Sleepy Hollow: Ragnarok
April 8, 2016 6:55 PM - Season 3, Episode 18 - Subscribe
It's the end of the show as we know it. (Season finale)
How very bizarre. The chemistry between Crane and Abbie made the show, terrible decision to kill her off.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:56 PM on April 8, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:56 PM on April 8, 2016 [6 favorites]
The only way this ending makes any sense is if Nicole Beharie wanted to be written off the show, as rumored. Still doesn't make it any less craptastic, but it reminds me of when Linda Hamilton wanted out of CBS' Beauty & the Beast after the end of S2 -- there's no good way to write Beauty out of "Beauty & the Beast", and there's no good way to write Abbie Mills out of Sleepy Hollow. The show has proved already with both Katrina and Betsy that no good comes of having a substitute Abbie. Tom Mison is a precious cinnamon roll, but, I do not want to see him captaining Washington's secret army alongside some new random actress. I pray to all the TV gods that a cancellation announcement is imminent.
posted by oh yeah! at 7:58 PM on April 8, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by oh yeah! at 7:58 PM on April 8, 2016 [5 favorites]
Stopped watching this show after season two seemed to forget everything that made the show great in season one. Then I heard about Abbie. Just... What the fuck? How did things go so wrong after such a promising start?
posted by tobascodagama at 8:26 PM on April 8, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 8:26 PM on April 8, 2016 [2 favorites]
How did things go so wrong after such a promising start?
I'll take Racism & Misogyny for $200, Alex.
posted by oh yeah! at 8:57 PM on April 8, 2016 [10 favorites]
I'll take Racism & Misogyny for $200, Alex.
posted by oh yeah! at 8:57 PM on April 8, 2016 [10 favorites]
In retrospect, I think season 2 will prove to have been the death blow to the show. It was such an endless, meandering slog. I could barely bring myself to keep watching the show even then.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:04 AM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Thorzdad at 5:04 AM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
From The Hollywood Reporter - "The [season] finale featuring the tragic death of Abbie Mills was a very dramatic ending and a bold move for the show, but Sleepy Hollow has always been known for its shocking finales," producers 20th Century Fox Television and showrunner Clifton Campbell said in a joint statement to THR. "We feel we provided a wonderfully poignant conclusion for Abbie and showed some of the best moments between the Witnesses that we’ve seen onscreen. We thank Nicole Beharie for bringing Abbie and Sleepy Hollow to life. We are currently discussing season four, and should the series be picked up for another season, we have some exciting scenarios and new avenues we want to explore."
Burn It Down. The more I think about that ending the angrier I get. Bad enough to write her out, but to turn her into nothing but a vehicle for Crane's destiny, to make her last words "my job was to carry you forward." So insulting.
posted by oh yeah! at 6:18 AM on April 9, 2016 [2 favorites]
Burn It Down. The more I think about that ending the angrier I get. Bad enough to write her out, but to turn her into nothing but a vehicle for Crane's destiny, to make her last words "my job was to carry you forward." So insulting.
posted by oh yeah! at 6:18 AM on April 9, 2016 [2 favorites]
For me, the show sidelined one of the better aspects of the show, namely Crane's being a stranger in a strange land. They mostly used it as joke material, rather than build episodes around how an 18th century man takes to a 21st century world. In fact, I thought they wrote Crane as pretty-much having no serious issues with adjusting to the modern world. I mean, he drove a damned car in at least one episode, for pete's sake.
I get that he's a learned Renaissance man, but, sheesh. Not near enough scenes of jaw-dropping awe, as one might expect. Like marveling at something the size of a 747, and then seeing it lift off the ground and fly away. Or, did I miss that scene?
posted by Thorzdad at 7:10 AM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
I get that he's a learned Renaissance man, but, sheesh. Not near enough scenes of jaw-dropping awe, as one might expect. Like marveling at something the size of a 747, and then seeing it lift off the ground and fly away. Or, did I miss that scene?
posted by Thorzdad at 7:10 AM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
Well, at last it proved two things I've been defending for a while:
1) Headless was the best thing they had going against the witnesses. 2 minutes of him pumping a shotgun and waving an axe around were better than any villain they had since (and they had John Noble and Peter Mensah on the role).
2) Zach Appelman was perfectly cast as Clancy Brown's son.
As for Abbie, without knowing if Beharie wanted out or not (the word was that for very good reason, she was already tuning out by season 2), I really can't comment on the decision to kill Abbie off was wrong. It was handled terribly on-screen, for all that matters.
I just hope this dies off, and everyone can find better managed projects to work in. The lunacy in S01 was not sustainable, but it didn't really have to be. Make it a closed four seasons, each warding off a different horseman, and next year we'd have a big-ass battle between the witnesses and Moloch backed by the four horseman as the series finale. Instead...
posted by lmfsilva at 8:13 AM on April 9, 2016 [2 favorites]
1) Headless was the best thing they had going against the witnesses. 2 minutes of him pumping a shotgun and waving an axe around were better than any villain they had since (and they had John Noble and Peter Mensah on the role).
2) Zach Appelman was perfectly cast as Clancy Brown's son.
As for Abbie, without knowing if Beharie wanted out or not (the word was that for very good reason, she was already tuning out by season 2), I really can't comment on the decision to kill Abbie off was wrong. It was handled terribly on-screen, for all that matters.
I just hope this dies off, and everyone can find better managed projects to work in. The lunacy in S01 was not sustainable, but it didn't really have to be. Make it a closed four seasons, each warding off a different horseman, and next year we'd have a big-ass battle between the witnesses and Moloch backed by the four horseman as the series finale. Instead...
posted by lmfsilva at 8:13 AM on April 9, 2016 [2 favorites]
Well, it looks like Orlando Jones won't be back next season either, in case you needed another reason to quit the show
posted by bibliowench at 12:06 PM on April 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by bibliowench at 12:06 PM on April 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
As for Abbie, without knowing if Beharie wanted out or not (the word was that for very good reason, she was already tuning out by season 2)
Care to elaborate on what that very good reason is?
I didn't follow the show regularly, but the show seemed to want to ignore the chemistry between its two leads to ridiculous degrees.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:40 PM on April 9, 2016
Care to elaborate on what that very good reason is?
I didn't follow the show regularly, but the show seemed to want to ignore the chemistry between its two leads to ridiculous degrees.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:40 PM on April 9, 2016
The writers messing up with the formula of the first season and sidelining her character for a part of season 2? I'm pretty sure that was not what she signed on. Or the audience.
posted by lmfsilva at 1:31 PM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by lmfsilva at 1:31 PM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
Well, it looks like Orlando Jones won't be back next season either, in case you needed another reason to quit the show
That Orlando was fired is not new info - he said back in December 2015 that he was asked to leave.
Care to elaborate on what that very good reason is?
There's the in-front-of-the-camera reasons of the fact that her character was continually sidelined in season 2 in favor of Crane/Katrina, and the shoe-horning of Hawley into the cast. Behind-the-camera, it appears that she was also being disrespected - that Mison was invited to do DVD commentary when she was not, that she had to remind the official show twitter account to follow her. And, this is the same network that offered Gillian Anderson half the money that they offered Duchovny for the X-Files reboot, so I would not be surprised to learn that there was some kind of disparity there (though that's pure speculation on my part, not something I've seen mentioned in any articles or tumblr posts so far). I expect that if there's more dirt it's not going to come out anytime soon, so she doesn't seem like she's burning bridges.
posted by oh yeah! at 1:31 PM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
That Orlando was fired is not new info - he said back in December 2015 that he was asked to leave.
Care to elaborate on what that very good reason is?
There's the in-front-of-the-camera reasons of the fact that her character was continually sidelined in season 2 in favor of Crane/Katrina, and the shoe-horning of Hawley into the cast. Behind-the-camera, it appears that she was also being disrespected - that Mison was invited to do DVD commentary when she was not, that she had to remind the official show twitter account to follow her. And, this is the same network that offered Gillian Anderson half the money that they offered Duchovny for the X-Files reboot, so I would not be surprised to learn that there was some kind of disparity there (though that's pure speculation on my part, not something I've seen mentioned in any articles or tumblr posts so far). I expect that if there's more dirt it's not going to come out anytime soon, so she doesn't seem like she's burning bridges.
posted by oh yeah! at 1:31 PM on April 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
The writers messing up with the formula of the first season and sidelining her character for a part of season 2? I'm pretty sure that was not what she signed on. Or the audience.
Which is why I tuned out. The io9 thread is all 'racism', which seems odd based in the show I fell for in season one, but I stopped watching after the show got Hawleyed, so I'll just assume there's a broad truth in there that things got much, much worse.
So much damned squandered potential.
I mean, season one was one of the strongest first seasons for a show that - on paper seemed an objectively terrible idea - and they pissed it away... and then kept digging the latrine, it seems.
posted by Mezentian at 6:01 PM on April 9, 2016
Which is why I tuned out. The io9 thread is all 'racism', which seems odd based in the show I fell for in season one, but I stopped watching after the show got Hawleyed, so I'll just assume there's a broad truth in there that things got much, much worse.
So much damned squandered potential.
I mean, season one was one of the strongest first seasons for a show that - on paper seemed an objectively terrible idea - and they pissed it away... and then kept digging the latrine, it seems.
posted by Mezentian at 6:01 PM on April 9, 2016
The io9 thread is all 'racism',
Side question: how do people read io9 threads for any length? Don't you have to constantly reload the page and then get a lot of repeat comments you've already read?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:51 PM on April 9, 2016
Side question: how do people read io9 threads for any length? Don't you have to constantly reload the page and then get a lot of repeat comments you've already read?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:51 PM on April 9, 2016
I click on 'Read All' (assuming I am interested enough), and just keep reading down until I get to the end, or get bored, and then walk away, because I'm not 'engaged' there.
I assume, if you are logged in, there's a way to see most recent comments, but I hear bad things about Kinja, so who knows?
posted by Mezentian at 7:04 PM on April 9, 2016
I assume, if you are logged in, there's a way to see most recent comments, but I hear bad things about Kinja, so who knows?
posted by Mezentian at 7:04 PM on April 9, 2016
Nope, am logged in, but reading the comments is just a shitshow of bad design.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:14 PM on April 9, 2016
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:14 PM on April 9, 2016
Good summary: Why Sleepy Hollow Lost Any Faith Fans Had Left in it -- Vulture
posted by oh yeah! at 7:19 PM on April 9, 2016
posted by oh yeah! at 7:19 PM on April 9, 2016
Maybe they'll fix it in Season Four ... without Irving or the Mills sisters, or the Headless Horseman.
Maybe they should move Crane to California. He can get a batchelor pad on the beach. It'll be hilarious.
posted by Mezentian at 7:23 PM on April 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
Maybe they should move Crane to California. He can get a batchelor pad on the beach. It'll be hilarious.
posted by Mezentian at 7:23 PM on April 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
The io9 thread is all 'racism', which seems odd based in the show I fell for in season one, but I stopped watching after the show got Hawleyed, so I'll just assume there's a broad truth in there that things got much, much worse.
My take is the producers/Fox were unhappy with the demographics of the show, aka "the wrong people are watching" (joke's on them! nobody is now!), and then reshuffled some things, such as giving more screen time to Katrina (without making her more than a wafer-thin character) and introducing the total waste that was Hawley at the expense of the sisters and Irving, and removing any hint of threat from Headless in favour of the Crane family drama (wasting John Noble), while forgetting the fish-out-of-the-water and acid-trip history (look, you want to have Katrina dress like a modern goth? make her casually mention she was searching an old legend about a welsh witch, and she found this Stevie Nicks quite dashing in appearance, but so, so wrong on history) for mostly generic witchicisms.
Then, this season was squandered by wasting Mensah and Sossamon going on circles without transpiring any menace, Beharie looking uninterested for half the season, pulling Betsy Ross out of someone's ass because it's incredible how Crane never mentioned her before, dropping that Mills Sr. was after all Black Helsing, killing Joe (who was one of the new characters that actually fitted in), and struggling to find any balance at all. It tries so hard to throw shit and see what sticks it made the cliff-hangery ending pointless - all of that Washington's Secret Society could have been settled on a season Premiere.
So, racism? Yeah. But more than that, the show was aimless for most part of it's run. The show could have Katrina in modern times aiding the witnesses in a secondary role (If the shippers are still whining, I'd usually say "fuck them", but the writers have been flirting with the CraneLovesAbbie idea all season long, so fuck them instead) if she was properly developed as a character. THO/Pandora could have been decent villains if they were properly developed. Hawley and Betsy Ross could have been decent secondary characters if were properly developed.
Seeing a pattern?
Because this is what I think it boils down to. I don't think the show was being intentionally racist (after all, it still introduced Reynolds, Foster, THO, Pandora and Ezra on the third season, and other than Ezra, they could have been all lily white), but after the first season it certainly made concessions based on racial demographics that took things the show did best (chemistry between leads) without compensating with anything else. It still had it's charming moments throughout the second and third seasons (the "slide to unlock" is perhaps the greatest Crane moment), but at this point, we're talking about Family Guy levels of decay - like the one good/delightfully stupid joke they get every episode doesn't justify FG dragging on, even with Beharie still on board I couldn't find any reasons to keep this going.
posted by lmfsilva at 2:17 AM on April 10, 2016 [2 favorites]
My take is the producers/Fox were unhappy with the demographics of the show, aka "the wrong people are watching" (joke's on them! nobody is now!), and then reshuffled some things, such as giving more screen time to Katrina (without making her more than a wafer-thin character) and introducing the total waste that was Hawley at the expense of the sisters and Irving, and removing any hint of threat from Headless in favour of the Crane family drama (wasting John Noble), while forgetting the fish-out-of-the-water and acid-trip history (look, you want to have Katrina dress like a modern goth? make her casually mention she was searching an old legend about a welsh witch, and she found this Stevie Nicks quite dashing in appearance, but so, so wrong on history) for mostly generic witchicisms.
Then, this season was squandered by wasting Mensah and Sossamon going on circles without transpiring any menace, Beharie looking uninterested for half the season, pulling Betsy Ross out of someone's ass because it's incredible how Crane never mentioned her before, dropping that Mills Sr. was after all Black Helsing, killing Joe (who was one of the new characters that actually fitted in), and struggling to find any balance at all. It tries so hard to throw shit and see what sticks it made the cliff-hangery ending pointless - all of that Washington's Secret Society could have been settled on a season Premiere.
So, racism? Yeah. But more than that, the show was aimless for most part of it's run. The show could have Katrina in modern times aiding the witnesses in a secondary role (If the shippers are still whining, I'd usually say "fuck them", but the writers have been flirting with the CraneLovesAbbie idea all season long, so fuck them instead) if she was properly developed as a character. THO/Pandora could have been decent villains if they were properly developed. Hawley and Betsy Ross could have been decent secondary characters if were properly developed.
Seeing a pattern?
Because this is what I think it boils down to. I don't think the show was being intentionally racist (after all, it still introduced Reynolds, Foster, THO, Pandora and Ezra on the third season, and other than Ezra, they could have been all lily white), but after the first season it certainly made concessions based on racial demographics that took things the show did best (chemistry between leads) without compensating with anything else. It still had it's charming moments throughout the second and third seasons (the "slide to unlock" is perhaps the greatest Crane moment), but at this point, we're talking about Family Guy levels of decay - like the one good/delightfully stupid joke they get every episode doesn't justify FG dragging on, even with Beharie still on board I couldn't find any reasons to keep this going.
posted by lmfsilva at 2:17 AM on April 10, 2016 [2 favorites]
I guess I have to go contrarian on the whole idea that Abbie and Crane should have hooked-up. Honestly, I was very glad that their relationship didn't go there. For me, having the two leads fall in love is one of the most overused memes in all television, and it usually doesn't do anything other than muddy the waters.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:44 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Thorzdad at 5:44 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
I guess I have to go contrarian on the whole idea that Abbie and Crane should have hooked-up
I support you.
posted by Mezentian at 5:47 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
I support you.
posted by Mezentian at 5:47 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
I would have enjoyed seeing them get together and having to deal with all sorts of messy race issues, presuming it was done under different writers.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:50 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:50 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
In general, I agree that it's an overused trope -- was very annoyed at Warehouse 13 for turning Pete/Myka into a couple after having such a good run of them as non-romantic partners, or Person of Interest turning Carter into Reese's love interest right before they killed her off. But I can understand why the Ichabbie shippers feel especially cheated, since the show teased the possibility of it going canon all season with multiple characters telling Crane he was in love with Abbie. And I remember when the movie "Belle" came out people were pointing out how rare it is for a movie/show to have a story where the black woman gets to be the princess in the tower, to be rescued instead of having to be the strong one. So, in avoiding one trope, it seems that the show stepped right into another one.
This tumblr post sums it up well - "Every black woman character I’ve seen when written by white writers has been delegated to the stereotypes of mammy, jezebel, or sapphire. They are portrayed to the ultimate extremes of hypersexualization or desexualization. Always there to prop up the white fave, always there to protect or die for them if need be. Just props and tools, never actual people. And if they EVER get even in walking distance to a man deemed “too good” for them, white fandom starts having a case of the “platonics”, wondering why the black woman needs a romantic male interest when PLENTY of heterosexual ones have been shown throughout the years. NEVER MIND the fact that those have been exclusively WHITE ones, NEVER MIND the fact every time a new heterosexual white romance pops up in the present ain’t no one gives a shit. No it’s only an issue when it’s a WoC, particularly if she’s black, and ESPECIALLY if she’s dark-skinned."
So, yeah. It's not my ship, but as a white woman I'm not going to rail against it. I don't think my wanting them to be platonic is racistly-motivated (I mean, I do truly adore a great platonic ship - I watch "Guarding Tess" every damn time it pops up on cable), but it is pretty ridiculous that the writers were throwing multiple love interests at Crane, while giving Abbie got nothing but a couple of exes in S1 & 2 and then her one & only on-screen kiss in S3.
posted by oh yeah! at 7:56 AM on April 10, 2016 [5 favorites]
This tumblr post sums it up well - "Every black woman character I’ve seen when written by white writers has been delegated to the stereotypes of mammy, jezebel, or sapphire. They are portrayed to the ultimate extremes of hypersexualization or desexualization. Always there to prop up the white fave, always there to protect or die for them if need be. Just props and tools, never actual people. And if they EVER get even in walking distance to a man deemed “too good” for them, white fandom starts having a case of the “platonics”, wondering why the black woman needs a romantic male interest when PLENTY of heterosexual ones have been shown throughout the years. NEVER MIND the fact that those have been exclusively WHITE ones, NEVER MIND the fact every time a new heterosexual white romance pops up in the present ain’t no one gives a shit. No it’s only an issue when it’s a WoC, particularly if she’s black, and ESPECIALLY if she’s dark-skinned."
So, yeah. It's not my ship, but as a white woman I'm not going to rail against it. I don't think my wanting them to be platonic is racistly-motivated (I mean, I do truly adore a great platonic ship - I watch "Guarding Tess" every damn time it pops up on cable), but it is pretty ridiculous that the writers were throwing multiple love interests at Crane, while giving Abbie got nothing but a couple of exes in S1 & 2 and then her one & only on-screen kiss in S3.
posted by oh yeah! at 7:56 AM on April 10, 2016 [5 favorites]
My thing against the shippers is that the boat was being built when Katrina was still alive and Crane trying to bring her back. I really don't see him cheating on his wife, or Abbie willing to go that route, either. As of the first two seasons, it would be completely out of character for both of them. This season, less so, and the writers seemed to be hinting that way for a potential S04 plotline.
That's not to say there are legitimate complaints about how Abbie's personal life was written in the show, but really, part of the frustration seems to be coming not because the show wasted a lot of potential running in circles and underdeveloping every single character, but because their precious shipping came to nothing. I get why people got upset, but of all things that fucked up the show, not Moonlighting right away ranks pretty low on it.
posted by lmfsilva at 8:45 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
That's not to say there are legitimate complaints about how Abbie's personal life was written in the show, but really, part of the frustration seems to be coming not because the show wasted a lot of potential running in circles and underdeveloping every single character, but because their precious shipping came to nothing. I get why people got upset, but of all things that fucked up the show, not Moonlighting right away ranks pretty low on it.
posted by lmfsilva at 8:45 AM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, that's the way to go, disparaging other peoples wishes for fictional characters.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:33 PM on April 10, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:33 PM on April 10, 2016 [4 favorites]
Bleh. The whole season was a slog and without Beharie there's little reason to care if the show continues. Also: Worst-Handled. Shittiest. Television. Death. Ever.
posted by eyeballkid at 11:29 PM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by eyeballkid at 11:29 PM on April 10, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's so disheartening to me the number of problems this show could've avoid if they didn't consistently sideline Abbie for no reason at all. Season 2 was a long slog of "can Katrina be trusted? Can Henry be redeemed?" where the answers were very obviously "lol no" and "lol fuck no" from the very beginning. But what would that've looked like if it had shared time--equal time, not one and a half episodes--with Abbie's quest to find out what happened to her mother (which still had a ton of dangling threads and unanswered questions that will now never get addressed)? Or if Ichabod had seem genuinely torn between his loyalty to Abbie and to his family instead of him throwing her under the bus at every occasion for people who kept betraying him and her shrugging it off, largely?
Season one worked so well because of the crazy chemistry, yes, but also because the two characters were foils to one another, and there was a joy in watching them adapt to one another and illuminate unexpected sides of the other. I wonder what happened in the writer's room, because the stuff for Abbie seemed relatively strong, even as there was less and less of it, while Ichabod's stuff got flatter and broader and took up more of the show.
But the thing that really stings is the lie it puts to the whole "representation will happen when it becomes profitable!" that is sometimes used as a justification for the overwhelming homogeneity of most media. Because they fucking knew. The fan base and the critical response in season one was very vocal that Abbie Mills was a huge part of what people loved. The way the writers and producers talked about the show made it clear that they knew this. The response to the second and third season had people vocally unhappy about how minimizing her was hurting the show. But they kept doing it. They could've had something X-Files big, or at least a show with a solid dedicated audience like Fringe. But they don't, because they couldn't stop slighting a black female character, and the actor who played her (who herself was vocal about being an SFF fan who felt incredibly lucky to play the hero), and the fan base that responded to her.
posted by Krom Tatman at 6:17 PM on April 14, 2016 [4 favorites]
Season one worked so well because of the crazy chemistry, yes, but also because the two characters were foils to one another, and there was a joy in watching them adapt to one another and illuminate unexpected sides of the other. I wonder what happened in the writer's room, because the stuff for Abbie seemed relatively strong, even as there was less and less of it, while Ichabod's stuff got flatter and broader and took up more of the show.
But the thing that really stings is the lie it puts to the whole "representation will happen when it becomes profitable!" that is sometimes used as a justification for the overwhelming homogeneity of most media. Because they fucking knew. The fan base and the critical response in season one was very vocal that Abbie Mills was a huge part of what people loved. The way the writers and producers talked about the show made it clear that they knew this. The response to the second and third season had people vocally unhappy about how minimizing her was hurting the show. But they kept doing it. They could've had something X-Files big, or at least a show with a solid dedicated audience like Fringe. But they don't, because they couldn't stop slighting a black female character, and the actor who played her (who herself was vocal about being an SFF fan who felt incredibly lucky to play the hero), and the fan base that responded to her.
posted by Krom Tatman at 6:17 PM on April 14, 2016 [4 favorites]
I actually saw the spoilers before I watched the episode since I tend to watch them 2 or 3 at a time in one sitting. With this development, I'm not watching the rest of the season and I am certainly not watching a 4th season with Abbie gone. I stuck through that crappy second season and had hopes for this season, but a show minus Nicole Beharie is a bridge too far.
Ship or not to ship - as everyone with eyeballs could see the two stars of the show had overflowing chemistry. Whether you interpreted that as romantic or platonic differed, but they were central to the success of the show. I would have enjoyed them as a romantic couple or not because they were just wonderful to watch together on screen no matter how their relationship was defined. If they never became a couple on the show, I would always have fanfiction :)
Some people are comparing her departure to an X-Files without Scully. I find that a bit funny, since the show actually had one of the main leads depart, but I guess people have scrubbed those Mulderless seasons from their memory! They also seem to forget that Mulder and Scully moved from platonic to "platonic" to romantic, but I guess not everyone watched as obsessively as I did.
Anyway, goodbye Sleepy Hollow. We will always have batshitinsane Season One to remember and enjoy.
posted by Julnyes at 9:14 AM on April 27, 2016
Ship or not to ship - as everyone with eyeballs could see the two stars of the show had overflowing chemistry. Whether you interpreted that as romantic or platonic differed, but they were central to the success of the show. I would have enjoyed them as a romantic couple or not because they were just wonderful to watch together on screen no matter how their relationship was defined. If they never became a couple on the show, I would always have fanfiction :)
Some people are comparing her departure to an X-Files without Scully. I find that a bit funny, since the show actually had one of the main leads depart, but I guess people have scrubbed those Mulderless seasons from their memory! They also seem to forget that Mulder and Scully moved from platonic to "platonic" to romantic, but I guess not everyone watched as obsessively as I did.
Anyway, goodbye Sleepy Hollow. We will always have batshitinsane Season One to remember and enjoy.
posted by Julnyes at 9:14 AM on April 27, 2016
I think X-Files got to the point where it could lose a lead and keep going by the virtue of having delivered six solid seasons of television leading up to that departure. And also because Mulder wasn't the audience surrogate character in the way that Scully and Abby were. Like Ichabod, Mulder showed up on day one full of occult knowledge, which he doled out to a skeptical partner. By the time Mulder died, Scully had become more or less his equal in knowledge, if not in belief, so Mulder's departure played more like the death of a mentor, a milestone in Scully's Heroic Journey and a turning point in her character arc.
Whereas Abby dying is just some stupid, racist bullshit
posted by tobascodagama at 9:43 AM on April 27, 2016 [1 favorite]
Whereas Abby dying is just some stupid, racist bullshit
posted by tobascodagama at 9:43 AM on April 27, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah the whole "I've fulfilled my purpose in moving you along so I can die happy" crap not only is a never-ending racist trope, it also made NO SENSE IN THE SHOW'S OWN MYTHOLOGY!
posted by Julnyes at 11:21 AM on April 27, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Julnyes at 11:21 AM on April 27, 2016 [2 favorites]
My thing against the shippers is that the boat was being built when Katrina was still alive and Crane trying to bring her back. I really don't see him cheating on his wife, or Abbie willing to go that route, either.
Hello, I am an early season Shipper :)
When I thought of Crane and Abbie together it was never about him cheating on Katrina and the vast number of people I saw talking about them as a couple were thinking of them together after Katrina was fully gone. It was a widely held belief that the moment Katrina was released from purgatory that her spirit would pass on... leaving Crane to properly mourn her death and paving the way for the Witnesses to move forward without her. This obviously didn't happen in the show, but it was plausible. Others thought it might happen, but many seasons down the line with Katrina, once again, either dead or having chosen a life separate from Crane.
It was hard to ignore when the actors who are "just partners" have amazing chemistry and the actors who are married were more like limp biscuits.
posted by Julnyes at 11:29 AM on April 27, 2016 [2 favorites]
Hello, I am an early season Shipper :)
When I thought of Crane and Abbie together it was never about him cheating on Katrina and the vast number of people I saw talking about them as a couple were thinking of them together after Katrina was fully gone. It was a widely held belief that the moment Katrina was released from purgatory that her spirit would pass on... leaving Crane to properly mourn her death and paving the way for the Witnesses to move forward without her. This obviously didn't happen in the show, but it was plausible. Others thought it might happen, but many seasons down the line with Katrina, once again, either dead or having chosen a life separate from Crane.
It was hard to ignore when the actors who are "just partners" have amazing chemistry and the actors who are married were more like limp biscuits.
posted by Julnyes at 11:29 AM on April 27, 2016 [2 favorites]
Good news everyone!
Sleepy Hollow Has Been Renewed for a Fourth Season and I Absolutely Refuse to Watch
posted by Mezentian at 10:36 PM on May 13, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sleepy Hollow Has Been Renewed for a Fourth Season and I Absolutely Refuse to Watch
posted by Mezentian at 10:36 PM on May 13, 2016 [2 favorites]
A much bigger insult than killing off Abbie was in the first place. These assholes just love to double down, don't they?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:32 AM on May 14, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 7:32 AM on May 14, 2016
Unfuckingbelievable. I will also not be watching, and look forward to news coverage of S4's dismal ratings figures and subsequent cancellation.
posted by oh yeah! at 12:26 PM on May 14, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by oh yeah! at 12:26 PM on May 14, 2016 [1 favorite]
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posted by Thorzdad at 7:27 PM on April 8, 2016 [3 favorites]