The Witcher: Season 2 is here
December 17, 2021 8:47 PM - Season 2 (Full Season) - Subscribe
Happy Witcher weekend to those who celebrate.
Ok, just finished the season. The final fight being basically a group therapy session is deeply hysterical to me. But I enjoyed it.
Uh sorry to fans of one Witcher in particular, I expect.
posted by cendawanita at 3:39 AM on December 18, 2021 [3 favorites]
Uh sorry to fans of one Witcher in particular, I expect.
posted by cendawanita at 3:39 AM on December 18, 2021 [3 favorites]
Great, this is perfect, late nite, need to snooze off but need a but of distraction from reality fun.
posted by sammyo at 4:55 AM on December 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by sammyo at 4:55 AM on December 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
Season 1 of The Witcher was basically the last fun, episodic media I consumed in The Before Times. I watched it late at night on our Christmas/New Year's vacation trip 2019. It was grim and goofy in the right amounts for me back then.
Here we are in 2021 and everything is so different, but I'm willing to give it a spin and see where I land on it.
posted by kaiseki at 7:20 AM on December 18, 2021
Here we are in 2021 and everything is so different, but I'm willing to give it a spin and see where I land on it.
posted by kaiseki at 7:20 AM on December 18, 2021
I thought the mask work in the first episode was top notch. (That is, unless it was CGI?)
Also we have no idea what happened in season one. It's been way too long. Still, as we are not super into Wheel of Time, it's great to have this. We've just got to watch it slowly. My wife only likes to do an hour of TV a day, so we sometimes will watch a show over a week or two. It'd be nice to stretch this one out til the end of the year.
posted by Catblack at 9:39 AM on December 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
Also we have no idea what happened in season one. It's been way too long. Still, as we are not super into Wheel of Time, it's great to have this. We've just got to watch it slowly. My wife only likes to do an hour of TV a day, so we sometimes will watch a show over a week or two. It'd be nice to stretch this one out til the end of the year.
posted by Catblack at 9:39 AM on December 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
Saw the first two episodes. First one had a nice (dark) fairytale feeling to it. Second one was basically the beginning of the game Witcher 3. I'm very happy with the direction the show has gone so far. I think the young woman who plays Ciri does a bang-up job straddling the line of young/naive/innocent (she was a pampered princess) yet smart and competent with Big Things ahead of her. I really like that she's still finding her confidence in a world that's completely new to her, and that they didn't make her an overnight smartass/badass. She's a good actor!
I still think Cavill is way to large of a man to play the part, but he does a great job nonetheless. Geralt in the game Witcher 3 is my all-time favorite video game protagonist... a perfect blend of gruff, funny, jaded (he's seen this stuff before, just as I as a gamer have seen similar stuff before), careworn yet loving at heart. Geralt MADE that game great. I could do with less hair hanging in his eyes all the time, but so far? Really enjoying this season.
Anya Chalotra does a good job, but I wish they had cast someone older. Not the actor's fault. Just a minor nitpick for me.
Plus: fun, scary monster effects!
posted by SoberHighland at 2:39 PM on December 18, 2021
I still think Cavill is way to large of a man to play the part, but he does a great job nonetheless. Geralt in the game Witcher 3 is my all-time favorite video game protagonist... a perfect blend of gruff, funny, jaded (he's seen this stuff before, just as I as a gamer have seen similar stuff before), careworn yet loving at heart. Geralt MADE that game great. I could do with less hair hanging in his eyes all the time, but so far? Really enjoying this season.
Anya Chalotra does a good job, but I wish they had cast someone older. Not the actor's fault. Just a minor nitpick for me.
Plus: fun, scary monster effects!
posted by SoberHighland at 2:39 PM on December 18, 2021
Me at the end of Season 1: "Well, that was certainly an adaptation. I wonder where they're going with this."
Me at the end of Season 2: "Well, that was certainly an adaptation. I wonder where they're going with this."
I mean, I can't say that I'm not entertained, but I have no idea WTF I'm watching. It does make me want to re-read the books.
posted by confluency at 5:45 PM on December 18, 2021
Me at the end of Season 2: "Well, that was certainly an adaptation. I wonder where they're going with this."
I mean, I can't say that I'm not entertained, but I have no idea WTF I'm watching. It does make me want to re-read the books.
posted by confluency at 5:45 PM on December 18, 2021
Four episodes in and Ciri is giving me Arya-when-GoT-was-good feelings. Also the introduction of The Sandpiper… I might have screamed.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:16 PM on December 18, 2021
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:16 PM on December 18, 2021
However I am having trouble getting past Yennifer acting theatrically stealthy in THE MOST PURPLE ROBE IMAGINABLE.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:49 PM on December 18, 2021 [16 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:49 PM on December 18, 2021 [16 favorites]
am having trouble getting past Yennifer acting theatrically stealthy in THE MOST PURPLE ROBE IMAGINABLE
I guess when you lost the natural access to Chaos, store bought will do, lol.
posted by cendawanita at 7:53 PM on December 18, 2021 [5 favorites]
I guess when you lost the natural access to Chaos, store bought will do, lol.
posted by cendawanita at 7:53 PM on December 18, 2021 [5 favorites]
Some of the hair and make-up looks so different this season, I guess it's partly to do with moving the production to the UK? Yennefer's sudden lack of heavy eye-liner makes sense within the story, but Queen Calanthe's not so much- I had to check if that was still Jodhi May. (It is apparently! She looks ten years younger.)
The Sandpiper! Glad his poor fingers survived the season. Needs a luthier sponsorship stat, he sure goes through the instruments.
posted by Coaticass at 8:33 PM on December 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
The Sandpiper! Glad his poor fingers survived the season. Needs a luthier sponsorship stat, he sure goes through the instruments.
posted by Coaticass at 8:33 PM on December 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
I have only seen episode one but I had to double check that it was still Freya Allan as Ciri because of the change in production. She just looked different, partly because of age but also they seemed to have stopped dying/bleaching her eyebrows. Then again the scene at the end of episode one when they are talking has Geralt's skin tone change at least twice and I think it was three times but that could have just been a lighting shift.
The script was solid and the acting was good to great. Geralt speaking in more than grunts was nice.
posted by Ignorantsavage at 9:22 PM on December 18, 2021
The script was solid and the acting was good to great. Geralt speaking in more than grunts was nice.
posted by Ignorantsavage at 9:22 PM on December 18, 2021
I've just finished episode 5 and really enjoying it, though agree that a purple cloak is the opposite of stealthy. Loved the conversation between Jaskier and the guard asking for his papers when the guard starts giving him feedback on a song and mentions that it took him ages to realise there were multiple timelines, a little nod to criticism of the first season!
posted by kumonoi at 12:13 AM on December 19, 2021 [6 favorites]
posted by kumonoi at 12:13 AM on December 19, 2021 [6 favorites]
My more expanded and less sarcastic review: from early on in the first season it was clear that many characters in the TV series would have little more in common with their book counterparts than their names -- they have completely different backgrounds, allegiances, etc.. Sometimes characters who appeared very briefly in the books were given more extended roles so that they could be plot "glue" and fill in certain holes for the viewer. Entire plotlines were significantly modified or rearranged.
And this is not in itself bad. I don't want to be a grump complaining about changes just because they're changes. I haven't read the Expanse novels, but my understanding is that a similar kind of streamlining and merging of characters and stories has happened in the TV series, which I love.
But in this second season I saw less and less of the book story and more completely bananas storylines that were invented from whole cloth (perhaps they're more familiar to fans of the games, which I haven't played). And whereas in the first season I was totally willing to let the writers take me on a journey and see how they were going to resolve certain things, in this season I found most of these changes to be disappointing.
A lot of them feel simultaneously contrived and overcomplicated (as if the writers are bending over backwards to keep certain characters in the story) and childishly simplistic and linear (push button A; get political result B).
I guess what most bothered me was the elf storyline. In the books, the elves ally themselves with Nilfgaard willingly, because the Northern kingdoms treat them like shit and Nilfgaard has promised them a homeland. This is part of a pattern of a more nuanced and ambiguous portrayal of Nilfgaard as more advanced and socially progressive than the countries of the North; something that I really liked in the books and which is largely lost in the TV series (where this "difference" seems to have been replaced by a kind of pseudo-religious fanaticism).
posted by confluency at 12:50 AM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
And this is not in itself bad. I don't want to be a grump complaining about changes just because they're changes. I haven't read the Expanse novels, but my understanding is that a similar kind of streamlining and merging of characters and stories has happened in the TV series, which I love.
But in this second season I saw less and less of the book story and more completely bananas storylines that were invented from whole cloth (perhaps they're more familiar to fans of the games, which I haven't played). And whereas in the first season I was totally willing to let the writers take me on a journey and see how they were going to resolve certain things, in this season I found most of these changes to be disappointing.
A lot of them feel simultaneously contrived and overcomplicated (as if the writers are bending over backwards to keep certain characters in the story) and childishly simplistic and linear (push button A; get political result B).
I guess what most bothered me was the elf storyline. In the books, the elves ally themselves with Nilfgaard willingly, because the Northern kingdoms treat them like shit and Nilfgaard has promised them a homeland. This is part of a pattern of a more nuanced and ambiguous portrayal of Nilfgaard as more advanced and socially progressive than the countries of the North; something that I really liked in the books and which is largely lost in the TV series (where this "difference" seems to have been replaced by a kind of pseudo-religious fanaticism).
posted by confluency at 12:50 AM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
I don't think the show has done a good job of "showing rather than telling" that Nilfgaard is a bit more progressive - there's a lot of talk about it, but since we only spend time with the fanatical military we don't really see it; but what you're saying is the reason for the elf alliance in the books is basically what I understood the reason to be in the show.
posted by LionIndex at 2:56 AM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by LionIndex at 2:56 AM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
Sort of. But in the books there's no witch and no baby McGuffin, and Fringilla is not involved. The elves make a rational political decision and don't need to be tricked into anything. In the TV series they make a political agreement and then immediately renege on it for... reasons, somehow assuming that there will be no consequences and they'll just be able to keep Cintra anyway, and then abruptly change course as a result of a ruse. I'm really not a fan of this writing.
In the books Francesca is initially a sorceress in the same organisation as the other Northern mages (until a political schism which we won't see in the series because at this point it would make zero sense), Fringilla is a Nilfgaardian sorceress with no connection to the North who appears much later, and Yennefer's elven heritage pretty much never comes up. I can't even remember if it's a verified book fact, or just an accusation that her father makes against her mother's family in a flashback.
The TV series flattens out a lot of complexity into very simple binaries.
posted by confluency at 3:30 AM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
In the books Francesca is initially a sorceress in the same organisation as the other Northern mages (until a political schism which we won't see in the series because at this point it would make zero sense), Fringilla is a Nilfgaardian sorceress with no connection to the North who appears much later, and Yennefer's elven heritage pretty much never comes up. I can't even remember if it's a verified book fact, or just an accusation that her father makes against her mother's family in a flashback.
The TV series flattens out a lot of complexity into very simple binaries.
posted by confluency at 3:30 AM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
Deeply unhappy that [SPOILER]
[SPOILER]
[SPOILER]
Roach was not okay. He was a good horse. Why did the show kill off a Very Good Horse?
posted by Mr. Excellent at 4:22 AM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
[SPOILER]
[SPOILER]
Roach was not okay. He was a good horse. Why did the show kill off a Very Good Horse?
posted by Mr. Excellent at 4:22 AM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
IIRC, all his horses are Roach (which was meant to be Roach a type of fish, and Roachie at that). Anyway these are things i picked up from fandom. So, bye old Roach, hi new Roach.
Re: story complexity -- i can see the point but this is the show that just got the hang of how to lay story tracks well enough to pay them off this season, maybe s3 will be where there'll be narrative sophistication (ha ha). That said, coming fresh from the Foundation and The Expanse threads, where I have read the Asimov books and not the Expanse ones, these days i can say as beautifully faithful The Expanse has been, I'm much more intrigued by the Foundation's adaptation choices. It's not like I can't go back to the books (or even the games in this case) if i want to.
The Witcher the tv show is a goofy thing that finally got into its rhythm, but based on what I understand of the changes as you say, I'll say I'm very okay with the narrative streamlining that's happening in this season -- as it is, they wasted an entire season to actually present the Elvish social conditions (i thought they're all in the woods based on the first season) as well as setting up the political situation of the Northern kingdoms and this upstart Southern empire, what more Ciri's heritage... Argh, i digress, or else I'm going to launch into another rant again about the nonsensical way they set up the world for all the money Netflix threw them. They're lucky Netflix saw the GoT hole hasn't been filled yet in the audience ratings and so scored this season.
But clearly this season had a lot to do to actually get into whatever big bad plot the showrunner has in mind. Maybe it helps to think of it like a remix, much like Foundation.
For this show, I was actually reluctantly impressed (broken record but i really did go into this season thinking this is a deeply stupid show) by the way the plot arranged the elves to go on a rampage in Redania:
In the TV series they make a political agreement and then immediately renege on it for... reasons, somehow assuming that there will be no consequences and they'll just be able to keep Cintra anyway, and then abruptly change course as a result of a ruse.
Ok, ,
.
.
.
.
All the three mages knew their visions were a scam, but only Yennefer chose not to take the bargain (hence being lost for most of the season but yet with more narrative propulsion compared the last time). Fringilla and Franchesca both took their chances because they considered their respective situations to be more fraught and desperate. Over the months of Franchesca's pregnancy there was a reluctant respect from her side, which eventually became sincere. This Fringilla thought would be sufficient to rally the elves to her side should the Emperor arrived... of course Cahir arrived first and kinda interrupted the process. Because Franchesca never quite let go of the need to fight until the baby was safely born (you can read it as she thinks the scam wasn't one, or her deadline is years to come). Fringilla's gamble was basically coming to a naught because the elves under Franchesca are now feeling confident of their chances with the first full-blood elf born in ... Uh, centuries? So that's why they're willing to aboutface on the agreement especially with the accurate assessment that Fringilla's influence was waning with Cahir's arrival. Then the baby got killed anyway and they realized even in Cintra, northern humans will always be a threat etc etc. I just really liked that the mages weren't fooled by the Deathless Mother, just how they responded differed.
It was actually pretty solid and elegant and somehow earned the Big Bad status of the Emperor imo.
posted by cendawanita at 5:42 AM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
Re: story complexity -- i can see the point but this is the show that just got the hang of how to lay story tracks well enough to pay them off this season, maybe s3 will be where there'll be narrative sophistication (ha ha). That said, coming fresh from the Foundation and The Expanse threads, where I have read the Asimov books and not the Expanse ones, these days i can say as beautifully faithful The Expanse has been, I'm much more intrigued by the Foundation's adaptation choices. It's not like I can't go back to the books (or even the games in this case) if i want to.
The Witcher the tv show is a goofy thing that finally got into its rhythm, but based on what I understand of the changes as you say, I'll say I'm very okay with the narrative streamlining that's happening in this season -- as it is, they wasted an entire season to actually present the Elvish social conditions (i thought they're all in the woods based on the first season) as well as setting up the political situation of the Northern kingdoms and this upstart Southern empire, what more Ciri's heritage... Argh, i digress, or else I'm going to launch into another rant again about the nonsensical way they set up the world for all the money Netflix threw them. They're lucky Netflix saw the GoT hole hasn't been filled yet in the audience ratings and so scored this season.
But clearly this season had a lot to do to actually get into whatever big bad plot the showrunner has in mind. Maybe it helps to think of it like a remix, much like Foundation.
For this show, I was actually reluctantly impressed (broken record but i really did go into this season thinking this is a deeply stupid show) by the way the plot arranged the elves to go on a rampage in Redania:
In the TV series they make a political agreement and then immediately renege on it for... reasons, somehow assuming that there will be no consequences and they'll just be able to keep Cintra anyway, and then abruptly change course as a result of a ruse.
Ok, ,
I'm only doing this because it's not even a week of the show dropping and we're just about to start getting into it, so spoilers ahead
.
.
.
.
All the three mages knew their visions were a scam, but only Yennefer chose not to take the bargain (hence being lost for most of the season but yet with more narrative propulsion compared the last time). Fringilla and Franchesca both took their chances because they considered their respective situations to be more fraught and desperate. Over the months of Franchesca's pregnancy there was a reluctant respect from her side, which eventually became sincere. This Fringilla thought would be sufficient to rally the elves to her side should the Emperor arrived... of course Cahir arrived first and kinda interrupted the process. Because Franchesca never quite let go of the need to fight until the baby was safely born (you can read it as she thinks the scam wasn't one, or her deadline is years to come). Fringilla's gamble was basically coming to a naught because the elves under Franchesca are now feeling confident of their chances with the first full-blood elf born in ... Uh, centuries? So that's why they're willing to aboutface on the agreement especially with the accurate assessment that Fringilla's influence was waning with Cahir's arrival. Then the baby got killed anyway and they realized even in Cintra, northern humans will always be a threat etc etc. I just really liked that the mages weren't fooled by the Deathless Mother, just how they responded differed.
It was actually pretty solid and elegant and somehow earned the Big Bad status of the Emperor imo.
posted by cendawanita at 5:42 AM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
@cendawanita that's a fair interpretation. I think I'm just too attached to the source material -- I quite liked Foundation, and it didn't bother me at all that it was a very loose adaptation, because I only read the books once a very long time ago.
I still think Cavill's casting is spot on, and really enjoy his performance. And yes, it's a running joke that Geralt gives all of his horses the same name, and IIRC goes through quite a number of them in the books. RIP Roach; long live Roach.
posted by confluency at 6:14 AM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
I still think Cavill's casting is spot on, and really enjoy his performance. And yes, it's a running joke that Geralt gives all of his horses the same name, and IIRC goes through quite a number of them in the books. RIP Roach; long live Roach.
posted by confluency at 6:14 AM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
Re. Roach, and not knowing all his horses are Roach, I was just thinking that since the horse had a name it wouldn't be in any danger...five minutes later: no, my mistake.
posted by kumonoi at 12:00 PM on December 19, 2021
posted by kumonoi at 12:00 PM on December 19, 2021
The old elf who abandons them in the sewer then sacrifices himself to get them aboard the boat looks disturbingly like Critical Role's Matt Mercer to me. I was like, that's Mercer in 15 years.
I'm only 4ish episodes in but overall it seems less of a goofy mess than S1, which I know has made some people dislike it.
I feel like most of the dialogues go on for, like, two lines too long.
posted by fleacircus at 12:15 PM on December 19, 2021
I'm only 4ish episodes in but overall it seems less of a goofy mess than S1, which I know has made some people dislike it.
I feel like most of the dialogues go on for, like, two lines too long.
posted by fleacircus at 12:15 PM on December 19, 2021
First season was so uneven. Some scenes looked wonderful. Then they'd cut to something that looked like a 1970s-era BBC Shakespeare production.
posted by SoberHighland at 1:13 PM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by SoberHighland at 1:13 PM on December 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
I think the show actually is at its best when it's doing a bit of a goofy mess. When it's actually trying to drive to a point it has a tendency to whiplash back and forth for reasons that don't make much internal sense...
The Elves, for example, go from "we'll fight with Nilfgaard in exchange for a home" to "we won't fight because of this one baby" for no reason that is explained (surely they would not expect an about face to come without consequences), other than "because the writers needed to have a reason to kill the baby and have the elves become a biblical plague on Redania for this cool scene someone thought up."
In the final episode Vesemir goes from "gotta kill Ciri" to "OK Geralt I won't kill Ciri" to "nope let's kill her" back to "sorry I tried to kill you, Ciri" in a matter of minutes, again with no real justifiable reasons. It's not character driven, it's plot driven, and poorly so at that.
I agree that this season was very obviously a lot of maneuvering for things to come later, which probably means that Netflix will capriciously cancel the show before it gets there.
posted by axiom at 4:48 PM on December 19, 2021 [8 favorites]
The Elves, for example, go from "we'll fight with Nilfgaard in exchange for a home" to "we won't fight because of this one baby" for no reason that is explained (surely they would not expect an about face to come without consequences), other than "because the writers needed to have a reason to kill the baby and have the elves become a biblical plague on Redania for this cool scene someone thought up."
In the final episode Vesemir goes from "gotta kill Ciri" to "OK Geralt I won't kill Ciri" to "nope let's kill her" back to "sorry I tried to kill you, Ciri" in a matter of minutes, again with no real justifiable reasons. It's not character driven, it's plot driven, and poorly so at that.
I agree that this season was very obviously a lot of maneuvering for things to come later, which probably means that Netflix will capriciously cancel the show before it gets there.
posted by axiom at 4:48 PM on December 19, 2021 [8 favorites]
That final episode was definitely s1 in quality, it's like they seeded the whole dad vs dad between Vesemir and Geralt from early in the season to get to that point of having to sacrifice your child and then realized oh shit, they have 10 minutes left before the season is done, lol. Maybe the stabbing attempt was sufficient, maybe we're not treating that group therapy of a final faceoff significantly enough, ha (i really thought the witchers were each going to take a turn and shout, we love you Ciri!).
posted by cendawanita at 5:06 PM on December 19, 2021
posted by cendawanita at 5:06 PM on December 19, 2021
it is nice to hear the elves openly complaining about superficial human racism in ways that the vulcans have almost always been too repressed and reserved to give voice.
posted by 20 year lurk at 10:34 PM on December 19, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by 20 year lurk at 10:34 PM on December 19, 2021 [2 favorites]
I enjoyed this, having neither read the books nor played the games. A lot of my enjoyment comes from parts of it leaning in an extremely campy direction, like at the end when they meet up with the Wild Hunt and seem to have been transported into a 1982 heavy metal album cover dimension. I could definitely tell there was a big interesting plot behind everything, and the narrative was mercifully much more straightforward than the first season's baroque timeline jumping, but I still feel like large chunks of the larger story went right over my head. Like, apparently Laura Dern has set up a ten-generation genetic time-bomb, which is Ciri? And I still don't quite get who the king with the red-robed bald magician is.
Still, I liked the action overall, the leads were appealing, and the show almost never felt like it was spinning its wheels. (Well, maybe a bit with the elves.) For me the rapid pacing makes up for a lot.
I didn't really understand the logic behind giving Ciri the witcher mutagen. If her blood is needed to make new witchers, wouldn't it be better to not take a chance on her dying during the witcherization process? Also, what if the mutagen changes her blood so that she can no longer create witchers with it because the, like, alchemical properties were changed by the procedure?
posted by whir at 11:45 PM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
Still, I liked the action overall, the leads were appealing, and the show almost never felt like it was spinning its wheels. (Well, maybe a bit with the elves.) For me the rapid pacing makes up for a lot.
I didn't really understand the logic behind giving Ciri the witcher mutagen. If her blood is needed to make new witchers, wouldn't it be better to not take a chance on her dying during the witcherization process? Also, what if the mutagen changes her blood so that she can no longer create witchers with it because the, like, alchemical properties were changed by the procedure?
posted by whir at 11:45 PM on December 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
Also, witchers are sterile, so that ends the elder bloodline.
posted by Quonab at 3:21 AM on December 20, 2021
posted by Quonab at 3:21 AM on December 20, 2021
Something in the taste or grain has been lost between season 1 and 2. Less budget for costumes and more for cgi? Can you actually remember any great costume from S2? There are many in season 1.
Same for location. You could feel some of the polish/mittleeuropen fantasy of its origin in season 1. Now the landscapes and the SGI castles taste exactly like the Anglos think central Europe medieval should be like but are not.
posted by thegirlwiththehat at 4:06 PM on December 20, 2021 [1 favorite]
Same for location. You could feel some of the polish/mittleeuropen fantasy of its origin in season 1. Now the landscapes and the SGI castles taste exactly like the Anglos think central Europe medieval should be like but are not.
posted by thegirlwiththehat at 4:06 PM on December 20, 2021 [1 favorite]
Beauty and the Beast sendup early was interesting, I was wondering where it was going to go.
As mentioned, some of the about-faces and reveals (elfs, Ciri's father) make no sense.
I loved the dockworker and the "didn't make any sense there were multiple timelines" lampshade.
Also we never got the name of the monster that decided to nest on Jaskier's head.
Fingers crossed that season 3 is a little more cohesive now that they've set up the mystery more.
posted by curious nu at 7:29 PM on December 20, 2021
As mentioned, some of the about-faces and reveals (elfs, Ciri's father) make no sense.
I loved the dockworker and the "didn't make any sense there were multiple timelines" lampshade.
Also we never got the name of the monster that decided to nest on Jaskier's head.
Fingers crossed that season 3 is a little more cohesive now that they've set up the mystery more.
posted by curious nu at 7:29 PM on December 20, 2021
The Jaskier & Geralt Buddy Comedy continues to be the show's strongest point. Jaskier & Yen Buddy Comedy equally strong.
I 100% get the impulse to keep Jaskier to small doses, because oversaturation could ruin a good thing.
Converesely, I could definitely go for a show that is entirely Jaskier-driven.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:08 PM on December 20, 2021 [1 favorite]
I 100% get the impulse to keep Jaskier to small doses, because oversaturation could ruin a good thing.
Converesely, I could definitely go for a show that is entirely Jaskier-driven.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:08 PM on December 20, 2021 [1 favorite]
I thought some of Francesca(?)'s costumes were fantastic but agree that overall the costuming didn't stand out quite so much. There were some beautiful dresses but they looked more...generic? That said I did like the dress Yennefer wore when escaping Aretuza, a belted black one with grey shoulder cape, which had a modern/architectural edge more reminiscent of the costumes in season 1.
posted by kumonoi at 11:17 PM on December 20, 2021
posted by kumonoi at 11:17 PM on December 20, 2021
You could feel some of the polish/mittleeuropen fantasy of its origin in season 1. Now the landscapes and the SGI castles taste exactly like the Anglos think central Europe medieval should be like but are not.
Oh totally (one of the few bright spots of the season). Now that I actually am into the show, I've been actively searching for behind-the-scenes stuff, and I'm thinking that we're seeing the one-two-punch impact of COVID and Brexit, both in the SOP probably even down to limiting close interaction between workers but also sourcing and the budget not going as far as before (okay admittedly I'm basing that on drag queens in the pandemic seasons of Drag Race complaining about the difficulty in getting materials). And if it's the UK only, then you won't get non-Anglo European stuff easily, methinks.
posted by cendawanita at 12:40 AM on December 21, 2021 [1 favorite]
Oh totally (one of the few bright spots of the season). Now that I actually am into the show, I've been actively searching for behind-the-scenes stuff, and I'm thinking that we're seeing the one-two-punch impact of COVID and Brexit, both in the SOP probably even down to limiting close interaction between workers but also sourcing and the budget not going as far as before (okay admittedly I'm basing that on drag queens in the pandemic seasons of Drag Race complaining about the difficulty in getting materials). And if it's the UK only, then you won't get non-Anglo European stuff easily, methinks.
posted by cendawanita at 12:40 AM on December 21, 2021 [1 favorite]
I had to get used to the black eyebrows of Ciri at the beginning, but there is a reason, from this article:
Freya Allan: “I was the one who said, ‘I’m so sorry, but if we are’ — which hopefully we will — ‘get to do many more seasons, I am not going to have any eyebrows left if they are bleached every day of The Witcher. They won’t be there anymore.’ .... It was my choice. I said, ‘I think we’re done with the bleached eyebrows. I think that was a bad idea.’ So yeah, ditched the eyebrows. I mean, just got my own usual eyebrows back!”
posted by Pendragon at 1:28 AM on December 21, 2021 [2 favorites]
Freya Allan: “I was the one who said, ‘I’m so sorry, but if we are’ — which hopefully we will — ‘get to do many more seasons, I am not going to have any eyebrows left if they are bleached every day of The Witcher. They won’t be there anymore.’ .... It was my choice. I said, ‘I think we’re done with the bleached eyebrows. I think that was a bad idea.’ So yeah, ditched the eyebrows. I mean, just got my own usual eyebrows back!”
posted by Pendragon at 1:28 AM on December 21, 2021 [2 favorites]
And I still don't quite get who the king with the red-robed bald magician is.
He's King Vizimir of Redania (one of the Northern nations, who united to win the battle of Sodden Hill against Nilfgaard at the end of S1) and the bald guy isn't a mage, he's the head of Redanian intelligence (his name is Dijkstra). The show didn't do a great job of explaining that.
posted by axiom at 3:19 PM on December 21, 2021 [3 favorites]
He's King Vizimir of Redania (one of the Northern nations, who united to win the battle of Sodden Hill against Nilfgaard at the end of S1) and the bald guy isn't a mage, he's the head of Redanian intelligence (his name is Dijkstra). The show didn't do a great job of explaining that.
posted by axiom at 3:19 PM on December 21, 2021 [3 favorites]
the bald guy isn't a mage, he's the head of Redanian intelligence (his name is Dijkstra)
He's not a mage?! So the owl is the Redanian mage?
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 5:37 PM on December 21, 2021
He's not a mage?! So the owl is the Redanian mage?
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 5:37 PM on December 21, 2021
Yes, the owl is a mage, but the show is apparently leaving it until S3 to properly introduce her. There was a shot of her human form at the very end, so I guess she's been cast, but I think that was mostly an Easter egg for those familiar with the books/games.
posted by axiom at 5:58 PM on December 21, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by axiom at 5:58 PM on December 21, 2021 [3 favorites]
Finished this last night and... yeah. I don't know; I'm ambivalent. I've played only a few hours of Witcher 3, tried to read the books and bounced off at the time, but know an okay amount through osmosis interacting with fan friends and fanfiction.
Learning the Deathless Mother was a show-only invention kind of killed the suspension of disbelief I had for her as an antagonist; I can't explain it well. I liked her aesthetic initially, but by the finale I just sat in that knowledge, knowing I was watching someone's OC summon monsters through a hidden monolith in Kaer Morhen (was Vesemir truly unaware? because he looked it) and turning it into Jurassic Park. And then, watching said dinos rip through the remaining Witchers when they are a dying breed anyway, and did no one truly think to check Eskel's shoulder wound? He turned into a tree? Vesemir's emotional whiplash in the finale, too, was kind of ridiculous.
Writers. What are you doing.
And Jaskier's new look was certainly, uh. Something. His interactions with Yen stole the show, however.
I don't mean to be a mega-grouch. I did enjoy a good handful of things this season, enough to continue through to the end, but at this point I'm treating it like Game of Thrones and putting it on while I knit, keeping my emotions a healthy distance away from caring too much.
(I also believe every Roach is usually a mare. I wonder if the newest Roach isn't, which is why Geralt said "not my usual type." RIP to the latest goodest girl. )
posted by lesser weasel at 10:49 PM on December 21, 2021 [2 favorites]
Learning the Deathless Mother was a show-only invention kind of killed the suspension of disbelief I had for her as an antagonist; I can't explain it well. I liked her aesthetic initially, but by the finale I just sat in that knowledge, knowing I was watching someone's OC summon monsters through a hidden monolith in Kaer Morhen (was Vesemir truly unaware? because he looked it) and turning it into Jurassic Park. And then, watching said dinos rip through the remaining Witchers when they are a dying breed anyway, and did no one truly think to check Eskel's shoulder wound? He turned into a tree? Vesemir's emotional whiplash in the finale, too, was kind of ridiculous.
Writers. What are you doing.
And Jaskier's new look was certainly, uh. Something. His interactions with Yen stole the show, however.
I don't mean to be a mega-grouch. I did enjoy a good handful of things this season, enough to continue through to the end, but at this point I'm treating it like Game of Thrones and putting it on while I knit, keeping my emotions a healthy distance away from caring too much.
(I also believe every Roach is usually a mare. I wonder if the newest Roach isn't, which is why Geralt said "not my usual type." RIP to the latest goodest girl. )
posted by lesser weasel at 10:49 PM on December 21, 2021 [2 favorites]
Can someone help me out? I'm watching S2E8, around 10 minutes in, and suddenly the purebred elf baby is dead.
I went back to the last episode and skimmed through, and I couldn't figure out where I missed the baby dying??!? When/how the heck did the baby die?
Did the magical elf messiah baby really die between the scenes, or did I miss a scene that I can't seem to find now? It's implied that Dijkstra killed the baby somehow. hALP I'm losing my mind here.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 2:32 PM on December 22, 2021
I went back to the last episode and skimmed through, and I couldn't figure out where I missed the baby dying??!? When/how the heck did the baby die?
Did the magical elf messiah baby really die between the scenes, or did I miss a scene that I can't seem to find now? It's implied that Dijkstra killed the baby somehow. hALP I'm losing my mind here.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 2:32 PM on December 22, 2021
At the end of Episode 7 (minute 48), when Geralt is holding Yennefer at swordpoint and she recites the incantation thing, it cuts over to the scene where it happens. It's very quick.
posted by BungaDunga at 4:25 PM on December 22, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by BungaDunga at 4:25 PM on December 22, 2021 [2 favorites]
I can't hear "child surprise" without thinking "wait, an illegal chocolate egg?"
posted by BungaDunga at 4:49 PM on December 22, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by BungaDunga at 4:49 PM on December 22, 2021 [5 favorites]
I can only ever think "Is it made with real children?".
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 8:26 AM on December 23, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 8:26 AM on December 23, 2021 [1 favorite]
Okay, I haven't quite finished the season, but I'm glad I'm not the only one who can't tell what's going on. I mean, I'm enjoying it, I just have no idea what's happening or why.
Also, Istredd, get yourself some candles or a light spell or something, it's stressing my eyeballs out that you're reading in the dark.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:58 PM on December 23, 2021 [2 favorites]
Also, Istredd, get yourself some candles or a light spell or something, it's stressing my eyeballs out that you're reading in the dark.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:58 PM on December 23, 2021 [2 favorites]
Okay, wait.
The emperor that everyone is so afraid of is actually ciri's dad? The hedgehog knight?
And he killed everyone in cintra to find his daughter, who would have come running if he just said "hi, I'm alive!"?
Not complaining, just confused.
Next season, I'm hoping for more episodes like the beauty and the beast one. (And a viewer insert character who is dumber than rocks and needs the political situation explained very clearly with maps and crayons.)
posted by Acari at 12:22 PM on December 25, 2021 [3 favorites]
The emperor that everyone is so afraid of is actually ciri's dad? The hedgehog knight?
And he killed everyone in cintra to find his daughter, who would have come running if he just said "hi, I'm alive!"?
Not complaining, just confused.
Next season, I'm hoping for more episodes like the beauty and the beast one. (And a viewer insert character who is dumber than rocks and needs the political situation explained very clearly with maps and crayons.)
posted by Acari at 12:22 PM on December 25, 2021 [3 favorites]
Unpopular opinion here, but I'd be happy if the Witcher was more like fairytale monster of the week, and the main questline faded into the shadowy background. Those are easily my favorite episodes.
Jaskier's magenta leather jacket was definitely from another sphere.
posted by iamkimiam at 4:23 PM on December 26, 2021 [6 favorites]
Jaskier's magenta leather jacket was definitely from another sphere.
posted by iamkimiam at 4:23 PM on December 26, 2021 [6 favorites]
I second Acari's ask for a dopey character who is constantly receiving simplified explanations at center stage. If my stand-in made it onscreen -- and I hope she's as good at ducking under tables as Jaskier -- I would want her to ask if the elven blood thing is why Calanthe appeared as long-lived as Geralt. Last season I thought the answer was just "all the important characters live a long time, shut up," but maybe there's something else happening there?
That said, I had a much easier time following this season than the first. And it was still fun! I love that Geralt tears through humans like tissue paper. It makes sense, but a lesser show might've tried to make the Geralt-vs-armed-goons more suspenseful and that would've been a shame. He fights dragons and stuff as his day job, of course he can take out a small band of goons in less than a minute. Normally I'd find a season with a depowered character frustrating, but I liked that they made Yennefer < Oprah voice > DEpowered, not powerLESS. And Jaskier's break-up song was good, too. Very Taylor Swift.
I have to admit the inhabitants of the Witcher house were not what I was expecting. Or, as @meakoopa put it, how come Geralt of Rivia is big as a house and has an ass upon which i could build my church but when we meet the other Witchers they're just schlubby guys
posted by grandiloquiet at 8:49 PM on December 26, 2021
That said, I had a much easier time following this season than the first. And it was still fun! I love that Geralt tears through humans like tissue paper. It makes sense, but a lesser show might've tried to make the Geralt-vs-armed-goons more suspenseful and that would've been a shame. He fights dragons and stuff as his day job, of course he can take out a small band of goons in less than a minute. Normally I'd find a season with a depowered character frustrating, but I liked that they made Yennefer < Oprah voice > DEpowered, not powerLESS. And Jaskier's break-up song was good, too. Very Taylor Swift.
I have to admit the inhabitants of the Witcher house were not what I was expecting. Or, as @meakoopa put it, how come Geralt of Rivia is big as a house and has an ass upon which i could build my church but when we meet the other Witchers they're just schlubby guys
posted by grandiloquiet at 8:49 PM on December 26, 2021
They're all very fit! He's just extra fit lmao. (Fanwank theory i like is that it's the fact he went thru the trials/mutagens twice. The hotness is compensation.)
...want her to ask if the elven blood thing is why Calanthe appeared as long-lived as Geralt. Last season I thought the answer was just "all the important characters live a long time, shut up," but maybe there's something else happening there?
Omg that could be it. Damn that was horrendously plotted season. Lampshading in stupid points but not at points like these. Then again, what about Jaskier?
posted by cendawanita at 9:33 PM on December 26, 2021
...want her to ask if the elven blood thing is why Calanthe appeared as long-lived as Geralt. Last season I thought the answer was just "all the important characters live a long time, shut up," but maybe there's something else happening there?
Omg that could be it. Damn that was horrendously plotted season. Lampshading in stupid points but not at points like these. Then again, what about Jaskier?
posted by cendawanita at 9:33 PM on December 26, 2021
I wish more and more that they hadn't made Cavill wear colored contacts, because it really mutes the emotion he's able to show in quieter moments (like when he gave the horse a mercy stroke). In The Crown, people complained that they didn't give Olivia Colman colored contacts or CGI to make her eyes blue like the queen's, but the directors realized it limited her performance. I keep thinking about that when they show Cavill in close-up having feelings about something, and his creepy contacts mean his eyes don't do what his face is doing.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:20 PM on December 27, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:20 PM on December 27, 2021 [3 favorites]
why Calanthe appeared as long-lived as Geralt.
I'm not sure I'm understanding you....
Chronologically the first appearance of Calanthe is during the betrothal party for Pavetta. The last appearance is during the invasion of Cintra. That's only 13-14 years so I wouldn't expect her appearance to change much.
posted by Pendragon at 3:43 PM on December 30, 2021
I'm not sure I'm understanding you....
Chronologically the first appearance of Calanthe is during the betrothal party for Pavetta. The last appearance is during the invasion of Cintra. That's only 13-14 years so I wouldn't expect her appearance to change much.
posted by Pendragon at 3:43 PM on December 30, 2021
Unpopular opinion here, but I'd be happy if the Witcher was more like fairytale monster of the week, and the main questline faded into the shadowy background.
Same! I was really hoping for more episodes like the first one with the beauty and the beast fairytale monster hunt. I would have loved to have seen more episodes of Geralt begrudgingly taking Cirri along on adventures and training her to fight like a Witcher and his general grumpy dad kind of thing.
posted by litera scripta manet at 8:52 AM on December 31, 2021 [5 favorites]
Same! I was really hoping for more episodes like the first one with the beauty and the beast fairytale monster hunt. I would have loved to have seen more episodes of Geralt begrudgingly taking Cirri along on adventures and training her to fight like a Witcher and his general grumpy dad kind of thing.
posted by litera scripta manet at 8:52 AM on December 31, 2021 [5 favorites]
Also, I wish Yennefer had spent more time at Arethusa, because I love her interactions with Tissaia.
Speaking of Yennefer, am I the only one who doesn't really buy her chemistry with Geralt? Like, yes, they are both super hot, and I get that the show wants me to see them as this epic, star crossed lovers romantic pairing, but I just don't really feel it. I think Yen had more chemistry with Istrid that with Geralt, and Geralt had more chemistry with Triss in S1 (maybe not so much in S2) and definitely more with Renfrey (?? is that the name of murder princess from S1 E1).
With all that being said, I find this show very enjoyable to watch. I absolutely love watching Geralt being a grumbly, reluctant, but actually pretty solid father figure (considering all his baggage). Although on the whole, i actually think I preferred S1 overall. I definitely preferred Yen in S1 vs S2.
I would have liked more Jaskier. But I do love Jaskier and Yen teaming up. That was fun.
posted by litera scripta manet at 8:58 AM on December 31, 2021 [1 favorite]
Speaking of Yennefer, am I the only one who doesn't really buy her chemistry with Geralt? Like, yes, they are both super hot, and I get that the show wants me to see them as this epic, star crossed lovers romantic pairing, but I just don't really feel it. I think Yen had more chemistry with Istrid that with Geralt, and Geralt had more chemistry with Triss in S1 (maybe not so much in S2) and definitely more with Renfrey (?? is that the name of murder princess from S1 E1).
With all that being said, I find this show very enjoyable to watch. I absolutely love watching Geralt being a grumbly, reluctant, but actually pretty solid father figure (considering all his baggage). Although on the whole, i actually think I preferred S1 overall. I definitely preferred Yen in S1 vs S2.
I would have liked more Jaskier. But I do love Jaskier and Yen teaming up. That was fun.
posted by litera scripta manet at 8:58 AM on December 31, 2021 [1 favorite]
I read some of the books, haven't played the games, but I enjoyed both S1 and S2 of The Witcher. My main complaint is that S2 seemed more... dark? melodramatic? unfunny? than the first one. I get that their world is at war and that dark things are happening all around them, but in The Year of Our Lord 2022, I would appreciate more light in my life.
I also don't like Yennefer and would love a "monster-of-the-week with Geralt and friends" type of show. Perhaps Netflix could do that after they're done with Hissrich's story?
posted by gakiko at 1:41 AM on January 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
I also don't like Yennefer and would love a "monster-of-the-week with Geralt and friends" type of show. Perhaps Netflix could do that after they're done with Hissrich's story?
posted by gakiko at 1:41 AM on January 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
I finished season 2 last night and enjoyed it as silly fun. I was quite happy to see Yennefer get her chaos back and am really hoping we get to see her absolutely fuck up that other fire mage, particularly if he underestimates her from their past interaction.
posted by knapah at 1:06 AM on January 14, 2022
posted by knapah at 1:06 AM on January 14, 2022
You are not logged in, either login or create an account to post comments
posted by cendawanita at 8:48 PM on December 17, 2021 [3 favorites]