Supernatural: Out of the Darkness, Into the Fire
October 8, 2015 11:58 PM - Season 11, Episode 1 - Subscribe
Sam and Dean face the consequences of unleashing the Darkness. Castiel prays for help to deal with the spell Rowena cast on him and remembers his battle with Crowley.
I was so bored by the retread of Sam "oh noes Dean, don't!" and Dean "Oh noes Sam, don't" that I fast forwarded through chunks of the show and finished it all in 15 minutes flat. They're locked in by not being able to kill or do anything permanently altering to the central characters, and it just becomes an endless retread.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 12:08 AM on October 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 12:08 AM on October 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
I was wondering, just for a moment, if Sheppard was leaving the series (or at least being written out for a while) and the suburban lady was going to be the new Crowley for a while. That would have been interesting, but I would have missed Sheppard.
The post-orgy scene would seem to confirm that Crowley is indeed bisexual. He's always been flirty and sassy with the Winchesters, but I was surprised and a little troubled by the way the show dealt with his sexuality here. Crowley is evil again... so the first thing he does is bang some dudes? And the two dudes and the lady wanted to do some spouse-swapping, so of course they deserve to get killed? It all seems kind of sex shame-y and makes me think of those 80s slasher movies where teenagers were always making out before they were killed, like they were getting punished with death for feeling each other up.
(All that being said, I must admit FemCrowley was kind of sexy.)
I thought the whole thing where Sam was saying they had to do things differently this time was an acknowledgement that the show has hit the same tropes too many times... but I wasn't getting what Sam was saying they should do differently. They need to change... but how? Presumably that's something the show will explore this season. (So have a little patience, dorothyisunderwood!)
I liked the episode. It amazes me the show can still be this good after so long. It should be so, so tired and bad after all this time, but I'm eager to see what happens next.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 1:26 AM on October 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
The post-orgy scene would seem to confirm that Crowley is indeed bisexual. He's always been flirty and sassy with the Winchesters, but I was surprised and a little troubled by the way the show dealt with his sexuality here. Crowley is evil again... so the first thing he does is bang some dudes? And the two dudes and the lady wanted to do some spouse-swapping, so of course they deserve to get killed? It all seems kind of sex shame-y and makes me think of those 80s slasher movies where teenagers were always making out before they were killed, like they were getting punished with death for feeling each other up.
(All that being said, I must admit FemCrowley was kind of sexy.)
I thought the whole thing where Sam was saying they had to do things differently this time was an acknowledgement that the show has hit the same tropes too many times... but I wasn't getting what Sam was saying they should do differently. They need to change... but how? Presumably that's something the show will explore this season. (So have a little patience, dorothyisunderwood!)
I liked the episode. It amazes me the show can still be this good after so long. It should be so, so tired and bad after all this time, but I'm eager to see what happens next.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 1:26 AM on October 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
I don't think demons really have a sexual preference, it seems like they take on the desires of the host body, if there's a preference, it feels more like they prefer a certain gender of vessel, similar to the angels. And I didn't read it as sex shame-y at all. Demons kills innocents all the time. They do it for shits and giggles. Crowley just wanted some fun before getting back into business.
I think I get what Sam wanted to say, that the last few seasons have been them more hunting things than saving people, unless it was specific people, i.e. themselves, Cass, people they know, etc. Especially with Mark-of-Cain Dean, who just wants to bulldoze everything.
It's going to be interesting seeing how they bring themselves back to somewhat of a center line.
posted by numaner at 8:42 AM on October 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think I get what Sam wanted to say, that the last few seasons have been them more hunting things than saving people, unless it was specific people, i.e. themselves, Cass, people they know, etc. Especially with Mark-of-Cain Dean, who just wants to bulldoze everything.
It's going to be interesting seeing how they bring themselves back to somewhat of a center line.
posted by numaner at 8:42 AM on October 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
dorothyisunderwood, how would you change the core characters to keep it interesting? The fans really care about the trio (and Crowley), so what could be done to satiate them?
Personally, I'm all for a Doctor Who style change where we get new faces, same personality (I know that's not true for the Doctor), just so we can get some diversity up in there.
posted by numaner at 8:48 AM on October 9, 2015
Personally, I'm all for a Doctor Who style change where we get new faces, same personality (I know that's not true for the Doctor), just so we can get some diversity up in there.
posted by numaner at 8:48 AM on October 9, 2015
I'd have let Dean or Sam go dark for a full season and more. They let Dean be a demon for what, 3-5 episodes? Sam had half a season without his soul and most of that was off screen. They kept them separate while they went dark and so there were no repercussions. I'd like to see one of them possessed or soulless or just otherwise broken, and unable to kill the other for some technical reason but forced to work together a whole season.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 10:05 AM on October 9, 2015
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 10:05 AM on October 9, 2015
I took Sam's argument with Dean as the writers making a promise to try and push the Winchesters back to the brothers they were in the first few seasons. The last six or seasons have heavily relied upon the formula of Sam/Dean lies to Dean/Sam and the lie creates a rift and drama. I enjoyed the partial return to monster of the week last season because when they did so, they were putting that formula into the background and the was slipping back into the excellent partnership of brainy Sam and tough Dean, so to speak.
It's my hope, anyhoots, that the Darkness inhabits a place in season 11 more like the one that the Yellow Eyed Demon held in their first major story arc. Is there another Colt .45 out there, symbolically speaking that they will have to hunt down to find? That was kind of drawn upon with the Blade of Cain, though.
For this specific episode, it's implied that Dean remembers his conversation with the Darkness, and is feigning knowing nothing to Sam. (Holding back a relevant piece of info is formula number two, FYI). I hope that comes to a quick conclusion or I'm just misreading the situation.
I guess since we've had angels, demons, witches, and so on, this season will be dedicated to some kind of zombie plague. (North America - your one stop for all apocalyptic happenings!).
I did like the reference to "The Cage," as we haven't forgotten the other Winchester brother, possessed by Michael, and in eternal conflict with Satan. As for Crawley, I was ready to accept the character in a different body (albeit I would have missed the actor), but I definitely saw it as him deciding to enjoy himself and by extension, kill the swinging couples, or at least kill them because he needed their blood and simply didn't care a twig about their lives. I didn't think there was any intention of shame concerned to their activities. (If anything, the over the top prelude to the orgy playing on the swinging middle age suburban couples was kind of ridiculing the idea).
posted by Atreides at 11:37 AM on October 9, 2015
It's my hope, anyhoots, that the Darkness inhabits a place in season 11 more like the one that the Yellow Eyed Demon held in their first major story arc. Is there another Colt .45 out there, symbolically speaking that they will have to hunt down to find? That was kind of drawn upon with the Blade of Cain, though.
For this specific episode, it's implied that Dean remembers his conversation with the Darkness, and is feigning knowing nothing to Sam. (Holding back a relevant piece of info is formula number two, FYI). I hope that comes to a quick conclusion or I'm just misreading the situation.
I guess since we've had angels, demons, witches, and so on, this season will be dedicated to some kind of zombie plague. (North America - your one stop for all apocalyptic happenings!).
I did like the reference to "The Cage," as we haven't forgotten the other Winchester brother, possessed by Michael, and in eternal conflict with Satan. As for Crawley, I was ready to accept the character in a different body (albeit I would have missed the actor), but I definitely saw it as him deciding to enjoy himself and by extension, kill the swinging couples, or at least kill them because he needed their blood and simply didn't care a twig about their lives. I didn't think there was any intention of shame concerned to their activities. (If anything, the over the top prelude to the orgy playing on the swinging middle age suburban couples was kind of ridiculing the idea).
posted by Atreides at 11:37 AM on October 9, 2015
If anything, the over the top prelude to the orgy playing on the swinging middle age suburban couples was kind of ridiculing the idea
To me it seemed like the swingers were depicted as goofy so we wouldn't feel bad for them when they were killed. I didn't think Crowley was judging them harshly for swinging. I've always gotten the impression he's fine with kinky sex stuff. But I got the feeling the show's creators were kind of ridiculing these goofy people, and punishing them for being kinky.
I'd forgotten that Sam was saying they need to put the emphasis more on Saving People than Hunting Things. That's disappointing, because I had it in my head that Sam was talking (indirectly) about the need to get past some of the show's tropes when it sounds like he was probably just making a very Sam-esque plea to be more compassionate and less kill-y. (I did like that he referred to Hunting Things as "only half of the the bumper sticker". And in fact, there are bumper stickers that say Saving People, Hunting Things.)
posted by Ursula Hitler at 2:28 PM on October 9, 2015
To me it seemed like the swingers were depicted as goofy so we wouldn't feel bad for them when they were killed. I didn't think Crowley was judging them harshly for swinging. I've always gotten the impression he's fine with kinky sex stuff. But I got the feeling the show's creators were kind of ridiculing these goofy people, and punishing them for being kinky.
I'd forgotten that Sam was saying they need to put the emphasis more on Saving People than Hunting Things. That's disappointing, because I had it in my head that Sam was talking (indirectly) about the need to get past some of the show's tropes when it sounds like he was probably just making a very Sam-esque plea to be more compassionate and less kill-y. (I did like that he referred to Hunting Things as "only half of the the bumper sticker". And in fact, there are bumper stickers that say Saving People, Hunting Things.)
posted by Ursula Hitler at 2:28 PM on October 9, 2015
Quotes
Dean Winchester: [he and Sam are walking back to the car, the left rear tire of which is stuck in a muddy hole] We know what she looks like, and we know that she's evil. The question is what does *she* know? I mean, she's been locked away since the beginning of time. Does she even know what a cheeseburger is? All I know is that we set her free, and we're gonna put her back in no matter what it takes. [opens the car door, sits down, then immediately gets back out again, looking at the rear tire; turns to Sam] You let me get in the car?
Sam: You were on a roll.
Sam: Hunting things. We're good at that. Sure, we're *great* at that. But, it's only half of the bumper sticker, man.
Dean: Just a couple hours ago, I killed Death. I'm pretty much open for anything.
Dean: [to Castiel] We were hoping you could tell us what kind of Def Con Screwed we are.
Dean Winchester: [to Sam] We *have* a plan. Okay? Same plan as it's always been. In order to get out, we go through.
Crowley: The Darkness? Please. Myth. It's a bedtime story. Something that daddy demons threaten toddler demons with to get them to eat their vegetables. Even if it was true, what's the concern? Darkness, King of Hell -- natural allies.
Deputy Jenna Nickerson: [to Sam and Dean] FBI, my ass.
Trivia
The name Amara is found in several languages. In Igbo it means "grace". In Latin/Italian it means "bitter". It is also a Mongolian name meaning "peaceful", and in Sanskrit it means "eternal". In Greek it means "unfading", and in Spanish it means "imperishable". In America it is used as a derivative of the Latin "amore" to mean "beloved" and in Arabic it means "a sign".
The season picks up immediately after the events from last season. There is no time jump.
In a nod to the movie The Usual Suspects, Crowley says the Darkness is, "something that daddy demons threaten toddler demons with to get them to eat their vegetables". In the movie, Verbal Kent says, "Kaiser Sösey is a myth, a bedtime story told to kids ...". Both of these quotes are said towards the end of the episode and movie AND both are contradictions, as the Darkness and Kaiser Sösey do exist.
posted by orange swan at 8:16 AM on December 15, 2021
Dean Winchester: [he and Sam are walking back to the car, the left rear tire of which is stuck in a muddy hole] We know what she looks like, and we know that she's evil. The question is what does *she* know? I mean, she's been locked away since the beginning of time. Does she even know what a cheeseburger is? All I know is that we set her free, and we're gonna put her back in no matter what it takes. [opens the car door, sits down, then immediately gets back out again, looking at the rear tire; turns to Sam] You let me get in the car?
Sam: You were on a roll.
Sam: Hunting things. We're good at that. Sure, we're *great* at that. But, it's only half of the bumper sticker, man.
Dean: Just a couple hours ago, I killed Death. I'm pretty much open for anything.
Dean: [to Castiel] We were hoping you could tell us what kind of Def Con Screwed we are.
Dean Winchester: [to Sam] We *have* a plan. Okay? Same plan as it's always been. In order to get out, we go through.
Crowley: The Darkness? Please. Myth. It's a bedtime story. Something that daddy demons threaten toddler demons with to get them to eat their vegetables. Even if it was true, what's the concern? Darkness, King of Hell -- natural allies.
Deputy Jenna Nickerson: [to Sam and Dean] FBI, my ass.
Trivia
The name Amara is found in several languages. In Igbo it means "grace". In Latin/Italian it means "bitter". It is also a Mongolian name meaning "peaceful", and in Sanskrit it means "eternal". In Greek it means "unfading", and in Spanish it means "imperishable". In America it is used as a derivative of the Latin "amore" to mean "beloved" and in Arabic it means "a sign".
The season picks up immediately after the events from last season. There is no time jump.
In a nod to the movie The Usual Suspects, Crowley says the Darkness is, "something that daddy demons threaten toddler demons with to get them to eat their vegetables". In the movie, Verbal Kent says, "Kaiser Sösey is a myth, a bedtime story told to kids ...". Both of these quotes are said towards the end of the episode and movie AND both are contradictions, as the Darkness and Kaiser Sösey do exist.
posted by orange swan at 8:16 AM on December 15, 2021
It makes sense to me that Crowley would be interested in an orgy, but I do question his being interested in one involving two dorky, middle-aged suburban couples.
How does a supernatural entity that has been locked away since the earth was created have an American accent and perfectly styled and contemporary black evening dress?
posted by orange swan at 8:18 AM on December 15, 2021
How does a supernatural entity that has been locked away since the earth was created have an American accent and perfectly styled and contemporary black evening dress?
posted by orange swan at 8:18 AM on December 15, 2021
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posted by cfoxhi at 12:05 AM on October 9, 2015