Arrow: Second Chances
February 2, 2017 4:29 AM - Season 5, Episode 11 - Subscribe

Talia al Ghul agrees to help Oliver take down Kovar, but her offer comes with a steep price. Meanwhile, Felicity attempts to hack the NSA to help free Diggle; and Curtis tells the team about a female vigilante, Tina Boland, he uncovered online who has been wreaking havoc all over the country.
posted by oh yeah! (7 comments total)
I didn't get why the name Dinah was significant to Ollie -- like, I see from the recaps that it's the name of the comics canon Black Canary, but what am I not remembering from in-show that would explain Oliver's reaction?
posted by oh yeah! at 5:18 AM on February 2, 2017

Dinah was Laurel's first name, but she didn't go by it. I think the show mentioned this once when Laurel said her full name to someone as part of a threat.
posted by Servo5678 at 5:57 AM on February 2, 2017 [1 favorite]

I feel like this show is starting to rely on too much knowledge of the extended Arrowverse and the DC Comics. I'm an Arrow-only guy and I'm totally lost without looking stuff up. Like Dinah. Or Talia Al Ghul. I'm like "wait haven't we already met Ra's al Ghul's daughter? This doesn't look like her." Then I read up and I guess this is some other daughter. It's a little baffling to keep up with.

Enjoyed the episode though. Particularly the introduction of yet another Canary; the actress seems pretty solid. I still regret that metahumans are even a thing in this show, but again I'm back to complaining about the larger Arrowverse.
posted by Nelson at 9:51 AM on February 2, 2017 [1 favorite]

You don't have to know yet that Talia is an Al Ghul. They're hinting at it but they will show a reveal later that will provoke some huge reaction from the team. Talia Al Ghul is actually the more popular daughter in DC-verse. She had a son (I think) with Bruce Wayne.

We did know that Dinah is Laurel's first name, but it wasn't said very often.
posted by numaner at 1:47 PM on February 2, 2017

I have nothing against the actress they've hired to play Talia (it's the first time I've ever seen her in anything) and she's not doing a terrible job, but she's so not in keeping with my vision of Talia. I mean I can buy her as a tough, assassin-type, but her physicality is so different from Talia, who I always saw as slinkier and slier in everything from her speech to her movements to her facial expressions. Talia would never be so direct. (I'm ignoring the fact that they've seated Oliver into the League's world, which I've been griping about since practically day one on this show. But when it comes to Talia, especially, she should not be in Oliver Queen's orbit--unless Oliver has lost a bet with Bruce and has to babysit Damian. Actually I'd be perfectly fine with an episode where Oliver was left alone to babysit a tiny little demon ninja assassin. I think it would be good for Oliver's character growth!)

I just hope they don't drag out the Talia-preps-The Hood flashbacks. Oliver with the Bratva was fun. I don't expect mentoring part three (or four or whatever we're up to by now) will be.

I'm also undecided about what to think about the new Canary. I never liked the Laurel version. I mean I could see how Laurel worked as a character on this show, but she never felt like a real Canary who has traditionally been one of the best combatants in the DC universe and who also happens to have a pretty powerful meta ability. So part of me is all for her, but part of me feels like they're just trying to reinvent the wheel, and not going about it all that well. I know Oliver promised Laurel that he'd preserve her legacy, but I think there's got to be a better way to do it than hand-me-down identities. Plus, I'm not sure about new Dinah carrying all that emotional/psychological baggage the writers seem to be loading her up with, especially since that's part of what made Laurel such a difficult character. Oh, and I really hate Oliver's paternalistic attitude toward Dinah. That had better change and change fast. We've already got one misogynist on the team (Rene) and that's more than enough for me.

I openly cringed when I heard both "Helix" and "Pandora" out of the hacker girl's mouth. (I'll admit, I blanked for a bit trying to place the Helix reference. I was thinking it was Titans related and then I realized it was Infinity and then I felt better because I don't think there is any way the writers are going to go there and dig out that dried well for characters, and that's saying something considering they added Wild Dog to the team. As for Pandora, I would have thought after that new-52 fiasco, DC would have avoided any reference to that term like a plague.) Still, we all know this new alliance is going to cause all sorts of trouble for Team Arrow, right?

Okay, stepping away from the funny books and back to the show itself, it feels like it's in a bit of a holding pattern. I was going to say they don't even have a big bad anymore, but then I remembered Prometheus. Somehow I just don't care about him or have an interest in him. Maybe it's because he's all costume and bad CGI with no actual personality, or maybe because the story arc has been drawn out for too long a time, but I'd actually be fine if they just let his plot drop.

It seems like they've finally got a better sense of Curtis' character, but I have to wonder how they're going to balance his role with Felicity's. I guess he'll be in the field tech support and she will be Overwatch home-base co-ordinator. It just seems that as the team expands there is less time for character development that isn't about Oliver.

I hope they manage to do something to give this show a shot in the arm. It needs a boost of some kind. Whether that's going to come from Dinah, I have no idea (although I do hold out hope for the prospect of her beating Rene into a messy pulp the second he disrespects her or Felicity.)
posted by sardonyx at 2:49 PM on February 2, 2017

On the one hand, looking for another Black Canary down to the same name is an icky concept. But darned if this episode didn't make it work and I liked it!
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:22 PM on February 2, 2017

It seems like they've finally got a better sense of Curtis' character, but I have to wonder how they're going to balance his role with Felicity's. I guess he'll be in the field tech support and she will be Overwatch home-base co-ordinator.

It would be nice if they used this as a stepping-stone to him using more of his inventions and technology; they took the time to show the floating orbs long before he suited up. I assume they're not in play because it would be expensive, but if they used this as a way for him to say oh hey, maybe I'm better leveraging my skills here instead of being 100% kickpuncher that would work nicely. Doubt it though, since we haven't seen the Ragman suit in use in a while now.
posted by phearlez at 1:02 PM on February 7, 2017

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