Secret Invasion: Home
July 26, 2023 10:09 AM - Season 1, Episode 6 - Subscribe
Fury and Gravik have it out as Russia and the United States are on the brink of nuclear war.
EPISODE RECAP:
Fury calls bae (Varra/Pricillas) to have a chat on a secret burner phone, as she gathers up a few things from her wrecked home and bloodied home after last episodes attempted assassination of her behind Gravik’s soldiers. So much for that gorgeous light in the living room.
It’s a short conversation, as Fury tries to say something meaningful to his patiently listening alien shapeshifting wife, but can’t think of anything meaningful, so he says he has to go, Varra/Pricilla says he doesn’t have to, but unfortunately Fury mans up and does the usual tough guy thing and runs from the emotional aspects of the relationship. If a master spy can’t suddenly come clean to his eternally understanding wife, what’s that say for the rest of us mens?
Meanwhile SkruRhodey keeps prodding a wounded and recovering US President Ritson to start a nuclear war against those dastardly Russians and Skrulls. A navy admiral is also in the room, and stressing caution, but captain SkruRhodey overrules her and since there’s no other senior advisors in the room or on the phone, welp guess it’s going to war. The scene is nuts, like all the budget went to special effects, so they couldn’t afford to to have more than 3 or 4 actors in the room. Which is fine, ‘cause Don Cheadle gets to chew through the half assed dialogue and plot like he’s a starving man at buffet and he sells like it a salesman going for his yearly bonus.
Meanerwhile, Fury shows in Russia, to the previously agreed upon meeting place to finally have it out with Gravik. But’s a radiation rich area (where could that be), which has Fury coughing and stumbling as his human body starts falling apart from all the high exposure. Not the brightest of moves, but surely he has something up his sleeve.
Anyway, Fury and Gravik meet in the room with the machine that transforms Skrulls into SuperSkrulls. Fury has brought the Harvest, aka a collection of the DNA of all (most?) of the superpowered Avengers (sorry Clint and Nat). Gravik points out that he’s big mad ‘cause Fury let the Skrulls down by not finding them a planet and Fury’s like “yeah ok, you got a point”. Turns out Fury didn’t look too hard for a new home for the Skrulls, because having an army of shape-shifting aliens was much more useful to him.
Back by the US President’s bedside, SkruRhodey gets a call from the ever delightful Sonya, who urges him to move the President becauseFury is coming for them. So SkruRhodey starts wheeling the leader of the free world up hospital hallways so that the hero with the gun won’t kill the President. SkruRhodey isn’t the brightest diamond
Gravik gives great monologue to a dying Fury (wait, how is Fury in two places, how is that possible with shape-shifting aliens about?!). Gravik makes several excellent points bout how bad Fury messed up and let the Skrulls down, as we cut to various scenes of secret service agents being shot by someone off screen. Who could it be?!
Gravik and Fury continue jabbering away, then Gravik takes the Harvest, puts it in the fancy machine and turns it on, while Fury lies coughing and wheezing on the floor of said machine. OSHA would not approve of this.
With Gravik now SuperDuper Skrulled, he goes into finally kill Fury with punch. But surprise Fury holds him off! It’s not our man in black, but Giah herself, who has now also gotten SuperDuper Skrulled.
At the hospital, the real Fury makes his appearance to the President, urging him to stand down. SkrullRhodey says it’s bullshit, still tries to convince the President, and nobody bothers to shoot him or at least cut off a finger to convince the President that Rhodey is a Skrull. At least not until SkruRhodey goes for a gun, then he gets a bullet to the head, causing the Skkrull form to appear. The President is finally convinced and calls off the strike on Russia
Giah and Gravik have it out, via fighting and flying, showcasing the various powers they have at head. it’s a decent action scene, but the outcome is never in doubt. Giah uses Mantis’s psy powers to cause Gravik to sleep or at least have a short nap and then puts an energy bolt through his chest, so I guess she really did put him to sleep.
Giah then goes about freeing the human prisoners that the Skrulls were impersonating. Naturally one of them is the is the real Rhodey, who is in a hospital gown and can’t walk. Looks like the Skrulls were impersonating him after the events in Civil War. Hmmm, that’s a spin on things.
The US President declares all out war on an alien species on Earth, Fury and his wife make up, she joins him on the orbiting space station as a Skrull diplomat to the Kree. Meanwhile Sonya and Giah decide to do a team up to help the humans and Skrulls deal with war the President has declared as we see various styles of vigilante justice carried out against humans and Skrulls.
Yes, Maria Hill is still dead.
EPISODE RECAP:
Fury calls bae (Varra/Pricillas) to have a chat on a secret burner phone, as she gathers up a few things from her wrecked home and bloodied home after last episodes attempted assassination of her behind Gravik’s soldiers. So much for that gorgeous light in the living room.
It’s a short conversation, as Fury tries to say something meaningful to his patiently listening alien shapeshifting wife, but can’t think of anything meaningful, so he says he has to go, Varra/Pricilla says he doesn’t have to, but unfortunately Fury mans up and does the usual tough guy thing and runs from the emotional aspects of the relationship. If a master spy can’t suddenly come clean to his eternally understanding wife, what’s that say for the rest of us mens?
Meanwhile SkruRhodey keeps prodding a wounded and recovering US President Ritson to start a nuclear war against those dastardly Russians and Skrulls. A navy admiral is also in the room, and stressing caution, but captain SkruRhodey overrules her and since there’s no other senior advisors in the room or on the phone, welp guess it’s going to war. The scene is nuts, like all the budget went to special effects, so they couldn’t afford to to have more than 3 or 4 actors in the room. Which is fine, ‘cause Don Cheadle gets to chew through the half assed dialogue and plot like he’s a starving man at buffet and he sells like it a salesman going for his yearly bonus.
Meanerwhile, Fury shows in Russia, to the previously agreed upon meeting place to finally have it out with Gravik. But’s a radiation rich area (where could that be), which has Fury coughing and stumbling as his human body starts falling apart from all the high exposure. Not the brightest of moves, but surely he has something up his sleeve.
Anyway, Fury and Gravik meet in the room with the machine that transforms Skrulls into SuperSkrulls. Fury has brought the Harvest, aka a collection of the DNA of all (most?) of the superpowered Avengers (sorry Clint and Nat). Gravik points out that he’s big mad ‘cause Fury let the Skrulls down by not finding them a planet and Fury’s like “yeah ok, you got a point”. Turns out Fury didn’t look too hard for a new home for the Skrulls, because having an army of shape-shifting aliens was much more useful to him.
Back by the US President’s bedside, SkruRhodey gets a call from the ever delightful Sonya, who urges him to move the President becauseFury is coming for them. So SkruRhodey starts wheeling the leader of the free world up hospital hallways so that the hero with the gun won’t kill the President. SkruRhodey isn’t the brightest diamond
Gravik gives great monologue to a dying Fury (wait, how is Fury in two places, how is that possible with shape-shifting aliens about?!). Gravik makes several excellent points bout how bad Fury messed up and let the Skrulls down, as we cut to various scenes of secret service agents being shot by someone off screen. Who could it be?!
Gravik and Fury continue jabbering away, then Gravik takes the Harvest, puts it in the fancy machine and turns it on, while Fury lies coughing and wheezing on the floor of said machine. OSHA would not approve of this.
With Gravik now SuperDuper Skrulled, he goes into finally kill Fury with punch. But surprise Fury holds him off! It’s not our man in black, but Giah herself, who has now also gotten SuperDuper Skrulled.
At the hospital, the real Fury makes his appearance to the President, urging him to stand down. SkrullRhodey says it’s bullshit, still tries to convince the President, and nobody bothers to shoot him or at least cut off a finger to convince the President that Rhodey is a Skrull. At least not until SkruRhodey goes for a gun, then he gets a bullet to the head, causing the Skkrull form to appear. The President is finally convinced and calls off the strike on Russia
Giah and Gravik have it out, via fighting and flying, showcasing the various powers they have at head. it’s a decent action scene, but the outcome is never in doubt. Giah uses Mantis’s psy powers to cause Gravik to sleep or at least have a short nap and then puts an energy bolt through his chest, so I guess she really did put him to sleep.
Giah then goes about freeing the human prisoners that the Skrulls were impersonating. Naturally one of them is the is the real Rhodey, who is in a hospital gown and can’t walk. Looks like the Skrulls were impersonating him after the events in Civil War. Hmmm, that’s a spin on things.
The US President declares all out war on an alien species on Earth, Fury and his wife make up, she joins him on the orbiting space station as a Skrull diplomat to the Kree. Meanwhile Sonya and Giah decide to do a team up to help the humans and Skrulls deal with war the President has declared as we see various styles of vigilante justice carried out against humans and Skrulls.
Yes, Maria Hill is still dead.
I chortled all the way through your write-up Brandon Blatcher. Thank you for being more entertaining that I suspect the entire show was. And, no, I'm not going to bother to watch it.
posted by sardonyx at 11:03 AM on July 26, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by sardonyx at 11:03 AM on July 26, 2023 [7 favorites]
so Giah is now the most powerful person in the MCU? Also, as the US has declared war on aliens on earth, have they forgotten the asgardians in Norway? Is the US at war with Norway now?
The series was a bit disappointing in my opinion.
posted by alchemist at 11:25 AM on July 26, 2023 [9 favorites]
The series was a bit disappointing in my opinion.
posted by alchemist at 11:25 AM on July 26, 2023 [9 favorites]
The series was a bit disappointing in my opinion.
Agreed, which makes no sense because the cast was absolutely fantastic, it was like a good mine of solid talent. They wasted it for another punchout fest.
I could (and was tempted) to go through the series and point out all the dumb plot points, but ain't nobody got time for that.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:33 AM on July 26, 2023 [6 favorites]
Agreed, which makes no sense because the cast was absolutely fantastic, it was like a good mine of solid talent. They wasted it for another punchout fest.
I could (and was tempted) to go through the series and point out all the dumb plot points, but ain't nobody got time for that.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:33 AM on July 26, 2023 [6 favorites]
This whole series felt like the writers’ strike started early.
posted by sixswitch at 11:35 AM on July 26, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by sixswitch at 11:35 AM on July 26, 2023 [12 favorites]
Maybe, just maybe... the MCU doesn't need to continue indefinitely.
(I made it longer than most before crapping out, so no judgment.)
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:18 PM on July 26, 2023
(I made it longer than most before crapping out, so no judgment.)
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:18 PM on July 26, 2023
The implication is that Rhodey has been a Skrull since after Civil War. That means he doesn't know who Dr. Strange, Black Panther, or the Guardians are, has no idea about Wakanda, the Infinity War, the Blip, or the death of Tony and Nat.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:30 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:30 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
I didn't watch last week, and after reading the recap I don't think I'll bother with finishing the series. Very disappointing. I was looking forward to an MCU Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy but the plot of this was just so ridiculous that I don't think it's worth my time.
posted by synecdoche at 3:42 PM on July 26, 2023
posted by synecdoche at 3:42 PM on July 26, 2023
Yeah, I assume Rhodey needed help because he was still post Civil War accident Rhodey, and not pre-accident and just a Skrull Husk for over a decade? I mean it's mostly moot in the day-to-day presentation of the character since Stark's nanobot suits means Rhodey just walks like normal.
I'm looking forward to The Marvels, but mostly on the strength of Iman Vellani's Ms. Marvel? I mean yeah ok fine Brie Larson and Teyonah Parris too, but Ms. Marvel was among the best of the current crop of MCUTV, and it's a shame it's probably not going to have a second season.
posted by Kyol at 6:15 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
I'm looking forward to The Marvels, but mostly on the strength of Iman Vellani's Ms. Marvel? I mean yeah ok fine Brie Larson and Teyonah Parris too, but Ms. Marvel was among the best of the current crop of MCUTV, and it's a shame it's probably not going to have a second season.
posted by Kyol at 6:15 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
> I could (and was tempted) to go through the series and point out all the dumb plot points, but ain't nobody got time for that.
I'm specifically annoyed at:
* Maria getting offed for a fairly dumb false-ID reason, soon after telling Fury maybe he wasn't at the top of his game.
* the Skrull machine can duplicate powers from DNA samples, in about a minute? this apparently includes Captain Marvel, who I'd thought partially had powers based on an Infinity Stone. this device seems like something overpowered that utterly breaks world building.
How I misread IMDB early on:
* the Olivia Colman role had a "/?" earlier, so I was thinking, ooh, maybe she's Kree!
* Cobie Smulders was listed for every episode, and again, arrrgh.
Elsewhere:
* the bad guy was a Ken in the Barbie movie, and, uh, I don't know. Bad Ken! Bad!
Going forward:
* oh great, a hateful, racist?, speciesist? president. what a totally theoretical, interesting, idea. it's lovely and a nice change of pace from *vaguely gestures at everything*. how fun!
* how many Skrulls are still around? between 1 and a million?
> Yes, Maria Hill is still dead.
And I'm still mad.
posted by Pronoiac at 7:01 PM on July 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
I'm specifically annoyed at:
* Maria getting offed for a fairly dumb false-ID reason, soon after telling Fury maybe he wasn't at the top of his game.
* the Skrull machine can duplicate powers from DNA samples, in about a minute? this apparently includes Captain Marvel, who I'd thought partially had powers based on an Infinity Stone. this device seems like something overpowered that utterly breaks world building.
How I misread IMDB early on:
* the Olivia Colman role had a "/?" earlier, so I was thinking, ooh, maybe she's Kree!
* Cobie Smulders was listed for every episode, and again, arrrgh.
Elsewhere:
* the bad guy was a Ken in the Barbie movie, and, uh, I don't know. Bad Ken! Bad!
Going forward:
* oh great, a hateful, racist?, speciesist? president. what a totally theoretical, interesting, idea. it's lovely and a nice change of pace from *vaguely gestures at everything*. how fun!
* how many Skrulls are still around? between 1 and a million?
> Yes, Maria Hill is still dead.
And I'm still mad.
posted by Pronoiac at 7:01 PM on July 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
A friend pointed out that the US gubment getting xenophobic is probably a setup for hatred of mutants.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:31 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:31 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
A friend pointed out that the US gubment getting xenophobic is probably a setup for hatred of mutants.
I actually just watched the 2000 X-Men this evening and had never previously noticed how much Ian McKellen ~25 years ago resembles Ben Mendelsohn today.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 10:05 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
I actually just watched the 2000 X-Men this evening and had never previously noticed how much Ian McKellen ~25 years ago resembles Ben Mendelsohn today.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 10:05 PM on July 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
Yeah so this was by far the worst of the MCU series. I've honestly found things to enjoy in every series so far, and I think some of them are genuinely good, while others were good, but with flaws or mistakes which made them less effective.
But what was this? The cast were great, and no one turned in a bad performance. There were some nice character moments along the way. But everything else?
1) I commented on this last time, but the insanity of the President deciding to nuke a site in Russia on the word of one person only got more nuts this episode (and it did appear to be a nuke, rather than a conventional weapon). Let's ignore the obvious conclusion that this would lead to everyone on earth dying, and focus on the fact that during preparation for this strike, apparently minutes away the President remained in a hospital in Britain. He would definitely die in the inevitable retaliation.
Honestly it felt like that for this plot point to work you needed to forget that MAD is a thing, but they explicitly mentioned nukes, and it seemed to be Gravik's actual plan that the US would willingly enter world war 3 for no actual reason.
2) So after saying that he needed to clean this mess up himself, Fury instead sends the daughter of his best friend to go fight for him. The switcheroo was moderately clever, but relied on Gravik just deciding to turn the machine on while Fury was standing there
3) The switcheroo also means we don't actually get a reveal on Fury's feelings on the Skrulls. I guess we can assume the speech given to Gravik was me he relayed, but it really did pitch him as callous and cruel, and utterly responsible for the mess in this series. If we take him at his word, he basically gaslit the skrulls for decades while not even trying to pay the groundwork for them joining earth. He told basically no one about their presence, even during multiple crises where their superhuman strength could have come in useful. Or hell, their ability to impersonate people would have been very useful in many of the earlier conflicts. But no apparently he used them as his own private spy network after giving up entirely on ever making their situation better
4) The final fight looked cool, but had a couple of major problems. Because it failed to establish the rules for the new powers, it was very confusing to understand why one person got the upper hand. And given that they both had the same set of powers, how did G'iah win? Why did Gravik die? I thiiink maybe that they could only assume a limited number of their powers at once, but if that's the case why not just be permanently in captain marvel form?
5) As others have pointed out, G'iah is now around to provide plot holes in more stories, as she seems to be more powerful than captain Marvel, who is already so powerful she can break a bunch of stories just by being present.
6) The close out of this episode was insanely fast. It really felt like there was a whole episode, or even a whole series, in the concept of an earth driven mad by the idea of skrulls hidden among then. And probably a better series than this one to be honest. And Fury seeing this all, and deciding that his response would be to just head off to space again makes him such a dick. I have no idea why his wife would forgive him
7) Speaking of his wife... Apparently she's the best diplomat ever? The whole Kree peace treaty thing came from absolutely nowhere, and might have been worth mentioning before this point! I assume the Marvels is going to be about this, but it felt very abrupt here.
8) The show expecting me to care about Fury and his wife when it put barely any effort into establishing their relationship just didn't work for me. Apparently this episode marks the first time he has called her? What the hell? Did they spend any time actually married? Can you imagine if your spouse was missing for 5 years thanks to a tragedy, and when they came back to life they immediately went to space, and only came back to see you for one night? And then expected you to come with them? Absurd
Maybe there was a version of this show during the reshoots that worked, but what they ended up with is easily one of the worst products the MCU has put out
posted by Cannon Fodder at 11:24 PM on July 26, 2023 [11 favorites]
But what was this? The cast were great, and no one turned in a bad performance. There were some nice character moments along the way. But everything else?
1) I commented on this last time, but the insanity of the President deciding to nuke a site in Russia on the word of one person only got more nuts this episode (and it did appear to be a nuke, rather than a conventional weapon). Let's ignore the obvious conclusion that this would lead to everyone on earth dying, and focus on the fact that during preparation for this strike, apparently minutes away the President remained in a hospital in Britain. He would definitely die in the inevitable retaliation.
Honestly it felt like that for this plot point to work you needed to forget that MAD is a thing, but they explicitly mentioned nukes, and it seemed to be Gravik's actual plan that the US would willingly enter world war 3 for no actual reason.
2) So after saying that he needed to clean this mess up himself, Fury instead sends the daughter of his best friend to go fight for him. The switcheroo was moderately clever, but relied on Gravik just deciding to turn the machine on while Fury was standing there
3) The switcheroo also means we don't actually get a reveal on Fury's feelings on the Skrulls. I guess we can assume the speech given to Gravik was me he relayed, but it really did pitch him as callous and cruel, and utterly responsible for the mess in this series. If we take him at his word, he basically gaslit the skrulls for decades while not even trying to pay the groundwork for them joining earth. He told basically no one about their presence, even during multiple crises where their superhuman strength could have come in useful. Or hell, their ability to impersonate people would have been very useful in many of the earlier conflicts. But no apparently he used them as his own private spy network after giving up entirely on ever making their situation better
4) The final fight looked cool, but had a couple of major problems. Because it failed to establish the rules for the new powers, it was very confusing to understand why one person got the upper hand. And given that they both had the same set of powers, how did G'iah win? Why did Gravik die? I thiiink maybe that they could only assume a limited number of their powers at once, but if that's the case why not just be permanently in captain marvel form?
5) As others have pointed out, G'iah is now around to provide plot holes in more stories, as she seems to be more powerful than captain Marvel, who is already so powerful she can break a bunch of stories just by being present.
6) The close out of this episode was insanely fast. It really felt like there was a whole episode, or even a whole series, in the concept of an earth driven mad by the idea of skrulls hidden among then. And probably a better series than this one to be honest. And Fury seeing this all, and deciding that his response would be to just head off to space again makes him such a dick. I have no idea why his wife would forgive him
7) Speaking of his wife... Apparently she's the best diplomat ever? The whole Kree peace treaty thing came from absolutely nowhere, and might have been worth mentioning before this point! I assume the Marvels is going to be about this, but it felt very abrupt here.
8) The show expecting me to care about Fury and his wife when it put barely any effort into establishing their relationship just didn't work for me. Apparently this episode marks the first time he has called her? What the hell? Did they spend any time actually married? Can you imagine if your spouse was missing for 5 years thanks to a tragedy, and when they came back to life they immediately went to space, and only came back to see you for one night? And then expected you to come with them? Absurd
Maybe there was a version of this show during the reshoots that worked, but what they ended up with is easily one of the worst products the MCU has put out
posted by Cannon Fodder at 11:24 PM on July 26, 2023 [11 favorites]
I suppose it's a case of "be careful what you wish for": I was complaining in the last one that the government is never the baddie, and now they are.
I was guessing that Super-Duper-Skrull Gravik would be the baddie in The Marvels, so a bit surpised that he's apparently dead and now Ford Giah has defeated Gravik and got Super-Duper-Skrull powers. Bit worried that she's now going to have a Wanda style heel turn and be another baddie instead.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 1:16 AM on July 27, 2023
I was guessing that Super-Duper-Skrull Gravik would be the baddie in The Marvels, so a bit surpised that he's apparently dead and now Ford Giah has defeated Gravik and got Super-Duper-Skrull powers. Bit worried that she's now going to have a Wanda style heel turn and be another baddie instead.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 1:16 AM on July 27, 2023
Also I was thinking about the possibilities of Skrull detection technology. Now when they pick a human to impersonate, they don't seem to worry about size: e.g. Giah can impersonate the much taller and heavier Nick Fury. So if their mass is conserved but their volume is varied (presumably by internal voids), to detect a Skrull impersonating a human you just need to drop them in a tank of water. If they either sink straight to the bottom, or float too high in the water, they're a Skrull.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 2:24 AM on July 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by TheophileEscargot at 2:24 AM on July 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
Or build a bridge out of them.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 5:51 AM on July 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by ricochet biscuit at 5:51 AM on July 27, 2023 [4 favorites]
Elsewhere:
* the bad guy was a Ken in the Barbie movie, and, uh, I don't know. Bad Ken! Bad!
It was impossible to take Gravik seriously as Ken!
posted by ellieBOA at 6:18 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
* the bad guy was a Ken in the Barbie movie, and, uh, I don't know. Bad Ken! Bad!
It was impossible to take Gravik seriously as Ken!
posted by ellieBOA at 6:18 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Listen, if it gives us Olivia Colman on an ongoing basis as a delightful bad ass in a red coat, I don't give a shit how much Marvel spends on their vanity project series. She was fantastic.
posted by ersatzkat at 6:21 AM on July 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by ersatzkat at 6:21 AM on July 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
we don't actually get a reveal on Fury's feelings on the Skrulls
Yeah, this sucked. The thing is that Fury's speech, as given, is totally in character for him as someone who is often a sort of "ends justify the means" anti-hero, and I think it makes his character a lot more interesting. But now we'll never know if that was really what he thought.
relied on Gravik just deciding to turn the machine on while Fury was standing there
This was the thing that bugged me the most, plot-wise. At least have Gravik pull Fury/G'iah outside of the machine and then have her jump back in at the last minute.
I feel like this series succumbed to the fate of every Marvel series, which is that even in the most experimental, nuanced story (WandaVision or Moon Knight, say) they have to devolve everything into a big super-powered punch-out with explosions and laser beams in the last episode. This show tried to have its cake and eat it too by showing the big dumb fight at the same time as the climax for the show it wanted to be (the espionage-flavored showdown between Fury and Skrull-Rhodey) but it just didn't work out.
posted by whir at 8:08 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Yeah, this sucked. The thing is that Fury's speech, as given, is totally in character for him as someone who is often a sort of "ends justify the means" anti-hero, and I think it makes his character a lot more interesting. But now we'll never know if that was really what he thought.
relied on Gravik just deciding to turn the machine on while Fury was standing there
This was the thing that bugged me the most, plot-wise. At least have Gravik pull Fury/G'iah outside of the machine and then have her jump back in at the last minute.
I feel like this series succumbed to the fate of every Marvel series, which is that even in the most experimental, nuanced story (WandaVision or Moon Knight, say) they have to devolve everything into a big super-powered punch-out with explosions and laser beams in the last episode. This show tried to have its cake and eat it too by showing the big dumb fight at the same time as the climax for the show it wanted to be (the espionage-flavored showdown between Fury and Skrull-Rhodey) but it just didn't work out.
posted by whir at 8:08 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
I'll also note in passing that the whole thing with the Skrulls somehow gaining powers that they really shouldn't be able to gain through DNA and super-science (like the Captain Marvel powers) is also there in the original Secret Invasion comic event that this was based on, where a Skrull would take on the shape of, say, Spider-Woman, and then have for no reason given all of Spider-Woman's powers and abilities. That comic series sucked, it was far more badly-plotted than this TV series was, largely because it retconned a bunch of characters into having been replaced by Skrulls for years without ever explaining why they didn't act like Skrull secret agents for that entire time.
posted by whir at 8:21 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by whir at 8:21 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Agreed, with one exception - the issue of... I want to say New Avengers? where we see how those Avengers who had been replaced by Skrulls react to Wanda changing reality during House of M, seemingly as the only ones other than Wolverine to remember what reality should be. Skrull Hank Pym says something to Skrull Jessica Drew like "this new reality is paper thin", like Bendis is admitting it to the audience. I vaguely remember some dialogue where the Skrulls can't believe how dumb Civil War was too.
posted by Molesome at 8:34 AM on July 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Molesome at 8:34 AM on July 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
Finale is currently the lowest-rated-ever MCU episode on Rotten Tomatoes: 13%
posted by Thorzdad at 9:31 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Thorzdad at 9:31 AM on July 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Maybe, just maybe... the MCU doesn't need to continue indefinitely.
The first case of a whole universe jumping the shark?
posted by Paul Slade at 2:27 PM on July 27, 2023
The first case of a whole universe jumping the shark?
posted by Paul Slade at 2:27 PM on July 27, 2023
I'm assuming that's lowest rated Disney+ MCU show episode? Because it's hard to believe people didn't rate any given episode of Iron Fist lower.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 2:27 PM on July 27, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 2:27 PM on July 27, 2023 [7 favorites]
I know the into credits were done by AI, but the whole series felt like it was written by an AI, but a noticeably dumber one. I hated this; it was a complete waste of the actors and characters involved. I had accepted Fury was ruthlessly pragmatic, but his behavior in this is unforgivable and irredeemable. Maria Hill is still dead for no damn good reason, and Talos never got to demonstrate why he was the Skrulls' leader.
The only things I liked were 1) Olivia Colman, and b) now maybe G'iah can pop up in the upcoming MCU Fantastic Four (though they'd probably ignore her character growth and just Multiverse of Madness her into a straight up villain). Hopefully they'll retcon G'iah down to only four abilities, like the other powers decay/are forgotten from her system by neglecting their use.
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 3:48 PM on July 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
The only things I liked were 1) Olivia Colman, and b) now maybe G'iah can pop up in the upcoming MCU Fantastic Four (though they'd probably ignore her character growth and just Multiverse of Madness her into a straight up villain). Hopefully they'll retcon G'iah down to only four abilities, like the other powers decay/are forgotten from her system by neglecting their use.
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 3:48 PM on July 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
Yeah, the Harvest thing was such a desperately underwritten six-year-old-smashing-their-toys-together mess. I mean, Gravik morphed Ebony Maw's hand, complete with rings, so he could do telekinesis. Did they harvest the rings' DNA too? Didn't Maw get dusted? Isn't magic something you have to learn and not something in your genes?
If that's possible, why not just be Ghost every time your opponent attacks you? Or hell, why not trap your opponent in an old sitcom town, or turn into a living planet and crush them?
I feel like you could splice in the end of She-Hulk over this finale and it would fit perfectly well.
posted by Riki tiki at 10:26 PM on July 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
If that's possible, why not just be Ghost every time your opponent attacks you? Or hell, why not trap your opponent in an old sitcom town, or turn into a living planet and crush them?
I feel like you could splice in the end of She-Hulk over this finale and it would fit perfectly well.
posted by Riki tiki at 10:26 PM on July 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
why not just be Ghost every time your opponent attacks you?
Ghost is another super who gets his powers from the hi-tech suit he invented. (I'll stop with this flavor of comment now at the risk of becoming repetitive. I do think it wouldn't have taken that much hand-wavy super-science dialog to restore my suspension of disbelief about this stuff, though, and the show just never bothered to include it.)
posted by whir at 5:25 AM on July 28, 2023
Ghost is another super who gets his powers from the hi-tech suit he invented. (I'll stop with this flavor of comment now at the risk of becoming repetitive. I do think it wouldn't have taken that much hand-wavy super-science dialog to restore my suspension of disbelief about this stuff, though, and the show just never bothered to include it.)
posted by whir at 5:25 AM on July 28, 2023
Well, I was wrong. Maria Hill didn't reappear at the end.
The series did end with a big wet fart though. What a disappointment.
posted by Fleebnork at 6:14 AM on July 28, 2023
The series did end with a big wet fart though. What a disappointment.
posted by Fleebnork at 6:14 AM on July 28, 2023
Yeah, this was... not great. Just having the Super Skrulls be Kirkland-brand FF types would have been fine. (I thought that Fury would have snuck a secret allergy into the Harvest stuff as a sort of kryptonite, but that would have been modestly clever and thus beyond the scope of this show.)
* the bad guy was a Ken in the Barbie movie, and, uh, I don't know. Bad Ken! Bad!
Honestly, Kingsley Ben-Adir as Ken #3 (behind Your Perfect Secret Boyfriend and Shang-Chi) was loads better than anything he got to do in this series. I'd love to see him in something else that used his considerable charm.
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:36 PM on July 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
* the bad guy was a Ken in the Barbie movie, and, uh, I don't know. Bad Ken! Bad!
Honestly, Kingsley Ben-Adir as Ken #3 (behind Your Perfect Secret Boyfriend and Shang-Chi) was loads better than anything he got to do in this series. I'd love to see him in something else that used his considerable charm.
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:36 PM on July 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
Meanwhile SkruRhodey
Surely it should be Skrhodey?
Man this was bad.
posted by kitten kaboodle at 9:27 PM on July 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
Surely it should be Skrhodey?
Man this was bad.
posted by kitten kaboodle at 9:27 PM on July 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
Honestly, Kingsley Ben-Adir as Ken #3 (behind Your Perfect Secret Boyfriend and Shang-Chi) was loads better than anything he got to do in this series.
He was so funny as Ken #3!
posted by ellieBOA at 10:03 AM on July 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
He was so funny as Ken #3!
posted by ellieBOA at 10:03 AM on July 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
Secret Invasion Director Confirms Timeline With Rhodey and Skrull Twist [comicbook.com]
"A lot of people have asked about, 'Definitively, when did Rhodey...?'" […] "I think his legs not working in the end of episode six and him being in the hospital gown points to [Captain America: Civil War]. And, from there, does it have to be definitive, or is it more fun for the audience to go back and revisit every moment, every Rhodey moment and look at it with a different lens now that they think, 'Oh, he might've been a Skrull there.' And make the decision for themselves, or it'll be answered in Armor Wars."
posted by ellieBOA at 11:03 AM on July 29, 2023
"A lot of people have asked about, 'Definitively, when did Rhodey...?'" […] "I think his legs not working in the end of episode six and him being in the hospital gown points to [Captain America: Civil War]. And, from there, does it have to be definitive, or is it more fun for the audience to go back and revisit every moment, every Rhodey moment and look at it with a different lens now that they think, 'Oh, he might've been a Skrull there.' And make the decision for themselves, or it'll be answered in Armor Wars."
posted by ellieBOA at 11:03 AM on July 29, 2023
A Rhodey replaced at the end of Civil War is like nine years behind the times. Missed the Snap, the Blip, has no idea that Natasha Romanoff and Tony Stank are dead...
posted by ricochet biscuit at 5:22 PM on July 29, 2023
posted by ricochet biscuit at 5:22 PM on July 29, 2023
And, from there, does it have to be definitive, or is it more fun for the audience to go back and revisit every moment, every Rhodey moment and look at it with a different lens now that they think, 'Oh, he might've been a Skrull there.'
Yeah, that does change the meaning behind a scene in Endgame with Rhodey and Nebula. Previously, it read like survivors of trauma and/or disability moving forward or coming to terms with who they are currently. Now it just makes no goddamn sense.
Rhodey's tears at the death of Tony also hits different now, and not in a good way.
Which is a shame, because the Skrull impersonating Rhodey appeared to be having second thoughts about fulfilling Gravik's plan and I thought it would be interesting if she turned and joined the good guys. Then when the real Rhodey was found maybe they'd work together in Armor Wars. The story I had in my head was great, with the Skrull helping Rhodey to make peace with all that he'd lost, while redeeming herself and finding a home and purpose.
Plus, in the series in my head, Maria Hill would be alive and we'd actually get to learn a bit more about her, 'cause despite her years in the MCU, we know absolutely nothing about her. Which is just wild, in terms of world building and character development.
AND, I have major problems with Fury and Hill running around Moscow, knowing there's Skrulls about and not having any sort of protocol or system to establish that they are the real people. That made not a lick of sense.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:36 PM on July 29, 2023 [3 favorites]
Yeah, that does change the meaning behind a scene in Endgame with Rhodey and Nebula. Previously, it read like survivors of trauma and/or disability moving forward or coming to terms with who they are currently. Now it just makes no goddamn sense.
Rhodey's tears at the death of Tony also hits different now, and not in a good way.
Which is a shame, because the Skrull impersonating Rhodey appeared to be having second thoughts about fulfilling Gravik's plan and I thought it would be interesting if she turned and joined the good guys. Then when the real Rhodey was found maybe they'd work together in Armor Wars. The story I had in my head was great, with the Skrull helping Rhodey to make peace with all that he'd lost, while redeeming herself and finding a home and purpose.
Plus, in the series in my head, Maria Hill would be alive and we'd actually get to learn a bit more about her, 'cause despite her years in the MCU, we know absolutely nothing about her. Which is just wild, in terms of world building and character development.
AND, I have major problems with Fury and Hill running around Moscow, knowing there's Skrulls about and not having any sort of protocol or system to establish that they are the real people. That made not a lick of sense.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:36 PM on July 29, 2023 [3 favorites]
I wanted to see it through, but there was nothing to keep my interest beyond Sam Jackson. And yet here I am.
The other MCU shows that have been good were so because they had a central relationship: Loki and Sylvie; Wanda and Vision; Hawkeye and Kate and Yelena. We didn't get enough Talos and Fury and what was there wasn't that interesting.
The other plot developments hinged on:
A. Main Character is Dead!
B. Unless they Aren't!
C. Main Character is a Skrull!
So not much driving it forward.
The whole SuperSkrull thing was pretty dumb. And then you set up Gravik as some SuperDuperSkull and kill him in 5 minutes? Even dumber.
Don't get me started on Maria Hill getting fridged.
The Kree/Skrull peace treaty makes even less sense. The Kree have no reason to sign a deal with a species who are on the run and much diminished and in hiding on one planet. Why would they even care?
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 7:03 PM on July 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
The other MCU shows that have been good were so because they had a central relationship: Loki and Sylvie; Wanda and Vision; Hawkeye and Kate and Yelena. We didn't get enough Talos and Fury and what was there wasn't that interesting.
The other plot developments hinged on:
A. Main Character is Dead!
B. Unless they Aren't!
C. Main Character is a Skrull!
So not much driving it forward.
The whole SuperSkrull thing was pretty dumb. And then you set up Gravik as some SuperDuperSkull and kill him in 5 minutes? Even dumber.
Don't get me started on Maria Hill getting fridged.
The Kree/Skrull peace treaty makes even less sense. The Kree have no reason to sign a deal with a species who are on the run and much diminished and in hiding on one planet. Why would they even care?
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 7:03 PM on July 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
I am even more curious as to what was reshot both in this series and in The Marvels; I feel like the latter will be the place in which SABER is really established, which the beginning of this series seems to take for granted. (Yes, there was the mid-credits scene in Spider-Man: Far From Home, but that just showed Fury and a bunch of Skrulls in orbit while Talos pretended to be Fury on Earth. It didn't even name the station.)
The Kree have no reason to sign a deal with a species who are on the run and much diminished and in hiding on one planet. Why would they even care?
Well, how much do we know about the Kree after Captain Marvel? Ronan goes rogue and tries to destroy Xandar, and the Kree representative that the Nova-Prime talks to in GotG doesn't seem to give a shit that one of their most powerful warriors and his big-ass ship are apparently going off on their own. There's some stuff in Agents of SHIELD that I don't know about. Is it possible that the Kree Empire was already on the decline when the Snap happened and that a fascistic society ruled by an AI may have been destabilized even worse than most? I think that we'll find out in The Marvels.
posted by Halloween Jack at 11:09 PM on July 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
The Kree have no reason to sign a deal with a species who are on the run and much diminished and in hiding on one planet. Why would they even care?
Well, how much do we know about the Kree after Captain Marvel? Ronan goes rogue and tries to destroy Xandar, and the Kree representative that the Nova-Prime talks to in GotG doesn't seem to give a shit that one of their most powerful warriors and his big-ass ship are apparently going off on their own. There's some stuff in Agents of SHIELD that I don't know about. Is it possible that the Kree Empire was already on the decline when the Snap happened and that a fascistic society ruled by an AI may have been destabilized even worse than most? I think that we'll find out in The Marvels.
posted by Halloween Jack at 11:09 PM on July 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
Previously, it read like survivors of trauma and/or disability moving forward or coming to terms with who they are currently. Now it just makes no goddamn sense.
It just makes no sense to retcon that far back!
posted by ellieBOA at 6:48 AM on July 30, 2023
It just makes no sense to retcon that far back!
posted by ellieBOA at 6:48 AM on July 30, 2023
I'm assuming that's lowest rated Disney+ MCU show episode? Because it's hard to believe people didn't rate any given episode of Iron Fist lower.
No, its all of them, Rotten Tomatoes actually has the list up (seasons not episodes): Marvel TV shows by RT rating.
posted by biffa at 8:40 AM on July 30, 2023
No, its all of them, Rotten Tomatoes actually has the list up (seasons not episodes): Marvel TV shows by RT rating.
posted by biffa at 8:40 AM on July 30, 2023
Yeah, that does change the meaning behind a scene in Endgame with Rhodey and Nebula . Previously, it read like survivors of trauma and/or disability moving forward or coming to terms with who they are currently. Now it just makes no goddamn sense.
I guess technically the Skrull impersonating Rhodey actually "wasn't always like this" and is working with what he's got, but that turns what was a really nice emotional beat into Nebula getting tricked by wordplay at a vulnerable moment.
Little side moments like that, or Bruce sharing tacos with Scott, or Thor and Carol's staring contest, really helped the final battle of Endgame feel like one big team rather than a bunch of separate franchises that happened to be on screen at the same time. Sucks to undermine any of them.
posted by Riki tiki at 1:44 PM on July 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
I guess technically the Skrull impersonating Rhodey actually "wasn't always like this" and is working with what he's got, but that turns what was a really nice emotional beat into Nebula getting tricked by wordplay at a vulnerable moment.
Little side moments like that, or Bruce sharing tacos with Scott, or Thor and Carol's staring contest, really helped the final battle of Endgame feel like one big team rather than a bunch of separate franchises that happened to be on screen at the same time. Sucks to undermine any of them.
posted by Riki tiki at 1:44 PM on July 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
We finished this Sunday night and I've been processing since. What a waste of talent, money, and characters.
You mean to tell me they killed off Maria Hill for this crapfest? That they had Samuel L. Jackson as a lead and this was the best they could come up with?
They literally could've just let Samuel L. Jackson and Don Cheadle, two of my favorite actors, improvise for six hours across a table with the Scotch and it would've been far better than this.
It's like they had four or five different ideas for the storyline and didn't succeed with any of them.
It could've been action packed and fun as hell. It could've been a poignant story about Fury at the end of a long and storied career facing his mortality. It could've been a real spy thriller. It could've been an alien invasion story. It even could've just been a major setup for the Marvels movie with big doses of fan service.
It was just boring instead. I'm not sure which one I liked less, this or Eternals. At least this had Olivia Colman being wonderful, and the scene with Nick and Skrull/Rhodey was goodness. (They also wasted Katie Finneran... what a pity.)
posted by jzb at 6:44 AM on August 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
You mean to tell me they killed off Maria Hill for this crapfest? That they had Samuel L. Jackson as a lead and this was the best they could come up with?
They literally could've just let Samuel L. Jackson and Don Cheadle, two of my favorite actors, improvise for six hours across a table with the Scotch and it would've been far better than this.
It's like they had four or five different ideas for the storyline and didn't succeed with any of them.
It could've been action packed and fun as hell. It could've been a poignant story about Fury at the end of a long and storied career facing his mortality. It could've been a real spy thriller. It could've been an alien invasion story. It even could've just been a major setup for the Marvels movie with big doses of fan service.
It was just boring instead. I'm not sure which one I liked less, this or Eternals. At least this had Olivia Colman being wonderful, and the scene with Nick and Skrull/Rhodey was goodness. (They also wasted Katie Finneran... what a pity.)
posted by jzb at 6:44 AM on August 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
This just felt like there was no real vision behind it. No idea of what makes for a good twisty spy thriller, which should rally be an option when anyone can be an enemy. You should be looking at some surprise betrayal every couple of episodes, selling out friendships, etc. Instead they seemed to try and get surprises from bumping off acouple of characters and Fury suddenly being married. Meh.
Also, why shouldn't you wear Skrull underpants?
.
.
.
.
.
,
.
.
Because Chernobyl fallout.
posted by biffa at 3:24 PM on August 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
Also, why shouldn't you wear Skrull underpants?
.
.
.
.
.
,
.
.
Because Chernobyl fallout.
posted by biffa at 3:24 PM on August 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
This just felt like there was no real vision behind it.
I suspect there was something of a vision. The earlier episodes seemed to be setting up a few things and were longer. But the last three were like 30-40 minutes. I suspect there was some major revamping, probably to shift things for later projects.
No idea of what makes for a good twisty spy thriller...
Right? There's a scene in my head of SkruRodney taunting Fury by slowly calling "Nick," while smirking as the President yells for SkruRodey to get back in his office so they can plan how to fuck up the Russians, while Fury is dragged away and kicked out. Don and Samuel L could have feasted on so many awesome scenes of them playing mind games and cloak and dagger.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:12 PM on August 1, 2023 [3 favorites]
I suspect there was something of a vision. The earlier episodes seemed to be setting up a few things and were longer. But the last three were like 30-40 minutes. I suspect there was some major revamping, probably to shift things for later projects.
No idea of what makes for a good twisty spy thriller...
Right? There's a scene in my head of SkruRodney taunting Fury by slowly calling "Nick," while smirking as the President yells for SkruRodey to get back in his office so they can plan how to fuck up the Russians, while Fury is dragged away and kicked out. Don and Samuel L could have feasted on so many awesome scenes of them playing mind games and cloak and dagger.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:12 PM on August 1, 2023 [3 favorites]
Ghost is another super who gets his powers from the hi-tech suit he invented.
MCU Ghost is a woman introduced in the second Ant-Man movie who needed a suit to control the quantum phasing powers that were killing her until Janet Van Dyne came back from the quantum realm and healed her. Unclear if Ghost still needs the suit (probably "yes" because it looks cool), but it wasn't the source of her powers.
posted by straight at 3:00 AM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
MCU Ghost is a woman introduced in the second Ant-Man movie who needed a suit to control the quantum phasing powers that were killing her until Janet Van Dyne came back from the quantum realm and healed her. Unclear if Ghost still needs the suit (probably "yes" because it looks cool), but it wasn't the source of her powers.
posted by straight at 3:00 AM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
What a grim backstory. MCU Ghost seems like a real Killjoy.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 9:00 AM on August 16, 2023
posted by ActingTheGoat at 9:00 AM on August 16, 2023
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Why didn't the hostages die of radiation exposure? They didn't need to be catheterized? Or eat? Why would the remaining Skrulls trust Fury to negotiate on their behalf with the Kree? Why would the Kree, for that matter? And where was Carol during all this nonsense?
posted by orrnyereg at 10:38 AM on July 26, 2023 [4 favorites]