The Walking Dead: Not Tomorrow Yet
March 7, 2016 6:09 AM - Season 6, Episode 12 - Subscribe
Rick and the others determine that the only way to keep peace in Alexandria, is to wage a war with a new enemy.
I would like a high end coffee table book with the maps and plans they draw, would be hysterical. Also how big is that dudes head?!
posted by Iteki at 6:57 AM on March 7, 2016
posted by Iteki at 6:57 AM on March 7, 2016
I like that they threw some new music in. Does anybody know what that last song was called?
I thought for sure Rosita was a goner, and probably Abraham with her, after his dingleberry moment. But nope. Then I figured the dude with Glenn was going to get it. Nope. When the one 'Savior' awoke and hit the alarm and the shooting started with the alarm blaring, I thought oh here we go again - Gale Ann Hurd has overplayed her hand with the alarm + hero making their way through a tight enclosed area against an enemy. But no, it worked! Even though they did this same thing in a scene a few seasons back. I guess she's just the master at this. It was very well done I thought.
It was kind of a copout to have the Savior guys Glenn killed have polaroid (of all things) pictures of kills of humans on the wall. No, let the audience grapple with what they're doing. We knew already from character testimony that these were bad guys. I know they let us sit with it while Glenn was actually killing the guys with a knife to the head, and I did begin to feel uncomfortable, but at least have them leave the room without seeing the pictures, but the audience sees them. So then Glenn's character just has to deal with all that turmoil. Either way it definitely makes you not feel good to watch. The severed head stuff was also kind of grim.
I loved the events at the end of the episode because for a second there, Rick had made a 'correct' decision.
posted by cashman at 7:02 AM on March 7, 2016
I thought for sure Rosita was a goner, and probably Abraham with her, after his dingleberry moment. But nope. Then I figured the dude with Glenn was going to get it. Nope. When the one 'Savior' awoke and hit the alarm and the shooting started with the alarm blaring, I thought oh here we go again - Gale Ann Hurd has overplayed her hand with the alarm + hero making their way through a tight enclosed area against an enemy. But no, it worked! Even though they did this same thing in a scene a few seasons back. I guess she's just the master at this. It was very well done I thought.
It was kind of a copout to have the Savior guys Glenn killed have polaroid (of all things) pictures of kills of humans on the wall. No, let the audience grapple with what they're doing. We knew already from character testimony that these were bad guys. I know they let us sit with it while Glenn was actually killing the guys with a knife to the head, and I did begin to feel uncomfortable, but at least have them leave the room without seeing the pictures, but the audience sees them. So then Glenn's character just has to deal with all that turmoil. Either way it definitely makes you not feel good to watch. The severed head stuff was also kind of grim.
I loved the events at the end of the episode because for a second there, Rick had made a 'correct' decision.
posted by cashman at 7:02 AM on March 7, 2016
I think the last song was Arsonist's Lullabye by Hozier (found via Tunefind).
Well, Tobin is going to die a horrible fucking death now, isn't he? Kissing Carol has gotta doom you to be some kind of plot device death.
Genderswapped disposable woman? Crappy trope in general (introduce a love interest to motivate a main character when that new love without character development of their own dies), but I'd take a small gift of genderswapping a tired trope that is usually foisted upon women.
There's general consensus that logic isn't a strength of characters in TWD, but after Carol went around giving folks cookies, I asked my wife "why don't they just poison The Saviors?" You have the weekly food deliveries, and two doctors who would know various ways to taint that food supply in such a way as to ensure the poison survives general preparation practices, or some way to boost their chances of getting the majority of the people. And then you go into their territory to kill them all.
Because that plan was just f**king dumb. "We don't know how many they have, we don't know the layout of their compound, let alone what kind of defenses they have or what their armory looks like, but we can totally take them by surprise and everything will be great."
At least get a person on the inside to get a better idea of what they're dealing with. You know Daryl would be great in that situation.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:05 AM on March 7, 2016 [13 favorites]
Well, Tobin is going to die a horrible fucking death now, isn't he? Kissing Carol has gotta doom you to be some kind of plot device death.
Genderswapped disposable woman? Crappy trope in general (introduce a love interest to motivate a main character when that new love without character development of their own dies), but I'd take a small gift of genderswapping a tired trope that is usually foisted upon women.
There's general consensus that logic isn't a strength of characters in TWD, but after Carol went around giving folks cookies, I asked my wife "why don't they just poison The Saviors?" You have the weekly food deliveries, and two doctors who would know various ways to taint that food supply in such a way as to ensure the poison survives general preparation practices, or some way to boost their chances of getting the majority of the people. And then you go into their territory to kill them all.
Because that plan was just f**king dumb. "We don't know how many they have, we don't know the layout of their compound, let alone what kind of defenses they have or what their armory looks like, but we can totally take them by surprise and everything will be great."
At least get a person on the inside to get a better idea of what they're dealing with. You know Daryl would be great in that situation.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:05 AM on March 7, 2016 [13 favorites]
From this week of The Walking Dead: Relationship Drama, Abe wins the award for worst post-apocalypse break-up line -- "When I first met you, I thought you were the last woman on Earth. You're not."
But then he rolls with the crew, even teaming up with Sasha again? But that discussion happened earlier, and everything is forgotten, as Rosita is focused on the task at hand and not visibly shaken by Abe's super-dick move.
What's the point of building up relationship drama if you're not going that as any sort of plot device?
posted by filthy light thief at 7:11 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
But then he rolls with the crew, even teaming up with Sasha again? But that discussion happened earlier, and everything is forgotten, as Rosita is focused on the task at hand and not visibly shaken by Abe's super-dick move.
What's the point of building up relationship drama if you're not going that as any sort of plot device?
posted by filthy light thief at 7:11 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
I didn't hate this episode! Good job, Walking Dead!
It did feel like mostly filler, though. The decision to attack the Saviors was made last episode, and there was no real doubt that everyone would fall behind Rick in the church scene. (Though it was a bit more unanimous than I expected.) I guess a rubber-stamp parliamentary Rickarchy is an improvement over the Ricktatorship we had at the prison, sort of?
Abraham: at first, I thought he was leaving Alexandria, not just Rosita. Like he decided that safety just does not appeal to him. We knew he wanted to fuck around with other women, but I was hoping his arc would bend toward polyamory or something (which Rosita could still balk at, if the writers wanted that dreams). Still don't really know where his story is going, nor do I know why I'm supposed to care, apart from feeling really bad for Rosita.
As for Carol, good for her hooking up with Tobin. Maybe it bodes ill for him, but things are looking dodgy for Carol herself at the moment...
posted by tobascodagama at 7:13 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
It did feel like mostly filler, though. The decision to attack the Saviors was made last episode, and there was no real doubt that everyone would fall behind Rick in the church scene. (Though it was a bit more unanimous than I expected.) I guess a rubber-stamp parliamentary Rickarchy is an improvement over the Ricktatorship we had at the prison, sort of?
Abraham: at first, I thought he was leaving Alexandria, not just Rosita. Like he decided that safety just does not appeal to him. We knew he wanted to fuck around with other women, but I was hoping his arc would bend toward polyamory or something (which Rosita could still balk at, if the writers wanted that dreams). Still don't really know where his story is going, nor do I know why I'm supposed to care, apart from feeling really bad for Rosita.
As for Carol, good for her hooking up with Tobin. Maybe it bodes ill for him, but things are looking dodgy for Carol herself at the moment...
posted by tobascodagama at 7:13 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well that was super dark. I know they are bad guys but it still was hard to watch them go room to room killing people in their sleep.
I sure hope that at the very least, Daryl can get his bike back next episode.
posted by LizBoBiz at 7:20 AM on March 7, 2016
I sure hope that at the very least, Daryl can get his bike back next episode.
posted by LizBoBiz at 7:20 AM on March 7, 2016
Also, I totally thought Carol was poisoning all the "weak" Alexandrians, but they took a different turn and had her actually face the fact that she has killed so many people, which was also interesting considering that they were preemptively about to kill a bunch more people.
They could have gone a bit deeper into the internal conflict for Tara, what with her having been convinced to attack a previously unknown group before. She could have been a very strong voice of opposition, but instead they had other characters convince her that she was doing the right thing this time.
posted by LizBoBiz at 7:24 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
They could have gone a bit deeper into the internal conflict for Tara, what with her having been convinced to attack a previously unknown group before. She could have been a very strong voice of opposition, but instead they had other characters convince her that she was doing the right thing this time.
posted by LizBoBiz at 7:24 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
(I should mention that I didn't love this episode, either. But it was more watchable than most of the recent ones.)
And, yeah, the actual plan here was pretty bad. If the Saviors had anybody on the roof instead of just two guys standing around just inside the door, the plan would have been toast. At least show Daryl taking the roof guards out silently with his crossbow or something. And that's on top of having done no reconnaissance. They don't know if this is the only outpost of the Saviors, what Negan looks like, or if there are any patrols outside that might return to scree them over. And, look, failing to find out that stuff is immediately buying them in the ass.
I know these guys aren't supposed to be Seal Team Six, but we are supposed to see them as smart, hardened survivors.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:27 AM on March 7, 2016
And, yeah, the actual plan here was pretty bad. If the Saviors had anybody on the roof instead of just two guys standing around just inside the door, the plan would have been toast. At least show Daryl taking the roof guards out silently with his crossbow or something. And that's on top of having done no reconnaissance. They don't know if this is the only outpost of the Saviors, what Negan looks like, or if there are any patrols outside that might return to scree them over. And, look, failing to find out that stuff is immediately buying them in the ass.
I know these guys aren't supposed to be Seal Team Six, but we are supposed to see them as smart, hardened survivors.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:27 AM on March 7, 2016
I kind of actively dislike Tobin's theory that Carol's capacity to do terrible things in the name of survival comes from her being a mother. A) That's bullshit. There are tons of mothers on that show and not one of them is remotely like Carol. Remember Rick's disposable blond love interest and her idiot kids? B) It's already fairly well-established (or at least heavily, heavily implied) that Carol's terrifying personal will comes from a kind of hardening of her soul that came from surviving abuse. She has made a personal commitment never EVER to be a victim again. She's more parallel to Darryl than she is a Mama Bear.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:29 AM on March 7, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:29 AM on March 7, 2016 [18 favorites]
I can't imagine a scenario in which a Mama Bear says, "Look at the flowers" and puts one in a little kid's head.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:33 AM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:33 AM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
It's already fairly well-established (or at least heavily, heavily implied) that Carol's terrifying personal will comes from a kind of hardening of her soul that came from surviving abuse. She has made a personal commitment never EVER to be a victim again. She's more parallel to Darryl than she is a Mama Bear.
I agree on this account. Tobin's dead wrong about the source of Carol's strength. But maybe what Carol-the-character needs right now is for someone to see her as something other than a survivor?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
I agree on this account. Tobin's dead wrong about the source of Carol's strength. But maybe what Carol-the-character needs right now is for someone to see her as something other than a survivor?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
I also wouldn't pin it on her being a mother, if only for the fact that all the children that get close to Carol die horribly. She should not try being a mother figure to any child at this point.
posted by LizBoBiz at 7:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by LizBoBiz at 7:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't think Tobin knows about that, but I could be wrong. There are clearly things Carol doesn't share with the group at large.
And if you were wondering about Carol's own body count, here's a review of who she has killed.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
And if you were wondering about Carol's own body count, here's a review of who she has killed.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
Also, Tobin has bought into the Caring Mother image of Carol, so he's created his own justification for how she is the way she is.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:41 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by filthy light thief at 7:41 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
That's a good theory. Maybe if I had more faith in the writers, I would have seen Tobin being wrong about her as the point, and maybe an opportunity for her to reinvent herself. This show being how it is, though, it almost seems more likely they're ignoring their own history and making up new silly bullshit as they go along.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:44 AM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:44 AM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
I do like the idea that Carol hasn't actually become a remorseless killing machine, but had simply never had an opportunity to downshift from Maximum Survival Mode and reflect on everything she has done.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:47 AM on March 7, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:47 AM on March 7, 2016 [6 favorites]
Did anybody not know what was going to happen to Maggie and Carol?
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:50 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:50 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
I didn't.
posted by cashman at 7:52 AM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by cashman at 7:52 AM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
I realize she's not actually The Bringer of Death, but considering how badass Carol is, a part of me really wanted Rick to tell the person on the walkie talkie, "You're with Carol? MAY GOD HAVE MERCY ON YOUR SOULS."
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:53 AM on March 7, 2016 [26 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:53 AM on March 7, 2016 [26 favorites]
"I mean, she's no throat ripper, but she's pretty brutal."
posted by filthy light thief at 8:38 AM on March 7, 2016
posted by filthy light thief at 8:38 AM on March 7, 2016
Here's an idea for defending your settlement against marauders in the zombie apocalypse: weaponize the zombie hordes.
You build gated, reinforced pens at regular intervals along the outside of your walls. Use bait to fill them with zombies, then close them up. In the event of attack, raise the gates (you could have them on chains you could operate from inside the walls of your compound) and unleash a few hundred zombies around the outside of your compound that the marauders would have to deal with before they could even consider trying to get inside.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:42 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
You build gated, reinforced pens at regular intervals along the outside of your walls. Use bait to fill them with zombies, then close them up. In the event of attack, raise the gates (you could have them on chains you could operate from inside the walls of your compound) and unleash a few hundred zombies around the outside of your compound that the marauders would have to deal with before they could even consider trying to get inside.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:42 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, that would be a great twist. They think they've got some awesome hostage, but Rick just laughs like, "Haha, ok, good luck with that."
Which is, of course, why Maggie got snagged as well. While tough, she's nowhere near Carol's Memetic Badass level, and then there's Glenn's manfeels to be considered as well. So they'll have to capitulate in order to save Everyone's Mom and the Mom to Be.
(I agree with DirtyOldTown. It's about 50/50 whether the show is trying to have a complex portrayal of Carol's relationships to the Alexandrians who don't know her history or just plain being revisionist about said history. I'd love to have more faith that it's the former, but I just don't at the moment.)
posted by tobascodagama at 8:43 AM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
Which is, of course, why Maggie got snagged as well. While tough, she's nowhere near Carol's Memetic Badass level, and then there's Glenn's manfeels to be considered as well. So they'll have to capitulate in order to save Everyone's Mom and the Mom to Be.
(I agree with DirtyOldTown. It's about 50/50 whether the show is trying to have a complex portrayal of Carol's relationships to the Alexandrians who don't know her history or just plain being revisionist about said history. I'd love to have more faith that it's the former, but I just don't at the moment.)
posted by tobascodagama at 8:43 AM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
One the subject of "Why can't they just poison the Saviors?" The very tiniest, not-at-all-hard-to-guess spoiler about the comics follows... BUT... IIRC, Negan uses the equivalent of a royal taster. He's not an idiot.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:47 AM on March 7, 2016
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:47 AM on March 7, 2016
What was up with Carol apparently being VERY concerned about Maggie and saying she should stay back? I know she's pregnant but she could have stayed home if she wanted but she doesn't want to! And its not like she's super pregnant and can't run fast or move quickly, she's barely showing!
I know the show's reasoning is probably that she needs to protect herself so she can give birth to the next generation, but I have 2 problems with that:
1) it would make sense to reason that all the women need to stay home because we need them to give birth to the next generation at some point, which is gross and terrible
2) given the high risk of death in childbirth without modern medicine (yay for the new OB!) at this early in her pregnancy, she's probably safer fighting with Rick's group than giving birth.
If I were Maggie, I'd tell Carol and everyone else to shut up and mind their business. Don't make Rick look like the better person here, Carol.
posted by LizBoBiz at 8:53 AM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
I know the show's reasoning is probably that she needs to protect herself so she can give birth to the next generation, but I have 2 problems with that:
1) it would make sense to reason that all the women need to stay home because we need them to give birth to the next generation at some point, which is gross and terrible
2) given the high risk of death in childbirth without modern medicine (yay for the new OB!) at this early in her pregnancy, she's probably safer fighting with Rick's group than giving birth.
If I were Maggie, I'd tell Carol and everyone else to shut up and mind their business. Don't make Rick look like the better person here, Carol.
posted by LizBoBiz at 8:53 AM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
it's about 50/50 whether the show is trying to have a complex portrayal of Carol's relationships to the Alexandrians who don't know her history or just plain being revisionist about said history. I'd love to have more faith that it's the former, but I just don't at the moment
At least on Talking Dead, Aaron (sorry, I forget the actor's real name) said he thought Tobin was completely wrong. So, at least the actors playing the roles acknowledge that the characters sometimes have have incorrect assessments of other characters.
posted by gatorae at 8:56 AM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
At least on Talking Dead, Aaron (sorry, I forget the actor's real name) said he thought Tobin was completely wrong. So, at least the actors playing the roles acknowledge that the characters sometimes have have incorrect assessments of other characters.
posted by gatorae at 8:56 AM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
There should be a walking dead spin-off where Carol hosts a post-apocalyptic cooking show.
posted by FallowKing at 9:00 AM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by FallowKing at 9:00 AM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
Yeah, the baby looked absurdly small on the ultrasound. She is closer to 6 weeks than 18 weeks based on what mine looked like. Not that Walking Dead cares about such details, but..
posted by gatorae at 9:12 AM on March 7, 2016
posted by gatorae at 9:12 AM on March 7, 2016
I think Carol wanted Maggie at home so she wouldn't be forced to kill humans. I think that's biting down pretty hard on Carol right now, and we also see Glen try to spare newkid from downright murdering people in their beds. The music at the end was indeed Hozier, excellent choice. I forgot how much I love PTA-Carol (even tho Inalso love PTS-Carol); my first thought when she macheted that walker was "oh my, that's going to need a cold soak".
posted by Iteki at 9:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Iteki at 9:40 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
I almost forgot the Gabriel scenes! That last scene where Gabriel is reciting scripture as the Savior guy tries to scheme his way out of getting shot was intense. It upped the ante in comparison to probably the most famous quoting of scripture in a similar manner from Pulp Fiction, because the person talking was actually a priest, and the way they filmed it was good. Shooting the guy then saying "Amen" was just cold. That was some action movie level stuff right there.
There should be a walking dead spin-off where Carol hosts a post-apocalyptic cooking show.
It would be better than Fear The Walking Dead, that's for sure.
posted by cashman at 9:49 AM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
There should be a walking dead spin-off where Carol hosts a post-apocalyptic cooking show.
It would be better than Fear The Walking Dead, that's for sure.
posted by cashman at 9:49 AM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
It did feel like mostly filler
Well, the show's unofficial tagline is "All killers, mostly filler."
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:35 AM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
Well, the show's unofficial tagline is "All killers, mostly filler."
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:35 AM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
(We can save this for when it actually comes back next month, but I think Fear the Walking Dead is absolutely the superior show right now.)
posted by tobascodagama at 11:55 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tobascodagama at 11:55 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm also enjoying hatewatching the... not webisode, but commercialisode (?) of the airplane zombie.
posted by gatorae at 1:02 PM on March 7, 2016
posted by gatorae at 1:02 PM on March 7, 2016
There should be a walking dead spin-off where Carol hosts a post-apocalyptic cooking show.
It would be better than Fear The Walking Dead, that's for sure.
More Carol, less BS filler*? That would be better than The Walking Dead! *rimshot*
* Beets and acorns are decidedly not BS filler.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:04 PM on March 7, 2016
It would be better than Fear The Walking Dead, that's for sure.
More Carol, less BS filler*? That would be better than The Walking Dead! *rimshot*
* Beets and acorns are decidedly not BS filler.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:04 PM on March 7, 2016
I'm also enjoying hatewatching the... not webisode, but commercialisode (?) of the airplane zombie.
Yeah, I feel like that guy has been dying in there for weeks
posted by LizBoBiz at 1:23 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I feel like that guy has been dying in there for weeks
posted by LizBoBiz at 1:23 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, that minisode thing is a hot mess. Whoever thought it was a great idea to deliver five minutes of story (if that) in the form of fifteen one-minute segments was an idiot.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:26 PM on March 7, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 1:26 PM on March 7, 2016
I have a feeling there will be some sort of Deep Moment when Abe turns zombie and then Sasha and Rosita will have complex feelings about who should be the one to put him down.
Dick.
posted by angrycat at 1:44 PM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
Dick.
posted by angrycat at 1:44 PM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh, god. I hope not, but that's exactly the kind of dumb thing this show would do.
(I'm still in the "Huh? Sasha has not shown any actual interest in Abraham." camp over here, but then Michonne didn't show any on-camera interest in Rick until they actually hooked up, so whatever.)
posted by tobascodagama at 1:46 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
(I'm still in the "Huh? Sasha has not shown any actual interest in Abraham." camp over here, but then Michonne didn't show any on-camera interest in Rick until they actually hooked up, so whatever.)
posted by tobascodagama at 1:46 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
Why was Abraham such a dick? He could have been nice about it.
I mean, Rosita is awesome! Even if you don't love her any more, she loves you! Be careful with her feelings!
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 2:12 PM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
I mean, Rosita is awesome! Even if you don't love her any more, she loves you! Be careful with her feelings!
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 2:12 PM on March 7, 2016 [7 favorites]
weaponize the zombie hordes
That's what I was thinking during the frontal assault on the Savior compound. You're going to kill the guards anyway, and you've got a brief window between killing them and the reanimation, so why not stab the guards in the neck, shove them back inside, then lock the door behind them and leave them to start walking around and eating sleeping Saviors?
...but then, I'm kind of a postapocalyptic dick.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 2:13 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
That's what I was thinking during the frontal assault on the Savior compound. You're going to kill the guards anyway, and you've got a brief window between killing them and the reanimation, so why not stab the guards in the neck, shove them back inside, then lock the door behind them and leave them to start walking around and eating sleeping Saviors?
...but then, I'm kind of a postapocalyptic dick.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 2:13 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
My favorite scene in this episode was when Carol laid the last of the cookies on the grave of the boy she literally scared to death in the I'm-baking-cookies-but-I'll-fucking-kill-you scene. I felt like that redeemed her somehow, pulled her back from the brink of being a two-dimensional (admittedly badass and awesome) killer, and re-humanized her.
posted by flyingsquirrel at 3:23 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by flyingsquirrel at 3:23 PM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]
Did anyone else notice this split-second shot while they were busting open doors inside the Saviors' compound? I mean, I guess that's supposed to be weed, in some kind of grow room, to reinforce the notion that the Saviors are bad criminals who do bad criminal stuff like growing weed. Even if it's supposed to be, like, basil or something—why would they use precious electricity to grow it indoors? It makes no sense.
I mostly liked this episode, though.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 3:36 PM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
I mostly liked this episode, though.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 3:36 PM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
yeah that was a wtf moment. that and morgan's bunker and carol's 18. It was the first time since the wolves started showing up that I was curious about something happening.
Although i dunno it helps their bona fides of evil to grow weed.
i mean, this whole thing with the hilltop and the saviors makes a spot of sense. the whole zombie horde movement plan? That was just boring (at least until the wolves attacked i think that was the only other episode i've 'enjoyed' this season).
Is it just me or is Rick's accent getting annoying? I mean maybe I'm just finally got around to hating Rick and his stupid yawpy ways.
posted by angrycat at 3:47 PM on March 7, 2016
Although i dunno it helps their bona fides of evil to grow weed.
i mean, this whole thing with the hilltop and the saviors makes a spot of sense. the whole zombie horde movement plan? That was just boring (at least until the wolves attacked i think that was the only other episode i've 'enjoyed' this season).
Is it just me or is Rick's accent getting annoying? I mean maybe I'm just finally got around to hating Rick and his stupid yawpy ways.
posted by angrycat at 3:47 PM on March 7, 2016
KILL THEM FOR THEIR BASIL
posted by cashman at 3:47 PM on March 7, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by cashman at 3:47 PM on March 7, 2016 [8 favorites]
...but then, I'm kind of a postapocalyptic dick.
They should have just sealed the exits and set the place on fire.
You also wouldn't have to leave two people outside to "guard" the entire perimeter.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:01 PM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
They should have just sealed the exits and set the place on fire.
You also wouldn't have to leave two people outside to "guard" the entire perimeter.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:01 PM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
Is it just me or is Rick's accent getting annoying?
I dunno. I'm southern-born and bad Southern accents on-screen are kind of a pet peeve of mine. (How could you, Michael Rapaport?) Andrew Lincoln's mostly vacillates between very solid and pretty good. He doesn't nail every word, but he nails the tonality and the sort of drawling refusal to enunciate in his targeted accent very well.
The actress who plays Maggie generally has the tonality right but routinely throws in clanking, honking phony pronunciations.
The guy who does Eugene is great.
The kid who plays Carl takes a lot of grief for various inadequacies, but his accent is fine, likely just from him being cast to play what he already is: a kid from a suburban/mid-sized town in the ATL area who grew up near a mall and sounds less southern than his own folks. His accent is close to mine at his age.
Norman Reedus is playing more of a general white trash dude with an odd cadence than a specific southern accent, but he's good too, mostly.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 4:40 PM on March 7, 2016 [11 favorites]
I dunno. I'm southern-born and bad Southern accents on-screen are kind of a pet peeve of mine. (How could you, Michael Rapaport?) Andrew Lincoln's mostly vacillates between very solid and pretty good. He doesn't nail every word, but he nails the tonality and the sort of drawling refusal to enunciate in his targeted accent very well.
The actress who plays Maggie generally has the tonality right but routinely throws in clanking, honking phony pronunciations.
The guy who does Eugene is great.
The kid who plays Carl takes a lot of grief for various inadequacies, but his accent is fine, likely just from him being cast to play what he already is: a kid from a suburban/mid-sized town in the ATL area who grew up near a mall and sounds less southern than his own folks. His accent is close to mine at his age.
Norman Reedus is playing more of a general white trash dude with an odd cadence than a specific southern accent, but he's good too, mostly.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 4:40 PM on March 7, 2016 [11 favorites]
Although i dunno it helps their bona fides of evil to grow weed.
Nah, man - [marijuana use intensifies] - it goes against their bona fides.
posted by alrightokay at 5:51 PM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
Nah, man - [marijuana use intensifies] - it goes against their bona fides.
posted by alrightokay at 5:51 PM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]
The kid who plays Carl takes a lot of grief for various inadequacies
Does he? I think Chandler Riggs has been doing a great job. I guess the character got some grief for always wandering off and doing dumb shit during season 2, but that's not his fault.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:19 PM on March 7, 2016
Does he? I think Chandler Riggs has been doing a great job. I guess the character got some grief for always wandering off and doing dumb shit during season 2, but that's not his fault.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:19 PM on March 7, 2016
This episode seemed like a lot of filler, and I actually dozed off during much of the killing in the compound, but I did really like that I, too, though for a second that Carol was giving poison cookies to everyone in Alexandria. (Also, did I miss something with her notebook? What was she counting?)
I do also like that Gabriel is FINALLY useful. Way to kill someone, Gabriel!
posted by TwoStride at 6:39 PM on March 7, 2016
I do also like that Gabriel is FINALLY useful. Way to kill someone, Gabriel!
posted by TwoStride at 6:39 PM on March 7, 2016
You'd think that weed wouldn't be the best drug to grow if you want to keep your mind off food problems. Meth maybe.
Also I liked Eugene's cookie review after the dingleberry drama.
posted by p3t3 at 7:10 PM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
Also I liked Eugene's cookie review after the dingleberry drama.
posted by p3t3 at 7:10 PM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]
At the beginning of the ep, when they drove back to Alexandria rather than straight to kill all the bad guys, I thought, "Oh, good! They DON'T actually mean to take pregnant Maggie with them on their killing mission! How radically intelligent!"
Then later on Maggie got in the RV to drive to kill the bad guys.
I mean, at least some of the characters occasionally expressed surprise/concern at her role in this. I just assume that Maggie's responses that we didn't see were along the lines of "But you don't understand - I'm trying to set up a dramatic plot point of some sort!"
posted by olinerd at 7:32 PM on March 7, 2016
Then later on Maggie got in the RV to drive to kill the bad guys.
I mean, at least some of the characters occasionally expressed surprise/concern at her role in this. I just assume that Maggie's responses that we didn't see were along the lines of "But you don't understand - I'm trying to set up a dramatic plot point of some sort!"
posted by olinerd at 7:32 PM on March 7, 2016
Also, did I miss something with her notebook? What was she counting?
Her personal kill count. Explanation of the abbreviations here.
Mixed feelings about this episode. I agree with all the criticisms, particularly the fact that they didn't seem to do much surveillance prior to their attack, which obviously has come back to bite them in the ass. But at least we got some Carol, so I can't be too annoyed. Glad Rosita is no longer stuck with Abraham, because lord almighty what a loser. Fr. Gabriel's shift feels very hollow to me. Dreading the season finale since I'm sure we're going to lose a regular. :(
posted by longdaysjourney at 7:49 PM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
Her personal kill count. Explanation of the abbreviations here.
Mixed feelings about this episode. I agree with all the criticisms, particularly the fact that they didn't seem to do much surveillance prior to their attack, which obviously has come back to bite them in the ass. But at least we got some Carol, so I can't be too annoyed. Glad Rosita is no longer stuck with Abraham, because lord almighty what a loser. Fr. Gabriel's shift feels very hollow to me. Dreading the season finale since I'm sure we're going to lose a regular. :(
posted by longdaysjourney at 7:49 PM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]
LizBoBiz: What was up with Carol apparently being VERY concerned about Maggie and saying she should stay back? I know she's pregnant but she could have stayed home if she wanted but she doesn't want to! And its not like she's super pregnant and can't run fast or move quickly, she's barely showing! ... If I were Maggie, I'd tell Carol and everyone else to shut up and mind their business. Don't make Rick look like the better person here, Carol."
Well, first of all, I think Carol's feelings are part of her FEELING MUCH ANGST OVER KILLING theme in this ep. She says "you're supposed to be someone different." I think that means: "you're nice, and you're not supposed to end up a jaded, wretched old husk who has to leave cookies on the graves of children she threatened with death like me." Which is - probably fair enough.
But honestly I agreed with her, and for practical reasons. Maggie is not a fighter and a killer. Hell, her husband isn't one either. Not sure either of them need to be there. But the biggest problem with her being there is: Maggie is the closest thing they have to a leader now. She's a hell of a lot smarter than dumb punch-the-zombie Rick. She set this whole thing up, and she did an awesome job of that. They need her. So she should be staying at Alexandria holding down the fort so that they have someone to keep shit together if it goes south with Negan. Her whole bluster in this episode, the whole 'I made this plan, so I must be present to see it carried out,' is nonsense to me. Being a leader means letting other people do things sometimes.
posted by koeselitz at 10:19 PM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
Well, first of all, I think Carol's feelings are part of her FEELING MUCH ANGST OVER KILLING theme in this ep. She says "you're supposed to be someone different." I think that means: "you're nice, and you're not supposed to end up a jaded, wretched old husk who has to leave cookies on the graves of children she threatened with death like me." Which is - probably fair enough.
But honestly I agreed with her, and for practical reasons. Maggie is not a fighter and a killer. Hell, her husband isn't one either. Not sure either of them need to be there. But the biggest problem with her being there is: Maggie is the closest thing they have to a leader now. She's a hell of a lot smarter than dumb punch-the-zombie Rick. She set this whole thing up, and she did an awesome job of that. They need her. So she should be staying at Alexandria holding down the fort so that they have someone to keep shit together if it goes south with Negan. Her whole bluster in this episode, the whole 'I made this plan, so I must be present to see it carried out,' is nonsense to me. Being a leader means letting other people do things sometimes.
posted by koeselitz at 10:19 PM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]
U guys, U GUYS!! I just realised Carol is the spitting image of Wonderwoman era Lynda Carter. This explains so much.
posted by Iteki at 1:53 AM on March 8, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Iteki at 1:53 AM on March 8, 2016 [2 favorites]
The 11 most ridiculous things from last night's Walking Dead, per Funny or Die. It's funny cuz it's true!
posted by flyingsquirrel at 4:17 AM on March 8, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by flyingsquirrel at 4:17 AM on March 8, 2016 [3 favorites]
that and morgan's bunker --angrycat
I don't think it's a bunker. I think he's making another jail/pacification unit, because it's the only thing he can think to do. The only question is, does he have an inmate/patient in mind already , or is he just getting ready for the next moral dilemma that pops up?
posted by Mogur at 5:51 AM on March 8, 2016 [3 favorites]
I don't think it's a bunker. I think he's making another jail/pacification unit, because it's the only thing he can think to do. The only question is, does he have an inmate/patient in mind already , or is he just getting ready for the next moral dilemma that pops up?
posted by Mogur at 5:51 AM on March 8, 2016 [3 favorites]
That was also my read, Mogur. He feels responsible for The Wolf (Owen, I think?) and for Jesus getting out. Jesus turns out to be mostly all right, but the next guy might not be. So he's doubling-down on his convictions by building a better cell rather than giving in to the prevailing "kill everyone who might be a threat" approach. He seems to think that if he builds a jail secure enough, he can convince the others to trust him again.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:14 AM on March 8, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tobascodagama at 7:14 AM on March 8, 2016 [1 favorite]
Protip: If the bakers who make the prop cookies forget to make them pink, you can totally drop that line about the cookies being pink.
posted by Sys Rq at 1:54 PM on March 8, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by Sys Rq at 1:54 PM on March 8, 2016 [13 favorites]
Also, what were Glenn and Maggie doing with that jar of pennies and the empty soda cans? I was stoked that they were making some kind of improvised weapon, but nothing happened at all.
posted by Mogur at 8:47 PM on March 8, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Mogur at 8:47 PM on March 8, 2016 [1 favorite]
They are saving up for Juniors college fund!
posted by ian1977 at 11:41 AM on March 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ian1977 at 11:41 AM on March 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
Foraging?
This is the first time I recall ANYONE foraging. And she does it to make cookies.
Greens! You get vitamins from greens!
The South would be overgrown with mustard at the time of year it seems to be. Maybe bitter, but blanch that shit. Then sautee it with some wild garlic or ramps. Tomatoes are nice but they are not easy to grow and take care of. Start with things that grow like crazy in the wild.
No domesticated animals? You can build a big fucking wall? You can weld a jail cell? But you can't build a cage to capture some hogs? Kill and eat the adults, domesticate the piglets.
Find some hickory trees, start producing salt. Cure hams and pickle greens for the winter.
Yeah, the stupid interpersonal decisions they make bug me, but the total inability to provide for themselves in a natural cornucopia is frustrating
posted by Seamus at 2:05 PM on March 9, 2016 [7 favorites]
This is the first time I recall ANYONE foraging. And she does it to make cookies.
Greens! You get vitamins from greens!
The South would be overgrown with mustard at the time of year it seems to be. Maybe bitter, but blanch that shit. Then sautee it with some wild garlic or ramps. Tomatoes are nice but they are not easy to grow and take care of. Start with things that grow like crazy in the wild.
No domesticated animals? You can build a big fucking wall? You can weld a jail cell? But you can't build a cage to capture some hogs? Kill and eat the adults, domesticate the piglets.
Find some hickory trees, start producing salt. Cure hams and pickle greens for the winter.
Yeah, the stupid interpersonal decisions they make bug me, but the total inability to provide for themselves in a natural cornucopia is frustrating
posted by Seamus at 2:05 PM on March 9, 2016 [7 favorites]
Why forage when you can loot? Because unrefrigerated Orange Crush is totally still drinkable after three years, right?
posted by tobascodagama at 2:07 PM on March 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 2:07 PM on March 9, 2016 [3 favorites]
So Rick had a throwaway line in this ep about how they were gonna have to fight at some point no matter what, like they always have, and mentioned the wolves. The way he said it seemed to confirm that the writers consider that story to be over. Not sure why this makes me so mad, but it does. That ratio of foreshadowing to substance in that storyline has got to be the highest in the history of human narrative. If I hadn't been keeping up with these threads, I probably would have had no idea that the wolves were a thing at all, just known that there was a random attack by some dudes with bad hygiene. What the hell was the point of all those scenes establishing their threat if they were just going to make one kamikaze attack and make a few vaguely nihilist statements while getting killed?
posted by skewed at 8:08 PM on March 9, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by skewed at 8:08 PM on March 9, 2016 [4 favorites]
I would honestly find and exploration of the Wolves' dumb philosophy more interesting than having a dumb repeat of the dumb Woodbury arc. Pitting Alexandria against a group that believes "people don't belong behind walls, we're freeing you by bringing them down" also makes a better counterpoint to Morgan's jail-building stuff and struggles with pacifism than just throwing another Guy What Needs Killing at us.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:18 PM on March 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tobascodagama at 8:18 PM on March 9, 2016 [1 favorite]
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Recaps
FoxSisters
The scenes of them murdering helpless people in their sleep were intense.
Did anyone else get a definite grindhouse vibe from the blood splattering on the camera during the battle at the satellite station?
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:12 AM on March 7, 2016 [2 favorites]