Fargo: Insolubilia
December 6, 2023 6:15 AM - Season 5, Episode 4 - Subscribe
Munch makes a bold move, Indira and Witt have questions, Wayne takes a fall and Gator disappoints.
I'm still thinking Dot could be Gator's mother. When Gator was chasing her through the house he did call her Mama at one point.
On the other hand, I guess there is another missing wife.
posted by halehale at 5:28 PM on December 6, 2023 [3 favorites]
On the other hand, I guess there is another missing wife.
posted by halehale at 5:28 PM on December 6, 2023 [3 favorites]
"I'm still thinking Dot could be Gator's mother. When Gator was chasing her through the house he did call her Mama at one point"
Yeah, that's a possibility. He also made a point of Noticing The 9-year-old Daughter, who is presumably his (half or full) sibling
posted by coriolisdave at 6:24 PM on December 6, 2023 [3 favorites]
Yeah, that's a possibility. He also made a point of Noticing The 9-year-old Daughter, who is presumably his (half or full) sibling
posted by coriolisdave at 6:24 PM on December 6, 2023 [3 favorites]
Me at the beginning of the home invasion sequence: “I am ready for some cartoony slapstick violence”
Me at the end: “Not like that! No!”
This episode was a little slower but, man, the bit at the end, Roy emotionlessly provoking a man into attacking him, is as tense as anything this show has ever shown.
posted by thecaddy at 5:16 AM on December 7, 2023 [2 favorites]
Me at the end: “Not like that! No!”
This episode was a little slower but, man, the bit at the end, Roy emotionlessly provoking a man into attacking him, is as tense as anything this show has ever shown.
posted by thecaddy at 5:16 AM on December 7, 2023 [2 favorites]
Can we have a spin-off with the two righteous FBI agents?
I'm wondering what their part will be in all of this, considering how little agency the actual "good guys" in this story have had so far.
I'm also wondering what has led to Nadine going so hard on the denialism. She's a capable woman, and seems able to find allies. Is Roy that unstoppable? outside of his fiefdom in ND?
I am also left wondering, now that Munch seems more of an otherworldy force, why he would have had a partner at all, for the kidnapping, let alone an inept one?
So many questions.
posted by OHenryPacey at 7:31 AM on December 7, 2023 [3 favorites]
I'm wondering what their part will be in all of this, considering how little agency the actual "good guys" in this story have had so far.
I'm also wondering what has led to Nadine going so hard on the denialism. She's a capable woman, and seems able to find allies. Is Roy that unstoppable? outside of his fiefdom in ND?
I am also left wondering, now that Munch seems more of an otherworldy force, why he would have had a partner at all, for the kidnapping, let alone an inept one?
So many questions.
posted by OHenryPacey at 7:31 AM on December 7, 2023 [3 favorites]
> I'm also wondering what has led to Nadine going so hard on the denialism
If she is still legally married to Roy, then her current marriage is invalid. Well it may also be invalid anyway because she's using a false identity. I think she's also in a kind of denial herself. Her penchant for violence also seems to indicate that her Nadine identity might not be exactly a clean one, and she doesn't want her husband (or his mother, god I love this Jennifer Jason-Leigh character) to have that dirt on her.
posted by dis_integration at 7:50 AM on December 7, 2023 [3 favorites]
If she is still legally married to Roy, then her current marriage is invalid. Well it may also be invalid anyway because she's using a false identity. I think she's also in a kind of denial herself. Her penchant for violence also seems to indicate that her Nadine identity might not be exactly a clean one, and she doesn't want her husband (or his mother, god I love this Jennifer Jason-Leigh character) to have that dirt on her.
posted by dis_integration at 7:50 AM on December 7, 2023 [3 favorites]
I think the talk she gave her kid in the hospital waiting room basically spelled out her world view and answered why she is denying the events and her past. I mean, it might not be that simple ... but I'm sticking with that for now.
posted by destructive cactus at 8:35 AM on December 7, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by destructive cactus at 8:35 AM on December 7, 2023 [1 favorite]
My take is that maybe she was either the same or even worse than Roy in her previous life. Then at some point she had a break and turned into the genuinely good person she is today, but she has to keep a firewall in her mind between her two selves that basically leads to a delusional level of denial.
The only time she dropped her accent was when basically threatened the life her mother-in-law, and even then it was for a few seconds. That, plus the justification she told Scotty in the hospital, and how tender she was with her husband, makes me think that Dot is a legitimately different person that doesn't "talk" to Nadine much. Typically in a "Lord forgive me but it's time to go back to tha old me" type situation Dot would have basically turned into Sarah Connor during the home invasion scene, and in the hospital she would have did a big ol' monologue how she promised she'd never go back to her old way of doing things, but messing with her family meant they had to pay in blood blah blah.
Basically, she'd be the biblical force instead of Munch.
posted by Back At It Again At Krispy Kreme at 9:09 AM on December 7, 2023 [1 favorite]
The only time she dropped her accent was when basically threatened the life her mother-in-law, and even then it was for a few seconds. That, plus the justification she told Scotty in the hospital, and how tender she was with her husband, makes me think that Dot is a legitimately different person that doesn't "talk" to Nadine much. Typically in a "Lord forgive me but it's time to go back to tha old me" type situation Dot would have basically turned into Sarah Connor during the home invasion scene, and in the hospital she would have did a big ol' monologue how she promised she'd never go back to her old way of doing things, but messing with her family meant they had to pay in blood blah blah.
Basically, she'd be the biblical force instead of Munch.
posted by Back At It Again At Krispy Kreme at 9:09 AM on December 7, 2023 [1 favorite]
I have a feeling Dot is going to need to team up with MIL Lorraine in order to get out of this. Woe be unto anyone facing that duo.
posted by queensissy at 1:15 PM on December 7, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by queensissy at 1:15 PM on December 7, 2023 [3 favorites]
When Gator was chasing her through the house he did call her Mama at one point.
My understanding of that line was that he was reminding her she had a young daughter in the house who Gator and his buddies could very easily hurt if Dot/Nadine didn't surrender. Anything further is overthinking it, in my view.
posted by Paul Slade at 3:21 PM on December 7, 2023 [2 favorites]
My understanding of that line was that he was reminding her she had a young daughter in the house who Gator and his buddies could very easily hurt if Dot/Nadine didn't surrender. Anything further is overthinking it, in my view.
posted by Paul Slade at 3:21 PM on December 7, 2023 [2 favorites]
“...man all that build up to a slightly underwhelming defense of the house.”
I thought it was done very well. The show isn't realistic, of course, but it's nevertheless handled all of Dot's violence very plausibly, which I feel has been really important to establishing the audience's connection to the character.
I'm certain from Gator's interaction with Dot that he's the child of Roy's first-wife, who must have died, and was a boy when Roy married Dot. She was his (young) stepmom; that's why she felt she could chastise him like he was a child, but also why his allegiance is ultimately with Roy and not her. And why Gator avoided being very violent with her himself and why he was surprised when she shot at him several times (I don't think she intended to hit him, really). He didn't know she had a gun, but I also think he was surprised she shot at him.
Foley's character is very much like the similar character in the movie. He's sort of becoming my archetype for that kind of character. He's that good.
Incidentally, I'm well aware that Dot's husband isn't and couldn't be played by Rick Moranis, but it sure seems like him up on the screen. The actor doesn't even look much like Moranis. But that's who he's channeling.
The photography on this show is so beautiful.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 9:27 PM on December 7, 2023 [6 favorites]
I thought it was done very well. The show isn't realistic, of course, but it's nevertheless handled all of Dot's violence very plausibly, which I feel has been really important to establishing the audience's connection to the character.
I'm certain from Gator's interaction with Dot that he's the child of Roy's first-wife, who must have died, and was a boy when Roy married Dot. She was his (young) stepmom; that's why she felt she could chastise him like he was a child, but also why his allegiance is ultimately with Roy and not her. And why Gator avoided being very violent with her himself and why he was surprised when she shot at him several times (I don't think she intended to hit him, really). He didn't know she had a gun, but I also think he was surprised she shot at him.
Foley's character is very much like the similar character in the movie. He's sort of becoming my archetype for that kind of character. He's that good.
Incidentally, I'm well aware that Dot's husband isn't and couldn't be played by Rick Moranis, but it sure seems like him up on the screen. The actor doesn't even look much like Moranis. But that's who he's channeling.
The photography on this show is so beautiful.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 9:27 PM on December 7, 2023 [6 favorites]
Foley's character is very much like the similar character in the movie. He's sort of becoming my archetype for that kind of character. He's that good.
He and Jason-Leigh could be Don and Marv, but competent.
posted by FatherDagon at 6:12 AM on December 8, 2023 [2 favorites]
He and Jason-Leigh could be Don and Marv, but competent.
posted by FatherDagon at 6:12 AM on December 8, 2023 [2 favorites]
I also thought it was a bit of a letdown.
I am not enjoying the mystical stuff they are doing with Munch. They keep going back to him -- omg he's covered in mud, guys!!! -- as if it's interesting, but it's not that interesting. Oh boy he put a symbol on the wall wow. It's checking my enthusiasm for the season a fair bit.
posted by fleacircus at 9:20 AM on December 8, 2023 [2 favorites]
I am not enjoying the mystical stuff they are doing with Munch. They keep going back to him -- omg he's covered in mud, guys!!! -- as if it's interesting, but it's not that interesting. Oh boy he put a symbol on the wall wow. It's checking my enthusiasm for the season a fair bit.
posted by fleacircus at 9:20 AM on December 8, 2023 [2 favorites]
I'm so sorry, Wayne.
posted by mcstayinskool at 1:09 PM on December 12, 2023
posted by mcstayinskool at 1:09 PM on December 12, 2023
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“with all due respect, we’ve got our own reality”, just an amazing line.
i guess this is normal midseason slow down but a weaker episode than the first three imo. although i too want pancakes.
posted by dis_integration at 5:13 PM on December 6, 2023 [5 favorites]