True Detective: Maybe Tomorrow
July 5, 2015 7:56 PM - Season 2, Episode 3 - Subscribe
Ani lets Ray know she's in charge after he goes rogue on the investigation, even though he stumbles on crucial evidence that takes the case in a new direction. Meanwhile, Frank meets with his former associates in the criminal underworld, but they make it clear they're not taking orders from him anymore; and Paul hits the streets to see if Caspere's face rings a bell.
I think the show has improved considerably from the first episode this season. The masked guy's costume in the episode reminded me of one of the creatures in Spirited Away. I wonder if it is deliberate?
posted by humanfont at 8:11 PM on July 5, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by humanfont at 8:11 PM on July 5, 2015 [5 favorites]
Nice post!
The highlight was right at the beginning, as far as I'm concerned. Oh, and Rachel McAdams has really grown on me and is basically why I'm tuning in.
Favorite moments:
(with shock and disgust): "Is that a fucking ecigarette?"
'phenomenal motility' (of his sperm)
'half anaconda, half great white' (absurd line delivered with utmost sincerity)
The sudden popularity of 'apoplectic'.
(Also, this post needs the Monty Python 'I'm Not Dead Yet' tag.)
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 8:12 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
The highlight was right at the beginning, as far as I'm concerned. Oh, and Rachel McAdams has really grown on me and is basically why I'm tuning in.
Favorite moments:
(with shock and disgust): "Is that a fucking ecigarette?"
'phenomenal motility' (of his sperm)
'half anaconda, half great white' (absurd line delivered with utmost sincerity)
The sudden popularity of 'apoplectic'.
(Also, this post needs the Monty Python 'I'm Not Dead Yet' tag.)
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 8:12 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Yes, I got the Spirited Away vibe, too.
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 8:14 PM on July 5, 2015
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 8:14 PM on July 5, 2015
Okay, True Detective, I'll let you slide on that one. Still, why would Raven Mask even do that? What's the point of attacking but not killing Ray?
posted by ob1quixote at 8:15 PM on July 5, 2015
posted by ob1quixote at 8:15 PM on July 5, 2015
I'm glad this up already. I was really disappointed in this episode. This was just a mess from the wanna be twin peaks opening, the reveal of the ray fake out, ray running after ani and saving her life not even a day after being shot in the chest....I won't even go on. I realized that I can count the scenes that I liked on one hand and have fingers left over. Ray's wife went to being sympathetic to being repugnant. The character I liked the best was the male hooker. What's keeping me watching at this point was the two scenes with the male hooker and the whole dental work thing.
Luckily Penny Dreadful didn't disappoint tonight as this ep left a bad taste in my mouth. (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)
posted by miss-lapin at 8:18 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Luckily Penny Dreadful didn't disappoint tonight as this ep left a bad taste in my mouth. (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)
posted by miss-lapin at 8:18 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Still not totally drawn in. All the principal cops still seem separate and not gelling, especially in their conversations with each other. Too many separate threads that aren't tying together yet.
Interesting that Frank is also playing detective too.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:21 PM on July 5, 2015
Interesting that Frank is also playing detective too.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:21 PM on July 5, 2015
Okay, True Detective, I'll let you slide on that one. Still, why would Raven Mask even do that? What's the point of attacking but not killing Ray?
It's obviously Vince Vaughan. Last episode he'll reveal himself as a nihilist. It's why he's so tired all the time.
posted by turbid dahlia at 8:21 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
It's obviously Vince Vaughan. Last episode he'll reveal himself as a nihilist. It's why he's so tired all the time.
posted by turbid dahlia at 8:21 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
the reveal of the ray fake out
I'm not sure it was really a fake-out in retrospect. There was no blood splatter anywhere, not after the first shot and before the second (where there was a clear shot of the wall and floor), nor after the second point-blank shot. I think that was attention to detail.
posted by SpacemanStix at 8:34 PM on July 5, 2015
I'm not sure it was really a fake-out in retrospect. There was no blood splatter anywhere, not after the first shot and before the second (where there was a clear shot of the wall and floor), nor after the second point-blank shot. I think that was attention to detail.
posted by SpacemanStix at 8:34 PM on July 5, 2015
"It's certainly possible to live with unhealthy habits. But it helps if you don't have every one under the sun."
I'm taking that quote home with me.
posted by SpacemanStix at 8:38 PM on July 5, 2015 [11 favorites]
I'm taking that quote home with me.
posted by SpacemanStix at 8:38 PM on July 5, 2015 [11 favorites]
The more I think about it, I agree that we weren't supposed to think he was dead. When they did the recap at the beginning, the lack of blood spatter really stood out. I mean, not that I actually know what it "looks like" when someone is shot, but I know what it "looks like" on TV. They did the same thing on the finale of White Collar when Neal was "killed" - the blood was really fake looking.
posted by radioamy at 8:39 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by radioamy at 8:39 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Not dead, but you still managed to shoe-horn in an "is this...the afterlife" scene? CHEAP.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 8:40 PM on July 5, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 8:40 PM on July 5, 2015 [3 favorites]
'half anaconda, half great white' (absurd line delivered with utmost sincerity)
That one landed for me more as a George Lucas "you can write this shit, but you can't say it" line.
Also, Vince Vaughn's lengthy inner-turmoil facial expression at the end of the episode: like a cat trying to throw up a hairball.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 8:45 PM on July 5, 2015 [9 favorites]
That one landed for me more as a George Lucas "you can write this shit, but you can't say it" line.
Also, Vince Vaughn's lengthy inner-turmoil facial expression at the end of the episode: like a cat trying to throw up a hairball.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 8:45 PM on July 5, 2015 [9 favorites]
The e-cigarette thing cracks me up, and I think when we look back on this show, it's going to be one thing that places it squarely in 2015. A few years ago nobody had really seen an e-cig. In a few years they'll probably be mainstrem. Right now they're at that point where you see people smoking them, but they still look ridiculous.
posted by radioamy at 8:46 PM on July 5, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by radioamy at 8:46 PM on July 5, 2015 [4 favorites]
Yeah his character is kind of veering into the 'big, tough, silent type' stock masculine player. I mean I know Nic loves his 'exploring masculinity' stuff and so do I but there's also lazy portrayals.
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 8:47 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 8:47 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
'half anaconda, half great white' (absurd line delivered with utmost sincerity)
That one landed for me more as a George Lucas "you can write this shit, but you can't say it" line.
Yeah, that's hilarious. If you look at Vaughn's expression right after he says this, it could easily be interpreted as, I have no idea what that really means, which makes it even funnier.
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:04 PM on July 5, 2015 [7 favorites]
That one landed for me more as a George Lucas "you can write this shit, but you can't say it" line.
Yeah, that's hilarious. If you look at Vaughn's expression right after he says this, it could easily be interpreted as, I have no idea what that really means, which makes it even funnier.
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:04 PM on July 5, 2015 [7 favorites]
Todd VanDerWerff, Vox: "The resolution to last week's big True Detective cliffhanger is total, utter bullshit."
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 9:25 PM on July 5, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 9:25 PM on July 5, 2015 [3 favorites]
Alan Sepinwall, HitFix:
The actor playing the director of the "collapse of civilization revenge flick" isn't a dead ringer for Cary Fukunaga, but it's hard to look at the way he was styled (albeit with a ponytail instead of a braid) and not view that whole scene as Pizzolatto throwing some shade at his former collaborator.posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 9:27 PM on July 5, 2015 [6 favorites]
Still, why would Raven Mask even do that? What's the point of attacking but not killing Ray?
I think that and the original murder of Caspere had to have been intended to draw more attention to what's going on in Vinci. If you just want to murder a sleazeball, why do it in such a bizarre way and then leave his body in a place that is easily going to be found with his wallet in his lap? Similarly, whoever Raven Mask is, they had to know that scaring the bejesus out of a cop would only cause more police resources to stream into the previously hidden sex dungeon. Hell, even the dude who torched that car at the end should have known that flashily destroying evidence is a good way to keep people interested, even if he didn't know that the two people who care most about that car were around the corner. If that car had shown up looking like the Dude's in The Big Lebowski, maybe no one gives it a second thought. I mean, it didn't look like the most promising lead in the world when it was introduced. But if it shows up having been burned in obvious evidence destruction, someone's going to follow up on that.
posted by Copronymus at 9:38 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think that and the original murder of Caspere had to have been intended to draw more attention to what's going on in Vinci. If you just want to murder a sleazeball, why do it in such a bizarre way and then leave his body in a place that is easily going to be found with his wallet in his lap? Similarly, whoever Raven Mask is, they had to know that scaring the bejesus out of a cop would only cause more police resources to stream into the previously hidden sex dungeon. Hell, even the dude who torched that car at the end should have known that flashily destroying evidence is a good way to keep people interested, even if he didn't know that the two people who care most about that car were around the corner. If that car had shown up looking like the Dude's in The Big Lebowski, maybe no one gives it a second thought. I mean, it didn't look like the most promising lead in the world when it was introduced. But if it shows up having been burned in obvious evidence destruction, someone's going to follow up on that.
posted by Copronymus at 9:38 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
why would Raven Mask even do that? What's the point of attacking but not killing Ray?
Ray mentions he was shot with what cops use. If the Raven Mask is a cop or an ex-cop, that person would know that getting an entire task force dedicated to finding a cop killer might not be the best strategy at this point.
posted by juiceCake at 9:39 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Ray mentions he was shot with what cops use. If the Raven Mask is a cop or an ex-cop, that person would know that getting an entire task force dedicated to finding a cop killer might not be the best strategy at this point.
posted by juiceCake at 9:39 PM on July 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
I keep catching these little things, like Vinci's alcoholic crime boss mayor (I love that guy and his screwed up family) posing prominently with George W. Bush in pictures, and massively PTSD bike cop pressing prostitutes for info under an American Sniper billboard.
I wish the show was a little bit smarter to carry through on whatever it thinks it's saying, but hey, it's a nice touch.
posted by codacorolla at 9:42 PM on July 5, 2015 [11 favorites]
I wish the show was a little bit smarter to carry through on whatever it thinks it's saying, but hey, it's a nice touch.
posted by codacorolla at 9:42 PM on July 5, 2015 [11 favorites]
RUBBER BUCKSHOT WTF OMG LAME
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 10:49 PM on July 5, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 10:49 PM on July 5, 2015 [6 favorites]
'half anaconda, half great white' (absurd line delivered with utmost sincerity)
That one landed for me more as a George Lucas "you can write this shit, but you can't say it" line.
Yeah, that's hilarious. If you look at Vaughn's expression right after he says this, it could easily be interpreted as, I have no idea what that really means, which makes it even funnier.
And it was a response to Vaughn's musings on causality. That whole scene was ridiculous.
posted by homunculus at 12:08 AM on July 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
That one landed for me more as a George Lucas "you can write this shit, but you can't say it" line.
Yeah, that's hilarious. If you look at Vaughn's expression right after he says this, it could easily be interpreted as, I have no idea what that really means, which makes it even funnier.
And it was a response to Vaughn's musings on causality. That whole scene was ridiculous.
posted by homunculus at 12:08 AM on July 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
This was the end of True Detective. It jumped so far over the shark it's now in orbit. The opening scene crossed the line from Twin Peaks homage to ripoff. Then they went and used Detox Mansion by Warren Zevon to signify Ray's moment of clarity (low hanging fruit). Then the whole Broke Back Mountain in the Middle East thing...sigh. Awful. Just awful. And we're three episodes in, and I still don't give a shit who murdered the fetish bureaucrat.
posted by dortmunder at 3:50 AM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by dortmunder at 3:50 AM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
I'm still stuck on the odd acting styles and I think that I unfairly maligned Vaughn last week because all most all of the actors are doing that slow affect-less speech with long pauses after each sentence. So it must be some sort of deliberate choice of the show runners but it really makes it hard to listen to.
posted by octothorpe at 3:58 AM on July 6, 2015
posted by octothorpe at 3:58 AM on July 6, 2015
Oh, man. This show is less plausible than a Castle plotline. It is genuinely like I am being punished for constantly downgrading my expectations. Only the other day I was saying to HerIndoors7 "It's noir - noir films are revered now but many of them are terribly flawed, wooden acting, terrible dialogue, thoroughly implausible stories..."
NOW LOOK WHAT YOU DID.
posted by prismatic7 at 4:26 AM on July 6, 2015
NOW LOOK WHAT YOU DID.
posted by prismatic7 at 4:26 AM on July 6, 2015
Is Vince Vaughn aware of just how many bags are hanging under his eyes? He's got a full set of luggage there. It's become distracting to me.
posted by dnash at 5:17 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by dnash at 5:17 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
In the Vinci police station, there is a framed dangling-kitty poster on the wall -- but instead of "Hang in there!" it says "EAT SHIT & DIE".
Also, one reason I haven't been to the doctor in years is that I sort of imagine the appointment going like Velcoro's checkup, with the doctor disgustedly throwing up his hands and asking "Do you even want to live?"
posted by paper chromatographologist at 5:23 AM on July 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
Also, one reason I haven't been to the doctor in years is that I sort of imagine the appointment going like Velcoro's checkup, with the doctor disgustedly throwing up his hands and asking "Do you even want to live?"
posted by paper chromatographologist at 5:23 AM on July 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
The opening scene crossed the line from Twin Peaks homage to ripoff.
You're not wrong, but I did enjoy that guy pretending to be Conway Twitty. I think this has way more to do with my liking Conway Twitty than anything else.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 5:40 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
You're not wrong, but I did enjoy that guy pretending to be Conway Twitty. I think this has way more to do with my liking Conway Twitty than anything else.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 5:40 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
I think my biggest problem with this season is that there's so little levity; in the first season, Woody Harrelson kept calling out how ridiculous Matthew McConaughey was acting and it added a lot. There were moments of fun. There was also a fair amount of light whereas this is season is very dark both literally and figuratively.
I'm also super, SUPER over stories about people, especially men, who are dark and brooding and had difficult childhoods as shorthand so we know they're complex. Show, don't tell, writers -- monologues about how awful your father was or whatever aren't substitutes for legit character development. "Oh look, I'm so MOODY and DARK and I have FEELINGS but I'm INTENSE and SCARY" -- Jesus, find something new. I'm not automatically seduced into caring about powerful men with dark pasts and tormented psyches. It feels really lazy at this point. Oh look, every person in this show is Troubled, that must mean that they're fully-developed characters! Well, no, they're really not, and the fact that everyone's moody and troubled and sad doesn't mean that they're actually interesting or complex and doesn't automatically make your show Good or Art.
posted by Mrs. Pterodactyl at 5:42 AM on July 6, 2015 [13 favorites]
I'm also super, SUPER over stories about people, especially men, who are dark and brooding and had difficult childhoods as shorthand so we know they're complex. Show, don't tell, writers -- monologues about how awful your father was or whatever aren't substitutes for legit character development. "Oh look, I'm so MOODY and DARK and I have FEELINGS but I'm INTENSE and SCARY" -- Jesus, find something new. I'm not automatically seduced into caring about powerful men with dark pasts and tormented psyches. It feels really lazy at this point. Oh look, every person in this show is Troubled, that must mean that they're fully-developed characters! Well, no, they're really not, and the fact that everyone's moody and troubled and sad doesn't mean that they're actually interesting or complex and doesn't automatically make your show Good or Art.
posted by Mrs. Pterodactyl at 5:42 AM on July 6, 2015 [13 favorites]
I'm still sticking with the series, 'cause hey it's interesting enough for 9pm on Sunday, but I'm not holding out a lot of hope for it to tie together.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:57 AM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:57 AM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
why would Raven Mask even do that? What's the point of attacking but not killing Ray?
Well the Raven Mask also took the camera and hard-drive. The Mayor wants Ray on the investigation so he can find something to use against Bezzerides. So Ray needs to be involved but can't actually find real evidence. So these masked dudes, presumably working for the Mayor, keep showing up to steal/destroy evidence but don't go so far as to kill Ray.
posted by mullacc at 7:30 AM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Well the Raven Mask also took the camera and hard-drive. The Mayor wants Ray on the investigation so he can find something to use against Bezzerides. So Ray needs to be involved but can't actually find real evidence. So these masked dudes, presumably working for the Mayor, keep showing up to steal/destroy evidence but don't go so far as to kill Ray.
posted by mullacc at 7:30 AM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
I would guess that whoever the masked conspiracy is, they're setting Ray up to be the fall guy for the whole thing.
posted by codacorolla at 7:34 AM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by codacorolla at 7:34 AM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
Hmm, interesting theory codacorolla. You've been right before, so I'm keeping an eye out for evidence to support this theory.
Mrs. Pterodactyl - I totally agree.
posted by radioamy at 7:41 AM on July 6, 2015
Mrs. Pterodactyl - I totally agree.
posted by radioamy at 7:41 AM on July 6, 2015
Sad to see the great Fred Ward in such a tiny cameo but still good to see him.
posted by octothorpe at 7:46 AM on July 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 7:46 AM on July 6, 2015 [4 favorites]
I think my biggest problem with this season is that there's so little levity
I had two LOL moments this episode (whereas I had none in the previous episodes).
1. The e-Cig comment
2. Bezzerides's comment of "it smells like piss"
Bezzerides seems to be the closest thing to comic relief.
difficult childhoods as shorthand so we know they're complex
The locked in the basement with rats monolog from last episode was just cliché and stupid. As soon as he said the light bulb burned out, I thought, "He'd better not be about to say there were rats." Then he did and it was almost comical in its cheesiness. It was so cliché that he might be making it up.
Despite that, I like no holds barred morally bankrupt Vince Vaughn much more than trying to play it straight Vince Vaughn, so he's been growing on me. Vince Vaughn trying to play a straight guy is about as convincing as Frank Semyon trying to play a straight guy, and perhaps that's intentional.
Did it seem to anyone else like Velcoro broke the 4th wall?
posted by tempestuoso at 8:01 AM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
I had two LOL moments this episode (whereas I had none in the previous episodes).
1. The e-Cig comment
2. Bezzerides's comment of "it smells like piss"
Bezzerides seems to be the closest thing to comic relief.
difficult childhoods as shorthand so we know they're complex
The locked in the basement with rats monolog from last episode was just cliché and stupid. As soon as he said the light bulb burned out, I thought, "He'd better not be about to say there were rats." Then he did and it was almost comical in its cheesiness. It was so cliché that he might be making it up.
Despite that, I like no holds barred morally bankrupt Vince Vaughn much more than trying to play it straight Vince Vaughn, so he's been growing on me. Vince Vaughn trying to play a straight guy is about as convincing as Frank Semyon trying to play a straight guy, and perhaps that's intentional.
Did it seem to anyone else like Velcoro broke the 4th wall?
posted by tempestuoso at 8:01 AM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
I think my biggest problem with this season is that there's so little levity; in the first season, Woody Harrelson kept calling out how ridiculous Matthew McConaughey was acting and it added a lot.
I think this more or less sums up my problems with this season so far as well. In Season 1, there was an interesting (and often darkly amusing) dynamic between McConaughey and Harrelson, with the former chewing up all the truly absurd dialogue, and the latter providing much-needed push-back. This season, though, it seems like they took all the crazypants dialogue and split it up between every single character, and forgot to cast anyone in the role of the straight man.
Also, I am bummed that they did the boring and sadly predictable "special bullets, he's totally fine!" resolution. I think killing Velcoro, and then using him in flashbacks and the like, could have taken the season in a really interesting direction. Instead, I guess he's got superpowers or something that will keep him alive ("look out, evil doer, it's Drunk Man!").
posted by tocts at 8:36 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
I think this more or less sums up my problems with this season so far as well. In Season 1, there was an interesting (and often darkly amusing) dynamic between McConaughey and Harrelson, with the former chewing up all the truly absurd dialogue, and the latter providing much-needed push-back. This season, though, it seems like they took all the crazypants dialogue and split it up between every single character, and forgot to cast anyone in the role of the straight man.
Also, I am bummed that they did the boring and sadly predictable "special bullets, he's totally fine!" resolution. I think killing Velcoro, and then using him in flashbacks and the like, could have taken the season in a really interesting direction. Instead, I guess he's got superpowers or something that will keep him alive ("look out, evil doer, it's Drunk Man!").
posted by tocts at 8:36 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
The medieval bird mask, the shrink played by Rick Springfield, and the Conway Twitty Impersonator all made me laugh. The weirdness is the levity this time, and it seems like that has to be at least halfway intentional. Someone HAS to come along and directly make fun of the brooding and sadness, though, I would agree. All that's treated as running joke in reviews, recaps, and discussions, thus far.
posted by raysmj at 9:01 AM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by raysmj at 9:01 AM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
forgot to cast anyone in the role of the straight man
Yes, this, exactly. With no one for the audience to truly identify with, the audience can't really feel anything. We're supposed to react when we see Stan's dead body and realize that his eyes were burned out, like the other murder victim. But we can't get into it, because it's all just weirdness for the sake of weirdness.
Did it seem to anyone else like Velcoro broke the 4th wall?
Yes. I thought he rifled the camera on purpose.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:01 AM on July 6, 2015
Yes, this, exactly. With no one for the audience to truly identify with, the audience can't really feel anything. We're supposed to react when we see Stan's dead body and realize that his eyes were burned out, like the other murder victim. But we can't get into it, because it's all just weirdness for the sake of weirdness.
Did it seem to anyone else like Velcoro broke the 4th wall?
Yes. I thought he rifled the camera on purpose.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:01 AM on July 6, 2015
I am actually really liking this show. Some caveats: I didn't watch the first season at all, and thus have no opinion as to this season living up or not to the first one. I'm just taking it as it is. What I like:
- Colin Farrell's performance (even though I kept referring to him as RDJ Jr. until I was corrected mid-Episode 2): I think he's doing a phenomenal job of portraying the should-be-unlikable Velcoro. Yeah, he's a terrible father and a crooked cop and not living his best life, but he plays him with so much justly-deserved self-loathing and longing that you can't help but feel for the guy.
- The setting, and how they film it. I think LA is one of the most beautiful cities in the world, and I love seeing its grimy industrial areas get the silver screen treatment. The actual towns Vinci is based on (Vernon, Commerce, Bell) are such strange, interesting places. And because they're so unphotogenic, bizarre scandals organically thrive in these towns.
- The mayor of Vinci. What a great character, played by a great actor. Love it. And I find his office oddly beautiful as well.
posted by Aubergine at 9:06 AM on July 6, 2015 [10 favorites]
- Colin Farrell's performance (even though I kept referring to him as RDJ Jr. until I was corrected mid-Episode 2): I think he's doing a phenomenal job of portraying the should-be-unlikable Velcoro. Yeah, he's a terrible father and a crooked cop and not living his best life, but he plays him with so much justly-deserved self-loathing and longing that you can't help but feel for the guy.
- The setting, and how they film it. I think LA is one of the most beautiful cities in the world, and I love seeing its grimy industrial areas get the silver screen treatment. The actual towns Vinci is based on (Vernon, Commerce, Bell) are such strange, interesting places. And because they're so unphotogenic, bizarre scandals organically thrive in these towns.
- The mayor of Vinci. What a great character, played by a great actor. Love it. And I find his office oddly beautiful as well.
posted by Aubergine at 9:06 AM on July 6, 2015 [10 favorites]
Incidentally: is "prost" as police slang for "prostitute" something that Pizzolatto made up? It stood out as awkward in S1 when Rust and Cohle used it, and here we also have Velcoro using it in S2.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 9:19 AM on July 6, 2015
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 9:19 AM on July 6, 2015
IIRC, prost is German for "Cheers!" so maybe every time you hear the word "prost," you're supposed to toast your neighbor and finish your drink. Also, whenever the mayor takes a drink or you hear Vince Vaughn use a 5-dollar word in either a strident or apoplectic manner, you're supposed to do a shot.
This season seems tailor-made for a drinking game.
posted by tempestuoso at 9:38 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
This season seems tailor-made for a drinking game.
posted by tempestuoso at 9:38 AM on July 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
The guy performing as Conway Twitty at the beginning is Jake La Botz, an actor and musician, apparently. From WSJ - Music on TV: ‘True Detective’ Resurrects ‘The Rose’:
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 10:20 AM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
"Songwriter and performer Amanda McBroom, who wrote 'The Rose' in the late 1970s, was ecstatic to find out that the show would be using her song, a timeless pop standard whose success has helped fuel her creative lifestyle. She just wrapped up a play in Los Angeles and will soon head to Chicago to perform a concert. In late September and early October, she is scheduled to perform at New York cabaret club 54 Below.There's a short interview with McBroom that follows.
"'Talk about the gift that keeps on giving,' McBroom told Speakeasy in a telephone interview last week. 'I have the opportunity to do whatever I damn well please, thank you very much.'
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 10:20 AM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
The Story Behind True Detective’s Cover of ‘The Rose’
posted by homunculus at 10:41 AM on July 6, 2015
posted by homunculus at 10:41 AM on July 6, 2015
I am actually really liking this show. Some caveats: I didn't watch the first season at all, and thus have no opinion as to this season living up or not to the first one. I'm just taking it as it is.
I'm usually along with the flow on the quality of a show, but I'm really liking it too, which doesn't seem to jive with the general consensus. I understand the criticisms, but those issues really don't bother me that much. The characters are interesting, even if overplayed at times, and I am genuinely curious how it's all going to turn out. And the cinematography is beautiful at times. As someone who lives in LA, it can look a bit dreary at times, but many of the overhead and skyline shots are done to some nice effect. I think we'll see enough interesting twists and turns to make this worth our while.
1. The e-Cig comment
I think this has served as a marker for the people that Ani emotionally connects with and finds trustworthy thus far. Each of the conversations that lead to that comment were in the context of either Ray or Paul being compromised in some way, and she seemed to connect with that more than if they were straight laced. Because she comes from a pretty broken past, I think she identifies with others who likewise feel broken on some level. She also seems to like men who can give it back a bit (and is pretty repulsed by those who can't), and flat-out criticizing her e-cig in each case brought no comment from her, but seemed to be the point that she found them direct and honest enough to confide in on deeper levels.
posted by SpacemanStix at 11:41 AM on July 6, 2015 [10 favorites]
I'm usually along with the flow on the quality of a show, but I'm really liking it too, which doesn't seem to jive with the general consensus. I understand the criticisms, but those issues really don't bother me that much. The characters are interesting, even if overplayed at times, and I am genuinely curious how it's all going to turn out. And the cinematography is beautiful at times. As someone who lives in LA, it can look a bit dreary at times, but many of the overhead and skyline shots are done to some nice effect. I think we'll see enough interesting twists and turns to make this worth our while.
1. The e-Cig comment
I think this has served as a marker for the people that Ani emotionally connects with and finds trustworthy thus far. Each of the conversations that lead to that comment were in the context of either Ray or Paul being compromised in some way, and she seemed to connect with that more than if they were straight laced. Because she comes from a pretty broken past, I think she identifies with others who likewise feel broken on some level. She also seems to like men who can give it back a bit (and is pretty repulsed by those who can't), and flat-out criticizing her e-cig in each case brought no comment from her, but seemed to be the point that she found them direct and honest enough to confide in on deeper levels.
posted by SpacemanStix at 11:41 AM on July 6, 2015 [10 favorites]
What did Paul's buddy from Black Mountain say he was doing for a job? Any chance he was the bird mask shooter? The right body type, knowledge about guns/ non-lethal rounds, a history of being a mercenary. I could see someone hiring a former merc to obtain incriminating evidence without creating waves by actually killing a cop.
posted by bluecore at 12:58 PM on July 6, 2015
posted by bluecore at 12:58 PM on July 6, 2015
So, perhaps this is a new idea to me because I'm slow and it's actually ripped from the pages of Duh! Magazine, but: Frank is gay, right?
Show, don't tell, writers -- monologues about how awful your father was or whatever aren't substitutes for legit character development.
I dunno, that whole scene with Ray and his dad, especially when he had to hold the whiskey glass to his lips because his shakes were so bad, was a pretty effective Shown, Not Told. That was a pretty great scene all around.
posted by jbickers at 1:02 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Show, don't tell, writers -- monologues about how awful your father was or whatever aren't substitutes for legit character development.
I dunno, that whole scene with Ray and his dad, especially when he had to hold the whiskey glass to his lips because his shakes were so bad, was a pretty effective Shown, Not Told. That was a pretty great scene all around.
posted by jbickers at 1:02 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
We had a deal, Kyle: “Incidentally: is "prost" as police slang for "prostitute" something that Pizzolatto made up?”I thought they were saying "pros" as in "professionals?" I've definitely heard that elsewhere.
posted by ob1quixote at 1:09 PM on July 6, 2015
I dunno, that whole scene with Ray and his dad, especially when he had to hold the whiskey glass to his lips because his shakes were so bad, was a pretty effective Shown, Not Told. That was a pretty great scene all around.
Yeah, that was actually much better -- I was thinking of Vince Vaughn's monologue about getting locked up in the basement in the previous episode. I agree that the actual father/son scene was pretty solid and I much, MUCH preferred it to someone just talking about their Dark Past and Troubled Childhood.
posted by Mrs. Pterodactyl at 1:22 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Yeah, that was actually much better -- I was thinking of Vince Vaughn's monologue about getting locked up in the basement in the previous episode. I agree that the actual father/son scene was pretty solid and I much, MUCH preferred it to someone just talking about their Dark Past and Troubled Childhood.
posted by Mrs. Pterodactyl at 1:22 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
I felt that way about Frank's little run-in with the Army buddy. I don't need your life story buddy!
posted by LizBoBiz at 1:23 PM on July 6, 2015
posted by LizBoBiz at 1:23 PM on July 6, 2015
I'm sort of familiar with noir as a genre, and here are a few boilerplate ways that I think this could go:
> It was MAJOR FRIEND CHARACTER all along! : Someone who's been helping with the investigation has in fact been doing it for their own ends, manipulating the detective(s) into accomplishing their goals under the guise of law and order. Last week I mentioned that it was possible that this could be Ray trying to get revenge on the Vinci establishment, although last week we got far enough into his character's perspective to make this more of a stretch. The mayor isn't a 'friend' per se, but it is possible that he arranged the hit on Casper, and is now trying to manipulate the investigation to fuck over Frank. The other Vinci cop is very, very suspicious IMO (he was the one spying on Woodrough, right?), and could be serving in this purpose. Frank's lieutenant is also a tantalizing prospect. It seems like they're playing coy with him, and keeping him at the periphery of the narrative so that he can be set up for a big reveal. He also has the bodytype and the mannerisms for it.
>It was COMPLETELY OUT OF NOWHERE person all along!: Less satisfying. They're into the second act, so I have to assume that whoever is principally involved has been introduced... maybe not. A less left field option may be to have someone who's not obviously involved actually be centrally involved. That would be Ani's dad, the psychologist (that seems like a red (or maybe black) herring, though), Woodrough's 'friend', the mayor's son... None of these are super satisfying to me. Ani's dad could just be a thematic tease, sort of like Marty's daughters in S1. They hint towards the ideas of the season, but they aren't directly involved in the central case, but out of this category he would be my number 1 pick (not that he's literally in the mask, but that he's pulling the strings).
>The ol' frame-up: This isn't exclusive with either above, but the idea that the detective is a pawn who gradually gains knowledge until they realize they're being set up (as a perversion of justice, with the just taking the fall for the guilty) is a pretty classic noir trope. One of the Vinci elite asks, 'This is your best man?' with regards to Ray, and I think that the answer might be 'no', and that Ray is just ready for a fall. He's at the end of his life, he doesn't even seem to want to live, and he would be a good scapegoat that they could throw to the state authorities. Ray realizing this and taking steps to prevent his own downfall would present a satisfying narrative arc. He goes from a drunken nihilist to (at the very least) acting in self preservation - maybe he even works to help Ani's career as they become friends.
>The main investigation was just a cover-up!: This sort of goes along with the idea above, but basically it's the twist that the real murder / kidnapping / burglary was just a coverup for something else. Big Lebowski-ish. I would be willing to put money on this being the case at this point. The Crow leaving Ray alive certainly points to the idea that there's a lot more going on here. If that is the case, then Frank's quest to recover his stolen land money could just be a tease... his suitcase full of cash was just caught up in the wrong place and time.
posted by codacorolla at 1:29 PM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
> It was MAJOR FRIEND CHARACTER all along! : Someone who's been helping with the investigation has in fact been doing it for their own ends, manipulating the detective(s) into accomplishing their goals under the guise of law and order. Last week I mentioned that it was possible that this could be Ray trying to get revenge on the Vinci establishment, although last week we got far enough into his character's perspective to make this more of a stretch. The mayor isn't a 'friend' per se, but it is possible that he arranged the hit on Casper, and is now trying to manipulate the investigation to fuck over Frank. The other Vinci cop is very, very suspicious IMO (he was the one spying on Woodrough, right?), and could be serving in this purpose. Frank's lieutenant is also a tantalizing prospect. It seems like they're playing coy with him, and keeping him at the periphery of the narrative so that he can be set up for a big reveal. He also has the bodytype and the mannerisms for it.
>It was COMPLETELY OUT OF NOWHERE person all along!: Less satisfying. They're into the second act, so I have to assume that whoever is principally involved has been introduced... maybe not. A less left field option may be to have someone who's not obviously involved actually be centrally involved. That would be Ani's dad, the psychologist (that seems like a red (or maybe black) herring, though), Woodrough's 'friend', the mayor's son... None of these are super satisfying to me. Ani's dad could just be a thematic tease, sort of like Marty's daughters in S1. They hint towards the ideas of the season, but they aren't directly involved in the central case, but out of this category he would be my number 1 pick (not that he's literally in the mask, but that he's pulling the strings).
>The ol' frame-up: This isn't exclusive with either above, but the idea that the detective is a pawn who gradually gains knowledge until they realize they're being set up (as a perversion of justice, with the just taking the fall for the guilty) is a pretty classic noir trope. One of the Vinci elite asks, 'This is your best man?' with regards to Ray, and I think that the answer might be 'no', and that Ray is just ready for a fall. He's at the end of his life, he doesn't even seem to want to live, and he would be a good scapegoat that they could throw to the state authorities. Ray realizing this and taking steps to prevent his own downfall would present a satisfying narrative arc. He goes from a drunken nihilist to (at the very least) acting in self preservation - maybe he even works to help Ani's career as they become friends.
>The main investigation was just a cover-up!: This sort of goes along with the idea above, but basically it's the twist that the real murder / kidnapping / burglary was just a coverup for something else. Big Lebowski-ish. I would be willing to put money on this being the case at this point. The Crow leaving Ray alive certainly points to the idea that there's a lot more going on here. If that is the case, then Frank's quest to recover his stolen land money could just be a tease... his suitcase full of cash was just caught up in the wrong place and time.
posted by codacorolla at 1:29 PM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
ob1quixote: I thought they were saying "pros" as in "professionals?" I've definitely heard that elsewhere.
It was definitely "prost" as I saw questions about it in the True Detective sub-reddit for the first season about Rust and Cohle using it there too.
posted by bluecore at 1:54 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
It was definitely "prost" as I saw questions about it in the True Detective sub-reddit for the first season about Rust and Cohle using it there too.
posted by bluecore at 1:54 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Got my hopes up with the end of Episode 2 but thought that this episode was horrible. I'm scared to go back and watch Season 1; this is quickly approaching "thing 2 is so bad it ruins thing 1 that person did."
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:21 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:21 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
This is rapidly turning into a ManPain Telenovela, but hey, now I can keep referring to Colin Farrell as "Magnum DWI." I'm barely interested enough to keep paying attention to the plot going forward, but the husband likes it and it's not too hard on the eyes cinematically, so... fuck it, I'm in.
It's almost like they wrote down every noir plot device on paper, tore that and a few David Lynch scripts up and threw the whole shebang into a hat. Then, after drawing a few things that didn't mix well together from the hat, they said "fuck it" and dumped the hat's contents into the trash. Then they started filming everything that still stuck to the inside of the hat and called it True Detective, Season 2: The Tropening.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 3:00 PM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
It's almost like they wrote down every noir plot device on paper, tore that and a few David Lynch scripts up and threw the whole shebang into a hat. Then, after drawing a few things that didn't mix well together from the hat, they said "fuck it" and dumped the hat's contents into the trash. Then they started filming everything that still stuck to the inside of the hat and called it True Detective, Season 2: The Tropening.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 3:00 PM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
Also, finale prediction: Vince Vaughn and Taylor Kitsch drive off on Paul's motorcycle together all starry-eyed with a duffel bag full of money, some of which Frank will use for life-changing blepharoplasty surgery. Paul is now 100% out of the closet and has a permanent gig as Frank's wife and co-owner of Reno's hottest new casino, with security provided by Frank's former crime cohorts.
Ani pours out some e-cig oil on her now-dead friend Ray's cemetery plot as her green-haired sister and the mayor try to figure out who killed the psychiatrist and stole their getaway funds from the safe behind the psych's creepy wall painting, which was originally a gift from Stanley Kubrick.
Seriously, though, whatever I make up won't be nearly as ridiculous as the actual plot resolution that eventually unfolds.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 3:08 PM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
Ani pours out some e-cig oil on her now-dead friend Ray's cemetery plot as her green-haired sister and the mayor try to figure out who killed the psychiatrist and stole their getaway funds from the safe behind the psych's creepy wall painting, which was originally a gift from Stanley Kubrick.
Seriously, though, whatever I make up won't be nearly as ridiculous as the actual plot resolution that eventually unfolds.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 3:08 PM on July 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
I'm really enjoying this season, and I think it's an interesting, high-quality show (and funny too). Normally I would try not to make a comment this inane, but this show doesn't seem to have many friends on fanfare at the moment.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 4:23 PM on July 6, 2015 [10 favorites]
posted by paper chromatographologist at 4:23 PM on July 6, 2015 [10 favorites]
Is it just me, or was there a lingering shot of someone filming Paul and his erstwhile boyfriend with a camcorder? Kind of looked like the film director maybe?
posted by capricorn at 7:36 PM on July 6, 2015
posted by capricorn at 7:36 PM on July 6, 2015
I'm nearly positive that it was Ray's fat partner.
posted by codacorolla at 7:56 PM on July 6, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by codacorolla at 7:56 PM on July 6, 2015 [6 favorites]
I came to the same conclusion codacorolla did re: the identity of the surreptitious photographer. Haven't gone back for a rewatch to confirm though.
I think I might actually be liking this season better than the first season, in some ways. It's not as deep or as focused, but I am finding a lot more dark humor in this go-round; Ani is just a kick-ass character; and maybe I am just simple but I love the interplay between Ani and Ray. They respect each other, but they can't trust each other. That's enough to keep me going.
posted by trunk muffins at 8:20 PM on July 6, 2015
I think I might actually be liking this season better than the first season, in some ways. It's not as deep or as focused, but I am finding a lot more dark humor in this go-round; Ani is just a kick-ass character; and maybe I am just simple but I love the interplay between Ani and Ray. They respect each other, but they can't trust each other. That's enough to keep me going.
posted by trunk muffins at 8:20 PM on July 6, 2015
joseph conrad is fully awesome: “'half anaconda, half great white' (absurd line delivered with utmost sincerity)”
We had a deal, Kyle: “That one landed for me more as a George Lucas ‘you can write this shit, but you can't say it’ line.”
SpacemanStix: “Yeah, that's hilarious. If you look at Vaughn's expression right after he says this, it could easily be interpreted as, I have no idea what that really means, which makes it even funnier.”
homunculus: “And it was a response to Vaughn's musings on causality. That whole scene was ridiculous.”
It probably had something to do with the giant painting of a snake on Semyon's wall in the background of that scene. I gather the snake (or even specifically the anaconda) is his totem or something.
I rather like the writing, but I don't think most of the actors are pulling it off.
posted by koeselitz at 9:38 PM on July 6, 2015
We had a deal, Kyle: “That one landed for me more as a George Lucas ‘you can write this shit, but you can't say it’ line.”
SpacemanStix: “Yeah, that's hilarious. If you look at Vaughn's expression right after he says this, it could easily be interpreted as, I have no idea what that really means, which makes it even funnier.”
homunculus: “And it was a response to Vaughn's musings on causality. That whole scene was ridiculous.”
It probably had something to do with the giant painting of a snake on Semyon's wall in the background of that scene. I gather the snake (or even specifically the anaconda) is his totem or something.
I rather like the writing, but I don't think most of the actors are pulling it off.
posted by koeselitz at 9:38 PM on July 6, 2015
Also, good lord, what the hell is with people saying the opening scene is reminiscent of (or even a ripoff of, yeesh) Twin Peaks? Have people seen shows that are not Twin Peaks? Do any of these shows have musical acts that are lit creatively? Does Twin Peaks have any country singers wearing Nudie suits? There was absolutely nothing Twin-Peaks-esque about that scene.
I actually like this season a lot. I gather I'm in the minority. People really, really, really want to hate it. I think casting Vince Vaughn was a big mistake, because it killed whatever goodwill it takes to get people to like something – in the same way that casting famously likeable actors that everyone and their dog loves to watch and adores unquestioningly, like Woody and McConaughey, will make people go the distance and open them up to be drawn into a show, even when it takes a fair number of episodes to build momentum.
posted by koeselitz at 9:45 PM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
I actually like this season a lot. I gather I'm in the minority. People really, really, really want to hate it. I think casting Vince Vaughn was a big mistake, because it killed whatever goodwill it takes to get people to like something – in the same way that casting famously likeable actors that everyone and their dog loves to watch and adores unquestioningly, like Woody and McConaughey, will make people go the distance and open them up to be drawn into a show, even when it takes a fair number of episodes to build momentum.
posted by koeselitz at 9:45 PM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
I think casting Vince Vaughn was a big mistake
What I find really interesting about Vaughn, and why I give him a pass, is because although his monologues are a bit forced, I find it believable that a character would really be like this; insecure yet needing to make a point about his toughness, which sometimes leads to over-talking and external processing in clumsy ways. You can say it's bad acting, but I don't think we're supposed to see him as refined, but as a just-making-it-crime-dude who has moments that are transparently awkward at times to the viewer, but perhaps not always to himself. I also think Vaughn's character pulls off some not talking moments really well. There are times when he speaks without saying anything (like occasionally when he was mingling at the party in episode 1), and I find him pretty compelling at those times. So, he comes off better when he's not talking, but I think we're supposed to think he's the kind of character who comes off better when he's not talking.
posted by SpacemanStix at 10:12 PM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
What I find really interesting about Vaughn, and why I give him a pass, is because although his monologues are a bit forced, I find it believable that a character would really be like this; insecure yet needing to make a point about his toughness, which sometimes leads to over-talking and external processing in clumsy ways. You can say it's bad acting, but I don't think we're supposed to see him as refined, but as a just-making-it-crime-dude who has moments that are transparently awkward at times to the viewer, but perhaps not always to himself. I also think Vaughn's character pulls off some not talking moments really well. There are times when he speaks without saying anything (like occasionally when he was mingling at the party in episode 1), and I find him pretty compelling at those times. So, he comes off better when he's not talking, but I think we're supposed to think he's the kind of character who comes off better when he's not talking.
posted by SpacemanStix at 10:12 PM on July 6, 2015 [5 favorites]
ob1quixote: “why would Raven Mask even do that? What's the point of attacking but not killing Ray?”
mullacc: “Well the Raven Mask also took the camera and hard-drive. The Mayor wants Ray on the investigation so he can find something to use against Bezzerides. So Ray needs to be involved but can't actually find real evidence. So these masked dudes, presumably working for the Mayor, keep showing up to steal/destroy evidence but don't go so far as to kill Ray.”
Or – the masked dudes, who work for the corrupt state people investigating Vinci, want the investigation to continue, but only enough to give them dirt on Vinci. Velcoro pointed this out to Bezzerides in a previous episode – they clearly don't actually want to solve the murder, because they sent in this tiny random selection of people instead of an actual task force – what they really want is to nail the city of Vinci. And this episode clarified even more that the state people are approaching the corruption of the Vinci contingent, with the woman saying (specifically saying – "I'm not writing this in a memo") that "I'm not saying you should fuck him, but let him think you'll fuck him" in order to get dirt on him and thereby leverage him against the rest.
posted by koeselitz at 10:19 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
mullacc: “Well the Raven Mask also took the camera and hard-drive. The Mayor wants Ray on the investigation so he can find something to use against Bezzerides. So Ray needs to be involved but can't actually find real evidence. So these masked dudes, presumably working for the Mayor, keep showing up to steal/destroy evidence but don't go so far as to kill Ray.”
Or – the masked dudes, who work for the corrupt state people investigating Vinci, want the investigation to continue, but only enough to give them dirt on Vinci. Velcoro pointed this out to Bezzerides in a previous episode – they clearly don't actually want to solve the murder, because they sent in this tiny random selection of people instead of an actual task force – what they really want is to nail the city of Vinci. And this episode clarified even more that the state people are approaching the corruption of the Vinci contingent, with the woman saying (specifically saying – "I'm not writing this in a memo") that "I'm not saying you should fuck him, but let him think you'll fuck him" in order to get dirt on him and thereby leverage him against the rest.
posted by koeselitz at 10:19 PM on July 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
"The everything all right?" girl who shut the door in the mayor's mansion was Jesse's last girlfriend in Breaking Bad.
In case anyone cares.
posted by SpacemanStix at 11:27 PM on July 6, 2015
In case anyone cares.
posted by SpacemanStix at 11:27 PM on July 6, 2015
So you're saying it was Jesse's girl?
posted by starman at 4:58 AM on July 7, 2015 [13 favorites]
posted by starman at 4:58 AM on July 7, 2015 [13 favorites]
Also, good lord, what the hell is with people saying the opening scene is reminiscent of (or even a ripoff of, yeesh) Twin Peaks? Have people seen shows that are not Twin Peaks? Do any of these shows have musical acts that are lit creatively? Does Twin Peaks have any country singers wearing Nudie suits? There was absolutely nothing Twin-Peaks-esque about that scene.
It was hard to think about anything but Twin Peaks in particular and David Lynch in general while watching that scene and it's not just people here, multiple people at work brought it up independently.
posted by octothorpe at 5:03 AM on July 7, 2015 [7 favorites]
It was hard to think about anything but Twin Peaks in particular and David Lynch in general while watching that scene and it's not just people here, multiple people at work brought it up independently.
posted by octothorpe at 5:03 AM on July 7, 2015 [7 favorites]
It wasn't just Lynchian -- it was deliberately Lynchian, in neon letters and all caps. But why Pizzalato would try to reference Lynch in the middle of this show is beyond me. It doesn't help the series to try to evoke the touch of a better filmmaker. Maybe it was the idea of the new director for Episode 3? Which leads me to a theory -- the reason why Season 1 was so good was because of Cary Fukunaga.
People really, really, really want to hate it.
I don't watch a lot of TV. This is the only series I'm watching right now; I was really looking forward it. I really, really, really want to like it, and defended the first two episodes to friends who don't like it. But I'm not going to defend it after Ep3. But I'll keep watching it and hope for the best, but my hopes, they are no longer up.
I'm disappointed because a "Chinatown through the lens of Lynch" would make a HELL of a series if done right. But in the humblest of opinions, this is not that.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:19 AM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
People really, really, really want to hate it.
I don't watch a lot of TV. This is the only series I'm watching right now; I was really looking forward it. I really, really, really want to like it, and defended the first two episodes to friends who don't like it. But I'm not going to defend it after Ep3. But I'll keep watching it and hope for the best, but my hopes, they are no longer up.
I'm disappointed because a "Chinatown through the lens of Lynch" would make a HELL of a series if done right. But in the humblest of opinions, this is not that.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:19 AM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't hate the show, I wouldn't bother to keep watching if I did.
posted by octothorpe at 6:12 AM on July 7, 2015
posted by octothorpe at 6:12 AM on July 7, 2015
So you're saying it was Jesse's girl?
And Rick Springfield played the psychiatrist in the previous episode. It's all starting to make sense now.
posted by SpacemanStix at 6:28 AM on July 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
And Rick Springfield played the psychiatrist in the previous episode. It's all starting to make sense now.
posted by SpacemanStix at 6:28 AM on July 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
So many things about that opening scene were evocative of Twin Peaks - Julee Cruise under the spotlight singing inexplicably wistful love songs on the roadhouse stage; Dale Cooper having dream-world visitations from otherwordly, unidentified characters; Major Briggs relating the details of a dream about the future to his son Bobby; Ray was even shot in the chest at point-blank range, just as Cooper was. It was unquestionably an homage.
It's fair to ask why. So far, season 2 has largely lacked the supernatural overtones of season 1. Our mysterious killer/shadow figure(s) are concealed behind creepy masks and it seems like Caspere was into some Eyes Wide Shut-style shit, but that's been the extent of the spookiness. Evoking the shadow-world of Twin Peaks injects some of that supernatural element into the show. In Peaks (during the first season anyway) there was always a sense that the residents of the town were not 100% acting of their own volition. The soap opera/community theater feel of the show underscored that point, brilliantly. Pizzolato and Lin are maybe a bit out of their depth, but I don't think they're just throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks.
posted by trunk muffins at 8:30 AM on July 7, 2015 [4 favorites]
It's fair to ask why. So far, season 2 has largely lacked the supernatural overtones of season 1. Our mysterious killer/shadow figure(s) are concealed behind creepy masks and it seems like Caspere was into some Eyes Wide Shut-style shit, but that's been the extent of the spookiness. Evoking the shadow-world of Twin Peaks injects some of that supernatural element into the show. In Peaks (during the first season anyway) there was always a sense that the residents of the town were not 100% acting of their own volition. The soap opera/community theater feel of the show underscored that point, brilliantly. Pizzolato and Lin are maybe a bit out of their depth, but I don't think they're just throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks.
posted by trunk muffins at 8:30 AM on July 7, 2015 [4 favorites]
I'm sort of familiar with noir as a genre, and here are a few boilerplate ways that I think this could go:
I agree with your options. On top of that, whatever the direction, we've already met everyone we need to meet. From this point forward, there will be no characters introduced that are significant to the resolution of the plot.
Keep in mind that in Season 1, we were shown the illustration of the "green-eared" killer in episode 1.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:02 AM on July 7, 2015
I agree with your options. On top of that, whatever the direction, we've already met everyone we need to meet. From this point forward, there will be no characters introduced that are significant to the resolution of the plot.
Keep in mind that in Season 1, we were shown the illustration of the "green-eared" killer in episode 1.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:02 AM on July 7, 2015
People really, really, really want to hate it
*sets "Days Since Someone Went Full Homer In FanFare" counter back to zero*
posted by ominous_paws at 9:11 AM on July 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
*sets "Days Since Someone Went Full Homer In FanFare" counter back to zero*
posted by ominous_paws at 9:11 AM on July 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
I also want to like this show. I loved the first season. I love noir detective novels. I watch more than my fair share of police procedurals. I just thing this season is not (yet?) super great.
That said, I enjoy it a lot more because I have you all to explain the nuances to me and catch the little things that I miss.
posted by radioamy at 9:22 AM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
That said, I enjoy it a lot more because I have you all to explain the nuances to me and catch the little things that I miss.
posted by radioamy at 9:22 AM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
I love being wrong and want badly to like this season, so I will definitely keep watching. Hated many shows at the outset that became favorites later, like Community, so I look forward to changing my mind about this season.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 10:21 AM on July 7, 2015
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 10:21 AM on July 7, 2015
I like it! It's not a masterpiece so far, but I'm intrigued and I am genuinely interested in the characters. We'll see how it goes.
Paul's ex-lover said he got occasional work as an electrician, right? Just after Frank finagled his way into some protection money from the construction dude who has a beef with electricians, right? Hmm.
Drunk mayor ftw, by the way. The actor is really good at playing conniving wasted asshole.
posted by lydhre at 10:35 AM on July 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
Paul's ex-lover said he got occasional work as an electrician, right? Just after Frank finagled his way into some protection money from the construction dude who has a beef with electricians, right? Hmm.
Drunk mayor ftw, by the way. The actor is really good at playing conniving wasted asshole.
posted by lydhre at 10:35 AM on July 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
I'm enjoying it, in spite of/because of having to work to enjoy it. The flat tones and lengthy dialogues (broken by the drunk Mayor's posturing) mean it can be hard to keep focus, especially on a show where there might be the tiniest clue or giveaway to what's really going on underneath it all.
Mostly I am loving the cuts to long shots of perfectly symmetrical freeway interchanges. They are beautiful in that context. I'm still paying way too much attention to how many scenes take place in or around cars.
I think we're far enough into the show that we have been introduced to most of the key players, but bearing in mind the main villain/scapegoat in season one didn't appear until the second half. I've started eyeing every character as the Potential Raven Person.
Could be more than one though, right? The one who drove/murdered Caspere may not be the one who shot Velcoro, and may not be the one who Ani and Velcoro chased.
posted by tracicle at 10:59 AM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
Mostly I am loving the cuts to long shots of perfectly symmetrical freeway interchanges. They are beautiful in that context. I'm still paying way too much attention to how many scenes take place in or around cars.
I think we're far enough into the show that we have been introduced to most of the key players, but bearing in mind the main villain/scapegoat in season one didn't appear until the second half. I've started eyeing every character as the Potential Raven Person.
Could be more than one though, right? The one who drove/murdered Caspere may not be the one who shot Velcoro, and may not be the one who Ani and Velcoro chased.
posted by tracicle at 10:59 AM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'm definitely enjoying the atmosphere, the cinematography, and even most of the acting (VV's sad bits are pretty weak but his angry bits are good). This may well require taking the entire show as a whole to fully understand, which should be done for most creative works anyway). Season 1 was, to me, brilliant and engaging in a way that this one isn't yet, to me at least and I'm aware that many found season 1's ending less then satisfactory (whereas I quite liked it) so perhaps season 2 reverses that and it will get better, who knows. I was so pissed off at HBO for gutting Boardwalk Empire that I'm not sure I trust them to consistently make great shows anymore. GoT was wildly inconsistent last season, though that said, so to was the source material.
I avoided season 1 until it was over such was my unjustified contempt for Matthew and Woody but they were superb. It remains to be seen if Vince can excel, though as mentioned, his range seems limited. I fear that for season 3 they'll cast Adam Sandler to fuck with us.
posted by juiceCake at 12:21 PM on July 7, 2015
I avoided season 1 until it was over such was my unjustified contempt for Matthew and Woody but they were superb. It remains to be seen if Vince can excel, though as mentioned, his range seems limited. I fear that for season 3 they'll cast Adam Sandler to fuck with us.
posted by juiceCake at 12:21 PM on July 7, 2015
Ooooh lydhere, good catch. Gonna keep an eye out for that.
posted by radioamy at 12:47 PM on July 7, 2015
posted by radioamy at 12:47 PM on July 7, 2015
I dunno, that whole scene with Ray and his dad, especially when he had to hold the whiskey glass to his lips because his shakes were so bad, was a pretty effective Shown, Not Told. That was a pretty great scene all around.
What I loved about that scene is that it seemed (to me at least) that Ray was using his dad's recommendations of 'good cops' as a checklist of 'terrible cops to avoid', and really played on the dynamic of 'Father-Son Cop Dynasty' by realizing the legacy is something to be corrected for, not lived up to.
posted by FatherDagon at 1:40 PM on July 7, 2015 [6 favorites]
What I loved about that scene is that it seemed (to me at least) that Ray was using his dad's recommendations of 'good cops' as a checklist of 'terrible cops to avoid', and really played on the dynamic of 'Father-Son Cop Dynasty' by realizing the legacy is something to be corrected for, not lived up to.
posted by FatherDagon at 1:40 PM on July 7, 2015 [6 favorites]
I have a (possibly dumb) question about Bezzerides. In writing I keep seeing her referred to as Ani. I remember one of the many characters noting that her legal name is Antigone. When do we find out that she goes by Ani? And is it pronounced like "Annie" or the way Ani Difranco says her name?
I'm so confused.
posted by radioamy at 3:19 PM on July 7, 2015
I'm so confused.
posted by radioamy at 3:19 PM on July 7, 2015
When do we find out that she goes by Ani? And is it pronounced like "Annie"
IIRC, she's introduced first as Annie, it's pronounced that way, and only later do we learn from her hippy father that it's Antigone (and contrasted with her sister, Athena).
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 3:33 PM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
IIRC, she's introduced first as Annie, it's pronounced that way, and only later do we learn from her hippy father that it's Antigone (and contrasted with her sister, Athena).
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 3:33 PM on July 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
I can see why so many people continue to be disappointed, but it's too bad because I kinda want FanFare to be along for this ride, it's clearly leading somewhere good. The season is shaping up into something really interesting, possibly more interesting that Season 1 was. While that previous season was tightly focused, this is aiming for something entirely different. There's such a sprawling density to the narrative here, with the possibilities and connections expanding outwards with each episode. Those everpresent aerial freeway shots are a visual reminder of how to approach this season. There are hints at things from Episode 1 which haven't been expanded upon yet, and minor details in many scenes which could become quite significant. I'm ending up watching each episode twice and finding it rewarding. The first season's "whodunit" aspects weren't deeply appealing to me, but here there's a delicious second-guessing of every character. This is a show designed to be watched and rewatched. Some of the writing is overwrought, sure, but it openly wears its noir influences on its sleeve; the genre lays it on thick, it's part of the territory.
Conway Twitty's "The Rose" is a beautiful piece of music and that scene just nails it. I'm okay with more moments like it. The entire damn show owes Lynch a debt, it was obvious from the start. There's nothing wrong with homage, and it was winking at the viewer for another reason: we've seen the "Agent Cooper is dead! Oops, he's alive" cliffhanger so we shouldn't be surprised that Ray is alive, either.
Speaking of that - I initially felt it was cheap, but the possibilities for the narrative that it raises are interesting enough for me that it's worth it. Now the killer is 1) either law enforcement or has access/ties to law enforcement in some way, from the appearance of it, which both narrows the possible suspects and changes how we view things, and 2) it's someone who, for whatever reason, had no intention of killing Ray. This plays off the twisting allegiances and motives of the characters in interesting ways too.
posted by naju at 3:54 PM on July 7, 2015 [5 favorites]
Conway Twitty's "The Rose" is a beautiful piece of music and that scene just nails it. I'm okay with more moments like it. The entire damn show owes Lynch a debt, it was obvious from the start. There's nothing wrong with homage, and it was winking at the viewer for another reason: we've seen the "Agent Cooper is dead! Oops, he's alive" cliffhanger so we shouldn't be surprised that Ray is alive, either.
Speaking of that - I initially felt it was cheap, but the possibilities for the narrative that it raises are interesting enough for me that it's worth it. Now the killer is 1) either law enforcement or has access/ties to law enforcement in some way, from the appearance of it, which both narrows the possible suspects and changes how we view things, and 2) it's someone who, for whatever reason, had no intention of killing Ray. This plays off the twisting allegiances and motives of the characters in interesting ways too.
posted by naju at 3:54 PM on July 7, 2015 [5 favorites]
Also, shout out to the subtle viewer-acknowledging humor in this show, too - like the guy who says that no one would buy Paul's "angst-ridden cop persona you're rolling". I got a laugh from that.
posted by naju at 3:58 PM on July 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by naju at 3:58 PM on July 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
I also thought it was pretty funny when Ray said that he "ain't ever exactly been Columbo," and they were like why in the world are we using this guy.
posted by SpacemanStix at 4:11 PM on July 7, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by SpacemanStix at 4:11 PM on July 7, 2015 [5 favorites]
I find the setting/atmospheric change from Season 1 possibly the most interesting thing about Season 2.
The Louisiana bayou was rural, post-industrial, and static. There was a deep sense of generational locality. The Scarred Man's family "has always lived in these parts", the roots of the Tuttle family and their peculiar and disturbing cult go back, it is implied, to slavery days, and pretty much everyone that Rust and Marty meet in the course of their investigations came from these parts, will never leave these parts, and live in an unchanging landscape defined by endemic rural poverty, illegal activity, and familial ties. The only enlivening elements are drugs and "old time" religion (of both the orthodox and horrifyingly unorthodox varieties). Rust's over the top references to this reality - "memory of a town", "the jungle" coming back to claim it - meshes nicely with the constant presence of a landscape of rotting physical infrastructure and renaescent, tubercular vegetation.
Vinci is the opposite in every way. The pretentious name of the town itself implies creativity, innovation, forward-thinking. It is a place where no one has roots - none of the main characters are from there, and Velcoro, who is the closest to a "native" you get, moved to Vinci PD from LA in pursuit of higher pay and better hours. It is a boom town of crude waste industry and immigrant labor, everything and everyone in motion. Insofar as a recognition of any value beyond hard cash exists, it is relentlessly New Age and post-Christian, psychotherapy and glitzed pseudo-hippie communes. The landscape, usually pictured from above, is one of vast, arterial highways, a population in continuous motion, hustling, moving, grasping. A sick energy to contrast with the sick enervation of the first season.
posted by AdamCSnider at 6:00 PM on July 7, 2015 [15 favorites]
The Louisiana bayou was rural, post-industrial, and static. There was a deep sense of generational locality. The Scarred Man's family "has always lived in these parts", the roots of the Tuttle family and their peculiar and disturbing cult go back, it is implied, to slavery days, and pretty much everyone that Rust and Marty meet in the course of their investigations came from these parts, will never leave these parts, and live in an unchanging landscape defined by endemic rural poverty, illegal activity, and familial ties. The only enlivening elements are drugs and "old time" religion (of both the orthodox and horrifyingly unorthodox varieties). Rust's over the top references to this reality - "memory of a town", "the jungle" coming back to claim it - meshes nicely with the constant presence of a landscape of rotting physical infrastructure and renaescent, tubercular vegetation.
Vinci is the opposite in every way. The pretentious name of the town itself implies creativity, innovation, forward-thinking. It is a place where no one has roots - none of the main characters are from there, and Velcoro, who is the closest to a "native" you get, moved to Vinci PD from LA in pursuit of higher pay and better hours. It is a boom town of crude waste industry and immigrant labor, everything and everyone in motion. Insofar as a recognition of any value beyond hard cash exists, it is relentlessly New Age and post-Christian, psychotherapy and glitzed pseudo-hippie communes. The landscape, usually pictured from above, is one of vast, arterial highways, a population in continuous motion, hustling, moving, grasping. A sick energy to contrast with the sick enervation of the first season.
posted by AdamCSnider at 6:00 PM on July 7, 2015 [15 favorites]
In case you didn't know, Vinci is based on the real-world corruption in Vernon, California.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 6:41 PM on July 7, 2015
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 6:41 PM on July 7, 2015
I was utterly convinced that Ray was dead, and goshdarnit, if he wasn't, that kind of cheap ploy was going to be enough to make me drop the show. But I am willing to forgive them by doing it the way they did, completely over the top in that Lynchian way.
At this point, I'm willing to stick in for the ride just to see where they take this thing.
Also, count me in on Team Vince Vaughn Deserves a Chance.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 8:35 PM on July 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
At this point, I'm willing to stick in for the ride just to see where they take this thing.
Also, count me in on Team Vince Vaughn Deserves a Chance.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 8:35 PM on July 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
I was utterly convinced that Ray was dead, and goshdarnit, if he wasn't, that kind of cheap ploy was going to be enough to make me drop the show. But I am willing to forgive them by doing it the way they did, completely over the top in that Lynchian way.
I just watched all of the previews (I think 3?) for season 2 that HBO put out a couple of months ago, and I noticed that each had a scene with Ray that we haven't seen yet, or took place after the shooting. Some people avoid the previews because of spoilers, and plots can change between preview and broadcast, but there seemed to have been some clues floating around. I found it way more interesting to speculate not having known that, however.
posted by SpacemanStix at 8:48 PM on July 7, 2015
I just watched all of the previews (I think 3?) for season 2 that HBO put out a couple of months ago, and I noticed that each had a scene with Ray that we haven't seen yet, or took place after the shooting. Some people avoid the previews because of spoilers, and plots can change between preview and broadcast, but there seemed to have been some clues floating around. I found it way more interesting to speculate not having known that, however.
posted by SpacemanStix at 8:48 PM on July 7, 2015
I just watched all of the previews (I think 3?) for season 2 that HBO put out a couple of months ago, and I noticed that each had a scene with Ray that we haven't seen yet, or took place after the shooting.
Last week I saw a lot of people suggesting that those were intentional misdirections to make the surprise of killing him off greater.
Kind of glad he's still alive, and that it was managed in such a crazy, farcical way. Because of the way it intersects with and subverts his fucked-up, superviolent sense of masculinity. Being brutally shotgunned by a masked villain (after that ludicrous turn-and-draw no less) has potentially a heavy "bad-ass goes down fighting" quality, creating the Great Male Martyr for the rest of the cast to avenge. Instead, it's just some fucker in a bird hat dicking with a drunk, incompetent if oddly compelling asshole, for reasons as yet unknown.
One thing a friend did point out to me is how the franchise's title is sort of hanging a question mark over this season. Marty and Rust were both, in their respective ways, "true detectives" - men who took the case and the victim seriously, despite their tremendous divergence in other ways on both the personal and professional level. From the first scene of the crime up through their reunion in the penultimate episode, they both understand without every really having to explain it that there's a sort of commitment to see it through that they can't walk away from.
By contrast, no one, not a single one of the detectives involved, and aside from Vince Vaughn none of the civilians, gives a flying fuck about Caspere's death. They care about using his death, certainly, to pursue their assigned goals (protect Vinci's corrupt bosses, shine a light on Vinci's corrupt bosses, get a rung up on the career ladder, recover from a scandal). Even Vaughn's mainly concerned because Caspere's death sucked his big plans out from under him. There are no "true detectives" here in that sense, who give the case its due from a sense of professional pride or personal obsession, as with Marty and Rust. Or, at least, none have yet emerged.
posted by AdamCSnider at 9:11 PM on July 7, 2015 [6 favorites]
Last week I saw a lot of people suggesting that those were intentional misdirections to make the surprise of killing him off greater.
Kind of glad he's still alive, and that it was managed in such a crazy, farcical way. Because of the way it intersects with and subverts his fucked-up, superviolent sense of masculinity. Being brutally shotgunned by a masked villain (after that ludicrous turn-and-draw no less) has potentially a heavy "bad-ass goes down fighting" quality, creating the Great Male Martyr for the rest of the cast to avenge. Instead, it's just some fucker in a bird hat dicking with a drunk, incompetent if oddly compelling asshole, for reasons as yet unknown.
One thing a friend did point out to me is how the franchise's title is sort of hanging a question mark over this season. Marty and Rust were both, in their respective ways, "true detectives" - men who took the case and the victim seriously, despite their tremendous divergence in other ways on both the personal and professional level. From the first scene of the crime up through their reunion in the penultimate episode, they both understand without every really having to explain it that there's a sort of commitment to see it through that they can't walk away from.
By contrast, no one, not a single one of the detectives involved, and aside from Vince Vaughn none of the civilians, gives a flying fuck about Caspere's death. They care about using his death, certainly, to pursue their assigned goals (protect Vinci's corrupt bosses, shine a light on Vinci's corrupt bosses, get a rung up on the career ladder, recover from a scandal). Even Vaughn's mainly concerned because Caspere's death sucked his big plans out from under him. There are no "true detectives" here in that sense, who give the case its due from a sense of professional pride or personal obsession, as with Marty and Rust. Or, at least, none have yet emerged.
posted by AdamCSnider at 9:11 PM on July 7, 2015 [6 favorites]
I've wondered whether the show is going to be in part the redemption of any of the characters. Each of the main three come from pretty broken and messed up situations, seeping into everything else going on. Maybe at least one of them has a moment like Rust at the end of season 1. Finding your way back from a life of pain or compromise through some pretty twisted stuff could be compelling, and apt for the title. Maybe we already see hints of it in Ray after the shooting.
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:45 PM on July 7, 2015
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:45 PM on July 7, 2015
A couple of weeks ago I noted the James Ellroy vibe but some redditors have gone further and listed all the similarities between this season and Ellroy's The Big Nowhere. In particular, one scene in episode 1 echoes this line from the novel: The killer drove his victim to the building site like a chauffeur, the stiff propped up in his white terry robe, eyeless head lolling against the sideboard, oozing the salve or ointment. See also The little nowhere: Ellroy’s mark on season two.
posted by elgilito at 2:59 AM on July 8, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by elgilito at 2:59 AM on July 8, 2015 [2 favorites]
Season Two of 'True Detective' Must Be Taken on Its Own Terms from Vice.
posted by dogwalker at 11:42 AM on July 8, 2015
posted by dogwalker at 11:42 AM on July 8, 2015
lydhre: Paul's ex-lover said he got occasional work as an electrician, right? Just after Frank finagled his way into some protection money from the construction dude who has a beef with electricians, right? Hmm.
Another possibility: film sets use lots of electricians too. Film sets that might've been promised non-existent or skimmed tax credits.
posted by bluecore at 7:53 PM on July 8, 2015
Another possibility: film sets use lots of electricians too. Film sets that might've been promised non-existent or skimmed tax credits.
posted by bluecore at 7:53 PM on July 8, 2015
Also the film set seemed to have a lot of weapons that could've been reloaded with riot rounds. And post-apocalyptic gang masks that could've been worn while torching a car.
posted by bluecore at 8:08 PM on July 8, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by bluecore at 8:08 PM on July 8, 2015 [2 favorites]
Taylor Kitsch on inhabiting the mind of “True Detective’s” most tortured cop: “It sort of f*cked me up"
A Redemption, A Murder, A Rescue And A Descent Bank Into The Underworld, Sonia Saraiya
I liked this one. We're sliding deeper into the twisted morass of LA County politics.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:00 PM on July 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
A Redemption, A Murder, A Rescue And A Descent Bank Into The Underworld, Sonia Saraiya
I liked this one. We're sliding deeper into the twisted morass of LA County politics.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:00 PM on July 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
The son puts on specialty events. Mayor Chessani met his wife at a party. The director mentions being extremely drunk at a party. The set photographer is scouting for women. Private parties for rich men.
#ClassicsWatch
I didn't mention it last episode, but Frank walking through the mirrored hallway to get into the club had a distinct blue tint - Frank crosses the River.
Kirk Douglas needs no explanation.
Stan is dead, eyes gone (again with the Byzantine punishments!),a cthonic sacrifice, literally in a bothros.
"Lux Infinitum," trade and the circuit club. I'll point you to blasdelb on porneia.
Frank talks to the pimps in the underground of the club. They box, a classically Greek sport, and Frank moves well.
He goes to the underworld to get some gold.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:16 PM on July 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
#ClassicsWatch
I didn't mention it last episode, but Frank walking through the mirrored hallway to get into the club had a distinct blue tint - Frank crosses the River.
Kirk Douglas needs no explanation.
Stan is dead, eyes gone (again with the Byzantine punishments!),a cthonic sacrifice, literally in a bothros.
"Lux Infinitum," trade and the circuit club. I'll point you to blasdelb on porneia.
Frank talks to the pimps in the underground of the club. They box, a classically Greek sport, and Frank moves well.
He goes to the underworld to get some gold.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:16 PM on July 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
I can't get past the body language McAdams uses in the scene where she's looking at some documents in the mayor's home office and there is a crash. Total break from character there, as she is supposed to be this hard boiled cop but when startled her hands come up like she's going to do some jazz dancing.
posted by Poldo at 9:56 PM on July 14, 2015
posted by Poldo at 9:56 PM on July 14, 2015
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posted by radioamy at 7:59 PM on July 5, 2015 [3 favorites]