Succession: Dundee
September 30, 2019 1:15 AM - Season 2, Episode 8 - Subscribe

The entire Roy clan travels to Logan's hometown of Dundee, Scotland for a celebration of Logan's fifty years in the business. There, Logan reflects on his past and the company's future, while Shiv defiantly looks to her family for support in taking down Rhea. Ewan gives Greg an ultimatum about working at Waystar.
posted by JimBennett (26 comments total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
I loved watching Rhea fly too close to the sun (her ability to read people comes and goes, I guess?) Kendall on the mic was the most cringeworthy thing I’ve seen on screen since Scott’s Tots. Logan is losing his touch. Marcia, I would follow into hell. (“Have you been tested recently?”) Shiv played the situation perfectly, so long as her goal is to burn it all down now that she can’t have her dad’s company (respect).

I kind of missed Roman and Geri together. I’m rooting for them to ride off into the sunset.
posted by sallybrown at 4:15 AM on September 30, 2019 [2 favorites]

It, uh, IS interesting how bad the everyone is at courting their Logan's approval. Roman bought the wrong soccer team, Kendall inflicted his nonsense performance on the whole room, Rhea somehow didn't notice Logan's profound disinterest in his family, his past, and all of Scotland; Connor is Connor. (His mother was institutionalized! I think that's new info.) Shiv's been playing Logan wrong all season, but she was finally on form this episode. Their ease with each other at the end of the episode was so unlike everything else about the Roy family...especially now that we might have some kind of Dumbledorian sister trauma in the background. I could see how Shiv got used to being the favorite. As long as Shiv plays the cool girl (drinks, "gets it," isn't asking for anything), Logan is happy with her. Even a little guilty! (Shiv IS smart, he insists, after teaming up with Rhea to attack her last week.)

Um...did Shiv bother letting Tom know that the cruise story is about to explode? That's SUCH a bad relationship. Marcia would never stand for it.

The worst thing about how I watch shows (or movies, or books, or whatever) is that at a certain point I start screaming for a character to GET OUT BEFORE THEY GET CREAMED. Greg. GREG. 250 million dollars AND your strong moral stance that "racism is bad" say you should quit! Please quit!

The sole ROY CUNT protester brought to mind Scotland's excellent lone TRUMP IS A CUNT protester. (But of course, it's less offensive there. Like calling someone a buddy.)
posted by grandiloquiet at 6:55 AM on September 30, 2019 [12 favorites]

Connor is Connor.

The perfect touch was that even in late middle age with tons of money, a partner he seems happy about, and a quixotic run for President going on, he’s still so upset at his little sister calling him “the first pancake.”
posted by sallybrown at 7:04 AM on September 30, 2019 [11 favorites]

I kind of missed Roman and Geri together. I’m rooting for them to ride off into the sunset.

I kind of am too?

Everyone is so great on this show. Every single scene I'm like, "And that's the best performance on this show to date" and then the next scene it's like, "Okay, no actually that is."
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:05 AM on September 30, 2019 [4 favorites]

I also could not believe how HUGE Kendall’s bow tie was. He looked like a cartoon character.
posted by sallybrown at 11:45 AM on September 30, 2019 [5 favorites]

A commenter transcribed this on the Primetimer forum:

Roman: Oh, and one more thing real quick. Should weeee get married?
Gerri: What?
Roman: You know, not that. An equivalent. The think. Like I abduct you and force you to live with me.
Gerri: That's not equivalent.
Roman: Then you kill me. You chop my dick off, you know? Something. I'm kidding, but you know what I'm saying. You eat me. I eat you. Like they do in Germany. Anyway, it's a lot to think about. I get it. So let it [wiggles fingers by his head]. Bye.

Roman is such a weirdo, I love it.

He and Geri are the best thing I never knew I wanted.
posted by rue72 at 11:56 AM on September 30, 2019 [19 favorites]

What was up with Logan's incredibly badly fitting jacket in Dundee? If I were the actor I'm not sure I'd agree to wear something that unflattering. Normally Logan is portrayed as well dressed, hiding his fat and his age. It seemed unusual to have this one humiliating outfit for him.

Poor Willa. She brought her play to Broadway! Well a sort of 30% preview at least. And it was terrible. Also her main actress fucked off on a booty call to Scotland with Kendall. Willa's just as bad as the rest of them but I'm kind of rooting for her.

I loved Marcia asking Rhea about STD testing. Absolutely shocking breach of decorum and done so artfully. I think that's the moment Rhea begins to realize she's in over her head.

I'm with you rue72, Roman is such a romantic!
posted by Nelson at 3:59 PM on September 30, 2019 [7 favorites]

Rhea and Logan, did they or didn't they?

I will pay good money for Gerri/Roman slash fiction.

I'm starting to think I was wrong about Willa being a secret genius.
posted by spikeleemajortomdickandharryconnickjrmints at 5:58 PM on September 30, 2019

What was up with Logan's incredibly badly fitting jacket in Dundee?

Marcia didn't lift a finger to make all the little things smooth and seamless for him like she usually does, is what
posted by queenofbithynia at 6:43 PM on September 30, 2019 [21 favorites]

I think we’re supposed to think Logan is losing his grip a little. He didn’t figure out the surprise, he didn’t pick up on Gerri and his other workerbees hiding the cruise news from him, he busted out (and out of) that jacket, and most of all he not only brought Rhea into the family in a sloppy manner, he then wobbled and second-guessed himself to Shiv about whether he made a mistake doing so. And throughout the episode he seemed a little perturbed or distracted.
posted by sallybrown at 6:57 PM on September 30, 2019 [1 favorite]

like what is that thing he says very early on, or maybe Kendall quotes him saying it, about how his favorite employees are the ones who eat shit for him without ever making him have to know about it or say thank you? so he gets pissy when Karolina informs him she's taking care of a problem, because she shouldn't have made him uncomfortable by telling him the problem existed.

but the thing about that is when someone gets mad and just suddenly stops being the perfect employee who does the unrewarding unpleasant work for you without making you look at it, you have no idea what's going on or why all these bad things have started happening to you.

and in the episodes where Marcia became visibly dissatisfied, she kept leaning on the one line about how she isn't one of his kids and doesn't work for him. but she does. being logan roy's wife is a job. & by dropping all her usual duties, she can make him feel a lot of pain since he is so slow to recognize its source.
posted by queenofbithynia at 7:01 PM on September 30, 2019 [7 favorites]

this was a great episode and I loved the last pancake smack. and then my husband & I both realized that we are also first pancakes...oh well!
posted by supermedusa at 8:49 AM on October 1, 2019 [3 favorites]

The perfect touch was that even in late middle age with tons of money, a partner he seems happy about, and a quixotic run for President going on, he’s still so upset at his little sister calling him “the first pancake.”

This is why I kind of fundamentally love Connor. He's so clueless and somehow even dorkier than Kendall, which really shouldn't be possible, but stuff like genuinely being hurt by his little sister calling him the first pancake or when he gets plastered at Tom's bachelor party and gets into trouble with the club management because he's telling everyone he loves them...there's just something so childlike about him. He's naive to the point that it's dangerous given the amount of money and therefore power he has at his disposal, but it's...I dunno, there's something touching about him.

I'm adopting a dog right now and so I keep thinking of all the characters as different sorts of rescue dogs in a foster. Connor is that one that wags his tail like crazy at literally everyone who walks in. Kendall hangs back, but the foster family stresses that he's very trainable and can already do a few tricks. Roman barks like a maniac at everybody. Shiv seems like the foster family's own dog.
posted by rue72 at 9:13 AM on October 1, 2019 [8 favorites]

There were a couple of small moments where I really felt the cruelty of the Roy siblings--Shiv's face during the drinks-pouring and "Rhea doesn't drink" scene, and then Kendall having his date (or booty call? what is even the term for someone flying you to another country like this?) flown back to NY on the first flight.

So cold and awful, and in a way that makes me think they're like this all the time. Kendall has enough of a conscience to feel bad about the death of the waiter, but he seemed 100% oblivious to any pain he'd inflict on his date by having her sent away abruptly.

Also, Roman's delightful facial expression when he contemplates the possibility of his father hooking up with Gerri.
posted by witchen at 11:30 AM on October 1, 2019 [1 favorite]

I think Kendall was kind of bothered by what he did to his temporary girlfriend, but it seemed he was squaring that with wanting to please daddy when they cut to him giving a blank, somewhat pained look after he'd sent her away.

I don't know that he was bothered by hurting her so much as that he seems to only get animating energy these days from whatever quasi relationship he's in, and when that's gone he goes back to broken robot.

Because I can't really reconcile his feeling bad about her with the incredibly brutal way he dumped her: he told her he was going to get her jacket! And then instead some Waystar goon is going to come out and tell her that she's leaving in the morning and that Kendall won't be able to see her before then. That's some remarkably shitty behavior, even on a show full of shitty behavior.
posted by Ragged Richard at 8:35 AM on October 2, 2019 [2 favorites]

Oh my word this is delicious: The Definitive Analysis of Kendall Roy’s Rap From ‘Succession’. Includes a link to a dialog-free version of Kendall's rap so you can listen to it over and over and over again.
Shaper of views, creator of news
Father of many, paid all his dues
posted by Nelson at 9:49 AM on October 2, 2019 [4 favorites]

Kendall treated Jennifer like sex with her was a drug. He used her for it, got the high, was making declarations like wanting to buy an island where they could go on an endless sex binge -- and then got the comedown, when he hated everything down to her word choice and couldn't bear to be near her, just sent her away like she was a bag of trash to be put out on the curb.

I felt terrible for her. I have been Jennifer more than once and it is not fun to be somebody's supplier when they need a hit of love/acceptance/sex that desperately. But that's the issue with Kendall being an addict. This is why Rava left him and isn't letting the kids near him. This is compulsive, cruel, and destructive behavior and Kendall is apparently so far down into the pit that it's like nobody else exists in his dark little world. I doubt he even registered what he was doing to Jennifer or how he was making her feel, let alone worrying about it.

I actually prefer the "broken doll" version of him to this, this seems even darker.

That said, I empathize so much with Kendall. To me, he seems so real as someone who struggles with intense depression and whose attempts to self-medicate have wound up spiraling into a pernicious addiction. Not trying to minimize how toxic and dangerous he is to everyone around him (not least his kids), but my heart does still go out to him because his frame of mind seems so heartbreakingly familiar even if his circumstances aren't.

Also, Roman's delightful facial expression when he contemplates the possibility of his father hooking up with Gerri.

I have to say, the Oedipal part of the dynamic kind of creeps me out. I don't think Gerri is interested in being any of the Roy kids' mother but I do think that Roman is *looking* for a mother, in a way that I honestly find uncomfortable to watch in an adult. And then that's the only relationship he's actually able to turn sexual? Yeesh. And I mean, it's not just the age differential that makes it seem Oedipal to me, it's how Roman is always going to her for advice and comfort in this weird "little boy" kind of way, literally wants her to scold him like a little boy, then his "that's disgusting!" reaction to Gerri and Logan maybe hooking up at some point...and Geri seems to have worked for Logan for decades and knows the whole family well, so did she actually know Roman when he was a kid? And now he's sexually harassing her but she thinks she can use it for her own career, or whatever is going on with her? I mean, wtf is Gerri's take on the situation, you know? She's so eerily blasé, when you would think that the founder's screw up kid latching onto you the way Roman has latched onto Gerri would be kind of a crisis. But I mean, she also took Boar on the Floor pretty well in stride, she's clearly seen some major shit over all these years at Waystar. Dude, these people are wild.
posted by rue72 at 9:53 AM on October 2, 2019 [7 favorites]

Kendall's bow tie.
posted by betweenthebars at 7:22 PM on October 3, 2019 [2 favorites]

Ewan is backing the whistleblower.
posted by spikeleemajortomdickandharryconnickjrmints at 7:31 PM on October 5, 2019 [6 favorites]

Ewan is backing the whistleblower.
posted by spikeleemajortomdickandharryconnickjrmints

This was my read as well.
posted by hwestiii at 6:47 PM on October 6, 2019 [1 favorite]

When I watched this, I thought that Logan bonding with Shiv was just another strategy for him. He knew the whole time that he was going to back Rhea, so after he made his decision it was safe to pal around with Shiv. Just like when he was in danger of losing Greg and he responded by telling Greg "I like you, I really do." He knows he's in danger of losing Shiv so he tells her, "You're smart, you really are."
posted by tofu_crouton at 7:05 PM on October 9, 2019 [2 favorites]

Actress-girlfriend was toast as soon as she was introduced to Logan. Maybe Kendall thought Dad would be impressed that he could pull a pretty young thing but no, with all their money, that's got to be a frequent occurrence. The problem was, she so clearly bored Logan. His tell is when he says "uh-huh". That's been a warning sign through the whole series. Kendall hate-values his father's opinion. Logan is *all* the bad things but his two wives and current maybe-lover are all pretty shrewd and girlfriend didn't measure up.

I thought Shiv was in danger of overplaying her hand, she and Logan were so cozy this episode. She's thought far enough ahead to maneuver Rhea into being the fall guy for the cruise scandal so naturally, either Tom is going to go down as well or Rhea will manage to survive it by scapegoating Tom and emerging stronger than ever.

If Ewan is backing the lawsuit, I guess he doesn't know Greg is compromised. Would've been funny if Greg had taken him up on his offer, then he'd have to choose between exposing Greg or sticking it to his brother.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:54 AM on November 16, 2019

posted by something something at 4:51 PM on January 17, 2020 [6 favorites]

I liked Kendall saying his dad was there for him at his lowest point, considering the season 1 finale.
posted by Pronoiac at 4:09 PM on November 22, 2021

The sole ROY CUNT protester brought to mind Scotland's excellent lone TRUMP IS A CUNT protester.
Specifically @JaneyGodley

Acclaimed US TV shows have a track record of falling flat on expeditions to Britain (and vice versa, I'm sure). So its great to see Succession make a good job of Scotland in "Dundee". Scotland as ancestral home has echoes of Trump and Andrew Carnegie (who Logan particularly resembles). The visit had everything a homecoming media empire plutocrat would expect, short of round condemnation from Nicola Sturgeon.

In the vein of Schitt's Creek - would love to see an offshoot series where Roman and Geri are somehow forced to get involved in the management of Hibernian football club - which they purchased in error. Hibs are currently owed by a Peruvian businessman - who may have done the same thing in real life, for all I know.
posted by rongorongo at 4:50 AM on January 5

(Brian Cox, himself, was born in Dundee - so no really stretch in that respect)
posted by rongorongo at 4:56 AM on January 5

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