Severance: Hide and Seek
March 18, 2022 7:40 PM - Season 1, Episode 6 - Subscribe
The team angers Cobel by forming an alliance.
"Kier brings the bounty to the plain / Through the torment, through the rains / Progress, knowledge, show no fear / Kier"—Harmony's rendition of The Pledge of Kierlegiance, apparently.
"Harmony Cobel is definitely drunk on Kier Kool-Aid."—from Erin Qualey's 5-star recap for Vulture.
"What does camaraderie mean? Most linguists agree it comes from the Latin 'camera,' which means 'a device used to take a photograph.'"—Ricken.
"Fuck you, Lumon"—June.
"Kier brings the bounty to the plain / Through the torment, through the rains / Progress, knowledge, show no fear / Kier"—Harmony's rendition of The Pledge of Kierlegiance, apparently.
"Harmony Cobel is definitely drunk on Kier Kool-Aid."—from Erin Qualey's 5-star recap for Vulture.
"What does camaraderie mean? Most linguists agree it comes from the Latin 'camera,' which means 'a device used to take a photograph.'"—Ricken.
"Fuck you, Lumon"—June.
There's a lot of good stuff in the opening scene with in Cobel's shrine.
"Myrtle Eagan School for Girls Founded 1957 (?)"
The mannequin head in bandages (mask).
"Lumon Industries High Quality Pharmaceutical Interventions, 345 E. Main Street, Kier PE"
Was not exactly expecting Dylan's outie life.
Bit odd that Ms. Casey is classified as a "part time innie." Does that mean the MDR team are full time - including their nominally outie life? Or that Casey is just an "on call" contract?
Camera
The root latin meant a chamber of some sort. Camaraderie came from roomate (sharing a chamber). (Photographic) Camera is short for camera obscura (dark chamber). So Riken's book is obviously as BS as the Kier/ Lumon cult, to show/ contrast how BS the Lumon cult is?
The Burt (Walken)/ Irving (Turturro) moment was glorious.
Is Alexa (Mark's date) a Kier operative, or an anti-Kier operative?
posted by porpoise at 8:59 PM on March 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
"Myrtle Eagan School for Girls Founded 1957 (?)"
The mannequin head in bandages (mask).
"Lumon Industries High Quality Pharmaceutical Interventions, 345 E. Main Street, Kier PE"
Was not exactly expecting Dylan's outie life.
Bit odd that Ms. Casey is classified as a "part time innie." Does that mean the MDR team are full time - including their nominally outie life? Or that Casey is just an "on call" contract?
Camera
The root latin meant a chamber of some sort. Camaraderie came from roomate (sharing a chamber). (Photographic) Camera is short for camera obscura (dark chamber). So Riken's book is obviously as BS as the Kier/ Lumon cult, to show/ contrast how BS the Lumon cult is?
The Burt (Walken)/ Irving (Turturro) moment was glorious.
Is Alexa (Mark's date) a Kier operative, or an anti-Kier operative?
posted by porpoise at 8:59 PM on March 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
Alexa is also an interesting name for the writers to pick nowadays.
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 9:48 PM on March 18, 2022 [16 favorites]
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 9:48 PM on March 18, 2022 [16 favorites]
If you enjoyed the Lumen corporate song, then prepare to feast on the 1937 edition of Songs of The IBM, featuring rousing hymns praising the founder, such as:
posted by autopilot at 12:34 AM on March 19, 2022 [20 favorites]
Thomas Watson is our inspiration,One modern reviewer said There is no God but IBM, and TJ Watson is his prophet, which is not an exaggeration. It is impossible to overstate how cult-like these songs are, extolling not just Watson, but also the T-H-I-N-K Slogan, the Vice Presidents, District Managers, and each of the seven Product Lines (Tabulation, ITR, Industrial Scales, Writing Machines, Radiotype, Proof Machines, and Ticketographs).
Head and soul of our splendid I. B. M.
We are pledged to him in every nation,
Our President and most beloved man.
His wisdom has guided each division
In service to all humanity
We have grown and broadened with his vision,
None can match him or our great company.
T. J. Watson, we all honor you,
You're so big and so square and so true,
We will follow and serve with you forever,
All the world must know what I. B. M. can do.
posted by autopilot at 12:34 AM on March 19, 2022 [20 favorites]
The wonderful world of industrial musicals
I've long held that any human activity with an '-ism' at the end is a religion (as they give a community of believers a sense of purpose and group identity around a common aim and object of veneration, which will be the bit before the '-ism', often with doctrines and dogmas and so forth.
Capitalism is definitely not an exception to this.
posted by Grangousier at 3:46 AM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
I've long held that any human activity with an '-ism' at the end is a religion (as they give a community of believers a sense of purpose and group identity around a common aim and object of veneration, which will be the bit before the '-ism', often with doctrines and dogmas and so forth.
Capitalism is definitely not an exception to this.
posted by Grangousier at 3:46 AM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
Bit odd that Ms. Casey is classified as a "part time innie."
I thought the line was “part time innie such as yourself”, that is, calling Mark part time (only business hours) and presumably calling Ms. Casey full time?
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 5:17 AM on March 19, 2022 [6 favorites]
I thought the line was “part time innie such as yourself”, that is, calling Mark part time (only business hours) and presumably calling Ms. Casey full time?
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 5:17 AM on March 19, 2022 [6 favorites]
The Vulture recap was useful - I hadn't picked up that the pregnant lady was severed, and that's why she didn't recognize Devon.
posted by simonw at 7:42 AM on March 19, 2022
posted by simonw at 7:42 AM on March 19, 2022
This is the only episode of TV I have ever rewatched immediately after finishing it the first time.
The lady at the birthing center is obviously severed while there. She said there she had three babies but she was only with one baby on the outside. And obviously she didn't remember anything that happened there while on the outside. So her politician husband is using her as some sort of Guinea pig?
"Mark, it's not your job to play nursemaid to every new refiner" -- Mrs. Cobel, shortly before she played a lactation consultant to Mark's sister's new baby. Do the babies have something to do with the refinement? As someone said in the last thread, are the goats actually human babies?
The scene with Dylan was crazy. What's he going to be like in the next episode now that he knows a bit about his outie life? It took me a bit to figure out what happened but then I remembered the outies have contact with Milchick, at least when they get hired.
The columns of workstations at O&D were labeled E and F, so there are AT LEAST four more columns full of people are probably more. What's with the watering can and the hatchets?
Does anyone know how many episodes there are? I'm worried this show is just going to be a big black box and we'll never really know exactly what's going on.
posted by bondcliff at 8:41 AM on March 19, 2022 [1 favorite]
The lady at the birthing center is obviously severed while there. She said there she had three babies but she was only with one baby on the outside. And obviously she didn't remember anything that happened there while on the outside. So her politician husband is using her as some sort of Guinea pig?
"Mark, it's not your job to play nursemaid to every new refiner" -- Mrs. Cobel, shortly before she played a lactation consultant to Mark's sister's new baby. Do the babies have something to do with the refinement? As someone said in the last thread, are the goats actually human babies?
The scene with Dylan was crazy. What's he going to be like in the next episode now that he knows a bit about his outie life? It took me a bit to figure out what happened but then I remembered the outies have contact with Milchick, at least when they get hired.
The columns of workstations at O&D were labeled E and F, so there are AT LEAST four more columns full of people are probably more. What's with the watering can and the hatchets?
Does anyone know how many episodes there are? I'm worried this show is just going to be a big black box and we'll never really know exactly what's going on.
posted by bondcliff at 8:41 AM on March 19, 2022 [1 favorite]
Looks like 9 episodes, bondcliff, with the last one airing on April 8th.
I need to watch this again. The fact that there's a severance switch! Moving the corridors! The elevator isn't a real elevator!
posted by minsies at 8:49 AM on March 19, 2022 [5 favorites]
I need to watch this again. The fact that there's a severance switch! Moving the corridors! The elevator isn't a real elevator!
posted by minsies at 8:49 AM on March 19, 2022 [5 favorites]
I wasn't sure what the maintenance people were doing. I figured they were putting "severed sections" into the hallways so they wouldn't remember what happens outside MDR. I guess we'll see in the next episode.
posted by bondcliff at 8:59 AM on March 19, 2022
posted by bondcliff at 8:59 AM on March 19, 2022
She said there she had three babies but she was only with one baby on the outside.
There were two other children there with them at the park, so I think baby Bradley-not-William was number three. And a high five to Captain Science who commented on the possibility of farming out the pain of a pregnancy to a different persona by choosing a severed labor/delivery last week. But I wonder: Is the delivering version of Gabby the severed persona? Or is the public version, the park version of Gabby, the one that's severed?
The break room has moved to physical punishment. That seems to be a new thing.
The opening with Cobel, I loved the early suggestion of a nun, with her hair tucked back and the implant dangling from a turtleneck, like a cross. I've been enjoying the subtlety of how the demands of loyalty to employers in real life is not unlike a cult, and so for me it was a bit jarring to move so quickly from subtle images to a full on altar with so much info there -- I'll need to pause the frame and examine it more closely. The big reveals for me were the Gabby sever storyline and the fact that severing works outside of the building, so I feel like maybe they should have waited to reveal that much about the cult? Unless that means that there's bigger information coming.
Questions!
The optics department, are they full time severed? Do they live there? If Miss Casey is severed full time, where else does she spend her time?
The establishing shots of the Lumon HQ, the plot of land surrounding the building is enormous and beyond it there's what looks like miles of low mountains. How far back does it go?
And perhaps most importantly, is Cobel's bedroom really made of cinderblock?
posted by mochapickle at 9:09 AM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
There were two other children there with them at the park, so I think baby Bradley-not-William was number three. And a high five to Captain Science who commented on the possibility of farming out the pain of a pregnancy to a different persona by choosing a severed labor/delivery last week. But I wonder: Is the delivering version of Gabby the severed persona? Or is the public version, the park version of Gabby, the one that's severed?
The break room has moved to physical punishment. That seems to be a new thing.
The opening with Cobel, I loved the early suggestion of a nun, with her hair tucked back and the implant dangling from a turtleneck, like a cross. I've been enjoying the subtlety of how the demands of loyalty to employers in real life is not unlike a cult, and so for me it was a bit jarring to move so quickly from subtle images to a full on altar with so much info there -- I'll need to pause the frame and examine it more closely. The big reveals for me were the Gabby sever storyline and the fact that severing works outside of the building, so I feel like maybe they should have waited to reveal that much about the cult? Unless that means that there's bigger information coming.
Questions!
The optics department, are they full time severed? Do they live there? If Miss Casey is severed full time, where else does she spend her time?
The establishing shots of the Lumon HQ, the plot of land surrounding the building is enormous and beyond it there's what looks like miles of low mountains. How far back does it go?
And perhaps most importantly, is Cobel's bedroom really made of cinderblock?
posted by mochapickle at 9:09 AM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
ALSO, that scene with Irving and Burt in the garden. It was so well done.
posted by mochapickle at 9:10 AM on March 19, 2022 [6 favorites]
posted by mochapickle at 9:10 AM on March 19, 2022 [6 favorites]
"What does camaraderie mean? Most linguists agree it comes from the Latin 'camera,' which means 'a device used to take a photograph.'"—Ricken.
Which is entirely made up, by the way! It's from the french word for comrade, or friend. Nothing to do with cameras.
This series plays so much with diametric extremes. You have these tightly controlled severance people, then you have random freeform, kelp-hanging, self-help Ricken who is creating chaos by saying things that sound interesting but are either meaningless or utterly wrong. No wonder there's so much moral confusion in the universe of this show -- the boundary markers of truth are so far apart.
posted by mochapickle at 10:30 AM on March 19, 2022 [7 favorites]
Which is entirely made up, by the way! It's from the french word for comrade, or friend. Nothing to do with cameras.
This series plays so much with diametric extremes. You have these tightly controlled severance people, then you have random freeform, kelp-hanging, self-help Ricken who is creating chaos by saying things that sound interesting but are either meaningless or utterly wrong. No wonder there's so much moral confusion in the universe of this show -- the boundary markers of truth are so far apart.
posted by mochapickle at 10:30 AM on March 19, 2022 [7 favorites]
The look on Miss Casey's face when she passed Mark in the narrow corridor was tragic, chilling and haunting.
posted by essexjan at 10:31 AM on March 19, 2022 [6 favorites]
posted by essexjan at 10:31 AM on March 19, 2022 [6 favorites]
The goat head mask in frame while Nurse Cobel held the baby was suggestive.
Didn’t we see an old fashioned (religious?) white dress in Mark’s basement too?
posted by Monochrome at 12:24 PM on March 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
Didn’t we see an old fashioned (religious?) white dress in Mark’s basement too?
posted by Monochrome at 12:24 PM on March 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
The garden of Eagan... illuminated by corporate fluorescence.
posted by gemutlichkeit at 5:07 PM on March 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by gemutlichkeit at 5:07 PM on March 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
I want to know who's been looking after the plants in the secret plant room.
posted by simonw at 5:09 PM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by simonw at 5:09 PM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
LOL, I assumed the plants were plastic office plants.
posted by armacy at 7:17 PM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by armacy at 7:17 PM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
So Dylan (innie) idly muses that "love transcends severance" on one day, and now the next time he wakes up he will be processing the fact that he doesn't remember his own son or family
posted by anazgnos at 8:03 PM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by anazgnos at 8:03 PM on March 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
Will he remember, though? It seems like they were able to retcon him with the switch…
posted by mochapickle at 9:18 PM on March 19, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by mochapickle at 9:18 PM on March 19, 2022 [1 favorite]
If he doesn't remember, that's all the more terrifying.
posted by thedward at 10:57 PM on March 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by thedward at 10:57 PM on March 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
And perhaps most importantly, is Cobel's bedroom really made of cinderblock?
I'm pretty sure she was in her basement.
posted by oneirodynia at 1:49 PM on March 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
I'm pretty sure she was in her basement.
posted by oneirodynia at 1:49 PM on March 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
I’ve waited to comment on this ep until other people have had a chance to weigh in. This is the first episode that I didn’t immediately love. It felt rushed to me — as if the series was written for 12 episodes but then it was cut down to 9. A LOT happened this ep, and instead of the wonderful “little bits of information disclosed through believable interactions”, there was a lot of important stuff that felt placed in without the care and build-up that’s made this deeply engaging.
Burt and Irv in the plant room was wonderful. Yes, two powerhouses of actors, but it’s made me so, so happy to see all of the desire and happiness and confusion and fear and hope of two older people who aren’t “supposed” to fall in love being depicted with authenticity and care.
I’m a little confused by both Scott’s flipping back and forth between toeing the line and taking radical action. Maybe the fact that we’re seeing both the innie and the outie simultaneously doing this is the point.
Cobel’s shrine… this is one of the places where (for me) I would have liked a more gradual revelation. Tacking a bunch of clippings on a wall is a standard filmic method for disclosing a bunch of information quickly when you don’t have the time or budget to tackle it more carefully. A slower series of reveals would have been more chilling …. and everything else about Cobel is so orderly - I would think they would have all been framed, in identical frames, or something. :)
And did I miss something about her being a lactation specialist? I thought she referenced owning a flower shop at Petey’s funeral. For me, this would have been a good place to show the conversation between her and Scott to see how she convinced him to refer her.
Ditto that with Mr. Graner’s entry into Dylan’s home. Poor Dylan! What a horror.
…and in one episode, we’ve gone from 5 big puzzles to about 47. I hope they manage to bring them all to a terrible and satisfying conclusion. :)
posted by Silvery Fish at 4:02 PM on March 20, 2022 [3 favorites]
Burt and Irv in the plant room was wonderful. Yes, two powerhouses of actors, but it’s made me so, so happy to see all of the desire and happiness and confusion and fear and hope of two older people who aren’t “supposed” to fall in love being depicted with authenticity and care.
I’m a little confused by both Scott’s flipping back and forth between toeing the line and taking radical action. Maybe the fact that we’re seeing both the innie and the outie simultaneously doing this is the point.
Cobel’s shrine… this is one of the places where (for me) I would have liked a more gradual revelation. Tacking a bunch of clippings on a wall is a standard filmic method for disclosing a bunch of information quickly when you don’t have the time or budget to tackle it more carefully. A slower series of reveals would have been more chilling …. and everything else about Cobel is so orderly - I would think they would have all been framed, in identical frames, or something. :)
And did I miss something about her being a lactation specialist? I thought she referenced owning a flower shop at Petey’s funeral. For me, this would have been a good place to show the conversation between her and Scott to see how she convinced him to refer her.
Ditto that with Mr. Graner’s entry into Dylan’s home. Poor Dylan! What a horror.
…and in one episode, we’ve gone from 5 big puzzles to about 47. I hope they manage to bring them all to a terrible and satisfying conclusion. :)
posted by Silvery Fish at 4:02 PM on March 20, 2022 [3 favorites]
I suspect the installation is to keep the departments separate by requiring specific access cards, as it did look like a card reader being installed in MDR.
posted by Marticus at 6:19 PM on March 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Marticus at 6:19 PM on March 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
I had to watch this twice because I really didn't like it the first time. I've been loving this show all along and couldn't figure out why this one fell so flat for me. Just having watched it the second time I realize why, it's because this episode is the fulcrum. This is when they shift from world building the kooky weirdness of the Severance procedure to a full-on plot involving danger and mystery. And that shift is awkward. Also I don't have a lot of faith the mystery is going to pay off satisfyingly, given the bad history of other shows like this.
The key moment here is the rebellion in the Innie world, when Mark S and the rest of MDR ignore their orders and go march over to O&D. And Burt joins their rebellion by justifying it all as part of Kier's teachings, even tries to bring Irving along. It's an enormous shift in the show; in the past everyone but Helly was trying to adhere to Lumon's rules. This conflict is heightened by the revelation that Harmony is a True Believer, between the opening with her shrine to Kier and then her singing the creepy Kier song. The conflict is established.
While that's a momentous plot development all the real complicated action is happening in Outie world. The confirmation of severance pregnancy, the skullduggery, Harmony inserting herself as a lactation consultant. But the real shock is Doug Graner the security heavy showing up in the Outie world, friends with Harmony, and them conspiring and competing to influence events Outside. The nice clean lines of Severance have been cut and it's really disorienting.
So having watched it this second time I appreciate what they've done. This is the episode that sunders the clean plot division, this is the one that blurs the lines. It just doesn't feel very comfortable watching. I go back to my fear I expressed up above: the writers have set a very high bar for themselves and they better pay all this weirdness off. I'm already bracing for heartbreak.
posted by Nelson at 9:37 PM on March 20, 2022 [4 favorites]
The key moment here is the rebellion in the Innie world, when Mark S and the rest of MDR ignore their orders and go march over to O&D. And Burt joins their rebellion by justifying it all as part of Kier's teachings, even tries to bring Irving along. It's an enormous shift in the show; in the past everyone but Helly was trying to adhere to Lumon's rules. This conflict is heightened by the revelation that Harmony is a True Believer, between the opening with her shrine to Kier and then her singing the creepy Kier song. The conflict is established.
While that's a momentous plot development all the real complicated action is happening in Outie world. The confirmation of severance pregnancy, the skullduggery, Harmony inserting herself as a lactation consultant. But the real shock is Doug Graner the security heavy showing up in the Outie world, friends with Harmony, and them conspiring and competing to influence events Outside. The nice clean lines of Severance have been cut and it's really disorienting.
So having watched it this second time I appreciate what they've done. This is the episode that sunders the clean plot division, this is the one that blurs the lines. It just doesn't feel very comfortable watching. I go back to my fear I expressed up above: the writers have set a very high bar for themselves and they better pay all this weirdness off. I'm already bracing for heartbreak.
posted by Nelson at 9:37 PM on March 20, 2022 [4 favorites]
I wasn't sure what the maintenance people were doing. I figured they were putting "severed sections" into the hallways so they wouldn't remember what happens outside MDR. I guess we'll see in the next episode.
It seemed to me they were putting a locking door on MDR, so that the severed employees won't be able to leave.
Will he remember, though? It seems like they were able to retcon him with the switch…
I'm not sure, but I thought the switch was just to flip him into and out of his innie while not in the Lumen building. So Milcheck comes to his house, they flip it, he turns into his innie, Milcheck questions him, he sees his son, then they flip it and he's his outie again.
posted by Ragged Richard at 7:28 AM on March 21, 2022 [6 favorites]
Milcheck questions him, he sees his son, then they flip it and he's his outie again.
The question I had was - why doesn’t Dylan’s outie flip out when he comes to and he’s in his closet and sees Milcheck in there with him?
posted by Silvery Fish at 8:51 AM on March 21, 2022 [1 favorite]
The question I had was - why doesn’t Dylan’s outie flip out when he comes to and he’s in his closet and sees Milcheck in there with him?
posted by Silvery Fish at 8:51 AM on March 21, 2022 [1 favorite]
I think the outie colluded with Milcheck. He was already in the closet when the switch was flipped for the first time to activate Dylan's innie. So he expected to wake back up and all was OK. Except for the part about the innie learning about having a kid. That's going to definitely cause problems.
One of the awful things about Severance is the way the outies are the "real people" and the innies are these forgotten, irrelevant slaves. You could imagine a more symmetric process. Although the innies have lost all their complex memories and live trapped inside Lumon headquarters, they're definitely the inferior half.
posted by Nelson at 8:57 AM on March 21, 2022 [13 favorites]
One of the awful things about Severance is the way the outies are the "real people" and the innies are these forgotten, irrelevant slaves. You could imagine a more symmetric process. Although the innies have lost all their complex memories and live trapped inside Lumon headquarters, they're definitely the inferior half.
posted by Nelson at 8:57 AM on March 21, 2022 [13 favorites]
I think the outie colluded with Milcheck.
That’s a fair interpretation, but in Scott’s case, Corbel lives next door under a different name and fictitious job, so I was wondering if all of the innies have a similar handler. Guess we find out next week 🙂
posted by Silvery Fish at 9:13 AM on March 21, 2022
That’s a fair interpretation, but in Scott’s case, Corbel lives next door under a different name and fictitious job, so I was wondering if all of the innies have a similar handler. Guess we find out next week 🙂
posted by Silvery Fish at 9:13 AM on March 21, 2022
I love this show so much, and it's also really bad for my sleep. Something about the off-kilter weirdness just seems to fuck with my subconscious.
While watching the last episode, I decided that Helly must be an Eagan, and I can't let go of this idea. I saw someone else mentioned this possibility, but I've been staying away from reddit and twitter so I apologize if this is old hat for some people, but: I was thinking her outie really reminded me of Shiv from Succession, which got me thinking, maybe there's a succession fight among various Eagan scions, and this is part of how Helly is trying to prove herself? That would explain why it's so important to her to keep her innie there, even at risk to her own life. And the fact that she sees her innie as subhuman shows she's a true believer. Maybe she's even the person in the inner circle advocating for expanding the severance program (working with powerful outsiders like the Senator?).
One thing that makes this show both fun and sickening to watch is that almost everything at Lumon has parallels to real-world work. And I think if Helly is an Eagan, she could be like the privileged kid who slums it for a summer and is horrified by the way regular people are treated in the workplace and uncomprehending about why they put up with it. She doesn't have her outie memories, but she has the confidence and maybe entitlement of someone raised in privilege, so she simply can't submit to this treatment, which is what allows for her rebellion. (Her wry "I wish I could remember my childhood" when they visit the museum is even funnier/darker in this context.)
If this is true, she could actually be the big villain of the season, which would be gutting. But there's also a possibility that if her innie consciousness could somehow transcend to her outie, it could be radicalizing.
posted by lunasol at 10:23 AM on March 21, 2022 [11 favorites]
While watching the last episode, I decided that Helly must be an Eagan, and I can't let go of this idea. I saw someone else mentioned this possibility, but I've been staying away from reddit and twitter so I apologize if this is old hat for some people, but: I was thinking her outie really reminded me of Shiv from Succession, which got me thinking, maybe there's a succession fight among various Eagan scions, and this is part of how Helly is trying to prove herself? That would explain why it's so important to her to keep her innie there, even at risk to her own life. And the fact that she sees her innie as subhuman shows she's a true believer. Maybe she's even the person in the inner circle advocating for expanding the severance program (working with powerful outsiders like the Senator?).
One thing that makes this show both fun and sickening to watch is that almost everything at Lumon has parallels to real-world work. And I think if Helly is an Eagan, she could be like the privileged kid who slums it for a summer and is horrified by the way regular people are treated in the workplace and uncomprehending about why they put up with it. She doesn't have her outie memories, but she has the confidence and maybe entitlement of someone raised in privilege, so she simply can't submit to this treatment, which is what allows for her rebellion. (Her wry "I wish I could remember my childhood" when they visit the museum is even funnier/darker in this context.)
If this is true, she could actually be the big villain of the season, which would be gutting. But there's also a possibility that if her innie consciousness could somehow transcend to her outie, it could be radicalizing.
posted by lunasol at 10:23 AM on March 21, 2022 [11 favorites]
Silvery Fish: "That’s a fair interpretation, but in Scott’s case, Corbel lives next door under a different name and fictitious job, so I was wondering if all of the innies have a similar handler. Guess we find out next week 🙂"
Based on his interactions with Helly's outie, Milchick seems to be the one employee that the outies (at least the MDR outies) are aware of. Someone has to liaise between the two halves of severed employees; makes sense for it to be one person, freeing up the other non-severed employees to spy on the outies.
That said, Harmony has demonstrated a lot of “freelance” behavior, and we got a sense this week of how much of a True Believer she is. Her proximity to Mark's outie is seeming less and less like standard protocol and more and more like an artifact of her own agenda.
posted by savetheclocktower at 10:25 AM on March 21, 2022 [4 favorites]
Based on his interactions with Helly's outie, Milchick seems to be the one employee that the outies (at least the MDR outies) are aware of. Someone has to liaise between the two halves of severed employees; makes sense for it to be one person, freeing up the other non-severed employees to spy on the outies.
That said, Harmony has demonstrated a lot of “freelance” behavior, and we got a sense this week of how much of a True Believer she is. Her proximity to Mark's outie is seeming less and less like standard protocol and more and more like an artifact of her own agenda.
posted by savetheclocktower at 10:25 AM on March 21, 2022 [4 favorites]
I'm still trying to decide how I feel about this episode. I do appreciate how much plot development we got, especially when compared to the previous episode's molasses-like pace. But I am also aware of how few episodes are left in this season.
A show that builds a deep, inscrutable universe ought to be meticulous in how it structures its mysteries and payoffs. The classic cautionary tale is Lost, for which it seems the main controversy was how long its viewers were willing to wait for answers to the accumulating mysteries, and whether the payoffs would ultimately be worth it. (Having bailed on Lost midway through season 2, I don't have much insight on the latter point.) I'm not allergic to cliffhangers, and I am theoretically willing to wait until the next season for crucial revelations. But the longer a certain thread takes to resolve itself, the more I begin to suspect that there wasn't a plan, and that the writers will just end up mining fan-theories.
So I think it behooves the showrunner to drop subtle narrative hints that, yes, there's a plan. One way to do that is to structure the payoffs so that a season feels rewarding on its own. If I have to wait until season 2 unfolds to decide how I felt about season 1, that's rough.
I'm also aware of how many different ways viewers approach these narrative ambiguities, and how difficult it can be to please everyone. Some people really do seem to appreciate when certain mysteries are left unexplained, as it leaves behind fertile ground for them to grow their own theories of what really happened. (Without spoilers: there are a couple of Christopher Nolan movies that do this, albeit defensibly. And Blade Runner might be the modern originator of this trope.)
I think it's fun to sit around and think about explanations for those mysteries that would be narratively satisfying, and lord knows that fan theories are a reliable generator of clickbait for a handful of TV-obsessed web sites. But ultimately it doesn't have much to tell us about the original work. At its best it's an exercise in fan fiction (and I don't mean that pejoratively); at its worst, it's like sitting around and trying to figure out whether the titular star of SNL's It’s Pat sketches was “actually” a man or a woman. In neither case does it tell us anything about the intent of the author. If things are purposefully left unexplained, then my takeaway is that the ambiguity is the point, and I'm going to judge the work by how poignant that ambiguity actually is, not by filling in the blank with the explanation I find most interesting.
I am digressing pretty hard here. My gears are turning on how I'd want the next three episodes to play out, what sort of payoff I'd be satisfied with to end this season, and which mysteries I'd be willing to let carry over into another season.
I'd be remiss if I didn't compliment them on this, though: they seem to understand how the mere existence of an innie is the product of a fascinating decision made by an outie. Mark's story is perhaps the most obvious rationale: loss of a loved one made him spiritually barren, and he made a choice that he thought would allow him to compartmentalize. But I'm betting that there are other rationales — some just as tragic, others perhaps just optimistic and self-deluded. The glimpse we got into outie Dylan makes me think that the writers know they have a hand full of trump cards and are willing to drop them purposefully. This can be risky — I've already got some wacko guesses about what Irving's outie is like, and who knows if I'll like what they decide on — but it's still a position of strength.
posted by savetheclocktower at 11:09 AM on March 21, 2022 [7 favorites]
A show that builds a deep, inscrutable universe ought to be meticulous in how it structures its mysteries and payoffs. The classic cautionary tale is Lost, for which it seems the main controversy was how long its viewers were willing to wait for answers to the accumulating mysteries, and whether the payoffs would ultimately be worth it. (Having bailed on Lost midway through season 2, I don't have much insight on the latter point.) I'm not allergic to cliffhangers, and I am theoretically willing to wait until the next season for crucial revelations. But the longer a certain thread takes to resolve itself, the more I begin to suspect that there wasn't a plan, and that the writers will just end up mining fan-theories.
So I think it behooves the showrunner to drop subtle narrative hints that, yes, there's a plan. One way to do that is to structure the payoffs so that a season feels rewarding on its own. If I have to wait until season 2 unfolds to decide how I felt about season 1, that's rough.
I'm also aware of how many different ways viewers approach these narrative ambiguities, and how difficult it can be to please everyone. Some people really do seem to appreciate when certain mysteries are left unexplained, as it leaves behind fertile ground for them to grow their own theories of what really happened. (Without spoilers: there are a couple of Christopher Nolan movies that do this, albeit defensibly. And Blade Runner might be the modern originator of this trope.)
I think it's fun to sit around and think about explanations for those mysteries that would be narratively satisfying, and lord knows that fan theories are a reliable generator of clickbait for a handful of TV-obsessed web sites. But ultimately it doesn't have much to tell us about the original work. At its best it's an exercise in fan fiction (and I don't mean that pejoratively); at its worst, it's like sitting around and trying to figure out whether the titular star of SNL's It’s Pat sketches was “actually” a man or a woman. In neither case does it tell us anything about the intent of the author. If things are purposefully left unexplained, then my takeaway is that the ambiguity is the point, and I'm going to judge the work by how poignant that ambiguity actually is, not by filling in the blank with the explanation I find most interesting.
I am digressing pretty hard here. My gears are turning on how I'd want the next three episodes to play out, what sort of payoff I'd be satisfied with to end this season, and which mysteries I'd be willing to let carry over into another season.
I'd be remiss if I didn't compliment them on this, though: they seem to understand how the mere existence of an innie is the product of a fascinating decision made by an outie. Mark's story is perhaps the most obvious rationale: loss of a loved one made him spiritually barren, and he made a choice that he thought would allow him to compartmentalize. But I'm betting that there are other rationales — some just as tragic, others perhaps just optimistic and self-deluded. The glimpse we got into outie Dylan makes me think that the writers know they have a hand full of trump cards and are willing to drop them purposefully. This can be risky — I've already got some wacko guesses about what Irving's outie is like, and who knows if I'll like what they decide on — but it's still a position of strength.
posted by savetheclocktower at 11:09 AM on March 21, 2022 [7 favorites]
If things are purposefully left unexplained, then my takeaway is that the ambiguity is the point,
I have a theory, one I hope is incorrect, that someone at Apple TV+ decided character driven shows about ambiguity are the way to get people talking and build up their subscriber base. If Severance ends season 1 with More! Mystery! and essentially no answers then I will take my theory as correct and basically write off any unfinished Apple TV+ shows.
But I really hope there's a point to the fantastic story being told in this show.
Stomp on the mystery box, I'm not here for shaggy dog stories.
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 12:04 PM on March 21, 2022 [6 favorites]
I have a theory, one I hope is incorrect, that someone at Apple TV+ decided character driven shows about ambiguity are the way to get people talking and build up their subscriber base. If Severance ends season 1 with More! Mystery! and essentially no answers then I will take my theory as correct and basically write off any unfinished Apple TV+ shows.
But I really hope there's a point to the fantastic story being told in this show.
Stomp on the mystery box, I'm not here for shaggy dog stories.
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 12:04 PM on March 21, 2022 [6 favorites]
Bit odd that Ms. Casey is classified as a "part time innie."
I thought the line was “part time innie such as yourself”, that is, calling Mark part time (only business hours) and presumably calling Ms. Casey full time?
I rewatched and the line is:
"Part-time innies may not be as sophisticated and socialized as yourself, but they still must be held accountable."
So it seems Ms. Casey is indeed a part-time innie.
Anyway, I was really disappointed in the episode the first watch, and so I watched it again. I'm not pleased about the religious nut job angle- I was really hoping this show was going to go somewhere new with some deep corporate fascism and instead it's trite religious kookery, Crazy Altar and all. I hated that the band scene felt like it was written and cast by some old man who was like "this is what kids these days get up to!" with their only reference being The Lost Boys and Streets of Fire. Really it was such a jarring bit of inauthenticity that I am still angry about it. Those two scenes really seemed so poorly done, trite and familiar, falling back on countless other shows for their imagery. Now I am suddenly having doubts about what seemed a really robust vision and purpose.
Generally I thought this episode seemed rushed, cramming in numerous plot points. After emphasizing the mistrust and suspicion between the two departments the sudden turn towards working together felt unearned. Mark's little burst of rebelliousness also seemed to come from nowhere. I'm hoping that the feeling the people making this show maybe are not as slick and competent as they seemed is vanquished in the next episode, but there was just something about this one that really didn't sit right.
(I have to say the "Book" was also quite disappointing.)
posted by oneirodynia at 12:29 PM on March 21, 2022 [4 favorites]
I thought the line was “part time innie such as yourself”, that is, calling Mark part time (only business hours) and presumably calling Ms. Casey full time?
I rewatched and the line is:
"Part-time innies may not be as sophisticated and socialized as yourself, but they still must be held accountable."
So it seems Ms. Casey is indeed a part-time innie.
Anyway, I was really disappointed in the episode the first watch, and so I watched it again. I'm not pleased about the religious nut job angle- I was really hoping this show was going to go somewhere new with some deep corporate fascism and instead it's trite religious kookery, Crazy Altar and all. I hated that the band scene felt like it was written and cast by some old man who was like "this is what kids these days get up to!" with their only reference being The Lost Boys and Streets of Fire. Really it was such a jarring bit of inauthenticity that I am still angry about it. Those two scenes really seemed so poorly done, trite and familiar, falling back on countless other shows for their imagery. Now I am suddenly having doubts about what seemed a really robust vision and purpose.
Generally I thought this episode seemed rushed, cramming in numerous plot points. After emphasizing the mistrust and suspicion between the two departments the sudden turn towards working together felt unearned. Mark's little burst of rebelliousness also seemed to come from nowhere. I'm hoping that the feeling the people making this show maybe are not as slick and competent as they seemed is vanquished in the next episode, but there was just something about this one that really didn't sit right.
(I have to say the "Book" was also quite disappointing.)
posted by oneirodynia at 12:29 PM on March 21, 2022 [4 favorites]
@oneiradynia - those were the scenes that felt off to me, too, for the exact reasons you listed. Again, I’m hoping that what we see are the unfortunate consequences of budget cuts and that they chose to have one clunker of an episode that would allow them to preserve the feel and pace of the remaining eps.
posted by Silvery Fish at 12:38 PM on March 21, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Silvery Fish at 12:38 PM on March 21, 2022 [1 favorite]
are the goats actually human babies?
Oh 100% for sure they are!
I'm not pleased about the religious nut job angle
I'm not so sure it's a religious thing as opposed to a cult thing, which was pretty clear from the start what with all the iconography.
I hated that the band scene felt like it was written and cast by some old man who was like "this is what kids these days get up to!"
The episode was written by Amanda Overton, who also writes for Netflix's Arcane, so that's not it. But punk rock always looks ridiculous on TV, so you're not wrong there.
After emphasizing the mistrust and suspicion between the two departments the sudden turn towards working together felt unearned.
The only mistrust was on the part of Dylan and a few sideways looks from Burt's coworker. Burt was open to collaboration from the beginning, and Irving is obviously willing to play along. I feel like this was inevitable after Irving's visit in the previous episode.
posted by schoolgirl report at 1:50 PM on March 21, 2022 [1 favorite]
Oh 100% for sure they are!
I'm not pleased about the religious nut job angle
I'm not so sure it's a religious thing as opposed to a cult thing, which was pretty clear from the start what with all the iconography.
I hated that the band scene felt like it was written and cast by some old man who was like "this is what kids these days get up to!"
The episode was written by Amanda Overton, who also writes for Netflix's Arcane, so that's not it. But punk rock always looks ridiculous on TV, so you're not wrong there.
After emphasizing the mistrust and suspicion between the two departments the sudden turn towards working together felt unearned.
The only mistrust was on the part of Dylan and a few sideways looks from Burt's coworker. Burt was open to collaboration from the beginning, and Irving is obviously willing to play along. I feel like this was inevitable after Irving's visit in the previous episode.
posted by schoolgirl report at 1:50 PM on March 21, 2022 [1 favorite]
The pacing is too slow for me. Also I don’t understand why the innies are so compliant with things like the break room and the bosses.
posted by interogative mood at 2:09 PM on March 21, 2022
posted by interogative mood at 2:09 PM on March 21, 2022
interogative mood: "Also I don’t understand why the innies are so compliant with things like the break room and the bosses."
What choice do they have? From their perspective, any leverage they can apply results in their nonexistence, as demonstrated by Helly’s attempts to resign, first from Lumon and then from the human race. I totally get why someone would shrug and think “might as well make the best of this.”
posted by savetheclocktower at 2:17 PM on March 21, 2022 [3 favorites]
What choice do they have? From their perspective, any leverage they can apply results in their nonexistence, as demonstrated by Helly’s attempts to resign, first from Lumon and then from the human race. I totally get why someone would shrug and think “might as well make the best of this.”
posted by savetheclocktower at 2:17 PM on March 21, 2022 [3 favorites]
Also I don’t understand why the innies are so compliant with things like the break room and the bosses.
I think this is probably the most interesting question the show raises. I personally think they are compliant because they literally don't know anything else. Their only conscious existence is in that basement, with those people and those rules. They've never read philosophy, or quit a job and know how good that feels, or gone to happy hour and have a friend say "wait, your boss did WHAT?" They can't look at job boards and daydream about doing something else within their grasp. They can't even quit of their own volition. They've never heard of labor unions.
And we're seeing a variety of coping behaviors: Mark's fake cheer and determination to make the best of it, Irving's upholding of the values they've been taught, Dylan's snark and materialism, Helly's rebellion.
posted by lunasol at 2:42 PM on March 21, 2022 [19 favorites]
I think this is probably the most interesting question the show raises. I personally think they are compliant because they literally don't know anything else. Their only conscious existence is in that basement, with those people and those rules. They've never read philosophy, or quit a job and know how good that feels, or gone to happy hour and have a friend say "wait, your boss did WHAT?" They can't look at job boards and daydream about doing something else within their grasp. They can't even quit of their own volition. They've never heard of labor unions.
And we're seeing a variety of coping behaviors: Mark's fake cheer and determination to make the best of it, Irving's upholding of the values they've been taught, Dylan's snark and materialism, Helly's rebellion.
posted by lunasol at 2:42 PM on March 21, 2022 [19 favorites]
I personally think they are compliant because they literally don't know anything else.
That’s my take, too: very similar to children who grow up in abusive homes. There’s nothing else to compare it to, and even once realized, it can take a long time to understand how bad their “bad” really was.
posted by Silvery Fish at 2:55 PM on March 21, 2022 [6 favorites]
That’s my take, too: very similar to children who grow up in abusive homes. There’s nothing else to compare it to, and even once realized, it can take a long time to understand how bad their “bad” really was.
posted by Silvery Fish at 2:55 PM on March 21, 2022 [6 favorites]
I'm not pleased about the religious nut job angle
I'm not so sure it's a religious thing as opposed to a cult thing, which was pretty clear from the start what with all the iconography.
I'm not seeing any relevant difference here at this point-religions have iconography!-, and this observation seems like splitting hairs up until the point that we see other people participating: you can't have a cult of one, and two hallmarks of cults are isolated living arrangements and a lack of interaction with the outside world. Regardless of what anyone wants to label this scene, my opinion about it remains the same, "religion or cult" notwithstanding.
I hated that the band scene felt like it was written and cast by some old man who was like "this is what kids these days get up to!"
The episode was written by Amanda Overton, who also writes for Netflix's Arcane, so that's not it. But punk rock always looks ridiculous on TV, so you're not wrong there.
That's why I said "felt like".
After emphasizing the mistrust and suspicion between the two departments the sudden turn towards working together felt unearned.
The only mistrust was on the part of Dylan and a few sideways looks from Burt's coworker. Burt was open to collaboration from the beginning, and Irving is obviously willing to play along. I feel like this was inevitable after Irving's visit in the previous episode.
There was a lot of talk about various rumors of a massacre including pieces of art depicting similar violence. It's unreasonable to believe that every other person in O&D would not be concerned about those rumors.
At any rate, everything I wrote above was entirely my own opinion. I don't expect anyone else to share it.
posted by oneirodynia at 6:34 PM on March 21, 2022
I'm not so sure it's a religious thing as opposed to a cult thing, which was pretty clear from the start what with all the iconography.
I'm not seeing any relevant difference here at this point-religions have iconography!-, and this observation seems like splitting hairs up until the point that we see other people participating: you can't have a cult of one, and two hallmarks of cults are isolated living arrangements and a lack of interaction with the outside world. Regardless of what anyone wants to label this scene, my opinion about it remains the same, "religion or cult" notwithstanding.
I hated that the band scene felt like it was written and cast by some old man who was like "this is what kids these days get up to!"
The episode was written by Amanda Overton, who also writes for Netflix's Arcane, so that's not it. But punk rock always looks ridiculous on TV, so you're not wrong there.
That's why I said "felt like".
After emphasizing the mistrust and suspicion between the two departments the sudden turn towards working together felt unearned.
The only mistrust was on the part of Dylan and a few sideways looks from Burt's coworker. Burt was open to collaboration from the beginning, and Irving is obviously willing to play along. I feel like this was inevitable after Irving's visit in the previous episode.
There was a lot of talk about various rumors of a massacre including pieces of art depicting similar violence. It's unreasonable to believe that every other person in O&D would not be concerned about those rumors.
At any rate, everything I wrote above was entirely my own opinion. I don't expect anyone else to share it.
posted by oneirodynia at 6:34 PM on March 21, 2022
Also I don’t understand why the innies are so compliant with things like the break room and the bosses.I'm fascinated by the thing where if your outie quits, you cease to exist. Maybe the innies stay compliant because they know that they could get fired, and getting fired effectively
means death?
posted by simonw at 6:38 PM on March 21, 2022 [5 favorites]
I liked the punk thing. It added a nice retro rebel touch that goes right along with the cathode-ray-modern feel of the whole show.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 7:04 PM on March 21, 2022 [10 favorites]
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 7:04 PM on March 21, 2022 [10 favorites]
There is an extremely subtle sense of unreality to the "outie" world in Severance that I am very interested in. Above and beyond the advanced technology of the severance implant, there is the dinner-less dinner party, they way Mark mentions that they should "call their cars", Petey's flip phone, the retro-ish punk happening, the fact that the setting appears to be the town of Keir, PE (whatever state that is). It could be that this is signaling something to be revealed about the world we are in (outies are really the innies? alternate reality? parallel universe? post-scarcity situation?) or it could just be another way to make me feel off-kilter, and in my opinion, that's OK if that's all it ends up being.
Personally, I am OK with ambiguity and with not learning the solution to a mystery. That's life, right? Mysteries don't get solved sometimes. I can understand why folks want their scripted entertainment to be more neatly tied-up than reality, but as someone who has repeatedly announced my satisfaction with the finale of Lost on MeFi, I personally am not super worried about how it pays off, I am just enjoying the ride.
posted by Rock Steady at 9:01 AM on March 22, 2022 [16 favorites]
Personally, I am OK with ambiguity and with not learning the solution to a mystery. That's life, right? Mysteries don't get solved sometimes. I can understand why folks want their scripted entertainment to be more neatly tied-up than reality, but as someone who has repeatedly announced my satisfaction with the finale of Lost on MeFi, I personally am not super worried about how it pays off, I am just enjoying the ride.
posted by Rock Steady at 9:01 AM on March 22, 2022 [16 favorites]
I think some of those outie world weirdnesses aren't so weird really. "Calling our cars" is a thing my friends say; we're using our phones to summon Ubers. A made-up town / state just seems a way to set the story without being specific. (The town being named "Keir", of course, implies it's a Lumon company town.) I took the dinner-less dinner party to be just one way of establishing that Ricken is a jackass. The outie world feels a little weird, sure, but it just seems consistent with the general weirdness of the production.
I'm glad we're talking about the punk band. I watched that and was like "hell yeah, that's like the shows I went to in the 80s!" Which is great but, um, don't the Young People these days have their own music and style? It felt like a Dead Milkman show, only without the intentional self-parody. "Fuck you Lumon" is not exactly great lyric writing, although I did admire their commitment to the screaming. Full lyrics here, the line "fuck you lumon you took my first love" worked pretty well.
posted by Nelson at 9:33 AM on March 22, 2022 [4 favorites]
I'm glad we're talking about the punk band. I watched that and was like "hell yeah, that's like the shows I went to in the 80s!" Which is great but, um, don't the Young People these days have their own music and style? It felt like a Dead Milkman show, only without the intentional self-parody. "Fuck you Lumon" is not exactly great lyric writing, although I did admire their commitment to the screaming. Full lyrics here, the line "fuck you lumon you took my first love" worked pretty well.
posted by Nelson at 9:33 AM on March 22, 2022 [4 favorites]
Personally, I am OK with ambiguity and with not learning the solution to a mystery. That's life, right? Mysteries don't get solved sometimes.
My measuring stick here is if I get to learn what the Macrodata Refinement numbers are. In-universe someone at Lumon knows what they are (even if it's another unknown like "radiowaves from space that make people feel things, so we sort them and broadcast them back out because it's our religious duty"), which means the writers better know (unlike, say, LOST as the story goes).
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 10:22 AM on March 22, 2022
My measuring stick here is if I get to learn what the Macrodata Refinement numbers are. In-universe someone at Lumon knows what they are (even if it's another unknown like "radiowaves from space that make people feel things, so we sort them and broadcast them back out because it's our religious duty"), which means the writers better know (unlike, say, LOST as the story goes).
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 10:22 AM on March 22, 2022
The Stories Behind Severance’s Eerie Office Design [Vulture]
posted by ellieBOA at 12:55 PM on March 22, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by ellieBOA at 12:55 PM on March 22, 2022 [2 favorites]
That was a nice look at the set design process, and revealed (to me at least) that the devices in O&D are 3D printers.
posted by Marticus at 2:10 PM on March 22, 2022
posted by Marticus at 2:10 PM on March 22, 2022
Christopher Walken has been working up to this scene with Irving for a long time.
posted by cocoagirl at 11:44 AM on April 8, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by cocoagirl at 11:44 AM on April 8, 2022 [1 favorite]
I'm not pleased about the religious nut job angle
I'm not so sure it's a religious thing as opposed to a cult thing, which was pretty clear from the start what with all the iconography.
One can argue that every religion was originally started by someone who could gather enough people around their "cult of personality" to listen to their profound "thoughts / teachings / revelations / prophecies / channeled wisdom / word-from-on-high / conspiracy theories"...
And this is not without recent precedents... Mormonism... John Harvey Kellog and corn flakes...
posted by rozcakj at 7:30 PM on April 18, 2022 [2 favorites]
I'm not so sure it's a religious thing as opposed to a cult thing, which was pretty clear from the start what with all the iconography.
One can argue that every religion was originally started by someone who could gather enough people around their "cult of personality" to listen to their profound "thoughts / teachings / revelations / prophecies / channeled wisdom / word-from-on-high / conspiracy theories"...
And this is not without recent precedents... Mormonism... John Harvey Kellog and corn flakes...
posted by rozcakj at 7:30 PM on April 18, 2022 [2 favorites]
I think some of those outie world weirdnesses aren't so weird really. "Calling our cars" is a thing my friends say; we're using our phones to summon Ubers. A made-up town / state just seems a way to set the story without being specific.
It’s also part of the general trend in setting shows in the year Two Thousand Nineteen Eighty Five AD. People have cell phones and the Internet, but cars and other fashions are a little older. It’s a style I really like, because it adds to the weirdness of the setting but, by sort of pre-dating the styles, you don’t get the same sort of Z-rust you get watching, say, the X-Files where it’s always extremely 1996.
posted by thecaddy at 11:43 AM on April 19, 2022 [5 favorites]
It’s also part of the general trend in setting shows in the year Two Thousand Nineteen Eighty Five AD. People have cell phones and the Internet, but cars and other fashions are a little older. It’s a style I really like, because it adds to the weirdness of the setting but, by sort of pre-dating the styles, you don’t get the same sort of Z-rust you get watching, say, the X-Files where it’s always extremely 1996.
posted by thecaddy at 11:43 AM on April 19, 2022 [5 favorites]
Based on his interactions with Helly's outie, Milchick seems to be the one employee that the outies (at least the MDR outies) are aware of. Someone has to liaise between the two halves of severed employees; makes sense for it to be one person, freeing up the other non-severed employees to spy on the outies.
Milchick was also the person that outie Mark called in a previous episode to say that he was feeling sick and wouldn't make it into work that day. So most likely all the outies of the MDR team know him.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 6:02 PM on June 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
Milchick was also the person that outie Mark called in a previous episode to say that he was feeling sick and wouldn't make it into work that day. So most likely all the outies of the MDR team know him.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 6:02 PM on June 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
I liked the punk thing. It added a nice retro rebel touch that goes right along with the cathode-ray-modern feel of the whole show.
Agreed. It was perfectly in keeping with the late-20th-century cars, houses, office equipment, etc.
And even if the lyrics were kind of trite, well, so is Ricken's book. Anyway, it's a small-town band. They're probably the only game in town for young people who hate Lumon.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 6:05 PM on June 2, 2022 [3 favorites]
Agreed. It was perfectly in keeping with the late-20th-century cars, houses, office equipment, etc.
And even if the lyrics were kind of trite, well, so is Ricken's book. Anyway, it's a small-town band. They're probably the only game in town for young people who hate Lumon.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 6:05 PM on June 2, 2022 [3 favorites]
You are not logged in, either login or create an account to post comments
posted by bcwinters at 7:59 PM on March 18, 2022 [1 favorite]