on September 4, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by FatherDagon at 1:11 PM on September 4, 2015 [1 favorite]
Or alternately, they'll use the improbable plot device of how the worm encrypted all the data instead of just wiped it. And the encryption key will become the new Holy Grail everyone looks for. Or maybe Tyrell will wrest it free out of Elliot's skull and become the savior of the world. Or maybe fSociety will use this power they have to rule the world itself. Or maybe White Rose will steal it and force everyone to operate with watchwork efficiency.
I've got to think that Darlene was the one who made the decision to encrypt rather than delete, since she's the one who handled that part of the operation.
So isn't it likely that Darlene has the encryption key? She's the one who encrypted the data, so wouldn't it be relatively easy for her to make an encryption key? (Those are real questions -- I don't know anything about tech, lol).
I think she's liable to try and use a key as leverage for *herself* somehow. Though it's still so mysterious what her real motivations/goals are that I'm not sure what she'd be trying to leverage the encryption key to get.
Honestly, what I would have done, if I were Darlene, would be to delete all the data and then put in fake "encrypted" data in its place. That way, she could still dangle the "encryption key" in front of people in order to keep power over them, but nobody could come in and actually crack the code and get the data back.
Also, this is kind of random, but do Darlene and Elliot have the same father? I ask mostly because Darlene doesn't seem fixated on E Corp the way that Angela and Elliot are, so I'm wondering if she didn't actually lose a parent to them. Also, I guess I'm still puzzling over why there were a million pictures of Elliot and his dad on that blank CD of his, but none of those pictures included Darlene. And Darlene wasn't included in the Mr Robot store memory from '94, either.
Maybe it turns out the video was be faked. Or has steganographic data in it. Or viewing it online triggered some event in the Internet. Or maybe nothing at all happens with it and it's never mentioned again.
The idea that the video has steganographic data in it is really cool! Elliot already uses music to hide the hacked data on his CDs, so it would actually make sense if the video were being used to hide data, too, right? (Honestly asking, because I know nothing about tech).
posted by rue72 at 1:48 PM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
I've got to think that Darlene was the one who made the decision to encrypt rather than delete, since she's the one who handled that part of the operation.
So isn't it likely that Darlene has the encryption key? She's the one who encrypted the data, so wouldn't it be relatively easy for her to make an encryption key? (Those are real questions -- I don't know anything about tech, lol).
I think she's liable to try and use a key as leverage for *herself* somehow. Though it's still so mysterious what her real motivations/goals are that I'm not sure what she'd be trying to leverage the encryption key to get.
Honestly, what I would have done, if I were Darlene, would be to delete all the data and then put in fake "encrypted" data in its place. That way, she could still dangle the "encryption key" in front of people in order to keep power over them, but nobody could come in and actually crack the code and get the data back.
Also, this is kind of random, but do Darlene and Elliot have the same father? I ask mostly because Darlene doesn't seem fixated on E Corp the way that Angela and Elliot are, so I'm wondering if she didn't actually lose a parent to them. Also, I guess I'm still puzzling over why there were a million pictures of Elliot and his dad on that blank CD of his, but none of those pictures included Darlene. And Darlene wasn't included in the Mr Robot store memory from '94, either.
Maybe it turns out the video was be faked. Or has steganographic data in it. Or viewing it online triggered some event in the Internet. Or maybe nothing at all happens with it and it's never mentioned again.
The idea that the video has steganographic data in it is really cool! Elliot already uses music to hide the hacked data on his CDs, so it would actually make sense if the video were being used to hide data, too, right? (Honestly asking, because I know nothing about tech).
posted by rue72 at 1:48 PM on September 4, 2015 [2 favorites]
Iirc it started to change back to E from Evil when Elliot started denying we were real.
posted by tilde at 2:20 PM on September 4, 2015
posted by tilde at 2:20 PM on September 4, 2015
My thirty is we are also Elliot and another unreliable narrator.
posted by tilde at 2:20 PM on September 4, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by tilde at 2:20 PM on September 4, 2015 [1 favorite]
I loved it. I'm glad -- ecstatic really -- to hear that Time Zone track.
posted by Catblack at 6:53 AM on September 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by Catblack at 6:53 AM on September 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
> Why are there no pictures of Elliot's sister alongside his not-real family? And why does his mom look pregnant? There is just no way Darlene is ~8 years younger than him.
The only character that's said Darlene is Elliot's sister was Elliot, just once.
posted by morganw at 12:02 PM on September 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
The only character that's said Darlene is Elliot's sister was Elliot, just once.
posted by morganw at 12:02 PM on September 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
I'm fond of the idea that Darlene and Angela are two personalities for the same person, much like Elliot and Mr. Robot. I think they've shown us enough scenes of Darlene and Angela interacting with other people it's not possible, but I could be wrong. It definitely seemed weird the first time we learned Darlene and Angela knew each other.
posted by Nelson at 1:19 PM on September 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Nelson at 1:19 PM on September 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
It only seemed weird at the time because we didn't know that Darlene is Elliot's sister. It makes plenty of sense that a friend since childhood would know and be friendly with his sibling, especially if they both see themselves as taking care of Elliot in terms of his mental health.
posted by sparkletone at 1:29 PM on September 6, 2015
posted by sparkletone at 1:29 PM on September 6, 2015
I love that this show makes the audience question everything we see. The writers have done an amazing job of making us Elliot by proxy, which is exactly what we are to him. It's a weird relationship between the fiction and the observer.
Whether Darlene is Elliot's sister or not, we'll be wondering and worrying about it until some tangible evidence is provided.
posted by tracicle at 11:38 PM on September 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
Whether Darlene is Elliot's sister or not, we'll be wondering and worrying about it until some tangible evidence is provided.
posted by tracicle at 11:38 PM on September 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
The only character that's said Darlene is Elliot's sister was Elliot, just once.
When Darlene and Angela were at the Queens Museum looking for Elliot (in 1x09), Darlene refers to him as her brother. I looked up the transcript, and here's the line:
He is my brother, and I'm just trying to help.
I find it hard to believe that Darlene and Angela are the same person, because Angela is living with her father (who apparently isn't Darlene's father), and her father has talked about Darlene to her. Also, it really seems like Angela and Elliot have different mothers, and grew up in different houses. IIRC, when Elliot went missing, Angela's dad saw Darlene hanging out at Elliot and Darlene's childhood home (which I guess is in the same neighborhood where he lives?), and mentioned it to Angela. Then Angela went over there and met up with Darlene and asked about what was going on. So I believe that Angela really is who Elliot described her as: an old childhood friend who Elliot trusts.
posted by rue72 at 3:54 PM on September 7, 2015 [8 favorites]
When Darlene and Angela were at the Queens Museum looking for Elliot (in 1x09), Darlene refers to him as her brother. I looked up the transcript, and here's the line:
He is my brother, and I'm just trying to help.
I find it hard to believe that Darlene and Angela are the same person, because Angela is living with her father (who apparently isn't Darlene's father), and her father has talked about Darlene to her. Also, it really seems like Angela and Elliot have different mothers, and grew up in different houses. IIRC, when Elliot went missing, Angela's dad saw Darlene hanging out at Elliot and Darlene's childhood home (which I guess is in the same neighborhood where he lives?), and mentioned it to Angela. Then Angela went over there and met up with Darlene and asked about what was going on. So I believe that Angela really is who Elliot described her as: an old childhood friend who Elliot trusts.
posted by rue72 at 3:54 PM on September 7, 2015 [8 favorites]
Now that I'm finished I really, really wish I'd been part of the conversation from the beginning. I have a few random thoughts:
I think I only saw it mentioned once here, but I see a lot of 12 Monkeys in this.
I thought the decision to use such retro graphics for the titles was...an interesting choice, and then was so tickled to see it turn up as the business logo later in the season! This show is scratching my Better Call Saul itch as a show that I feel respects me as a viewer and rewards me by not dumbing it down.
I think the visuals and cinematography are out of this world. There are so many different references and styles that it could have -- and probably should have -- been gimmicky and cliched but it managed to avoid that. Maybe the montages of stock photography won't age well, but it's so on-point here: it's not a "thing" in the general zeitgeist but the stock photo meme is very timely in the show's world. That's another example of not dumbing it down; they could have easily referenced lolcats or a macro meme and a lot more people would get the joke.
The harpist was playing "Nearer, My God, to Thee", the song they played as the Titanic sank, and as featured in Ted Turner's end of the world video for CNN.
Ooh! Earlier, when Gideon was talking to his CFO, he says, "Ever since I started this company it's felt like rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic." I didn't think much of it until you mentioned this.
Others have mentioned the excellent music choices but what I wouldn't have noticed if I didn't use CC is really how perfectly the lyrics match up. Something about seeing the words right there had even more impact for me. Also, this from the song Pictures of You, played during the flashback with Shayla:
We don't think Tyrell = Elliot, right? Because I wondered if Joanna spoke Swedish because she knows or thinks he's Tyrell.
That was a pretty graphic suicide scene for basic cable.
Also I thought it was hilarious they never got to the gun in the popcorn machine, the one so carefully framed in two or three episodes.
Yes! Didn't they even show a close-up of the popcorn machine in one of the last scenes?
That's my complaint with this last episode. It planted like 15 teasers, open plot devices that they can then spin into new stories.
Cliffhanger!
Okay I'll stop now.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:15 AM on September 8, 2015 [5 favorites]
I think I only saw it mentioned once here, but I see a lot of 12 Monkeys in this.
I thought the decision to use such retro graphics for the titles was...an interesting choice, and then was so tickled to see it turn up as the business logo later in the season! This show is scratching my Better Call Saul itch as a show that I feel respects me as a viewer and rewards me by not dumbing it down.
I think the visuals and cinematography are out of this world. There are so many different references and styles that it could have -- and probably should have -- been gimmicky and cliched but it managed to avoid that. Maybe the montages of stock photography won't age well, but it's so on-point here: it's not a "thing" in the general zeitgeist but the stock photo meme is very timely in the show's world. That's another example of not dumbing it down; they could have easily referenced lolcats or a macro meme and a lot more people would get the joke.
The harpist was playing "Nearer, My God, to Thee", the song they played as the Titanic sank, and as featured in Ted Turner's end of the world video for CNN.
Ooh! Earlier, when Gideon was talking to his CFO, he says, "Ever since I started this company it's felt like rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic." I didn't think much of it until you mentioned this.
Others have mentioned the excellent music choices but what I wouldn't have noticed if I didn't use CC is really how perfectly the lyrics match up. Something about seeing the words right there had even more impact for me. Also, this from the song Pictures of You, played during the flashback with Shayla:
I've been looking so long at these pictures of youThe choice of a Beta fish for Elliot, since they are anti-social and need to be kept alone in their tank.
That I almost believe that they're real
I've been living so long with my pictures of you
That I almost believe that the pictures are
All I can feel
We don't think Tyrell = Elliot, right? Because I wondered if Joanna spoke Swedish because she knows or thinks he's Tyrell.
That was a pretty graphic suicide scene for basic cable.
Also I thought it was hilarious they never got to the gun in the popcorn machine, the one so carefully framed in two or three episodes.
Yes! Didn't they even show a close-up of the popcorn machine in one of the last scenes?
That's my complaint with this last episode. It planted like 15 teasers, open plot devices that they can then spin into new stories.
Cliffhanger!
Okay I'll stop now.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:15 AM on September 8, 2015 [5 favorites]
Oh, that shoe salesman! If that was me I'd jab a 5" stiletto through his thigh.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:18 AM on September 8, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 7:18 AM on September 8, 2015 [2 favorites]
This is the fastest I've ever gone from never having heard about a show to watching the entire thing and telling everyone I know all about it.
That suicide scene. Holy Bud Dwyer, Batman.
I didn't get the thing that happened after the credits. Was that an Illuminati meeting?
posted by bondcliff at 7:32 AM on September 8, 2015 [5 favorites]
That suicide scene. Holy Bud Dwyer, Batman.
I didn't get the thing that happened after the credits. Was that an Illuminati meeting?
posted by bondcliff at 7:32 AM on September 8, 2015 [5 favorites]
"Was that an Illuminati meeting?"
That's how I interpreted it. They took great pains to show people (mostly men, except for the servers) of all ethnicities and cultures, apparently incredibly wealthy, all in one place, seemingly unperturbed by the economic meltdown going on outside. If that's not the Illuminati then I don't know who is.
I was left thinking that Mr. Evilcorp CEO was un-fazed by all this hubbub because he knows White Rose, knows the Dark Army, knows his data has been encrypted but he might have a way out, and generally knew this was going down before it even started.
posted by komara at 8:40 PM on September 10, 2015 [1 favorite]
That's how I interpreted it. They took great pains to show people (mostly men, except for the servers) of all ethnicities and cultures, apparently incredibly wealthy, all in one place, seemingly unperturbed by the economic meltdown going on outside. If that's not the Illuminati then I don't know who is.
I was left thinking that Mr. Evilcorp CEO was un-fazed by all this hubbub because he knows White Rose, knows the Dark Army, knows his data has been encrypted but he might have a way out, and generally knew this was going down before it even started.
posted by komara at 8:40 PM on September 10, 2015 [1 favorite]
You did notice that the camera pans right past Sam Esmail in that final scene, right?
posted by Catblack at 10:18 PM on September 12, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by Catblack at 10:18 PM on September 12, 2015 [5 favorites]
This is the fastest I've ever gone from never having heard about a show to watching the entire thing and telling everyone I know all about it.
This. I'm still thinking about episode 9 where the fourth wall breaks for a bit and he slams the camera on the ground in frustration. That this show plays so much with whether or not Eliot should be trusted or the point of view of the camera. It makes me think of 'the machine' in Person of Interest in how that 'other' gets its own personality and becomes a separate character unto itself. Quite brilliant.
posted by Fizz at 6:50 AM on September 13, 2015 [3 favorites]
This. I'm still thinking about episode 9 where the fourth wall breaks for a bit and he slams the camera on the ground in frustration. That this show plays so much with whether or not Eliot should be trusted or the point of view of the camera. It makes me think of 'the machine' in Person of Interest in how that 'other' gets its own personality and becomes a separate character unto itself. Quite brilliant.
posted by Fizz at 6:50 AM on September 13, 2015 [3 favorites]
This is the fastest I've ever gone from never having heard about a show to watching the entire thing and telling everyone I know all about it.
This, and Bojack Horseman. I'm so glad I took the chance; I don't watch a lot of new-to-me television.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:23 AM on September 13, 2015 [1 favorite]
This, and Bojack Horseman. I'm so glad I took the chance; I don't watch a lot of new-to-me television.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:23 AM on September 13, 2015 [1 favorite]
I just bingewatched this this weekend and LOVED it. A few things:
- Someone mentioning upthread how Angela has a ruthless streak in her. This became really clear to me when she was buying shoes and the shoe salesman was kind of badgering her about working for E Corp and she finally snapped at him, "do you know who you're talking to? I will take the Pradas". I mean, he was being rude, but also, this was within hours of a guy killing himself live on national TV and she came into the shoestore with the guy's blood on her shoes. Her reaction seemed pretty strong. But according to big, soft balls guy that's exactly why they wanted to hire her. I think she has that ruthless streak and the other ruthless assholes recognize it.
- Darlene is not in any of the photos of the family. Does anyone remember Elliot's fever dream when he was going through withdrawal? He was walking down the sidewalk and a little girl came up to him and said something to him and giggled. I have to go back and watch it, but I wonder if that could have been Darlene.
- That scene at the end when Elliot is in Times Square with all the crowds protesting and he's in full-on delusion mode, talking to Mr. Robot. He keeps seeing a photo of him, his dad and his mom. This is the first time (that I remember) where we get a decent look at his mom's face and she looks a lot like Joanna. They don't seem to be the same person, but his mom has the longer, dark hair and full lips. His mom also seems pretty cruel, as does Joanna. I wonder if there's a connection there.
- That scene with Joanna. Omg. Just need to note that it was one of the creepiest scenes of the whole series (which has had a lot of creepy scenes, admittedly). The music playing was this kind of distorted, scary music that reminded me a lot of the music used in The Shining. Plus, I couldn't figure out if she was....puzzled, or not? I assume she has to know more than we know, but does she? Why would she have breezily said she just spoke to Tyrell and then a minute later say she hasn't seen him in three days? Especially if she is already suspicious of Elliot? What did he say or do that made her change her story and why? I'm confused on this point. She and the CEO of E Corp are the scariest characters at this point, imo.
- Also a note about the music selections (which is doing more for me than any other show I've ever seen, including Breaking Bad, which was notable in its music selection and use). The scene when Elliot brings Tyrell to the fsociety Coney Island HQ. Tyrell is questioning Elliot and seems confused and almost a little lost and the music they're playing over that scene is jarring. It's a piano, I think, and it's the kind of music that I associate with being played in the final scene of a movie, when everything has come together and they're setting up a happy, satisfying ending. It was just so out of sorts with what was happening and where we were in the story. Genuinely unsettling.
- Who filmed the Boardwalk Fail video? Was it Tyrell?
- That therapist has to be more involved than we know. We're just seeing Elliot's side. She has to have an idea of the extent of his illness and his background. That scene where her ex-bf (Michael/Lenny) tries to get her help in prosecuting Elliot - what was the point of that? Like she's going to have any sympathy for this dude when he's like "he ruined my life"? You ruined your OWN life, guy, with your multiple affairs and betrayals.
- You all are talking about an encryption key, and I say this as a total non-tech person (I had to google what a honeypot is, and I'm still none the wiser) - could Angela have it? Remember his dream about having a key and giving it to Angela as a proposal? I know an encryption key is not a LITERAL key, but just a thought as a key did figure prominently in his dream.
- Have we decided that every scene (except flashbacks) with Mr. Robot are in fact Elliot? Obviously the scene where Mr. Robot and Tyrell meet, but also the scene where Mr. Robot fights with the other hacker guy (forgot his name - the older guy) and Mr. Robot points a gun at him. Was that Elliot arguing with him?
- VERY confused by that last scene with BD Wong and Evil Corp guy. Are they conspiring?
I LOVE this show!
posted by triggerfinger at 7:21 AM on September 14, 2015 [6 favorites]
- Someone mentioning upthread how Angela has a ruthless streak in her. This became really clear to me when she was buying shoes and the shoe salesman was kind of badgering her about working for E Corp and she finally snapped at him, "do you know who you're talking to? I will take the Pradas". I mean, he was being rude, but also, this was within hours of a guy killing himself live on national TV and she came into the shoestore with the guy's blood on her shoes. Her reaction seemed pretty strong. But according to big, soft balls guy that's exactly why they wanted to hire her. I think she has that ruthless streak and the other ruthless assholes recognize it.
- Darlene is not in any of the photos of the family. Does anyone remember Elliot's fever dream when he was going through withdrawal? He was walking down the sidewalk and a little girl came up to him and said something to him and giggled. I have to go back and watch it, but I wonder if that could have been Darlene.
- That scene at the end when Elliot is in Times Square with all the crowds protesting and he's in full-on delusion mode, talking to Mr. Robot. He keeps seeing a photo of him, his dad and his mom. This is the first time (that I remember) where we get a decent look at his mom's face and she looks a lot like Joanna. They don't seem to be the same person, but his mom has the longer, dark hair and full lips. His mom also seems pretty cruel, as does Joanna. I wonder if there's a connection there.
- That scene with Joanna. Omg. Just need to note that it was one of the creepiest scenes of the whole series (which has had a lot of creepy scenes, admittedly). The music playing was this kind of distorted, scary music that reminded me a lot of the music used in The Shining. Plus, I couldn't figure out if she was....puzzled, or not? I assume she has to know more than we know, but does she? Why would she have breezily said she just spoke to Tyrell and then a minute later say she hasn't seen him in three days? Especially if she is already suspicious of Elliot? What did he say or do that made her change her story and why? I'm confused on this point. She and the CEO of E Corp are the scariest characters at this point, imo.
- Also a note about the music selections (which is doing more for me than any other show I've ever seen, including Breaking Bad, which was notable in its music selection and use). The scene when Elliot brings Tyrell to the fsociety Coney Island HQ. Tyrell is questioning Elliot and seems confused and almost a little lost and the music they're playing over that scene is jarring. It's a piano, I think, and it's the kind of music that I associate with being played in the final scene of a movie, when everything has come together and they're setting up a happy, satisfying ending. It was just so out of sorts with what was happening and where we were in the story. Genuinely unsettling.
- Who filmed the Boardwalk Fail video? Was it Tyrell?
- That therapist has to be more involved than we know. We're just seeing Elliot's side. She has to have an idea of the extent of his illness and his background. That scene where her ex-bf (Michael/Lenny) tries to get her help in prosecuting Elliot - what was the point of that? Like she's going to have any sympathy for this dude when he's like "he ruined my life"? You ruined your OWN life, guy, with your multiple affairs and betrayals.
- You all are talking about an encryption key, and I say this as a total non-tech person (I had to google what a honeypot is, and I'm still none the wiser) - could Angela have it? Remember his dream about having a key and giving it to Angela as a proposal? I know an encryption key is not a LITERAL key, but just a thought as a key did figure prominently in his dream.
- Have we decided that every scene (except flashbacks) with Mr. Robot are in fact Elliot? Obviously the scene where Mr. Robot and Tyrell meet, but also the scene where Mr. Robot fights with the other hacker guy (forgot his name - the older guy) and Mr. Robot points a gun at him. Was that Elliot arguing with him?
- VERY confused by that last scene with BD Wong and Evil Corp guy. Are they conspiring?
I LOVE this show!
posted by triggerfinger at 7:21 AM on September 14, 2015 [6 favorites]
i think the hardest thing the next season has to do is modulate Elliot's craziness. We got through most of the season with him being fairly functional, but that has gone by the wayside the last two episodes. At this rate, he will be lying in a ball on the floor drooling from s02e02 onward. Maybe Darlene and Angela pick up bigger chunks of the story?
Maybe it turns out the video was be faked. Or has steganographic data in it. Or viewing it online triggered some event in the Internet. Or maybe nothing at all happens with it and it's never mentioned again.
The idea that the video has steganographic data in it is really cool! Elliot already uses music to hide the hacked data on his CDs, so it would actually make sense if the video were being used to hide data, too, right? (Honestly asking, because I know nothing about tech)
I noticed upthread that the video had been posted to Vimeo a month or so ago. Has anyone taken a crack at it, ala I love Bees?
posted by rtimmel at 1:56 PM on September 14, 2015 [3 favorites]
Maybe it turns out the video was be faked. Or has steganographic data in it. Or viewing it online triggered some event in the Internet. Or maybe nothing at all happens with it and it's never mentioned again.
The idea that the video has steganographic data in it is really cool! Elliot already uses music to hide the hacked data on his CDs, so it would actually make sense if the video were being used to hide data, too, right? (Honestly asking, because I know nothing about tech)
I noticed upthread that the video had been posted to Vimeo a month or so ago. Has anyone taken a crack at it, ala I love Bees?
posted by rtimmel at 1:56 PM on September 14, 2015 [3 favorites]
One thing i noticed after watching the "boardwal fail" video a few times is that it was likely posted because the timing of the trick (an Ollie?) makes it look like the skateboarder knocks the tiny man off of the railing with the end of his board.
posted by OHenryPacey at 3:51 PM on September 14, 2015
posted by OHenryPacey at 3:51 PM on September 14, 2015
Instead everything's left open for speculation. And anything is possible. Because if previous shows like Lost or Heroes are any warning, the writers don't really know who Tyrell is either. A show like this can totally fall off the rails once the primary show creator runs out of brilliant planned story. Instead they leave a zillion loose ends they can pick up next season. I mean, what if it turns out Tyrell is really the Smoke Monster? Perhaps Mr. Robot is the polar bear. Not only will that kind of plate-spinning writing be disappointing, it will cheapen the brilliance that was most of this show so far.
I'm so worried about this. I know we got that babylon 5-esque "nah, i have a plan!" thing but... what other show has actually concisely pulled that off without getting drug into BSG-land? Even true detective, which was basically regarded as holy around these parts completely ran out of gas in season 2.
Up towards the end of the episode i was really hoping it would just end. I'm really really scared they're going to milk way too much filler out of this concept now.
This show got better the entire season. I didn't even expect to watch it, or like it, and basically watched it on a whim just from the description. And yea, wow. They set themselves up for a really hard act to follow here.
I'm not saying i think it's going to be turbo garbage and throw it into the sun, just that i think we're going to get a lot of pretty-good-but-average-TV out of this after an excellent first season.
- Who filmed the Boardwalk Fail video? Was it Tyrell?
The skaters! or someone with them. Notice how it tracks the girl skating at the start?
posted by emptythought at 3:33 AM on September 15, 2015 [2 favorites]
I'm so worried about this. I know we got that babylon 5-esque "nah, i have a plan!" thing but... what other show has actually concisely pulled that off without getting drug into BSG-land? Even true detective, which was basically regarded as holy around these parts completely ran out of gas in season 2.
Up towards the end of the episode i was really hoping it would just end. I'm really really scared they're going to milk way too much filler out of this concept now.
This show got better the entire season. I didn't even expect to watch it, or like it, and basically watched it on a whim just from the description. And yea, wow. They set themselves up for a really hard act to follow here.
I'm not saying i think it's going to be turbo garbage and throw it into the sun, just that i think we're going to get a lot of pretty-good-but-average-TV out of this after an excellent first season.
- Who filmed the Boardwalk Fail video? Was it Tyrell?
The skaters! or someone with them. Notice how it tracks the girl skating at the start?
posted by emptythought at 3:33 AM on September 15, 2015 [2 favorites]
Seeing this back in Recent Activity has made me want to do a rewatch already.
I mean, what if it turns out Tyrell is really the Smoke Monster?
Or worse: what if Elliot is in purgatory?! Noooooooooooo.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:12 AM on September 15, 2015 [4 favorites]
I mean, what if it turns out Tyrell is really the Smoke Monster?
Or worse: what if Elliot is in purgatory?! Noooooooooooo.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:12 AM on September 15, 2015 [4 favorites]
The skaters! or someone with them. Notice how it tracks the girl skating at the start?
Oh, duh.
Here I just assumed it to be something sinister (because I don't remember how Elliot got the video - was it on his computer? Did someone send it to him?) and that someone had secretly filmed him. But of course if you're just out filming a random video and you notice a person in the background just FALLING OFF A LEDGE of course that would be notable.
I'm not saying i think it's going to be turbo garbage and throw it into the sun, just that i think we're going to get a lot of pretty-good-but-average-TV out of this after an excellent first season.
I was listening to the Grantland Hollywood Prospectus podcast* when they were talking about this and they were saying that this was originally written as a feature film and that the entire first season we just saw was only meant to be the first act of the movie. But basically the whole thing was pretty much mapped out before it even started and USA approved a second season before the pilot even aired. I think they said (on the podcast) something about how it's written for three seasons, but that Sam Esmail said he could probably extend it to up to five seasons if need be. So hopefully that means that it was a pretty solid story from the get-go and they're not making it up as they go.
* One of the podcasters - not sure if it was Chris Ryan or Andy Greenwald - kept referring to the "honeycomb" and the "raspberry pies" in the show, which legit made me actually laugh out loud in my car every time. The other guys in the studio caught his error and would sort of laugh, but they wouldn't stop him to correct him because he was on such a roll with what he was saying every time he did it.
posted by triggerfinger at 7:26 AM on September 15, 2015 [2 favorites]
Oh, duh.
Here I just assumed it to be something sinister (because I don't remember how Elliot got the video - was it on his computer? Did someone send it to him?) and that someone had secretly filmed him. But of course if you're just out filming a random video and you notice a person in the background just FALLING OFF A LEDGE of course that would be notable.
I'm not saying i think it's going to be turbo garbage and throw it into the sun, just that i think we're going to get a lot of pretty-good-but-average-TV out of this after an excellent first season.
I was listening to the Grantland Hollywood Prospectus podcast* when they were talking about this and they were saying that this was originally written as a feature film and that the entire first season we just saw was only meant to be the first act of the movie. But basically the whole thing was pretty much mapped out before it even started and USA approved a second season before the pilot even aired. I think they said (on the podcast) something about how it's written for three seasons, but that Sam Esmail said he could probably extend it to up to five seasons if need be. So hopefully that means that it was a pretty solid story from the get-go and they're not making it up as they go.
* One of the podcasters - not sure if it was Chris Ryan or Andy Greenwald - kept referring to the "honeycomb" and the "raspberry pies" in the show, which legit made me actually laugh out loud in my car every time. The other guys in the studio caught his error and would sort of laugh, but they wouldn't stop him to correct him because he was on such a roll with what he was saying every time he did it.
posted by triggerfinger at 7:26 AM on September 15, 2015 [2 favorites]
So... is this streaming on any service yet, or do I need to wait for it to hit Netflix?
posted by mephron at 7:51 PM on September 15, 2015
posted by mephron at 7:51 PM on September 15, 2015
Streaming on Amazon (not Prime though)
posted by travertina at 8:36 AM on September 25, 2015
posted by travertina at 8:36 AM on September 25, 2015
Mr. Robot: every title and episode explained
posted by Room 641-A at 4:21 PM on October 19, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 4:21 PM on October 19, 2015 [2 favorites]
Completely LOST* it for me from ep 8.5 onwards. I must be the only hater here who thoughts that the show's lazy descent into cliche and really bad dialog writing was PAINFUL......I just wanted it to END.
posted by lalochezia at 7:47 PM on February 12, 2016
posted by lalochezia at 7:47 PM on February 12, 2016
I can't believe that I managed to stretch watching this season out over the course of 6 months, because it's really, really good.
Some random thoughts on this episode:
A ransomware attack is surprisingly topical, and doesn't even seem like it was jammed into the plot. Good job, writers.
Man, fuck Lenny. (But, also, why is he here? To bring Krista back into the story? He's not credible enough to be a threat.)
I smiled when Trenton freed the dogs.
I'll join the chorus that the Joanna scene was offputting, even by this show's standards. Also, what's her angle? Joanna's world-swallowing ambitions (and capacity to achieve those ambitions) seem like they might be even bigger than her husband's.
Phillip Price is one of the more intriguing characters. Multiple times in this episode, I fell for the gambit of thinking that he might actually be a sympathetic character, only to have that abruptly subverted. My skin crawled when he threw the $100 bills on the table, and also when he very abruptly launched into the "I'm glad he's dead" speech just before walking away. This guy is evil in a way that even Tyrell can't comprehend.
E-Corp has one hell of an imposing atrium. Where was that filmed?
Speaking of that, the location work on this show was excellent. I'm surprised and delighted that USA had the budget for that!
How much of this episode only existed in Elliot's head? Did the hack even happen? Elliot's progressive breakdown plus the "Empty Times Square" scene set a lot of this episode into doubt.
posted by schmod at 10:17 PM on April 20, 2016
Some random thoughts on this episode:
A ransomware attack is surprisingly topical, and doesn't even seem like it was jammed into the plot. Good job, writers.
Man, fuck Lenny. (But, also, why is he here? To bring Krista back into the story? He's not credible enough to be a threat.)
I smiled when Trenton freed the dogs.
I'll join the chorus that the Joanna scene was offputting, even by this show's standards. Also, what's her angle? Joanna's world-swallowing ambitions (and capacity to achieve those ambitions) seem like they might be even bigger than her husband's.
Phillip Price is one of the more intriguing characters. Multiple times in this episode, I fell for the gambit of thinking that he might actually be a sympathetic character, only to have that abruptly subverted. My skin crawled when he threw the $100 bills on the table, and also when he very abruptly launched into the "I'm glad he's dead" speech just before walking away. This guy is evil in a way that even Tyrell can't comprehend.
E-Corp has one hell of an imposing atrium. Where was that filmed?
Speaking of that, the location work on this show was excellent. I'm surprised and delighted that USA had the budget for that!
How much of this episode only existed in Elliot's head? Did the hack even happen? Elliot's progressive breakdown plus the "Empty Times Square" scene set a lot of this episode into doubt.
posted by schmod at 10:17 PM on April 20, 2016
Late to this conversation, as I just finished the show. But we all agree that when Elliot goes to answer the door, it's Tyrell there, right? And the two of them are now weirdly simpatico, and will work together in the next season?
posted by jbickers at 7:14 AM on May 3, 2016
posted by jbickers at 7:14 AM on May 3, 2016
Ooh, exciting, I think I need a re-watch!
Meanwhile....
Hacker fans give Mr. Robot website free security checkup -- Days after USA Network patches XSS bug, hacker finds a way to inject SQL code.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:12 AM on May 17, 2016 [1 favorite]
Meanwhile....
Hacker fans give Mr. Robot website free security checkup -- Days after USA Network patches XSS bug, hacker finds a way to inject SQL code.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:12 AM on May 17, 2016 [1 favorite]
Catching up before watching the season two opener.. Did no one else automatically assume Elliot (well, Mr. Robot, actually) had killed Tyrell with the popcorn machine gun? He was looking right at it at the end of the last episode. And this episode showed us that Mr. Robot will appear when threatened.. and I'm assuming Tyrell was about to stop the hack or maybe come away with the encryption key somehow (I have to rewatch that ending..) and so upon seeing the gun and the opportunity, Mr. Robot jumped in to take Tyrell out. I thought part of Elliot's fear was that he might have committed murder.
And the Joanna scene was creepy af, although I came away feeling she is just as confused as the rest of us and may be quietly freaking out, herself, at Tyrell going missing. But I have no explanation for the Danish.
posted by antinomia at 8:28 PM on July 13, 2016
And the Joanna scene was creepy af, although I came away feeling she is just as confused as the rest of us and may be quietly freaking out, herself, at Tyrell going missing. But I have no explanation for the Danish.
posted by antinomia at 8:28 PM on July 13, 2016
schmod this is way late now but the E corp atrium where the press conference scene is shot is Gotham Hall, a former bank now event space.
posted by Wretch729 at 11:15 AM on August 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Wretch729 at 11:15 AM on August 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
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posted by sparkletone at 9:37 PM on September 2, 2015