Fargo: Loplop
November 30, 2015 8:56 PM - Season 2, Episode 8 - Subscribe

Hanzee searches for Peggy and Ed. Dodd ends up in unfamiliar territory.
posted by komara (51 comments total) 3 users marked this as a favorite
 
Hanzee is done with everybody's bullshit.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 8:58 PM on November 30, 2015 [11 favorites]


I can not tell you how irrationally excited I am about this show. I know all good things must end, but I really don't want it to.

Favorite line from tonight:

Peggy: "I hardly stuck him."
Dodd: "I'm hurt real bad."

Coen references: the newspaper blowing across the parking lot after Ed finished his phone call was reminiscent of both the hat in Miller's Crossing and the newspaper in The Hudsucker Proxy. The conversation between Hanzee and the shop owner was straight out of No Country for Old Men ... except for the line, "He said, 'We're going crazy down there at the lake'" being pulled from Fargo.

Okay so Hanzee's menace is a totally different kind from Anton Chigurh's, and the show didn't have space to give the scene the same gravity as the movie had, but still. Great ominous threat there.

I absolutely loved the scene with the haircut. I was as tense there as while watching anything else in recent memory. It came across such an intentional betrayal of self, and I couldn't help but feel sadness for Hanzee, and then to have him literally pull away from his decision, and that slow-motion shot of the scissors on empty air ... man. It was by no means made explicit but I couldn't help but think of Samson and his power as well.
posted by komara at 9:06 PM on November 30, 2015 [3 favorites]


In an episode full of highlights, that poorly-considered handleless knife grab might be my favourite.
posted by Sys Rq at 9:22 PM on November 30, 2015 [5 favorites]


It was by no means explicit

Dodd name-dropped Samson earlier on in his misogynistic rant, so it kind of was. But the moral of the story, I think, is that there are worse things than strength-sapping haircuts. Like getting stabbed, for example.
posted by Sys Rq at 9:26 PM on November 30, 2015 [3 favorites]


"Dodd name-dropped Samson earlier on in his misogynistic rant, so it kind of was."

I had totally forgotten that. Guess that shows what put it in my head.
posted by komara at 10:23 PM on November 30, 2015


Somebody hand Kirsten Dunst her Emmy; that was a virtuoso performance.
posted by The Gooch at 10:24 PM on November 30, 2015 [14 favorites]


am i crazy for seeing echoes of Antichrist in this episode, specifically peggy's abuse of dodd? his line about satan being a woman seemed particularly lars von trier-y to me. kirsten dunst of course was the star of his next film melancholia, where her character was clinically depressed. she's super underrated, i hope her performance in this series gets serious awards attention. (scott tobias at the new york times compares the episode's plot to Misery, which also isn't far off)

this show astounds me at every turn. part of the fun this season has been trying to determine which member of the ensemble would end up being the incredible force of chaotic violence, see: malvo or chigur. i've had my money on hanzee over milligan this whole season, and i think so far he best fits the description lou gave in season one, "I'd call it an animal, except animals only kill for food." hanzee sets himself apart from malvo because the show has made it possible to understand where hanzee is coming from. malvo gets his kicks out of chaos, hanzee seems to be looking for reparations.

and one last hurrah for jeffory donovan. his performance this episode was delirious and wonderful, he seemed like he was truly losing his mind alongside peggy - and for good reason. it's easy to dismiss dodd gerhardt as a peice of shit human, but donovan gave him such charisma that i almost kind of liked the guy, even as i hated him.
posted by JimBennett at 11:54 PM on November 30, 2015 [3 favorites]


Erstwhile!

That horizontal split screen with Hanzee was beautiful, with the lower half slowing rising up.

I knew Hanzee was going to flip when he saw that plaque but I didn't realize how quickly and how hard.

The early scene with Peggy and Ed in the car, both talking past each other, was like a verbal split screen.

I haven't yet read up on the colors used, but I loved seeing the maroon uniform through the trees. I'm going to find those links now.

I was as tense there as while watching anything else in recent memory.
The earlier scene, too, when she was watching the tv.

More Coen references: was that the same thing on the tv at first as was playing on the tv in Fargo? The nature show? Also, Hanzee telling Peggy, No funny stuff is a nod to Lebowski and Blood Simple.

"Hon, you gotta stop stabbin' him."

Dodd: I'm gonna have fun taking her apart.
Ed: No.

I can not tell you how irrationally excited I am about this show.

Me, too! Conversely, the ads for the OJ Simpson thing are filling me with the dread. My only consolation about this ending is the return of Better Call Saul.

Where are Dodd's three other daughters?

So, what was the hangman game in the phone booth? S _ O _ X F _ L L. Okay Sioux Falls, but any other meaning?

(Apologies about last week, I accidentally referenced the scenes from next week clip. It sounds more confused than spoilers but feel free to flag it.)
posted by Room 641-A at 12:00 AM on December 1, 2015


Loplop
posted by Room 641-A at 12:03 AM on December 1, 2015 [4 favorites]


I was wrong about Hanzee's loyalty to the Gerhardt family. Today was a real bad day to call him "halfbreed" and "mongrel".

From reddit: Bruce Campbell was on the TV in the cabin in the original movie. So it was fitting that Peggy is watching a young Reagan movie in this cabin's TV with poor reception.
posted by Gary at 1:08 AM on December 1, 2015


I watched with headphones on, and it was glorious how they split the stereo of the phone conversations to match the split screens.
posted by transient at 3:53 AM on December 1, 2015 [2 favorites]


Hanzee might still consider himself loyal to the Gerhardts and see Dodd as also going against the family by wanting to do things on the DL. Whether Floyd would see it that way is hard to tell. I'm sure Bear is just fine with it.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:53 AM on December 1, 2015


Man, what an episode! And, Kirsten Dunst? She owned it.

When Ed left the cabin the final time, and they had the wide show of him, Peggy, and Dodd, I noticed that Dodd was sitting with his hips way forward from the back of the chair, and I thought to myself "Oh no! He's worked the ropes loose!" It was a neat detail that they didn't once draw attention to. I still don't understand why Dodd didn't kill Peggy outright. Unless he's one of those "never gets his own hands dirty" leaders? Have we ever seen Dodd do the violence/killing himself?

I loved how this entire episode was a filling-in of all the holes we talked about after last week's show.

I got my wish to see Hanzee turn and take-out Dodd. I have a feeling we'll see a scene between Hanzee and Bear, where Bear will struggle with his loyalty to family and his thinking of Hanzee as family, and his hatred of Dodd.

I loved how the previews from last week made it seem as if Hank was going to be wounded in a shootout or some such. The actual payoff was a good chuckle.

Hanzee's killing rampage is kind of interesting. The show takes great pains to show him doing the killing, yet we don't see him kill the store owner and Constance in the hotel. I get the feeling the show is saying "If you don't see him kill them, they are still alive". We know the store owner is alive, since the cops show-up at the cabin. We have no idea about Constance. Though, Hanzee's request for a haircut, and his reason for it, makes me wonder if Constance didn't talk some self-actualization lessons into his head...just be who you want to be.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:10 AM on December 1, 2015 [2 favorites]


Goddamn, this season is spectacular. I can't believe how much better it is than the first season, and the first season wasn't awful by any means.

I wanted to laugh so many times but at the same time I was on the edge of my seat waiting for something appalling to happen, and it did and then it changed into something else and then it was followed up by something even better (and more appalling - Ed's face turning aubergine, Hanzee trying for a change of heart but knowing he was doomed at the last second).

I'm devastated at the thought of there only being two episodes to go and yet at the same time I can't wait to see how everything ties together.
posted by h00py at 6:36 AM on December 1, 2015 [2 favorites]


yet we don't see him kill the store owner and Constance in the hote

I've only seen it once so far, but when Constance says, "I tried" it very subtly looks like Hanzee grabbed her by the back of the head to force her to give him a blow job. Maybe some kind of statement on the predator become the prey? Or he could have slit her throat. But both characters did cooperate to the best of their ability. I got the sense that Hanzee made a deliberate calculation to leave the store owner alive because I also thought he was going to come back and kill him because he saw him pick up the phone.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:01 AM on December 1, 2015


"I still don't understand why Dodd didn't kill Peggy outright."

My guess is that he thinks all women are beneath him, and he legitimately never once considered her a threat once he was untied. You've seen how he feels about his mom being in charge, and how he's treated his daughter. His misogyny (and hubris) was the road to his undoing.
posted by komara at 7:46 AM on December 1, 2015 [3 favorites]


Agreed. And I don't want to think about too hard, but it's possible he had more in store for Peggy and just wanted her to stop talking for a few minutes. Also, it looks like he was setting up Ed for a murder-suicide, so that may have required more planning.

I like the way a previous episode (when Lou is reading to Molly), mentioned measles and this episode mentioned global warming. Dumb hippies! I'm not going to read too much into it, but television as messaging tool is relevant to my interests.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:08 AM on December 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


This episode is amazing. It's just so beautiful and poetic. I sound like a sap but it is. I can't wait to watch it again.

As soon as I saw the hangman puzzle on the phone booth, I knew someone was going to get hung. All that rope! I mean....wow. That was a lot of rope. And I kept thinking...why don't they secure his legs?

Kirsten Dunst fucking slayed.

Like Chigur, the men in Fargo don't like to change their minds or back down from a killing. Thinking of the scene with the wife in the bedroom in No Country for Old Men, when she says, "You don't have to do this".
posted by the webmistress at 8:31 AM on December 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


Can I just say that I fucking nailed it.
posted by maxsparber at 9:16 AM on December 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


As soon as I saw the hangman puzzle on the phone booth, I knew someone was going to get hung.

Gah. Even after watching the episode twice I didn't make the connection. I'm so bad at this!
posted by Room 641-A at 1:09 PM on December 1, 2015 [2 favorites]


I love how Hanzee left the bar guys with wounded knees.
posted by essexjan at 2:32 PM on December 1, 2015 [46 favorites]


Can someone explain the reason for the split screen when Peggy and Ed are sitting next to each other in the car?
I mean, they're in different realities, sure, but that's obvious and doesn't need emphasis.
I'm not saying I didn't like it because I DID like it but I don't know what it was for.
posted by Jode at 3:19 PM on December 1, 2015


"I still don't understand why Dodd didn't kill Peggy outright."

Because he was planning to kill her slowly... and he's an idiot/underestimating her.

And I'm loving fully actualized Peggie, Give Dunst all the awards
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 3:48 PM on December 1, 2015


I think you nailed it, Jode. I noticed that even the photography was slightly different, with Peggy's side being sharper and clearer and Ed's side a bit fuzzier.
posted by Thorzdad at 3:48 PM on December 1, 2015


Interestingly, the times they had the literal split screen were the times in their conversation that they were on the same page.
posted by Room 641-A at 3:49 PM on December 1, 2015


King liked it
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 4:08 PM on December 1, 2015 [3 favorites]


I've gotta say have a theme of absurdity and chaos could have be terrible, but it's been amazing
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 4:10 PM on December 1, 2015


UFO Alert: the symbols at Hank's are also on the wall at the bar.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:19 PM on December 1, 2015 [9 favorites]


Can someone explain the reason for the split screen when Peggy and Ed are sitting next to each other in the car?
I mean, they're in different realities, sure, but that's obvious and doesn't need emphasis.
I'm not saying I didn't like it because I DID like it but I don't know what it was for.


Possible artsy explanation: It shows that, as much as they're coming together, they are very much still in two separate bubbles.

Possible practical explanation: There was a lot in the 2-shot that didn't work, but all the closeup coverage was shot from that same angle, so just cutting it like a regular scene would look like total ass. But if you just plunk the good take right on top of the bad one, hey, that sort of works, almost!
posted by Sys Rq at 6:26 PM on December 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


UFO Alert: the symbols at Hank's are also on the wall at the bar.

I saw that. I wondered if those aren't Native American pictograms. Maybe Hank is an amateur scholar?
posted by codacorolla at 6:48 PM on December 1, 2015


I'm not certain about the UFO/pictograms deal either -- they certainly could pass for cattle brands. Has this been eliminated?

I don't know why they'd have been in the office, but in a bar in South Dakota it makes sense.
posted by mr. digits at 6:53 PM on December 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


Can someone explain the reason for the split screen when Peggy and Ed are sitting next to each other in the car?
I mean, they're in different realities, sure, but that's obvious and doesn't need emphasis.
I'm not saying I didn't like it because I DID like it but I don't know what it was for.


This show, like Breaking Bad and Deutschland 83 are spectacular live action graphic novels to me. The paneling effect of the splitscreens just fits right in to that.
posted by juiceCake at 7:03 PM on December 1, 2015 [2 favorites]


I thought Thorzdad's UFO link from last week had the symbols. I can't fast forward to check now.

I feel like there was so much at Hank's that I'm not sure when in the story's timeline he would have a chance to make something so elaborate without being noticed.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:08 PM on December 1, 2015


My girlfriend immediately solved the hangman game: Sioux Falls.

It's like the phone booth itself was telling Ed that someone was going to get hanged in Sioux Falls.

But, then, the long Reagan movie was telling Peggy that someone would try to shoot someone and would need to be injured in the back to stop them before they took their weapon and staggered off.

And the newspapers told everybody that Hanzee was coming to town.

I don't know that the UFO thing is ever going to be solved. It seems lifted from The Man Who Wasn't There, and is just as inexplicable there. Ultimately, maybe the only point of them is that there is mystery in the world, and messages, and both are important if you can figure out how to read them.
posted by maxsparber at 10:09 PM on December 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


As well of the symbols in the bar there's also a load of signs / clippings - most are hard/impossible to read but there's something that looks like a cartoon alien / spaceship plus 'FUTURE IS HERE' and 'LOOK OUT BEHIND YOU and 'I BREAK FOR JACKELOPES' is clearly visible
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 2:09 AM on December 2, 2015 [1 favorite]




They're not kidding about Minnesota being UFO crazy in the 1970s. There was even a museum at the top of Minneapolis' skyscraper, the IDS Tower, called UFO Alert.
posted by maxsparber at 6:21 AM on December 2, 2015 [1 favorite]


"UFO Alert: the symbols at Hank's are also on the wall at the bar."

"I saw that. I wondered if those aren't Native American pictograms."


Considering the attitude of everyone in that bar I think a Native American pictogram is the absolute last thing they'd have on the wall.
posted by komara at 6:54 AM on December 2, 2015 [2 favorites]


Stephen King: "The current episode of FARGO may be the best thing on TV in the last three years. Terrifying and hilarious."
posted by komara at 6:55 AM on December 2, 2015 [4 favorites]


No love for Under The Dome, Steve?
posted by maxsparber at 6:59 AM on December 2, 2015 [4 favorites]


No love for Under The Dome, Steve?

He wrote this letter in 2013 about the series while in its first season. The first season was... somewhat tolerable. I'm curious to know what he thought of the second and third. (And to be fair, he wrote the first episode of S2.)

Anyway.
posted by 2ht at 7:12 AM on December 2, 2015


The Vince Gilligan interview with Kevin Pollack I mentioned a few weeks ago has been posted. Somewhere in the middle he talks about both season one of Fargo (he hadn't seen season two yet) and working with Jesse Plemons, but the whole thing is worth a listen.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:29 AM on December 2, 2015 [1 favorite]


I'm not certain about the UFO/pictograms deal either -- they certainly could pass for cattle brands. Has this been eliminated?

My thought was alchemical symbols.
posted by listen, lady at 4:43 AM on December 3, 2015


I knew Hanzee was going to flip when he saw that plaque but I didn't realize how quickly and how hard.

I missed this. What plaque?
posted by jeffamaphone at 1:15 PM on December 3, 2015


"Here were hanged 22 Sioux Indians May 25th 1882"

Someone had puked right under it. There's a screencap in this review.
posted by Gary at 1:51 PM on December 3, 2015


Ah, thanks. I remember the puke but missed the plaque. I'm going to need to re-watch both S1 and S2 in a big ol' binge when they're done.
posted by jeffamaphone at 2:13 PM on December 3, 2015




Aww. I was kinda hoping that Season 3 would start with

THIS IS A TRUE STORY.

THE EVENTS DEPICTED IN THIS FILM WILL TAKE PLACE IN MINNESOTA IN 2017...
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:49 PM on December 3, 2015 [6 favorites]


I've only seen it once so far, but when Constance says, "I tried" it very subtly looks like Hanzee grabbed her by the back of the head to force her to give him a...

No, I think he was holding and stroking her exactly like the rabbit in the earlier episode...
posted by mmoncur at 12:59 AM on December 8, 2015 [11 favorites]


Late to post, but the Hanzee arc is the darker vision of a 70's series of films about, you guessed it, a Native American Vietnam vet, getting justice. The Billy Jack series was iconic and some Hanzee scenes reminded me of the films. In the bar, Hanzee is told that he is not American even with his three tours of duty, purple heart and bronze star. Also, when he says "your welcome" to the bartender it is ironic when members of the public would thank servicemen for their sacrifice in war. It is even weirder when you know that the chief officer held responsible for the Mai Lai Massacre, William Calley, was pardoned and served two years of house arrest and showered with accolades by conservatives. There are no thanks for a First Nations member.

Hanzee was raised with the Gerharts since the age of eight but always separate and excluded. The closest to outreach was Ber and that did not work out. Notice that Hanzee is never invited to eat nor drink inside the house nor do we see him doing those things. He gets his water from the outside faucet and Ber talks about the family table being a conditional reward based on loyalty.

I was not surprised by Hanzee. Someone had to shoot the rednecks in the knee. And Ber was right, there was going to be a reckoning regarding Dodd. Simone was prescient, the Gerharts did inherit the ground, but not Hanzee, he was never a Gerhart.
posted by jadepearl at 8:28 PM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


This show does the Supernatural thing with South Dakota geography - pine trees everywhere! The Canistota/Lake Vermillion/Sioux Falls area is all flat grassland for the most part, the pine trees and hills are over in the far west part of the state in the Black Hills.

Not that this detracts from the show! Loving my first, albeit late, watch of it. But dang, it seems like showrunners see the Mount Rushmore scenes in North By Northwest and think they know the lay of the land...
posted by jason_steakums at 4:49 PM on May 9, 2016 [2 favorites]


« Older Transparent: Kina Hora...   |  Crazy Ex-Girlfriend: My Mom, G... Newer »

You are not logged in, either login or create an account to post comments

poster