I Saw the TV Glow (2024)
May 11, 2024 5:07 AM - Subscribe
Two teenagers bond over their love of a supernatural TV show, but it is mysteriously cancelled.
That IMBD description does not do the film justice. The movie is a beautiful metaphoric exploration of growing up queer.
That IMBD description does not do the film justice. The movie is a beautiful metaphoric exploration of growing up queer.
This is an itchy, awkward movie. (And I mean that as a compliment as that is a big part of what it is conveying.)
Schoenbrun has a knack for understanding the little moments before and after dialogue: the last few breaths of untroubled air you savor before starting a conversation you'd rather not have; drowning in dead silence when what you say didn't land like you hoped; the awful segment of time that it takes to finish walking up to someone who can see you coming from far away.
The bigger themes at work seem to largely be about the trans experience, about the horrible tension of being in the wrong body and it's killing you. That's not something I am qualified to speak to any real length about, obviously. But I will say that I have had trans friends who described their pre-transition time as an unbearably wrong feeling, like the entire world doesn't make sense and they wanted to crawl out of their skin. And this movie conveyed that very well.
My kid said this would be an egg-cracking movie for a lot of people. I suspect they're right.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:23 PM on May 19 [5 favorites]
Schoenbrun has a knack for understanding the little moments before and after dialogue: the last few breaths of untroubled air you savor before starting a conversation you'd rather not have; drowning in dead silence when what you say didn't land like you hoped; the awful segment of time that it takes to finish walking up to someone who can see you coming from far away.
The bigger themes at work seem to largely be about the trans experience, about the horrible tension of being in the wrong body and it's killing you. That's not something I am qualified to speak to any real length about, obviously. But I will say that I have had trans friends who described their pre-transition time as an unbearably wrong feeling, like the entire world doesn't make sense and they wanted to crawl out of their skin. And this movie conveyed that very well.
My kid said this would be an egg-cracking movie for a lot of people. I suspect they're right.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:23 PM on May 19 [5 favorites]
I wanted to go see this in a theater, but everywhere even remotely near me where it's showing is about 30+ minutes away and/or in an annoying place to get to. So I guess I'm waiting for streaming. I am really looking forward to this one, though.
posted by edencosmic at 2:27 PM on May 19
posted by edencosmic at 2:27 PM on May 19
I saw it yesterday.
I really liked the depiction of awkward, unlikable teenagers trying to figure out who/what they are. It's also a beautiful film, with so many extraordinary shots.
I did not like the endless unreliable narrators, who make it impossible to settle on an interpretation. Is Owen trans? Weill, you would think so, only it's impossible to tell if Owen wants to be Isabel or if Maddy wants Owen to be Isobel. The endlessly unreliable narrators rob the film of all meaning,making it a chose your own path adventure story where whatever you decide is true is true. Did Owen want to be Isabel? Maybe. Did Maddy want Owen to be Isabel? Maybe? Is this a trans story? The director says yes, but there is as much evidence in the film of a gay neurodivergent kid being cast as the female co-star of a cis lesbian, desperate for validation.
At the end of the day, it's an incoherent film where the director's reach exceeded her grasp.
posted by GenjiandProust at 6:00 PM on May 23 [1 favorite]
I really liked the depiction of awkward, unlikable teenagers trying to figure out who/what they are. It's also a beautiful film, with so many extraordinary shots.
I did not like the endless unreliable narrators, who make it impossible to settle on an interpretation. Is Owen trans? Weill, you would think so, only it's impossible to tell if Owen wants to be Isabel or if Maddy wants Owen to be Isobel. The endlessly unreliable narrators rob the film of all meaning,making it a chose your own path adventure story where whatever you decide is true is true. Did Owen want to be Isabel? Maybe. Did Maddy want Owen to be Isabel? Maybe? Is this a trans story? The director says yes, but there is as much evidence in the film of a gay neurodivergent kid being cast as the female co-star of a cis lesbian, desperate for validation.
At the end of the day, it's an incoherent film where the director's reach exceeded her grasp.
posted by GenjiandProust at 6:00 PM on May 23 [1 favorite]
That sounds too down on the film, I think. I enjoyed it; I would recommend it to people (although maybe not to people affected by strobing). I do think that it’s a tough watch and ultimately can mean too many things depending on what the viewer decides to take as “true,” but I’ve enjoyed other movies that can be described that way. I do want to watch her previous film, which also apparently messes with reality.
posted by GenjiandProust at 2:22 PM on May 24
posted by GenjiandProust at 2:22 PM on May 24
I would say that Maddy doesn't exist and is some kind of external manifestation of Owen except there is in fact a scene or two where you see another person interact with Maddy (her friend... Polo? don't remember their name). But not very much, and I can also believe that the director is canny enough to do that to ensure the overall narrative remains fractured and can't be tied up so neatly, it's clear the film's structure is considered enough for that to be true.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 9:32 AM on June 1 [2 favorites]
posted by lefty lucky cat at 9:32 AM on June 1 [2 favorites]
Came here to say pretty much exactly what GenjiandProust already said. This movie left me deeply angry, honestly. I'm left to wonder if studio meddling muddied the message here, or if the director just got too deep into making this a "if you know you know" thing. But either way, this feels like a cowardly film to me. It's honestly odd to see it getting as much praise as it has, when the ambiguity just as easily lets you read it as a "transitioning is scary and bad" sort of piece.
I'm left frustrated at the amount of wide distribution and air time this got versus, i don't know, Monica(2022). And i will say, i genuinely went into this wanting to, and expecting to like it. A couple(trans) friends loved it, and the narrative online seemed like the Right People Were Loving It.
And like, I really can't shake the feeling that this kind of ambiguous, vague trans story is much more acceptable from a corporate standpoint than a more explicit and coherent one. And that really, really bugs me.
The best part of the film honestly is the first few minutes, and at about the mid point when Maddy returns. That entire little sequence at the bar/diy show sort of space felt like it was going to redeem the whole thing for me... and then it just falls on its face.
I also do have to say i'm really uncomfortable with how i've seen some people present this as a ~queer POC~ film when it's directed by a white trans woman. Sigh. The entire thing was just a huge letdown to me.
posted by emptythought at 7:04 PM on June 3 [2 favorites]
I'm left frustrated at the amount of wide distribution and air time this got versus, i don't know, Monica(2022). And i will say, i genuinely went into this wanting to, and expecting to like it. A couple(trans) friends loved it, and the narrative online seemed like the Right People Were Loving It.
And like, I really can't shake the feeling that this kind of ambiguous, vague trans story is much more acceptable from a corporate standpoint than a more explicit and coherent one. And that really, really bugs me.
The best part of the film honestly is the first few minutes, and at about the mid point when Maddy returns. That entire little sequence at the bar/diy show sort of space felt like it was going to redeem the whole thing for me... and then it just falls on its face.
I also do have to say i'm really uncomfortable with how i've seen some people present this as a ~queer POC~ film when it's directed by a white trans woman. Sigh. The entire thing was just a huge letdown to me.
posted by emptythought at 7:04 PM on June 3 [2 favorites]
I, too, left the movie angry, but in a very different way. I was angry at the world that makes it so hard for us to recognize who we are. I was angry at Owen for giving up.
And at first I was angry because we have enough movies that show the trans experience as hard and sad. But once I processed, I realized that this one was different. It showed not transitioning as the hard, sad life. Yes, transitioning is scary, especially before you start, but living that hollow empty life is so much worse.
I feel like this movie wasn't made for me (although more for me than for cis people), but for the trans people who haven't figured themselves out yet, or are still scared to transition. I know of at least a few of the latter who were jolted into action by seeing this movie.
Right after seeing the movie, I was thinking of it as one of these movies where there isn't a "what really happened.," but on further reflection, I don't think it was ambiguous. Maddy and Owen are Tara and Isabel. Mr Melancholy did cut out their hearts and poison them. Owen/Isabel is trapped in the midnight realm, dying.
But there is still time.
posted by Tabitha Someday at 6:39 AM on June 4 [8 favorites]
And at first I was angry because we have enough movies that show the trans experience as hard and sad. But once I processed, I realized that this one was different. It showed not transitioning as the hard, sad life. Yes, transitioning is scary, especially before you start, but living that hollow empty life is so much worse.
I feel like this movie wasn't made for me (although more for me than for cis people), but for the trans people who haven't figured themselves out yet, or are still scared to transition. I know of at least a few of the latter who were jolted into action by seeing this movie.
Right after seeing the movie, I was thinking of it as one of these movies where there isn't a "what really happened.," but on further reflection, I don't think it was ambiguous. Maddy and Owen are Tara and Isabel. Mr Melancholy did cut out their hearts and poison them. Owen/Isabel is trapped in the midnight realm, dying.
But there is still time.
posted by Tabitha Someday at 6:39 AM on June 4 [8 favorites]
No one has mentioned the cinematography yet, which is a lot of fun.
I was pretty sure that Owen was a "should-be" trans, who didn't dare try it (yet), but neither of the two people i saw it with got that message, though they did agree once I'd brought it up. I think it was a tiny bit too opaque*, but a very interesting movie despite its flaws.
*I'm 66yro, white, cishet, so it can't be that opaque, but it's definitely not real clear.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:45 PM on June 5
I was pretty sure that Owen was a "should-be" trans, who didn't dare try it (yet), but neither of the two people i saw it with got that message, though they did agree once I'd brought it up. I think it was a tiny bit too opaque*, but a very interesting movie despite its flaws.
*I'm 66yro, white, cishet, so it can't be that opaque, but it's definitely not real clear.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:45 PM on June 5
I went to see this last night with a girlfriend! I liked it, but it was one of the oddest "horror" movies I've ever seen.
The director pushed so many subtle nostalgia buttons for me.
*The Young Adult Network (clearly Nickelodeon! with the jab of the old b&w 50s Nick at Nite used to run afterhours)
*The ice cream man in the beginning and the idea of where does the ice cream man go at the end of the summer is a direct link to the second episode of The Adventures of Pete & Pete season 1, "What We Did on our Summer Vacation"
* The Pink Opaque giving strong Buffy vibes: special girls who can save the world and of course cool bands play the Bronze, uh, I mean, The Double Lunch
* The brief scene were Owen begs Johnny Link's mom to tell his folks he was staying the night there was played by Buffy alum, Amber Benson (Tara)
*And those two weird neighbours standing in front of Owen's house towards the end? Why, that was Michael Maronna and Danny Tamberelli (Big Pete and Little Pete from, you guessed it, The Adventures of Pete & Pete)
In a way this is a weird love letter to Nickelodeon AND Buffy the Vampire Slayer. The 90s vibe of the first half was probably the most accurate portrayal of the 90s I've seen in contemporary film (especially the high school). It looked like the 90s felt instead of how Gen Z thinks the 90s were.
But for all those positives, I am still not sure how I feel about the themes over all. I want to say it's a trans allegory--the only time we see Owen genuinely smile is when he is wearing that pink dress--but I don't know. I am not trans and I won't speak to it. But it is worth seeing, if only because it feels original and strange.
posted by Kitteh at 5:21 AM on June 6 [3 favorites]
The director pushed so many subtle nostalgia buttons for me.
*The Young Adult Network (clearly Nickelodeon! with the jab of the old b&w 50s Nick at Nite used to run afterhours)
*The ice cream man in the beginning and the idea of where does the ice cream man go at the end of the summer is a direct link to the second episode of The Adventures of Pete & Pete season 1, "What We Did on our Summer Vacation"
* The Pink Opaque giving strong Buffy vibes: special girls who can save the world and of course cool bands play the Bronze, uh, I mean, The Double Lunch
* The brief scene were Owen begs Johnny Link's mom to tell his folks he was staying the night there was played by Buffy alum, Amber Benson (Tara)
*And those two weird neighbours standing in front of Owen's house towards the end? Why, that was Michael Maronna and Danny Tamberelli (Big Pete and Little Pete from, you guessed it, The Adventures of Pete & Pete)
In a way this is a weird love letter to Nickelodeon AND Buffy the Vampire Slayer. The 90s vibe of the first half was probably the most accurate portrayal of the 90s I've seen in contemporary film (especially the high school). It looked like the 90s felt instead of how Gen Z thinks the 90s were.
But for all those positives, I am still not sure how I feel about the themes over all. I want to say it's a trans allegory--the only time we see Owen genuinely smile is when he is wearing that pink dress--but I don't know. I am not trans and I won't speak to it. But it is worth seeing, if only because it feels original and strange.
posted by Kitteh at 5:21 AM on June 6 [3 favorites]
It opened here last Friday and I went to see it: I liked it a lot, in its visuals, cinematography, and weirdness in its horror. There were several points where I was thinking "if monsters start showing up in reality I'll be mad," because I understood that wasn't the kind of horror that this film was about. I knew that the creator was trans but I hadn't really read much about the film other than it was getting good reviews.
As a white-cis-mostlystraight-AMAB, I wasn't keyed into the trans allegory, but it read to me as "discomfort with living in the world", I understood the feeling of being at a right angles to reality and the desire to feel through how to fit into it. As the reality and the TV show start bleeding together - he finds parts of an episode guide for episodes that don't exist, go places that were mentioned as TV sets earlier, the irregular fourth-wall breaking - I felt the encroaching world that Owen might actually be part of, and whether that can cohabit with the apparent-reality. There were several points where I was like "if they end it there, I'll be mad".
But, then, it has taken me a while to process the ending: I expected something cathartic and felt like it ended on a lame joke. This article seems to explain that it's a rug-pull -- it's supposed to evoke more that the final girl gets killed right at the exit to safety. With this interpretation, I can see what the director was aiming for, and either way how I felt about the ending doesn't change that the rest of the movie was an amazing, interesting, challenging piece of horror storytelling.
posted by AzraelBrown at 12:26 PM on June 12 [5 favorites]
As a white-cis-mostlystraight-AMAB, I wasn't keyed into the trans allegory, but it read to me as "discomfort with living in the world", I understood the feeling of being at a right angles to reality and the desire to feel through how to fit into it. As the reality and the TV show start bleeding together - he finds parts of an episode guide for episodes that don't exist, go places that were mentioned as TV sets earlier, the irregular fourth-wall breaking - I felt the encroaching world that Owen might actually be part of, and whether that can cohabit with the apparent-reality. There were several points where I was like "if they end it there, I'll be mad".
But, then, it has taken me a while to process the ending: I expected something cathartic and felt like it ended on a lame joke. This article seems to explain that it's a rug-pull -- it's supposed to evoke more that the final girl gets killed right at the exit to safety. With this interpretation, I can see what the director was aiming for, and either way how I felt about the ending doesn't change that the rest of the movie was an amazing, interesting, challenging piece of horror storytelling.
posted by AzraelBrown at 12:26 PM on June 12 [5 favorites]
This is now available as a digital rental (although a $20 one) but since it wasn't playing near me, I didn't mind it.
I deeply loved it. It's not my story, no, and I think what Jane Schoenbrun does is highly dependent on knowing what they are referencing, but I think that is also the strength of what they do. Their movies feel more like a conversation with the audience -- this one especially. I mean, Fred Durst is basically playing the specter of '90s toxic masculinity (he only has one line but he looms over this film).
I like that this is not a neat narrative and it's very intensely dreamlike. I don't really care about what's "real" and what's not here. That wasn't the point for me. It was about the experience.
This is really one of the best movies I've seen so far this year. It has such a strong vision and it commits.
Other people can feel differently. I think it's purposefully unsatisfying. That worked for me but I'm fine if it didn't for other people.
posted by edencosmic at 4:19 PM on June 15 [2 favorites]
I deeply loved it. It's not my story, no, and I think what Jane Schoenbrun does is highly dependent on knowing what they are referencing, but I think that is also the strength of what they do. Their movies feel more like a conversation with the audience -- this one especially. I mean, Fred Durst is basically playing the specter of '90s toxic masculinity (he only has one line but he looms over this film).
I like that this is not a neat narrative and it's very intensely dreamlike. I don't really care about what's "real" and what's not here. That wasn't the point for me. It was about the experience.
This is really one of the best movies I've seen so far this year. It has such a strong vision and it commits.
Other people can feel differently. I think it's purposefully unsatisfying. That worked for me but I'm fine if it didn't for other people.
posted by edencosmic at 4:19 PM on June 15 [2 favorites]
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posted by skycrashesdown at 4:59 PM on May 15 [3 favorites]