Gentleman Jack: Do ladies do that?
May 27, 2019 8:53 PM - Season 1, Episode 6 - Subscribe

Lister faces a heart-breaking decision as Ann Walker's mental state takes an alarming downturn.
posted by oh yeah! (17 comments total)
 
Ugh, that was painful all around. I do wonder if the Vulture recapper noticed that Anne was exactly going to get Ann to a psychiatrist, but was preempted. (Dr Belcombe would have been the son of the guy whose asylum her first lover ended up in, so I assume she has experience enough of his methods to trust him.)

The beating does seem to be laid at the feet of the Rawsons, with the reverend disappearing to be replaced by the spectre of a Scottish rival for Ann's money and affections.
posted by I claim sanctuary at 6:53 AM on May 28, 2019 [1 favorite]


Yeah, the Vulture recaps seem to me to be way off as if they don't want to watch the show. I understand the intersectionality and the full spectrum of queer experiences and the community aren't represented but it is a costume drama. Though I do agree that there should be 10 other shows that display something more than an upper middle class white lesbian. However, I think personally that I haven't seen a lesbian relationship or tv show that has captured the butch/femme dynamic in the subtle way this does but that might be cause I'm obsessed. I can also understand just being disappointed that tv networks are only willing to go so far and never have an authentic POC/trans lesbian show.
posted by kanata at 9:27 AM on May 28, 2019 [3 favorites]


Good lord, putting the lesbian drama in lesbian drama! Poor Anne, I started off being all "playa no!" and now I am like "goddammit Ann, you can't have your cake and eat it too, and especially if you're also not eating #pillowqueenmuch" and so on. That's my in-depth review for this week, ithankyu.
posted by Iteki at 1:39 PM on May 28, 2019 [3 favorites]


Also weepy disheveled Ann reminds me very strongly of emo Beth Jordache from early ninties Brookside! And also I think I too need to start wearing a ring on my index finger, it's deffo a look.
posted by Iteki at 2:05 PM on May 28, 2019 [2 favorites]


oh her crying and her speech just killed me. and also Miss Walker doesn't deserve her. my sympathy is running low on her. gotta have that push and pull for all the lesbian drama I guess.
posted by kanata at 4:05 PM on May 28, 2019 [2 favorites]


Miss Walker isn't perfect but she's doing her best. Lister really did ask a lot of her very fast - like maybe after Mrs. Priestly walked in on them, playing it cool and not seeing each other every day for awhile would have also made the story go away, and would have put a whole heck of a lot less pressure on Walker, who is apparently dealing with chronic pain and severe insomnia (as per last week - that whole day when her cousin told her she was going to be hanged, she hardly had any sleep the night before, if I'm understanding the timeline correctly.) From her point of view she can't imagine a future with Lister even though she desperately wants one, because she hasn't had the life experiences that would let her imagine a future outside of her family's approval. In order to do something once, you have to do it the first time, and it's something that no one has ever asked her or shown her how to do. And now you better do it NOW, or you will LOSE the LOVE OF YOUR LIFE FOREVER. And do it with no sleep and chronic untreatable pain. And maybe she does have an underlying mental illness that's being set off by this sudden incredibly stressful event. I mean. And Lister even acknowledges that she pushed her too far too fast. I don't blame either of them for handling this brand new situation not completely the right way, because how do you know what to do in a situation that has never occurred before as far as you know? It just seems very realistic and understandable to me.
posted by bleep at 4:31 PM on May 28, 2019 [3 favorites]


That said, I’m not totally sure we get a solid read on whether this show thinks mental illness exists outside of secrets and anguish.

Does this show think travel can cure depression? Unclear! However, if you are depressed, I’d recommend seeing a therapist instead of booking that flight to Paris.


The Vulture recaps for this show (by Cameron Esposito, who I generally like) are also weird to me. Like, it's not what "the show" thinks about depression/mental illness, it's the situation of the time that the characters were dealing with. And for someone in Walker's position who it did seem like their biggest problem was that they were sad for no particular reason, and they had nothing better to do like a job, travel was probably pretty helpful.
posted by bleep at 4:36 PM on May 28, 2019 [7 favorites]


Yeah the recaps have a very modern take on the time period. There's a real threat that she could be institutionalized by her family and being told to travel would be the best option of available treatments. Cameron seems not to get that or Vulture just wanted quick flippant recaps.

I must have missed the chronic pain issue she has and that's a good point about lack of sleep. I do agree Lister was pushing way to fast and I also know how anxiety and a traumatic past can make it so freedom or change seem like a threat. Miss Walker has learned helplessness and her anxiety is spinning out if control at the idea of taking a huge risk. Also contrasting her and Listers family it's obvious she hasn't had the opportunities to learn how to stand up for yourself. Her family prefers her that way.

I just like Lister and want her happy and can imagine the hurt of someone saying I love you and then go away over and over. Especially when Walker forgets Lister has feelings as well. Another symptom of trauma and anxiety. But yeah Lister was just breaking up with someone before she met Walker so she does move awfully fast. slow down girl.

I really enjoyed that crying scene where she admits she pushed too fast. Authentic writing about how much she has to rise above everyday.
posted by kanata at 6:25 PM on May 28, 2019


Yeah I don’t think Cameron Esposito is um good at recaps or story comprehension, so...good thing it’s not her day job?

It just seems very realistic

Literally why I’ve decided to stop watching until the internet tells me things get better
posted by schadenfrau at 6:25 PM on May 28, 2019 [2 favorites]


I realize this is unlikely to happen in the show, but I honestly want Lister to just have a different girlfriend who can respect her. Miss Walker waffles every time she's asked for a yes or no on anything and then cries until Anne gives up and lives in ambiguity. Sure, Lister probably pressed for marriage way too fast, but I think if she was on AskMe, she'd get a load of DTMFA advice. (IIRC, the historical Lister briefly had a Scottish one who bounded around hunting and I keep hoping she'll go shack up with a lady like that and have some uncomplicated rebound fun.)
posted by tautological at 6:32 PM on May 28, 2019 [1 favorite]


Nice bruises when Anne took off her glove at the start, square on the front knuckles. Looks like she landed that right like a champ.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 6:55 PM on May 28, 2019 [2 favorites]


Yeah, I wasn't prepared for the sudden turn into "Miss Walker might have a real mental illness beyond just being 'sickly.'" That was... more serious than I was expecting, and put me back into feeling uncomfortable about this relationship because it just doesn't seem right now as if Ann and Anne will ever come to it on equal footing.

While I like Anne's side plots into crime solving and coal dealing, I'm less interested in the burgeoning relationship between the murderous pig farmer and the agent's daughter who doesn't want to be a seamstress.
posted by TwoStride at 7:52 PM on May 28, 2019 [1 favorite]


the murderous pig farmer and the agent's daughter who doesn't want to be a seamstress

They fight crime!
posted by Mogur at 3:20 PM on May 29, 2019 [3 favorites]


Ok yeah, haven't managed to drop this index-finger ring thing. At first I thought the way Anne wore it, between the knuckles, was due to it being, for example, an ex-lover's ring and not fitting, but I see that Ann wears one in the same way. Is this a known thing perhaps? I can pull that off, right?
posted by Iteki at 9:21 AM on May 30, 2019


the murderous pig farmer and the agent's daughter who doesn't want to be a seamstress

They fight crime!


But seriously, I keep expecting the pig farmer to become Miss Lister's solution to the Rawson problem, but then I was raised on network TV. He's probably just what he appears to be - a thematic mirror to what's going on with the main characters.
posted by Mogur at 9:52 AM on May 30, 2019 [1 favorite]


Ok so a week is a terribly long time, get used to me....

Is there such a thing as “show only” Gentleman Jack? If so don’t read on.

Ok, I haven’t gotten the companion book to the show, might well pick it or the diaries up.
Regardless, my previous understanding of Anne Lister was that, yeah, terrible rake/womanizer and frankly not particularly nice person. My understanding was, for example, that while Anne was totally “we married now”, Ann was less aware of that part (although they were a couple) and was by my previous understanding a bit of a dope? At the same time as I am loving the tv version of them which seems a more evenly empowered relationship, I wonder if we are doing a disservice to historical Ann with this tidying up of Anne? Or perhaps I’ve only had access to straight history’s interpretation of events that couldn’t or wouldn’t give credence to Ann being a fully empowered femme? Also, book spoilers, does Anne come across as stone in her writings or is she just taking things easy?
posted by Iteki at 10:52 PM on May 30, 2019 [2 favorites]


I didn't get a chance to watch episode 7 last night, probably won't be able to see it until tomorrow night, so, if anyone wants to post the new thread today please go ahead.
posted by oh yeah! at 5:33 AM on June 4, 2019 [1 favorite]


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