The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power: A Shadow of the Past
September 2, 2022 4:29 PM - Season 1, Episode 1 - Subscribe
Galadriel is disturbed by signs of an ancient evil's return. Arondir makes an unsettling discovery. Elrond is presented with an intriguing new venture. Nori breaks a deeply held community rule.
I'm loving this so far!
I don't know if it overlaps with Tolkien in the details. I also don't care: I read the Silmarillion (and RotK appendices, which I guess might be relevant?) 30 years ago and am impressed by the people who actually remember the parade of characters and feats but to me it was just a list of names with no personality, all rapidly forgotten. Tying a young Galadriel into an anti-Sauron plot, or having it so a newly-incarnated Gandalf hung out with hobbits? Seems like it all makes sense!
I get why people might not like it, but for me the pacing is great too. A lot of gorgeous scenery of elven lands or dwarvern caverns, people talking in a fantasy tavern or fantasy farm or fantasy elf tower about weird rumors, and one or two action scenes per episode. Lots of sub plots for minor characters, like in a '70s soap opera or disaster movie. I'd need barely any movement in the "main plot" if they keep balancing things this way.
posted by mark k at 6:14 PM on September 2, 2022 [11 favorites]
I don't know if it overlaps with Tolkien in the details. I also don't care: I read the Silmarillion (and RotK appendices, which I guess might be relevant?) 30 years ago and am impressed by the people who actually remember the parade of characters and feats but to me it was just a list of names with no personality, all rapidly forgotten. Tying a young Galadriel into an anti-Sauron plot, or having it so a newly-incarnated Gandalf hung out with hobbits? Seems like it all makes sense!
I get why people might not like it, but for me the pacing is great too. A lot of gorgeous scenery of elven lands or dwarvern caverns, people talking in a fantasy tavern or fantasy farm or fantasy elf tower about weird rumors, and one or two action scenes per episode. Lots of sub plots for minor characters, like in a '70s soap opera or disaster movie. I'd need barely any movement in the "main plot" if they keep balancing things this way.
posted by mark k at 6:14 PM on September 2, 2022 [11 favorites]
It is ... okay? More like a salad where some of the ingredients are really good and some are just there and the rest is iceberg lettuce that's gone brown on the edges. Also it's an airport salad so it cost $750 million.
Visually stunning, to be sure. Morfydd Clark really looks and acts like a young Cate Blanchett. The Harfoots are delightful, and their whole village has a Jim Henson feel that I love. I like Bronwyn and Arondir, too.
But where's the elvishness in the high elves? The long hair, the otherworldliness? Why do Elrond and Celebrimbor look like televangelists in robes? That Robert Tilton-ass hair took a lot of work; surely somebody noticed.
I don't want to give an inch to the racist, sexist nerds who are review-bombing this thing, especially when the critics are split between loving and hating it. But I am also not going to stan for Amazon. I just wanna look at it. The first few episodes of a show are generally the weakest, so there's that to keep in mind.
posted by Countess Elena at 6:17 PM on September 2, 2022 [8 favorites]
Visually stunning, to be sure. Morfydd Clark really looks and acts like a young Cate Blanchett. The Harfoots are delightful, and their whole village has a Jim Henson feel that I love. I like Bronwyn and Arondir, too.
But where's the elvishness in the high elves? The long hair, the otherworldliness? Why do Elrond and Celebrimbor look like televangelists in robes? That Robert Tilton-ass hair took a lot of work; surely somebody noticed.
I don't want to give an inch to the racist, sexist nerds who are review-bombing this thing, especially when the critics are split between loving and hating it. But I am also not going to stan for Amazon. I just wanna look at it. The first few episodes of a show are generally the weakest, so there's that to keep in mind.
posted by Countess Elena at 6:17 PM on September 2, 2022 [8 favorites]
It was OK. I'm willing to give it a few episodes, at least. As people are saying on IMDb, it's essentially Tolkien fan fiction, and for now, I think that's okay.
It helps when watching to remember the Galadriel we saw in LOTR (books or movies) wasn't the rebel and bad-ass she was in her younger days. Elves live a long time.
posted by lhauser at 7:32 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
It helps when watching to remember the Galadriel we saw in LOTR (books or movies) wasn't the rebel and bad-ass she was in her younger days. Elves live a long time.
posted by lhauser at 7:32 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
I wonder how much the rights issues affect the storytelling. Think it was said that they can't use anything from the Silmarillion or related books, they can only use the Appendices of the Lord of the Rings as source material,
Also, how much older is Galadriel than both Gil-Galad and Elrond? Thousands of years? I think they don't give her the reverence she deserves.
posted by ishmael at 8:41 PM on September 2, 2022 [1 favorite]
Also, how much older is Galadriel than both Gil-Galad and Elrond? Thousands of years? I think they don't give her the reverence she deserves.
posted by ishmael at 8:41 PM on September 2, 2022 [1 favorite]
Sorry, I guess she's only 119 years older than Gil-Galad. Still tho.
posted by ishmael at 8:47 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by ishmael at 8:47 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
If you had told me twenty years ago that in 2022 there would be a big-budget Tolkien show and a big-budget George Martin show and they would both have great visuals and good actors and cool monsters I would have been ecstatic. If you had then told me that they would rank something like eighth and ninth on the list of shows I was most looking forward to watching every week I wouldn’t have been able to comprehend it.
The first episode is fine and I’m sure I’ll find time to keep watching these fantasy behemoths after I’ve watched Primal, Reservation Dogs, AEW Dynamite, She-Hulk, This Fool, What We Do in the Shadows and AEW Rampage.
It’s a weird time to be a fantasy nerd.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 8:53 PM on September 2, 2022 [3 favorites]
The first episode is fine and I’m sure I’ll find time to keep watching these fantasy behemoths after I’ve watched Primal, Reservation Dogs, AEW Dynamite, She-Hulk, This Fool, What We Do in the Shadows and AEW Rampage.
It’s a weird time to be a fantasy nerd.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 8:53 PM on September 2, 2022 [3 favorites]
Also my wife commented that Elrond looks like if you asked an AI art generator to make a photorealistic human version of Brain from Animaniacs and now I cannot unsee it.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 8:57 PM on September 2, 2022 [18 favorites]
posted by Parasite Unseen at 8:57 PM on September 2, 2022 [18 favorites]
Parasite Unseen, you should also check out The Rehearsal. Kept saying "what is this show?!".
posted by ishmael at 9:02 PM on September 2, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by ishmael at 9:02 PM on September 2, 2022 [1 favorite]
Gorgeous and scrumptious. I love the elven super metal that allows for romantic/ pastoral depiction of (decorated!) chain mail.
The second ep is a better prognosticator of the arc of this production; this is a good - but not necessarily a great premiere/ pilot.
But that's what Jackson's LoTR and Hobbit movies are assumed.
Although thinking about this as a pilot is problematic as the series is a fait acompli - in that light, not a lot of complaints other than dwarves = Scots, harfoot = derogatorily racist Irish, elves = Anglo/ Saxon, etc.
I applaud the a-documented skin tone range and promoting non-males as primary characters/ iconoclasts that drive storytelling.
Morfydd Clark is compelling as Galadriel. No complaints, and I appreciate the technical storytelling to explaining why/ wherefore of Cate Blanchette's Galadriel's scene with Frodo.
posted by porpoise at 9:33 PM on September 2, 2022 [3 favorites]
The second ep is a better prognosticator of the arc of this production; this is a good - but not necessarily a great premiere/ pilot.
But that's what Jackson's LoTR and Hobbit movies are assumed.
Although thinking about this as a pilot is problematic as the series is a fait acompli - in that light, not a lot of complaints other than dwarves = Scots, harfoot = derogatorily racist Irish, elves = Anglo/ Saxon, etc.
I applaud the a-documented skin tone range and promoting non-males as primary characters/ iconoclasts that drive storytelling.
Morfydd Clark is compelling as Galadriel. No complaints, and I appreciate the technical storytelling to explaining why/ wherefore of Cate Blanchette's Galadriel's scene with Frodo.
posted by porpoise at 9:33 PM on September 2, 2022 [3 favorites]
Sorry, I guess she's only 119 years older than Gil-Galad. Still tho.
Err? The actual age of Gil-Galad is a bit uncertain, because it's actually disputed who he is! I'm fairly confident he was actually born in Beleriand, although the Tolkein Wiki claims he was born in Eldamar.
If he is Orodreth's son, then he is actually Galadriel's great-nephew.
Anyway! I was bothered by the way that the Elf told Elrond "only Elf-lords" were invited to the council, as if he weren't the son of fucking Earendil and the grandson of Idril Celebrindal and the great-grandson of Turgon, just on his father's side of the family! WTAF. (Plus his great-grandmother was Luthien and great-great-grandfather was Thingol. Doesn't get more royal than that in Middle-Earth.)
If the writers are going to make the Elves racist and elitist, which they have chosen to do, at least they should lean into the elitism built into the source text?
Anyway anyway, I only watched this first one, and I will have to sever my brain from the relatively recent dip into the Silmarillion (courtesy of the Prancing Pony Podcast), because it's clear they are just going to ignore the Silmarils and the sons of Feanor and the Exile of the Noldor and pretty much everything that happened before the War of Wrath, other than that it happened.
posted by suelac at 9:46 PM on September 2, 2022 [6 favorites]
Err? The actual age of Gil-Galad is a bit uncertain, because it's actually disputed who he is! I'm fairly confident he was actually born in Beleriand, although the Tolkein Wiki claims he was born in Eldamar.
If he is Orodreth's son, then he is actually Galadriel's great-nephew.
Anyway! I was bothered by the way that the Elf told Elrond "only Elf-lords" were invited to the council, as if he weren't the son of fucking Earendil and the grandson of Idril Celebrindal and the great-grandson of Turgon, just on his father's side of the family! WTAF. (Plus his great-grandmother was Luthien and great-great-grandfather was Thingol. Doesn't get more royal than that in Middle-Earth.)
If the writers are going to make the Elves racist and elitist, which they have chosen to do, at least they should lean into the elitism built into the source text?
Anyway anyway, I only watched this first one, and I will have to sever my brain from the relatively recent dip into the Silmarillion (courtesy of the Prancing Pony Podcast), because it's clear they are just going to ignore the Silmarils and the sons of Feanor and the Exile of the Noldor and pretty much everything that happened before the War of Wrath, other than that it happened.
posted by suelac at 9:46 PM on September 2, 2022 [6 favorites]
I enjoyed the first episode, and if this is the tone of the series I'll probably stick with it for a while. So right now in the good enough camp, and we'll see if it can achieve some greatness.
That being said, even if it felt a bit too by the numbers in some ways, it did greatly exceeded my expectations, and I think it manages to thread a lot of difficult needles successfully. I think it justifies its existence against a backdrop composed of a (the?) pillar of modern fantasy literature, and one of the most improbably good movie trilogies of all time. It also taps into the rich aesthetic of the books and movies, while also innovating and modernizing.
I know this isn't news to anyone here, but what makes the Lord of the Rings actually great is its heart, rather than the swords and sorcery. So I'm waiting to see if they manage to realize that, rather than just immersing us in a series of Alan Lee paintings. Which you know, also wouldn't be the worst consolation.
posted by Alex404 at 9:52 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
That being said, even if it felt a bit too by the numbers in some ways, it did greatly exceeded my expectations, and I think it manages to thread a lot of difficult needles successfully. I think it justifies its existence against a backdrop composed of a (the?) pillar of modern fantasy literature, and one of the most improbably good movie trilogies of all time. It also taps into the rich aesthetic of the books and movies, while also innovating and modernizing.
I know this isn't news to anyone here, but what makes the Lord of the Rings actually great is its heart, rather than the swords and sorcery. So I'm waiting to see if they manage to realize that, rather than just immersing us in a series of Alan Lee paintings. Which you know, also wouldn't be the worst consolation.
posted by Alex404 at 9:52 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
I found this absolutely gormless. No heat, no passion, no joy. Just a blandly competent execution of a generic fantasy plot. Casting Galadriel as Joan of Arc is particularly lazy. And I guess there are Men?
posted by Nelson at 10:22 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by Nelson at 10:22 PM on September 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
dwarves = Scots, harfoot = derogatorily racist Irish, elves = Anglo/ Saxon, etc.
I was wondering whether the elves are more like imperial Romans (posh, snotty, fancy buildings, always have upper class English accents in films) while the humans are more in a tribal role. However, the elves also put me in mind of middle to upper class brits in WW2 movies, all 'we know best'.
Liked Clark. Liked the border guard & healer. Also dubious about the harfoot.
That boat trip into the West looked like the world's least exciting cruise. 'On today's schedule, we have standing on deck in full armour. Be sure to keep your swords in the stress position. Tomorrow, more of the same.' How long is the voyage supposed to be? They cut back to it at least twice, suggesting it's a while but then it implies Galadriel swims back all the way.
posted by biffa at 12:15 AM on September 3, 2022 [2 favorites]
I was wondering whether the elves are more like imperial Romans (posh, snotty, fancy buildings, always have upper class English accents in films) while the humans are more in a tribal role. However, the elves also put me in mind of middle to upper class brits in WW2 movies, all 'we know best'.
Liked Clark. Liked the border guard & healer. Also dubious about the harfoot.
That boat trip into the West looked like the world's least exciting cruise. 'On today's schedule, we have standing on deck in full armour. Be sure to keep your swords in the stress position. Tomorrow, more of the same.' How long is the voyage supposed to be? They cut back to it at least twice, suggesting it's a while but then it implies Galadriel swims back all the way.
posted by biffa at 12:15 AM on September 3, 2022 [2 favorites]
imperial Romans
You're absolutely correct, in all respects.
posted by porpoise at 1:04 AM on September 3, 2022
You're absolutely correct, in all respects.
posted by porpoise at 1:04 AM on September 3, 2022
The casting of Gil-Galad seems to be an attempt to answer the question ‘what if Tommy Wiseau was an elf?’
posted by the duck by the oboe at 2:39 AM on September 3, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by the duck by the oboe at 2:39 AM on September 3, 2022 [7 favorites]
I'm not sure I agree with you a hundred percent on your mountaineering there, Galadriel.
“The second ep is a better prognosticator of the arc of this production; this is a good - but not necessarily a great premiere/ pilot.”
Yeah. I was very bored and sometimes annoyed with this episode and almost gave up. But I really liked the second episode! So I think this first episode suffered badly from being forced to provide all the backstory.
“Anyway! I was bothered by the way that the Elf told Elrond conly Elf-lords' were invited to the council, as if he weren't the son of fucking Earendil and the grandson of Idril Celebrindal and the great-grandson of Turgon, just on his father's side of the family! WTAF.”
Sir, this is an Arby's.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 3:09 AM on September 3, 2022 [20 favorites]
“The second ep is a better prognosticator of the arc of this production; this is a good - but not necessarily a great premiere/ pilot.”
Yeah. I was very bored and sometimes annoyed with this episode and almost gave up. But I really liked the second episode! So I think this first episode suffered badly from being forced to provide all the backstory.
“Anyway! I was bothered by the way that the Elf told Elrond conly Elf-lords' were invited to the council, as if he weren't the son of fucking Earendil and the grandson of Idril Celebrindal and the great-grandson of Turgon, just on his father's side of the family! WTAF.”
Sir, this is an Arby's.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 3:09 AM on September 3, 2022 [20 favorites]
1) I am betting a dragon's hoard right now that Theo (Bronwyn's sullen son) is indeed Arondir's son. They are going to a lot of trouble to a) not say where his father is and b) hide his ears. If Im' right, I am not sure if Arondir knows this.
2) I recommend looking up the specific place names. Knowing that Arondir and the Watchmaster were standing smack in the middle of what would one day become Mordor gives that scene a lot of extra kick.
3) Agreed that there was a ton of worldbuilding in the first ep. Am looking forward to the rest of the season now that's out of the way.
posted by Mogur at 7:07 AM on September 3, 2022 [8 favorites]
2) I recommend looking up the specific place names. Knowing that Arondir and the Watchmaster were standing smack in the middle of what would one day become Mordor gives that scene a lot of extra kick.
3) Agreed that there was a ton of worldbuilding in the first ep. Am looking forward to the rest of the season now that's out of the way.
posted by Mogur at 7:07 AM on September 3, 2022 [8 favorites]
Reminder: this is the post for just the first episode. I think some of the comments here are more appropriate for the second episode discussion. (I haven't seen it, so not sure.)
posted by Nelson at 7:14 AM on September 3, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Nelson at 7:14 AM on September 3, 2022 [1 favorite]
Hi! I am a 51 year old black guy born and raised in America and am not any sort of Lord of the Rings fan. The movies were fine, with thrilling moments, the books were fine with thrilling moments, but I've never had a huge interest in them. I have never and probably will never read the The Silmarillion. The commercials, hype, and trailer about The Rings of Power were mostly ignored by me, figuring it was going to be another large cast of white characters running around with dragons. Which isn't a terrible thing, but not high on my list of things to watch again.
Then I met Arondir and oh shit, it. is. on.
A black elf huh? It's astonishing that it took this look for one to appear and it's frankly embarrassing (looking at you Peter Jackson). What this one character in particular does for me personally, along with the other diverse members, it that it plainly states "this could be you. Your people matter and are part of history. You are no less or better than anyone else as a whole, it's the individual that matters."
So yeah, now I get it, why people might become obsessed about Tolkien and the like. Representation matters, it always has and always will. Sure, this is fantasy, but seeing someone like me so positively represented is a soothing balm to this old black man in the 21st century America. More please!
Overall, everything was quite good about the episode in general. Maybe a bit too much exposition, but that's not surprising in first and early episodes. What's clear is that the creators care and are using their immense budget very well to craft mostly new characters for a new story and that's extremely exciting. More please!
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:10 AM on September 3, 2022 [69 favorites]
Then I met Arondir and oh shit, it. is. on.
A black elf huh? It's astonishing that it took this look for one to appear and it's frankly embarrassing (looking at you Peter Jackson). What this one character in particular does for me personally, along with the other diverse members, it that it plainly states "this could be you. Your people matter and are part of history. You are no less or better than anyone else as a whole, it's the individual that matters."
So yeah, now I get it, why people might become obsessed about Tolkien and the like. Representation matters, it always has and always will. Sure, this is fantasy, but seeing someone like me so positively represented is a soothing balm to this old black man in the 21st century America. More please!
Overall, everything was quite good about the episode in general. Maybe a bit too much exposition, but that's not surprising in first and early episodes. What's clear is that the creators care and are using their immense budget very well to craft mostly new characters for a new story and that's extremely exciting. More please!
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:10 AM on September 3, 2022 [69 favorites]
I was extremely disappointed by the WoT series which, although it had its moments, never really took off for me.
This... was pretty good. I can't say that I'm ecstatic, but I liked it and some bits I liked a lot (some I liked less. I wasn't impressed by any of the elves other than Galadriel). First episodes tend to be exposition heavy, because of all the ground-work they have to lay, and I don't think they did a particularly deft job of it, but they did well enough that I'm eager (but perhaps not excited) to see the following episodes.
Nori is already my favorite character.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 8:31 AM on September 3, 2022
This... was pretty good. I can't say that I'm ecstatic, but I liked it and some bits I liked a lot (some I liked less. I wasn't impressed by any of the elves other than Galadriel). First episodes tend to be exposition heavy, because of all the ground-work they have to lay, and I don't think they did a particularly deft job of it, but they did well enough that I'm eager (but perhaps not excited) to see the following episodes.
Nori is already my favorite character.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 8:31 AM on September 3, 2022
I thought this first episode suffered for being an exposition dump and focusing on Galadriel who I find one-note and uninteresting (elves will literally jump into the sea to avoid going to therapy, etc.).
I feel the other races are promising and I like the potential elf/human romance.
posted by jeoc at 8:32 AM on September 3, 2022
I feel the other races are promising and I like the potential elf/human romance.
posted by jeoc at 8:32 AM on September 3, 2022
The pseudoprofundity of the dialog drove me absolutely bonkers. You'd think a billion dollars could hire you some decent writers.
Agreed. I had a temporary promotional Prime membership and I cancelled it immediately after seeing this episode. I have never been a fantasy fan or a horror fan but if the story and characters are good that usually doesn't matter (same is true of documentaries on subjects I have no lasting interest in but if the documentary is good and informative I find myself watching a doc on almost anything).
I watched the Walking Dead because the first episode was so well produced and competently written. That, of course, didn't last long and I dropped it.
I watched the new run of Dr. Who for awhile because I was a big fan from childhood but it turned out to be one of the worst modern shows on television that many other shows attempt to mimic in terms of over the top unearned melodramatic, toss story logic and established in universe limits at your convenience nonsense.
I watched the new Battlestar Galactica because it was well produced and written for awhile until it too descended into total garbage.
I watched Game of Thrones because again, well acted, well written, well produced, great characters and again it turned into an NBC quality show with blood and nudity.
Watched the new Trek shows and well, again, pretty terrible in terms of writing with the exception of Lower Decks which is far better than Discovery and Picard. SNW was ok but uneven.
I'm reminded of the early promise of cable/pay television. Higher quality content with far less commercials. That rarely worked out.
HBO has gone to shit as well. House of the Dragon is the equivalent of After M*A*S*H basically.
This was again utterly pedestrian, utterly boring, utterly predictable when it doesn't have to be. You have a captive audience. Give us some quality, instead it's just more of the same and even more of the same is fine if it has a little bit more nuance and is executed well but that's not the case.
The greatest period of modern television writing has been followed, with a few exceptions with a return to just barely above the level of the 1970s. Paying for Dukes of Hazard, Wonder Woman, and the Bionic Man level of writing is not something I can support.
Thankfully we had The Queen's Gambit, the Fargo series, Better Call Saul, etc. Not even advocating to equal the quality of those shows but get a little closer. Sadly, not the case.
posted by juiceCake at 8:57 AM on September 3, 2022 [3 favorites]
Agreed. I had a temporary promotional Prime membership and I cancelled it immediately after seeing this episode. I have never been a fantasy fan or a horror fan but if the story and characters are good that usually doesn't matter (same is true of documentaries on subjects I have no lasting interest in but if the documentary is good and informative I find myself watching a doc on almost anything).
I watched the Walking Dead because the first episode was so well produced and competently written. That, of course, didn't last long and I dropped it.
I watched the new run of Dr. Who for awhile because I was a big fan from childhood but it turned out to be one of the worst modern shows on television that many other shows attempt to mimic in terms of over the top unearned melodramatic, toss story logic and established in universe limits at your convenience nonsense.
I watched the new Battlestar Galactica because it was well produced and written for awhile until it too descended into total garbage.
I watched Game of Thrones because again, well acted, well written, well produced, great characters and again it turned into an NBC quality show with blood and nudity.
Watched the new Trek shows and well, again, pretty terrible in terms of writing with the exception of Lower Decks which is far better than Discovery and Picard. SNW was ok but uneven.
I'm reminded of the early promise of cable/pay television. Higher quality content with far less commercials. That rarely worked out.
HBO has gone to shit as well. House of the Dragon is the equivalent of After M*A*S*H basically.
This was again utterly pedestrian, utterly boring, utterly predictable when it doesn't have to be. You have a captive audience. Give us some quality, instead it's just more of the same and even more of the same is fine if it has a little bit more nuance and is executed well but that's not the case.
The greatest period of modern television writing has been followed, with a few exceptions with a return to just barely above the level of the 1970s. Paying for Dukes of Hazard, Wonder Woman, and the Bionic Man level of writing is not something I can support.
Thankfully we had The Queen's Gambit, the Fargo series, Better Call Saul, etc. Not even advocating to equal the quality of those shows but get a little closer. Sadly, not the case.
posted by juiceCake at 8:57 AM on September 3, 2022 [3 favorites]
Then I met Arondir and oh shit, it. is. on.
haven't yet made it through the first episode. Almost gave up a few times, beautiful as it is to look at. But I have now just seen Arondir's entrance, and my inner screenwriter immediately said:
"This is where the story should have started."
All the prologue stuff (before Galadriel) felt unnecessary, nothing that couldn't be provided later, once a more compelling human narrative had hooked me. Then Galadriel herself took over for a while and I feel the same about all of that. Too much exposition too soon. But she is good. Actor and character. As for the pre-Hobbits (whatever they're called), way too fucking cute and smiley, worst part of the story so far. I almost gave up.
But then two hooded figures walk into a suspicious village and finally, I'm feeling a story get its rich hooks into me.
I will now watch the rest of the episode.
posted by philip-random at 11:57 AM on September 3, 2022 [3 favorites]
haven't yet made it through the first episode. Almost gave up a few times, beautiful as it is to look at. But I have now just seen Arondir's entrance, and my inner screenwriter immediately said:
"This is where the story should have started."
All the prologue stuff (before Galadriel) felt unnecessary, nothing that couldn't be provided later, once a more compelling human narrative had hooked me. Then Galadriel herself took over for a while and I feel the same about all of that. Too much exposition too soon. But she is good. Actor and character. As for the pre-Hobbits (whatever they're called), way too fucking cute and smiley, worst part of the story so far. I almost gave up.
But then two hooded figures walk into a suspicious village and finally, I'm feeling a story get its rich hooks into me.
I will now watch the rest of the episode.
posted by philip-random at 11:57 AM on September 3, 2022 [3 favorites]
elves will literally jump into the sea to avoid going to therapy)
Avoid therapy? She narrowly avoided elvæporation. Vallinor schmallinor, that was the fiery spectacle of Carousel.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 3:07 PM on September 3, 2022 [10 favorites]
Avoid therapy? She narrowly avoided elvæporation. Vallinor schmallinor, that was the fiery spectacle of Carousel.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 3:07 PM on September 3, 2022 [10 favorites]
Logan’s Rune
posted by ActingTheGoat at 3:18 PM on September 3, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by ActingTheGoat at 3:18 PM on September 3, 2022 [5 favorites]
I for one am completely baffled where and when this story is taking place, in terms of the complete story and compendium of lore in my brain from ages ago.
I'm greatly happy to accept changes or reinterpretation, I just hope it's consistent!
posted by rebent at 5:49 PM on September 3, 2022
I'm greatly happy to accept changes or reinterpretation, I just hope it's consistent!
posted by rebent at 5:49 PM on September 3, 2022
The pseudoprofundity of the dialog drove me absolutely bonkers. You'd think a billion dollars could hire you some decent writers.
I'm a Tolkien fan and a fan of the movies (and the show so far) and I really shouldn't say this too loud but a lot of Tolkien's original dialog was kind of painfully stilted.
It just comes with the territory ya know?
posted by cubeb at 5:51 PM on September 3, 2022 [16 favorites]
I'm a Tolkien fan and a fan of the movies (and the show so far) and I really shouldn't say this too loud but a lot of Tolkien's original dialog was kind of painfully stilted.
It just comes with the territory ya know?
posted by cubeb at 5:51 PM on September 3, 2022 [16 favorites]
Re: ice-climbing scene, was this taking place 1,000 years before they invented rope? Then, they signify a different place by having fireworks, but just ones that defy physics. I think the worst was sailboat. That’s not how they work and that’s not how you ride in one.
I was totally fine with punching through a block of ice, and black milk from the cow teat and black stuff not following where the veins of the leaf would be. Or fireball guy. Things can be magical or different, no problem. But if you are going to show stuff from my world, you should make it realistic.
The audio wasn’t great for the dialog, so I didn’t quite catch it, but the village of dirty people was leprechaun because they had Irish accents, right?
posted by snofoam at 6:01 PM on September 3, 2022
I was totally fine with punching through a block of ice, and black milk from the cow teat and black stuff not following where the veins of the leaf would be. Or fireball guy. Things can be magical or different, no problem. But if you are going to show stuff from my world, you should make it realistic.
The audio wasn’t great for the dialog, so I didn’t quite catch it, but the village of dirty people was leprechaun because they had Irish accents, right?
posted by snofoam at 6:01 PM on September 3, 2022
I for one am completely baffled where and when this story is taking place, in terms of the complete story and compendium of lore in my brain from ages ago.
After the defeat of Morgoth and the sinking of Beleriand. At that point a lot of the Noldor (Galadriel's people) went back to the Undying Lands, but not everyone (for reasons).
Gil-Galad founded a kingdom with the remaining Noldor on the northwestern coast of M-E, where the Gray Havens are. Celebrimbor went further southeast to found Eregion.
The three houses of the Edain (men) went to Numenor with Elros: the island was a gift of the Valar in thanks for their support during the war and Earendil's quest. So the most "noble" humans aren't around in Middle-Earth.
What hasn't happened yet is Numenorean ships showing up in Middle-Earth, or Sauron revealing himself. No Rings have been made. Rivendell doesn't exist yet. Galadriel apparently hasn't met Celeborn, and hasn't gone to Lorien.
I can't tell how long it's supposed to be since the end of the War of Wrath: maybe a couple hundred years? It should be much longer, but ::handwaves::
(Sorry for the pedantry, I recently started listening to the Prancing Pony Podcast and they go *deep* on the lore.)
posted by suelac at 6:34 PM on September 3, 2022 [18 favorites]
After the defeat of Morgoth and the sinking of Beleriand. At that point a lot of the Noldor (Galadriel's people) went back to the Undying Lands, but not everyone (for reasons).
Gil-Galad founded a kingdom with the remaining Noldor on the northwestern coast of M-E, where the Gray Havens are. Celebrimbor went further southeast to found Eregion.
The three houses of the Edain (men) went to Numenor with Elros: the island was a gift of the Valar in thanks for their support during the war and Earendil's quest. So the most "noble" humans aren't around in Middle-Earth.
What hasn't happened yet is Numenorean ships showing up in Middle-Earth, or Sauron revealing himself. No Rings have been made. Rivendell doesn't exist yet. Galadriel apparently hasn't met Celeborn, and hasn't gone to Lorien.
I can't tell how long it's supposed to be since the end of the War of Wrath: maybe a couple hundred years? It should be much longer, but ::handwaves::
(Sorry for the pedantry, I recently started listening to the Prancing Pony Podcast and they go *deep* on the lore.)
posted by suelac at 6:34 PM on September 3, 2022 [18 favorites]
I thought this was delightful. I was never bored. It looks gorgeous. Loved Nori and Arodir and Mofydd Clark. Loved the second episode even more. I'm looking forward to next week.
posted by thivaia at 8:19 AM on September 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by thivaia at 8:19 AM on September 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
I really enjoyed this. For the complainers about stilted language, that is basically Tolkien for ya. The Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings both start off with fairly light conversation, but as they go on the dialogue gets more and more stilted and formal.
I at first thought elfs standing in the boat at attention was silly, but then it occurred to me that yeah, that is exactly what Tolkien elves would do. And they probably spent the entire voyage smugly thinking how superior they were to all the other races who have to sit or sleep or eat or whatever.
While I’m pretty sure meteorite dude is going to be Gandalf, as he has landed in proto-hobbit land, it would be much more interesting if it is Saruman. He was the first of the Istari to arrive in Middle Earth to oppose Sauron, so it would make sense.
posted by fimbulvetr at 9:47 AM on September 4, 2022 [8 favorites]
I at first thought elfs standing in the boat at attention was silly, but then it occurred to me that yeah, that is exactly what Tolkien elves would do. And they probably spent the entire voyage smugly thinking how superior they were to all the other races who have to sit or sleep or eat or whatever.
While I’m pretty sure meteorite dude is going to be Gandalf, as he has landed in proto-hobbit land, it would be much more interesting if it is Saruman. He was the first of the Istari to arrive in Middle Earth to oppose Sauron, so it would make sense.
posted by fimbulvetr at 9:47 AM on September 4, 2022 [8 favorites]
While I’m pretty sure meteorite dude is going to be Gandalf
Bit early for Gandalf, isn't it ?
posted by Pendragon at 2:06 PM on September 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
Bit early for Gandalf, isn't it ?
posted by Pendragon at 2:06 PM on September 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
They cut back to it at least twice, suggesting it's a while but then it implies Galadriel swims back all the way.
In her lengthy swimming scenes, I was hoping she’d exchange curt nods with Gendry rowing past.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 2:45 PM on September 4, 2022 [13 favorites]
In her lengthy swimming scenes, I was hoping she’d exchange curt nods with Gendry rowing past.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 2:45 PM on September 4, 2022 [13 favorites]
Confused about the stakes; I need some lore explained.
When they sail to the west, it seems like Elves aren't just going back across the sea to Elf Land. A lot of the imagery and some of the dialogue implied something more like they were getting Raptured into an afterlife (Elfterlife?).
As if Galadriel jumps off the boat because she can't face getting frozen in time forever, with her still in a state of doubt about the remaining presence of The Evil.
Is that a thing? I seem to remember some lines about "I shall Go Into the West, and Diminish".
posted by bartleby at 3:08 PM on September 4, 2022
When they sail to the west, it seems like Elves aren't just going back across the sea to Elf Land. A lot of the imagery and some of the dialogue implied something more like they were getting Raptured into an afterlife (Elfterlife?).
As if Galadriel jumps off the boat because she can't face getting frozen in time forever, with her still in a state of doubt about the remaining presence of The Evil.
Is that a thing? I seem to remember some lines about "I shall Go Into the West, and Diminish".
posted by bartleby at 3:08 PM on September 4, 2022
I do so enjoy hearing nerds nerd about nerddoms I never caught on to enough to nerd.
Not having any investment in the source material for either one, I will say this:
This seems like more of a soap opera type story.
The Wheel of Time series on the other hand, jumped right out at me as 'Oh, this is a Dungeons & Dragons campaign. She's a spellcaster with a Fighter companion for when she runs out of spell slots. That one's a Ranger with a Tragic Backstory; look who picked up a Cursed +1 Dagger and now it's changing their Alignment. Let's have everyone level up and take a Long Rest before starting the next Module'.
posted by bartleby at 3:25 PM on September 4, 2022
Not having any investment in the source material for either one, I will say this:
This seems like more of a soap opera type story.
The Wheel of Time series on the other hand, jumped right out at me as 'Oh, this is a Dungeons & Dragons campaign. She's a spellcaster with a Fighter companion for when she runs out of spell slots. That one's a Ranger with a Tragic Backstory; look who picked up a Cursed +1 Dagger and now it's changing their Alignment. Let's have everyone level up and take a Long Rest before starting the next Module'.
posted by bartleby at 3:25 PM on September 4, 2022
So Valinor (The West) is a physical non-afterlife place where Galadriel was literally born (and elf-afterlife is a physical building there), but every so often the world gets screwed up enough to make it less accessible from Middle-Earth. I think this story is set before the most extreme one of those, and I suspect the bright light might have just been Elrond's dad rendezvousing with them for the second leg of the journey.
I think you've got the right read on Galadriel's fear, but like, not actually literally frozen.
posted by polytope subirb enby-of-piano-dice at 4:38 PM on September 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
I think you've got the right read on Galadriel's fear, but like, not actually literally frozen.
posted by polytope subirb enby-of-piano-dice at 4:38 PM on September 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
and elf-afterlife is a physical building there
Wait, what? How does that work?
(Sorry if this is a derail, I'm just picturing a very nice apartment building but that seems wrong)
posted by trig at 5:22 PM on September 4, 2022
Wait, what? How does that work?
(Sorry if this is a derail, I'm just picturing a very nice apartment building but that seems wrong)
posted by trig at 5:22 PM on September 4, 2022
Valinor like a continent off limits to everyone but elves where everything is nice at this point. You can sail there, sail back, whatever, so it's not really the afterlife, more like Eden. It's just another place. I also thought it was odd that Galadriel chose to jump in the ocean rather than take a boat back after hanging out for a bit.
Later on, after the humans get uppity and ignore the warnings of the powers that be for reasons that the show will likely get into, it becomes a one way trip and only elves (and some specially chosen others) can even physically go there. If you're not an elf, you (presumably) end up sailing all the way around to the east side of Middle Earth because it's, in a sense, no longer on the planet.
posted by wierdo at 10:25 PM on September 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
Later on, after the humans get uppity and ignore the warnings of the powers that be for reasons that the show will likely get into, it becomes a one way trip and only elves (and some specially chosen others) can even physically go there. If you're not an elf, you (presumably) end up sailing all the way around to the east side of Middle Earth because it's, in a sense, no longer on the planet.
posted by wierdo at 10:25 PM on September 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
From Fellowship (via WIkipeida), Gandalf says this about Glorfindel:
posted by mark k at 12:05 AM on September 5, 2022
In Rivendell there live still some of his chief foes: the Elven-wise, lords of the Eldar from beyond the furthest seas. They do not fear the Ringwraiths, for those who have dwelt in the Blessed Realm live at once in both worlds, and against both the Seen and the Unseen they have great power.Were the Blessed Realms just Valinor? I assumed that (giving Vainor a strong supernatural tinge) but my Tolkien lore is weak.
posted by mark k at 12:05 AM on September 5, 2022
If you had told me twenty years ago that in 2022 there would be a big-budget Tolkien show and a big-budget George Martin show and they would both have great visuals and good actors and cool monsters I would have been ecstatic. If you had then told me that they would rank something like eighth and ninth on the list of shows I was most looking forward to watching every week I wouldn’t have been able to comprehend it.
Yeah, I am both a longtime genre fan and and Gen-X type. In the early eighties I was a teenager and lived in a world where there was a Star War every three years (but that was coming to an end) a Star Trek — of widely varying quality — every couple of years, and save for a Superman movie or two, superhero movies were basically unknown. Fantasy? I guess we had that Bakshi Lord of the Rings a few years back, but that was a mixed bag.
Now scarcely a week goes by without new releases of some combination of the above and most of us are “meh.”
posted by ricochet biscuit at 6:27 AM on September 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I am both a longtime genre fan and and Gen-X type. In the early eighties I was a teenager and lived in a world where there was a Star War every three years (but that was coming to an end) a Star Trek — of widely varying quality — every couple of years, and save for a Superman movie or two, superhero movies were basically unknown. Fantasy? I guess we had that Bakshi Lord of the Rings a few years back, but that was a mixed bag.
Now scarcely a week goes by without new releases of some combination of the above and most of us are “meh.”
posted by ricochet biscuit at 6:27 AM on September 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
Were the Blessed Realms just Valinor?
Yes, there are multiple names: Aman, Valinor, the Undying Lands, etc. Basically refers to the western continent & some islands offshore. The Valar live in a city on a mountain, surrounded by their most dedicated followers (few of whom went to Middle-Earth). The rest of the Elves live further east, some of them on an island offshore (Tol Eressea).
From what I have gathered, by the 2nd Age it's not impossible to get to Valinor, but you should probably have permission: during the 1st Age almost nobody was able to get through, because the Noldor had gone to Middle-Earth without permission and the Valar were really pissy about it. When the war against Morgoth went really badly, multiple people tried to reach Valinor to ask for help and didn't make it (only Earendil did, and that was because he had the Silmaril).
Around the end of the 2nd Age it becomes nearly impossible for anyone but Elves to get to Valinor: the Valar literally change the shape of the world to accomplish this. And again, one must have permission to go there: Galadriel at the end of LotR has only just realized that she will be allowed to go back to Valinor. (It's unclear to me how she learns this: maybe Gandalf tells her?)
posted by suelac at 10:02 AM on September 5, 2022 [8 favorites]
Yes, there are multiple names: Aman, Valinor, the Undying Lands, etc. Basically refers to the western continent & some islands offshore. The Valar live in a city on a mountain, surrounded by their most dedicated followers (few of whom went to Middle-Earth). The rest of the Elves live further east, some of them on an island offshore (Tol Eressea).
From what I have gathered, by the 2nd Age it's not impossible to get to Valinor, but you should probably have permission: during the 1st Age almost nobody was able to get through, because the Noldor had gone to Middle-Earth without permission and the Valar were really pissy about it. When the war against Morgoth went really badly, multiple people tried to reach Valinor to ask for help and didn't make it (only Earendil did, and that was because he had the Silmaril).
Around the end of the 2nd Age it becomes nearly impossible for anyone but Elves to get to Valinor: the Valar literally change the shape of the world to accomplish this. And again, one must have permission to go there: Galadriel at the end of LotR has only just realized that she will be allowed to go back to Valinor. (It's unclear to me how she learns this: maybe Gandalf tells her?)
posted by suelac at 10:02 AM on September 5, 2022 [8 favorites]
The Tolkien fan fiction thing is accurate, but I don't consider it a dealbreaker. Half of 20th century fantasy was also some form of Tolkien fan fiction, so I'm willing to see where this goes.
I was very dour about Grrrladriel from the trailer, and I'm happy to say I was wrong! The actress killed it. Galadriel is powerful here -- which is appropriate, regardless of how that power manifests -- but above all, she is driven. And...God, I really love her revenge quest. That is cool. I'm looking forward to more.
I don't love that humans seem basically the same as they were in the LoTR trilogy, but at least the hobbits look and act like they're hundreds of years removed from developing into English gentry. And I'm kind of digging the idea of the elves as an occupying force. (This is the sort of thing showrunners inevitably screw up, but right now it's a cool idea.)
posted by grandiloquiet at 12:46 PM on September 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
I was very dour about Grrrladriel from the trailer, and I'm happy to say I was wrong! The actress killed it. Galadriel is powerful here -- which is appropriate, regardless of how that power manifests -- but above all, she is driven. And...God, I really love her revenge quest. That is cool. I'm looking forward to more.
I don't love that humans seem basically the same as they were in the LoTR trilogy, but at least the hobbits look and act like they're hundreds of years removed from developing into English gentry. And I'm kind of digging the idea of the elves as an occupying force. (This is the sort of thing showrunners inevitably screw up, but right now it's a cool idea.)
posted by grandiloquiet at 12:46 PM on September 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
I will now watch the rest of the episode.
and I gotta say I liked it. I didn't love it. It's not up to Tolkien's fiction (obviously) or Peter Jackson's initial trilogy (which always felt at least a little Hollywood-heavy-handed to me) ... but overall, I gotta say, I was pleasantly surprised by this billion dollar expenditure on non-weapons.
Beautiful to look at. Not particularly stupid narratively. Definitely good enough to get me to episode two, which doesn't happen that often for me anymore. Definitely better than the final season or two of Game Of Thrones.
I'm still annoyed by the pre-Hobbits. And here I'll quote the Guardian:
One of the oddest choices is to make all the harfoots – the aforementioned prototypical hobbits – Irish. They all speak in hammy accents, are charming peasants and their every move is soundtracked by composer Bear McCreary’s aggressively annoying Celtic trilling. It’s one thing that the accents are dreadful, but the internet has also pointed out their resemblance to John Leech’s stereotypical and wildly unflattering anti-Irish cartoons from Punch magazine in the 19th century.
In a weird way, I liken it all to Star Trek - The Next Generation. A show I always liked but could never really LOVE. It was always a little too uptight, too flat, too sober, too Protestant (as a friend used to put it). Nevertheless, I found it very watchable and kept coming back, which is what TV's really all about. Isn't it?
posted by philip-random at 2:04 PM on September 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
and I gotta say I liked it. I didn't love it. It's not up to Tolkien's fiction (obviously) or Peter Jackson's initial trilogy (which always felt at least a little Hollywood-heavy-handed to me) ... but overall, I gotta say, I was pleasantly surprised by this billion dollar expenditure on non-weapons.
Beautiful to look at. Not particularly stupid narratively. Definitely good enough to get me to episode two, which doesn't happen that often for me anymore. Definitely better than the final season or two of Game Of Thrones.
I'm still annoyed by the pre-Hobbits. And here I'll quote the Guardian:
One of the oddest choices is to make all the harfoots – the aforementioned prototypical hobbits – Irish. They all speak in hammy accents, are charming peasants and their every move is soundtracked by composer Bear McCreary’s aggressively annoying Celtic trilling. It’s one thing that the accents are dreadful, but the internet has also pointed out their resemblance to John Leech’s stereotypical and wildly unflattering anti-Irish cartoons from Punch magazine in the 19th century.
In a weird way, I liken it all to Star Trek - The Next Generation. A show I always liked but could never really LOVE. It was always a little too uptight, too flat, too sober, too Protestant (as a friend used to put it). Nevertheless, I found it very watchable and kept coming back, which is what TV's really all about. Isn't it?
posted by philip-random at 2:04 PM on September 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
Metafilter: Sorry for the pedantry.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 11:14 AM on September 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 11:14 AM on September 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
I watched this last night with my family, we all saw the LOTR and Hobbit movies within the last year, and we all enjoyed it. Between the runtime and the high production values my younger kid said the episode was like a movie. It wasn't totally clear what was happening with Galadriel on the ship back to Valinor, like how long they were standing on the ship like that, and why the boat was dematerializing, but enough to convey that going back would be a big process and not one that could be reversed easily. There was also a line when she was talking with either Elrond or the King that they couldn't go back to Valinor until there was no chance of Sauron returning and to me that tied into the LOTR movies where at the end Galadriel finally left Middle Earth, her mission finally accomplished.
I really wanted to see what would happen with the paper boat in the beginning so as far as I'm concerned Galadriel's brother should have shown up a bit later so she could have beaten at least one of those brats up.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:41 PM on September 6, 2022 [3 favorites]
I really wanted to see what would happen with the paper boat in the beginning so as far as I'm concerned Galadriel's brother should have shown up a bit later so she could have beaten at least one of those brats up.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:41 PM on September 6, 2022 [3 favorites]
The elves on the ship reminded me of one of Pauline Baynes illustrations for Tolkein's Smith of Wootten Major, which also had a ship full of elves.
posted by Sparx at 6:35 PM on September 6, 2022
posted by Sparx at 6:35 PM on September 6, 2022
Hilarious how no one seems to ever be able to figure out how to convey Elven masculinity in person, at least not with white men. In the movies, Haldir was the pissiest bouncer east of the Sea, Elrond was commanding but not beautiful, and Legolas comes off as very young. Not one of these TV actors can sell beautiful and otherworldly and commanding. It's too remote from American masculinity. They all just look kind of soft and flabby and ridiculous. (Arondir has (1) and (3) but isn't really trying for (2). Maybe he could. He at least does not have a punchable face like Gil-galad and young Elrond and Celebrimbor.)
posted by praemunire at 8:51 PM on September 6, 2022 [8 favorites]
posted by praemunire at 8:51 PM on September 6, 2022 [8 favorites]
Not one of these TV actors can sell beautiful and otherworldly and commanding.
RIP David Bowie
posted by Nelson at 10:11 PM on September 6, 2022 [8 favorites]
RIP David Bowie
posted by Nelson at 10:11 PM on September 6, 2022 [8 favorites]
The friend I was watching with and I spontaneously mourned his lack of availability.
posted by praemunire at 10:20 PM on September 6, 2022
posted by praemunire at 10:20 PM on September 6, 2022
Not enough lingering shots of characters walking across the landscape.
1 out of 5 stars.
posted by TangoCharlie at 7:40 AM on September 7, 2022
1 out of 5 stars.
posted by TangoCharlie at 7:40 AM on September 7, 2022
One of the oddest choices is to make all the harfoots – the aforementioned prototypical hobbits – Irish. They all speak in hammy accents, are charming peasants and their every move is soundtracked by composer Bear McCreary’s aggressively annoying Celtic trilling. It’s one thing that the accents are dreadful, but the internet has also pointed out their resemblance to John Leech’s stereotypical and wildly unflattering anti-Irish cartoons from Punch magazine in the 19th century.
Especially weird since Tolkien based it on a pre-industrial English midlands. I guess to the mostly American production crew, anti-Irish stereotypes aren't really top of mind as having any recency.
Hilarious how no one seems to ever be able to figure out how to convey Elven masculinity in person, at least not with white men. In the movies, Haldir was the pissiest bouncer east of the Sea, Elrond was commanding but not beautiful, and Legolas comes off as very young. Not one of these TV actors can sell beautiful and otherworldly and commanding. It's too remote from American masculinity. They all just look kind of soft and flabby and ridiculous. (Arondir has (1) and (3) but isn't really trying for (2). Maybe he could. He at least does not have a punchable face like Gil-galad and young Elrond and Celebrimbor.)
They inevitably end up looking and sounding like David Mitchell invoking Vectron's Gilded Wings.
posted by atrazine at 3:07 AM on September 9, 2022 [1 favorite]
Especially weird since Tolkien based it on a pre-industrial English midlands. I guess to the mostly American production crew, anti-Irish stereotypes aren't really top of mind as having any recency.
Hilarious how no one seems to ever be able to figure out how to convey Elven masculinity in person, at least not with white men. In the movies, Haldir was the pissiest bouncer east of the Sea, Elrond was commanding but not beautiful, and Legolas comes off as very young. Not one of these TV actors can sell beautiful and otherworldly and commanding. It's too remote from American masculinity. They all just look kind of soft and flabby and ridiculous. (Arondir has (1) and (3) but isn't really trying for (2). Maybe he could. He at least does not have a punchable face like Gil-galad and young Elrond and Celebrimbor.)
They inevitably end up looking and sounding like David Mitchell invoking Vectron's Gilded Wings.
posted by atrazine at 3:07 AM on September 9, 2022 [1 favorite]
How long is that boat-ride to Valinor? The Elves just stand on the deck for that whole time? That sounds shitty. And poor Galadriel has a loooong swim home.
The entrance to Valinor, as a sort of light-portal in the middle of the ocean, reminded me of The Scar in China Mieville's The Scar. Like a tear in reality that you can slip through if you come at it from the right angle.
Agreed that most of the elves looked like dinks. Terrible, terrible hairstyles.
posted by Saxon Kane at 5:53 PM on October 13, 2022
The entrance to Valinor, as a sort of light-portal in the middle of the ocean, reminded me of The Scar in China Mieville's The Scar. Like a tear in reality that you can slip through if you come at it from the right angle.
Agreed that most of the elves looked like dinks. Terrible, terrible hairstyles.
posted by Saxon Kane at 5:53 PM on October 13, 2022
I'm just here to gather strength to push through to the end of the episode. I just cannot be doing with the cutesiness of the harfoots and the accents are just grating on me like crazy. Did not help that they basically entered with a they-fell-in-the mud-hahah funneh joke. Please let it get a little better than this.
posted by aesop at 4:39 PM on October 31, 2022
posted by aesop at 4:39 PM on October 31, 2022
ugh they shoulda let Lenny Henry do his Brum accent.
posted by aesop at 5:13 PM on October 31, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by aesop at 5:13 PM on October 31, 2022 [1 favorite]
I'm late to this but just want to say it's hard to accept a king of the Noldor with a double chin. Looks like Gil-galad spent too much time around the cheese dip.
posted by mono blanco at 7:57 PM on September 26
posted by mono blanco at 7:57 PM on September 26
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The performances are serviceable but unremarkable, while the dialogue is particularly corny and inartful, with too many intoned monologues about the search for “the light” or the ever-vague nature of evil. The fate of many worlds hangs in the balance, but the uninspired opulence on screen spark in the imagination only visions of bills going up in smoke. Rarely has danger felt so dull.
The pseudoprofundity of the dialog drove me absolutely bonkers. You'd think a billion dollars could hire you some decent writers.
posted by sockpup at 5:41 PM on September 2, 2022 [7 favorites]