The Walking Dead: Twice as Far
March 20, 2016 6:54 PM - Season 6, Episode 14 - Subscribe
Denise finds a drink (Crush) and Eugene finds a snack (crush).
We suddenly learn someone's backstory, which is never a good thing. This character almost dies, but doesn't die, but then does die, but then it seems like maybe not, but then, yep.
We suddenly learn someone's backstory, which is never a good thing. This character almost dies, but doesn't die, but then does die, but then it seems like maybe not, but then, yep.
What did Denise see in the sink?
posted by A Bad Catholic at 7:06 PM on March 20, 2016
posted by A Bad Catholic at 7:06 PM on March 20, 2016
It was a child's leg. The person in the cast drowned a toddler because it wouldn't keep quiet.
(Why isn't the toddler zombified? WALKING DEAD, THAT'S WHY. We don't need no fucking consistent internal logic on this show.)
posted by tobascodagama at 7:08 PM on March 20, 2016 [2 favorites]
(Why isn't the toddler zombified? WALKING DEAD, THAT'S WHY. We don't need no fucking consistent internal logic on this show.)
posted by tobascodagama at 7:08 PM on March 20, 2016 [2 favorites]
Braving a walker for a six pack of sodas? Now that has to be one of the dumbest things I've ever seen.
posted by Roger Pittman at 7:35 PM on March 20, 2016
posted by Roger Pittman at 7:35 PM on March 20, 2016
They sure made Denise turn dumb before they axelcuted her. It's one thing to want to get some zombie-killing experience, but you don't wander off on your own (twice) to go do it.
posted by cardboard at 7:39 PM on March 20, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cardboard at 7:39 PM on March 20, 2016 [1 favorite]
And why would the two veterans just turn their backs on the only doctor, knowing that she's inexperienced and doing reckless stuff?
For that matter, why are people allowed to just go out randomly wandering beyond the walls when they know there's a hostile group that they've pissed off?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:44 PM on March 20, 2016 [8 favorites]
For that matter, why are people allowed to just go out randomly wandering beyond the walls when they know there's a hostile group that they've pissed off?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:44 PM on March 20, 2016 [8 favorites]
Why do lesbians and bi women always die? thread on the blue.
posted by cashman at 7:47 PM on March 20, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cashman at 7:47 PM on March 20, 2016 [1 favorite]
My positive comment for this episode: since it brought back the guy who stole Daryl's bike, I guess it retroactively made that awful, boring, terrible episode retroactively 1 iota less terrible. Maybe. I guess at best we can say that horrendous episode existed for a reason.
posted by gatorae at 8:14 PM on March 20, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 8:14 PM on March 20, 2016 [2 favorites]
I liked the part where she barfed on her glasses. That was maybe my favourite moment in the whole series so far. It made me laugh, and I'm pretty sure that was on purpose for once!
Braving a walker for a six pack of sodas? Now that has to be one of the dumbest things I've ever seen.
Oh, it's even dumber than that; she didn't know there was anything in that cooler at all. For all she knew, she was risking her life for a half-eaten bologna sandwich that had been roasting in a hot car for two years. Besides, the area had rather obviously already been thoroughly picked clean of anything of use, what with the suitcases and whatnot strewn about.
It still wasn't as dumb as all the yelling. STOP YELLING, PEOPLE! People do a lot of dumb shit on this show, but that is always the dumbest.
posted by Sys Rq at 8:30 PM on March 20, 2016 [2 favorites]
Braving a walker for a six pack of sodas? Now that has to be one of the dumbest things I've ever seen.
Oh, it's even dumber than that; she didn't know there was anything in that cooler at all. For all she knew, she was risking her life for a half-eaten bologna sandwich that had been roasting in a hot car for two years. Besides, the area had rather obviously already been thoroughly picked clean of anything of use, what with the suitcases and whatnot strewn about.
It still wasn't as dumb as all the yelling. STOP YELLING, PEOPLE! People do a lot of dumb shit on this show, but that is always the dumbest.
posted by Sys Rq at 8:30 PM on March 20, 2016 [2 favorites]
Oh, also, notice how Daryl stopped the truck safely behind the stop line at the tracks? That's smart, 'cause you never know when the next zombie train might be due. Besides, you wouldn't want to get a ticket.
posted by Sys Rq at 8:43 PM on March 20, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Sys Rq at 8:43 PM on March 20, 2016 [8 favorites]
Wow, am I pissed-off that they killed Denise. What a way to waste an Emmy-winning actor.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 11:14 PM on March 20, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 11:14 PM on March 20, 2016 [18 favorites]
On the other hand, what a way to no longer waste an Emmy-winning actor.
posted by Sys Rq at 12:57 AM on March 21, 2016 [23 favorites]
posted by Sys Rq at 12:57 AM on March 21, 2016 [23 favorites]
Denise's demise was to display the irony of a noob surviving two walker encounters only to be taken out by Daryl's crossbow fired at someone else.
Daryl wouldn't have missed.
posted by arzakh at 4:11 AM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Daryl wouldn't have missed.
posted by arzakh at 4:11 AM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Alexandrian is the new Redshirt
posted by The Gooch at 5:57 AM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by The Gooch at 5:57 AM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
I stopped watching this show two episodes ago and I now only read the Fanfare threads. It improved my enjoyment of this show immensely.
posted by Pendragon at 6:08 AM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Pendragon at 6:08 AM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
So this also continued the issues the show has with women. Several times in this show when a woman has abilities, she has to immediately turn around and explain that a man taught them to her. Denise says she's been driving stick since she was 15 years old, then they have her say that her brother taught her. Why? I hate that.
In the first season, I think it was Amy and Andrea that had to explain on screen why they knew how to fish -their father. A season or two later, one of the women on the wall at the governor's place, if I remember correctly, had to explain how she knew how to shoot a crossbow. Her dad taught her.
I have yet to see this show have male characters be written to say dialogue that has them explain how they had to have a woman teach them some moderately normal skill they had before the zombie apocalypse happened.
And by itself it probably wouldn't be more than a passing note, but this show routinely has regular-character women get injured and die in just ridiculously dumb and inconsequential ways. From Amy walking off by herself to use the bathroom to Beth's death, to Denise. Andrea's death was stupid. Without rehashing every single one, most of them have been dumb. Jacqui. Lori. Jessie. Dumb.
Overall I thought this episode was poor anyway. The weird repetition, the blurry fade outs, the corny dialogue for the most part, it was just bad. The music was even poor during Denise's death, and Bear McCreary doesn't usually mess that up that bad.
And just to make sure I hated it, they had Carol leave at the end.
posted by cashman at 6:24 AM on March 21, 2016 [18 favorites]
In the first season, I think it was Amy and Andrea that had to explain on screen why they knew how to fish -their father. A season or two later, one of the women on the wall at the governor's place, if I remember correctly, had to explain how she knew how to shoot a crossbow. Her dad taught her.
I have yet to see this show have male characters be written to say dialogue that has them explain how they had to have a woman teach them some moderately normal skill they had before the zombie apocalypse happened.
And by itself it probably wouldn't be more than a passing note, but this show routinely has regular-character women get injured and die in just ridiculously dumb and inconsequential ways. From Amy walking off by herself to use the bathroom to Beth's death, to Denise. Andrea's death was stupid. Without rehashing every single one, most of them have been dumb. Jacqui. Lori. Jessie. Dumb.
Overall I thought this episode was poor anyway. The weird repetition, the blurry fade outs, the corny dialogue for the most part, it was just bad. The music was even poor during Denise's death, and Bear McCreary doesn't usually mess that up that bad.
And just to make sure I hated it, they had Carol leave at the end.
posted by cashman at 6:24 AM on March 21, 2016 [18 favorites]
Are we sure there's no additional foreshadowing they could give us that Abraham is about to die a horrible fucking death?
Also, I would like to point out that the last time Carol went walking the earth like Kane in Kung-Fu, our crew ended up in mortal danger from a settlement of wackjobs. At this point, Carol returned triumphantly and laid waste to those motherfuckers in beautiful, horrifying glory.
I kind of suspect at some point, she'll re-emerge to save some folks again.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:01 AM on March 21, 2016 [3 favorites]
Also, I would like to point out that the last time Carol went walking the earth like Kane in Kung-Fu, our crew ended up in mortal danger from a settlement of wackjobs. At this point, Carol returned triumphantly and laid waste to those motherfuckers in beautiful, horrifying glory.
I kind of suspect at some point, she'll re-emerge to save some folks again.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:01 AM on March 21, 2016 [3 favorites]
The one thing I will say I liked is that there was at least some thematic unity in the two plots of people going on runs outside, with the focus on whether people who've depended on others to save their lives can become survivors of their own accord.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:08 AM on March 21, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:08 AM on March 21, 2016 [2 favorites]
The weird repetition, the blurry fade outs, the corny dialogue for the most part, it was just bad.
Every time the show focuses on some random bit of scenery and holds the shot there for no reason, I just want to point at the TV and say, "I know Breaking Bad, Breaking Bad was a friend of mine. You, sir, are no Breaking Bad."
posted by tobascodagama at 8:23 AM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
Every time the show focuses on some random bit of scenery and holds the shot there for no reason, I just want to point at the TV and say, "I know Breaking Bad, Breaking Bad was a friend of mine. You, sir, are no Breaking Bad."
posted by tobascodagama at 8:23 AM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
I wasn't sure if there was some sort of deep symbolism in the jars of tomato sauce that the camera kept lingering on in the pantry.
posted by gatorae at 9:10 AM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 9:10 AM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
The ONE good thing in this episode was an example of show, don't tell, that sort of worked. The story of the pharmacist and his/her child was told in shorthand: photos of a child on the floor, pharmacist (or whoever) in the cast, "HUSH" scrawled on the walls, child's foot sticking out of the water.
And outside, behind Denise, the walls are smeared with the bloody handprints of dozens of zombies attracted by the child's cries, until its mother/father was forced to drown it.
The first half was still driven home too hard, but the handprints outside told a horrible, M.A.S.H.-finale story.
posted by tracicle at 9:47 AM on March 21, 2016 [16 favorites]
And outside, behind Denise, the walls are smeared with the bloody handprints of dozens of zombies attracted by the child's cries, until its mother/father was forced to drown it.
The first half was still driven home too hard, but the handprints outside told a horrible, M.A.S.H.-finale story.
posted by tracicle at 9:47 AM on March 21, 2016 [16 favorites]
What I hated about the parent/child story was that it actually was extra depressing compared to what they normally encounter, but Rosita's attitude was basically 'OMG DUH THIS IS WHAT THE WORLD IS NOW, YOU GIANT BABY!', when I think that would have shaken quite a number of them to see. Especially Michonne and Carol.
posted by gatorae at 12:10 PM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 12:10 PM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
This episode was pretty heavy with picking up threads from the comics, ranging from bigger stuff (like Dwight returning), the arrow through the eye death (though the victim was different), to the minor: beef jerky casserole!
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:21 PM on March 21, 2016
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:21 PM on March 21, 2016
Carol is not getting back on the path to badassdom. She's on the path to Morgan's "least harm" philosophy. All the significant-but-unexplained cutaways to Morgan point to it. That & her "sick of death dealing" attitude. Though she will be faced with the choice of helping Rick's crew or following Morgan, eventually.
posted by scalefree at 12:37 PM on March 21, 2016
posted by scalefree at 12:37 PM on March 21, 2016
Maybe Carol will be reunited with Dawson.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:12 PM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:12 PM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
That whole pharmacy run was so badly done. Instead of having our only doctor write down a list of what medications would be useful (and still viable after a couple of years in the back of an abandoned building), let's take her--again, our only doctor--out into the postapocalyptic wasteland, completely untrained, while we know there's a hostile group out there.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 1:26 PM on March 21, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 1:26 PM on March 21, 2016 [6 favorites]
I haven't seen this one yet but...
You're telling me that a pharmacist can't figure out how to keep a toddler quiet????
posted by ian1977 at 1:28 PM on March 21, 2016 [12 favorites]
You're telling me that a pharmacist can't figure out how to keep a toddler quiet????
posted by ian1977 at 1:28 PM on March 21, 2016 [12 favorites]
Roger Pittman: “Braving a walker for a six pack of sodas? Now that has to be one of the dumbest things I've ever seen.”
This seems sort of ridiculous to me, to be honest – sort of like the show is believing its own conceit too much. I mean: zombies should be a piece of cake at this point. Walker stuck in a car? Come on. Open the door, step back and see if they can get out, and maneuver to stab them cleanly in the head. Maybe that's a little harrowing your first time, but Denise isn't stupid, and she's done harrowing things medically. It should be insanely easy for her to dispatch a walker stuck in a car. Half a dozen characters on this show do the same thing routinely. In the last episode, it was apparently no big deal for Maggie and Carol to make their way through a walker-laden hallway by knocking off one at a time to escape at the end; the only time that hallway was mildly worrisome was when there was a murderous person threatening to shoot and/or stab them while they were doing it.
Walkers are a threat in huge, unmanageable groups. When it's one stuck in a car, that should be, like, a textbook example of a practice zombie, one that untrained people can practice on. The fact that Daryl and Rosita yell at her for this is kind of silly. Hell, the fact that this particularly zombie magically becomes a threat is weird. It wasn't very believable to me that someone used to being up-close with bodies suddenly wasn't able to sort out how to plunge a blade into a skull efficiently.
posted by koeselitz at 1:31 PM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
This seems sort of ridiculous to me, to be honest – sort of like the show is believing its own conceit too much. I mean: zombies should be a piece of cake at this point. Walker stuck in a car? Come on. Open the door, step back and see if they can get out, and maneuver to stab them cleanly in the head. Maybe that's a little harrowing your first time, but Denise isn't stupid, and she's done harrowing things medically. It should be insanely easy for her to dispatch a walker stuck in a car. Half a dozen characters on this show do the same thing routinely. In the last episode, it was apparently no big deal for Maggie and Carol to make their way through a walker-laden hallway by knocking off one at a time to escape at the end; the only time that hallway was mildly worrisome was when there was a murderous person threatening to shoot and/or stab them while they were doing it.
Walkers are a threat in huge, unmanageable groups. When it's one stuck in a car, that should be, like, a textbook example of a practice zombie, one that untrained people can practice on. The fact that Daryl and Rosita yell at her for this is kind of silly. Hell, the fact that this particularly zombie magically becomes a threat is weird. It wasn't very believable to me that someone used to being up-close with bodies suddenly wasn't able to sort out how to plunge a blade into a skull efficiently.
posted by koeselitz at 1:31 PM on March 21, 2016 [7 favorites]
That whole pharmacy run was so badly done. Instead of having our only doctor write down a list of what medications would be useful
...which wouldn't matter because they took it all anyways!
posted by LizBoBiz at 1:41 PM on March 21, 2016 [5 favorites]
...which wouldn't matter because they took it all anyways!
posted by LizBoBiz at 1:41 PM on March 21, 2016 [5 favorites]
Don't these zombies rot, BTW ? Shouldn't they just fall apart by now ?
posted by Pendragon at 1:42 PM on March 21, 2016
posted by Pendragon at 1:42 PM on March 21, 2016
I'm all for finding plot holes, but it's not mysterious why Denise went on the run even though they didn't really need her to do so. She explained it at length. It was more or less her entire arc for the episode.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:46 PM on March 21, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:46 PM on March 21, 2016 [5 favorites]
I totally get her motivation for wanting to go on the run. I don't get anybody else's motivation for allowing her to go. It makes even less sense why Eugene and Abraham are out there. I mean, at least with Denise there was a conversation. Eugene didn't tell anybody why he wanted to go out until he actually got to the foundry.
You're telling me that a pharmacist can't figure out how to keep a toddler quiet????
I don't think the person who drowned the toddler was actually pharmacist, just somebody who locked themselves in the shop with their kid.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:50 PM on March 21, 2016
You're telling me that a pharmacist can't figure out how to keep a toddler quiet????
I don't think the person who drowned the toddler was actually pharmacist, just somebody who locked themselves in the shop with their kid.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:50 PM on March 21, 2016
Ooh, ooh, and another thing. Lead: Harder than a skull?
posted by Sys Rq at 1:56 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Sys Rq at 1:56 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Denise made it pretty clear the choices were go with her or wave goodbye while she went on her own.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:57 PM on March 21, 2016
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:57 PM on March 21, 2016
And nobody there is capable of stopping her until she thinks better of it?
posted by tobascodagama at 3:48 PM on March 21, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 3:48 PM on March 21, 2016
Damn, that Dawson's Creek link just proves that Melissa McBride has been hotter than the doorknob to hell since day one, but I prefer her current gray, short-haired look.
I knew that Carol was Officially Done with Alexandria/constantly being attacked and then murdering people as soon as she asked that smoker in the previous ep for a cigarette. Smoking Carol is stressed-out Carol, and I hope she finds some peace in her journey away from the group.
Of course, NOW we know why Melissa looked so freaking sad and tight-lipped when she guested on Talking Dead a couple of weeks ago... she's probably not coming back to the show until next season, I'm guessing.
Although I'm not sure that what the group needs going forward is two especially strident pacifists and one guy who manages to douse himself in a few pints of some stranger's blood whenever a new, unidentified crew shows up.
It's been what, 3 episodes since we've seen Carl and Michonne, right? Carl, you and Michonne need to step up to the plate and take on some reasonable supporting leadership roles now that Carol's gone and Dr. Denise is dead. Maggie, Glenn, Abraham, Darryl and Rick are seriously not enough people to ensure cooler heads prevail both in Alexandria and in whatever sub-group's out doing recon or scavenging work.
And finally, HELL YES to Eugene's skillset finally making it to the show. I was starting to worry that we got some half-assed useless version for the show (*cough*ANDREA*cough*), but thankfully, Useful Eugene has finally arrived.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 3:49 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
I knew that Carol was Officially Done with Alexandria/constantly being attacked and then murdering people as soon as she asked that smoker in the previous ep for a cigarette. Smoking Carol is stressed-out Carol, and I hope she finds some peace in her journey away from the group.
Of course, NOW we know why Melissa looked so freaking sad and tight-lipped when she guested on Talking Dead a couple of weeks ago... she's probably not coming back to the show until next season, I'm guessing.
Although I'm not sure that what the group needs going forward is two especially strident pacifists and one guy who manages to douse himself in a few pints of some stranger's blood whenever a new, unidentified crew shows up.
It's been what, 3 episodes since we've seen Carl and Michonne, right? Carl, you and Michonne need to step up to the plate and take on some reasonable supporting leadership roles now that Carol's gone and Dr. Denise is dead. Maggie, Glenn, Abraham, Darryl and Rick are seriously not enough people to ensure cooler heads prevail both in Alexandria and in whatever sub-group's out doing recon or scavenging work.
And finally, HELL YES to Eugene's skillset finally making it to the show. I was starting to worry that we got some half-assed useless version for the show (*cough*ANDREA*cough*), but thankfully, Useful Eugene has finally arrived.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 3:49 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Fuck this shit.
posted by Iteki at 4:32 PM on March 21, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Iteki at 4:32 PM on March 21, 2016 [2 favorites]
so, uh, did Sasha mouth "I'm Sorry" at Rosita's ex, Foghorn Leghorn, whatever his name is after he asked to shack up or whatever that oaf thought he was doing
posted by angrycat at 4:50 PM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 4:50 PM on March 21, 2016 [4 favorites]
Damn, that Dawson's Creek link just proves that Melissa McBride has been hotter than the doorknob to hell since day one, but I prefer her current gray, short-haired look.
Definitely a "fine wine" situation, yes.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:07 PM on March 21, 2016
Definitely a "fine wine" situation, yes.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:07 PM on March 21, 2016
Did I miss something? Did something happen to Tara last episode? Where was she while they were burying her partner?
posted by torisaur at 5:24 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by torisaur at 5:24 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Pregnant. (In real life.)
posted by tobascodagama at 5:37 PM on March 21, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 5:37 PM on March 21, 2016
Tara's on a two week supply run with Heath.
My take on the gruesome baby thing was the pharmacist/parent broke her leg, couldn't care for crying child and then mercy killed it. And then went nuts and wrote hush on the walls. But the above theories make much more sense, I think I just didn't want to go there. Anyway, who killed the zombies outside the pharmacy door?
RIP Chloe.
posted by areaperson at 6:48 PM on March 21, 2016
My take on the gruesome baby thing was the pharmacist/parent broke her leg, couldn't care for crying child and then mercy killed it. And then went nuts and wrote hush on the walls. But the above theories make much more sense, I think I just didn't want to go there. Anyway, who killed the zombies outside the pharmacy door?
RIP Chloe.
posted by areaperson at 6:48 PM on March 21, 2016
Alexandrian is the new Redshirt
Also "chomped the cock" is the new "jumped the shark"
posted by oulipian at 6:58 PM on March 21, 2016 [3 favorites]
Also "chomped the cock" is the new "jumped the shark"
posted by oulipian at 6:58 PM on March 21, 2016 [3 favorites]
Errr I mean RIP Zoe. The arrow through the eye and still talking thing did unnerve me.
Last week with the, "I'll say 'I love you when you get back!' made me think Tara would die. So I guess Denise was a twist.
posted by areaperson at 6:59 PM on March 21, 2016
Last week with the, "I'll say 'I love you when you get back!' made me think Tara would die. So I guess Denise was a twist.
posted by areaperson at 6:59 PM on March 21, 2016
I'm a big fan of ridiculous injury zombies, so I was happy to see undead [spoiler for the first season of Game of Thrones] in this episode.
I predict that Morgan's prison cell will be used to hold some member of the gang (probably Rick) in what passes for a dramatic turn of events on this show before the end of the season.
Also, I predict that they will find another trained medical professional within five episodes, because those people are everywhere on this show.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 10:49 PM on March 21, 2016 [3 favorites]
I predict that Morgan's prison cell will be used to hold some member of the gang (probably Rick) in what passes for a dramatic turn of events on this show before the end of the season.
Also, I predict that they will find another trained medical professional within five episodes, because those people are everywhere on this show.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 10:49 PM on March 21, 2016 [3 favorites]
it brought back the guy who stole Daryl's bike
I cannot for the life of me remember this guy or what exactly happened, probably because I fell asleep binge-watching. And now it's driving me crazy. Does anyone remember which episode it was? I plan to re-watch it (this time, fully-alert and before midnight.)
posted by invisible ink at 11:09 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
I cannot for the life of me remember this guy or what exactly happened, probably because I fell asleep binge-watching. And now it's driving me crazy. Does anyone remember which episode it was? I plan to re-watch it (this time, fully-alert and before midnight.)
posted by invisible ink at 11:09 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Always Accountable, season 6 episode 6.
posted by peeedro at 11:25 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by peeedro at 11:25 PM on March 21, 2016 [1 favorite]
Perfect, thank you Peeedro:)
posted by invisible ink at 12:29 AM on March 22, 2016
posted by invisible ink at 12:29 AM on March 22, 2016
Isn't the replacement medical professional the Hilltop doctor who did Maggie's ultrasound? How convenient.
posted by olinerd at 1:17 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by olinerd at 1:17 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
If Carol has had a long dark tea-time of the soul and decided that she can't kill anymore, why doesn't she sit down and have an awesome conversation with Morgan about keeping your humanity in such a horrific environment? It's all he's been talking about for several episodes. Instead she decides that she has to walk the Cursed Earth. Ack!
posted by ActingTheGoat at 2:34 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by ActingTheGoat at 2:34 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
Rosita's ex, Foghorn Leghorn, whatever his name is
Dear neighbors. This is why I was cackling at an ungodly hour.
posted by cashman at 6:58 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
Dear neighbors. This is why I was cackling at an ungodly hour.
posted by cashman at 6:58 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
This seems sort of ridiculous to me, to be honest – sort of like the show is believing its own conceit too much. I mean: zombies should be a piece of cake at this point. Walker stuck in a car? Come on. Open the door, step back and see if they can get out, and maneuver to stab them cleanly in the head.
I would have loved it if when Denise went over to the passenger side to get the cooler, she was easily able to grab it because the walker in the driver's seat was having a tough time trying to climb over. Seriously, have you ever had an easy time doing that?
DENISE: Opens door
WALKER: :Struggling to get both legs around the steering wheel while supporting body weight enough to get over the console:
DENISE: Grabs cooler, slams door.
WALKER: :All uncomfortably stuck on the gearshift and trying to figure out if it's easier to just go headfirst into the floorboards or what:
DENISE: Watching the whole thing - "I guess some things are a pain in the ass no matter what."
posted by cashman at 7:16 AM on March 22, 2016 [8 favorites]
I would have loved it if when Denise went over to the passenger side to get the cooler, she was easily able to grab it because the walker in the driver's seat was having a tough time trying to climb over. Seriously, have you ever had an easy time doing that?
DENISE: Opens door
WALKER: :Struggling to get both legs around the steering wheel while supporting body weight enough to get over the console:
DENISE: Grabs cooler, slams door.
WALKER: :All uncomfortably stuck on the gearshift and trying to figure out if it's easier to just go headfirst into the floorboards or what:
DENISE: Watching the whole thing - "I guess some things are a pain in the ass no matter what."
posted by cashman at 7:16 AM on March 22, 2016 [8 favorites]
The tense dialogue between Abraham and Eugene was horrible, just horrible. Maybe it's the hammy accents or their affected cadence, but probably just the really stupid ideas they were expressing.
Also, I was groaning at the stupidity of Darryl and Rosita, two arch bad asses who regularly slay dozens of zombies without breaking a sweat, were suddenly like "NO, can't stop for one zombie locked in a car, it's TOO DANGEROUS, there's no time!"
Also, the little scene in the pharmacy with the dead toddler was juvenile ghost story material. "Hush" written in bloody scratches on the walls? Really? Who is that written for, the dying parent decides he needs to explain her motivation for whomever eventually discovers them? Or is it just that Hollywood-flavor of insanity where you are reduced to blubbering a single cryptic phrase that offers insight into your condition?
Bleh. Last episode was predictable from the start but well executed and enjoyable. This was just so dumb.
posted by skewed at 9:14 AM on March 22, 2016 [3 favorites]
Also, I was groaning at the stupidity of Darryl and Rosita, two arch bad asses who regularly slay dozens of zombies without breaking a sweat, were suddenly like "NO, can't stop for one zombie locked in a car, it's TOO DANGEROUS, there's no time!"
Also, the little scene in the pharmacy with the dead toddler was juvenile ghost story material. "Hush" written in bloody scratches on the walls? Really? Who is that written for, the dying parent decides he needs to explain her motivation for whomever eventually discovers them? Or is it just that Hollywood-flavor of insanity where you are reduced to blubbering a single cryptic phrase that offers insight into your condition?
Bleh. Last episode was predictable from the start but well executed and enjoyable. This was just so dumb.
posted by skewed at 9:14 AM on March 22, 2016 [3 favorites]
Foghorn Leghorn
I say, yah, I say that his vocal styling is highly stylized. (I wonder what he was like before the apocalypse.)
posted by filthy light thief at 9:26 AM on March 22, 2016 [1 favorite]
I say, yah, I say that his vocal styling is highly stylized. (I wonder what he was like before the apocalypse.)
posted by filthy light thief at 9:26 AM on March 22, 2016 [1 favorite]
Also, thanks to this episode, I got to tell my wife about Crone Island, because that's where I imagined Carol was going.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:53 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by filthy light thief at 9:53 AM on March 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
Maybe it's the hammy accents or their affected cadence, but probably just the really stupid ideas they were expressing.
I actually like their hammy accents and their affected cadences. But put Patrick Stewart and Ian McKellan in that scene, and it would have been just as dumb.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:14 AM on March 22, 2016
I actually like their hammy accents and their affected cadences. But put Patrick Stewart and Ian McKellan in that scene, and it would have been just as dumb.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:14 AM on March 22, 2016
Oh, I would love to see scenes from TWD, as read by Stewart and McKellan:
posted by filthy light thief at 10:55 AM on March 22, 2016 [2 favorites]
Abraham: I see you've tied back your Tennessee waterfall there.And, SCENE!
Eugene: I won't lie. I liked it. I may very well miss it. The feeling of the billowy curtain catching the breeze some days was straight-up bliss. But brass tacks-- the hair doesn't make the man, the man makes the man.
Abraham: Guard duty, weapons training, changing up the hairstyle, swigging some swagger with the ladies, spitting game--
Eugene: If you don't spit game, you are game.
Abraham: Man seems to be changing. At least trying like hell to. Makes me curious what that's about.
Eugene: It's simple, really. As with any RPG, tabletop, electronic, or otherwise, the key to survival is allowing oneself to be shaped by the assigned environment. In doing so, a broad range of capabilities are acquired, allowing one to flip the script and use said capabilities to shape said environment for maximum longevity. I'm saying I'm in the process of said stage two. I've changed, adapted. I'm a survivor.
Abraham: Keep telling yourself that. I've changed, adapted.
Eugene: I've become a survivor.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:55 AM on March 22, 2016 [2 favorites]
We're reading Abe as Stewart and Eugene as McKellan in this scenario, right? I mean, I suppose it could work either way, but that's what my brain immediately jumped to.
posted by tobascodagama at 12:19 PM on March 22, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 12:19 PM on March 22, 2016
Huh. I really liked this one. Things happened! They told two taut, focused stories, with real development for three characters (Eugene, Denise, Rosita). The zombie struggles were actually tense. Denise's death felt like a real loss. I felt like the balance of action and dialogue was perfect.
And there's suddenly a semblance of an arc: Carol's crisis is no longer just the drama-of-the-week; it's led to actual change and consequences. And they're escalating the conflict with the Saviors in a natural and believable way.
I do hope Carol isn't leaving us for good—although I suspect she might be.
Anyway, yeah, strong episode.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 7:38 PM on March 22, 2016
And there's suddenly a semblance of an arc: Carol's crisis is no longer just the drama-of-the-week; it's led to actual change and consequences. And they're escalating the conflict with the Saviors in a natural and believable way.
I do hope Carol isn't leaving us for good—although I suspect she might be.
Anyway, yeah, strong episode.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 7:38 PM on March 22, 2016
And now I've read the thread (I have a policy of typing up my impressions of an episode before reading the FanFare thread).
And, you know...many of the criticisms of this episode, probably most of them, are totally valid. And had I been in a different mood when I watched, I might feel similarly. But I wasn't, and I enjoyed it.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 7:56 PM on March 22, 2016 [3 favorites]
And, you know...many of the criticisms of this episode, probably most of them, are totally valid. And had I been in a different mood when I watched, I might feel similarly. But I wasn't, and I enjoyed it.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 7:56 PM on March 22, 2016 [3 favorites]
Aha! Finally caught up with this season and watched an episode kinda/sorta at the same time as everybody else (it's shown a day later here in the UK and I'm watching it through an on-demand service so it's actually two days later).
I've been deeply enjoying the Fanfare threads as I've been catching up, so thank you everybody who's been commenting.
With two episodes left, I've got a feeling that Alexandria is going to get Negan'd hard, with Carol the Destroyer waiting out in the wilderness to return for the next season opener.
One thing I haven't seen any comment on is the Hilltop letdown. When Jesus said 'your world is about to get a whole lot bigger', I was preparing myself for something really interesting - trade networks! The rebuilding of civilisation! Sweet armoured trade caravans with chainsaws!
But no, it's another walled compound run by an arsehole that's barely hanging on. I guess they can barely hang on together? Sigh. At least it doesn't appear to be another Omelas-of-the-week, we've got the Saviours for that.
posted by Happy Dave at 1:04 AM on March 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
I've been deeply enjoying the Fanfare threads as I've been catching up, so thank you everybody who's been commenting.
With two episodes left, I've got a feeling that Alexandria is going to get Negan'd hard, with Carol the Destroyer waiting out in the wilderness to return for the next season opener.
One thing I haven't seen any comment on is the Hilltop letdown. When Jesus said 'your world is about to get a whole lot bigger', I was preparing myself for something really interesting - trade networks! The rebuilding of civilisation! Sweet armoured trade caravans with chainsaws!
But no, it's another walled compound run by an arsehole that's barely hanging on. I guess they can barely hang on together? Sigh. At least it doesn't appear to be another Omelas-of-the-week, we've got the Saviours for that.
posted by Happy Dave at 1:04 AM on March 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
Are they really going to pull another "Carol comes back at just the right time to save the day"? The writing on the show is rarely great, but that seems like too much of a recycle. I think there must be another plan, or she is really gone for good. (Unlikely, we'd probably get a bigger send off.)
posted by 2ht at 3:59 AM on March 23, 2016
posted by 2ht at 3:59 AM on March 23, 2016
Well, here's hoping that, when she returns (yes, I said when), it's with a bo staff and she and Morgan drive the sheep before them in a nonlethal but kickass way.
posted by Mogur at 5:02 AM on March 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Mogur at 5:02 AM on March 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
Carol's crisis is no longer just the drama-of-the-week; it's led to actual change and consequences.
I've had trouble with the most recent episodes because I'm just not buying Carol's crisis of conscience. Unless I missed it, there wasn't anything at all to precipitate it. I don't see how she got to this point--it just happened. Her recent arc would be a lot stronger if, for example, she had accidentally killed an innocent bystander in the heat of battle. That might plausibly cause her to rethink things. But after seasons of becoming a more and more skilled fighter, of vigorously defending the idea that lethal force is required to survive, to do an about-face this quickly just isn't working. The writers are taking too many shortcuts with her story. And having her leave the group for a second time seems like they are just running out of ideas for her character.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 11:02 AM on March 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
I've had trouble with the most recent episodes because I'm just not buying Carol's crisis of conscience. Unless I missed it, there wasn't anything at all to precipitate it. I don't see how she got to this point--it just happened. Her recent arc would be a lot stronger if, for example, she had accidentally killed an innocent bystander in the heat of battle. That might plausibly cause her to rethink things. But after seasons of becoming a more and more skilled fighter, of vigorously defending the idea that lethal force is required to survive, to do an about-face this quickly just isn't working. The writers are taking too many shortcuts with her story. And having her leave the group for a second time seems like they are just running out of ideas for her character.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 11:02 AM on March 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
We're meant to believe that she feels bad about killing Owen/W-Man right after Denise apparently succeeded in bringing him back to Jesus or whatever.
I don't believe it, either.
posted by tobascodagama at 11:16 AM on March 23, 2016
I don't believe it, either.
posted by tobascodagama at 11:16 AM on March 23, 2016
We're supposed to think carol magically knows she inspired Sam's meltdown. Source, grave cookie.
posted by angrycat at 11:20 AM on March 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 11:20 AM on March 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
I've had trouble with the most recent episodes because I'm just not buying Carol's crisis of conscience. Unless I missed it, there wasn't anything at all to precipitate it. I don't see how she got to this point--it just happened.
Maybe if she hadn't straight-up preemptively murdered Karen and the other flu victim back at the prison I could buy the conscience crises, but at this point it just seems out-of-character. Not that Carol is a monster, but she was solidly pragmatic the last few seasons, and her "code" made a lot of sense in terms of her personal history, even if you thought the whole Karen thing was immoral/unethical. Morgan proved over and over that practically speaking his philosophy of nonviolence is simply unworkable and Carol was - quite in character and based on events, quite rightly - extremely pissed at him earlier in the season. Now she has done a 360 in the span of 2-3 episodes and it just smells like manufactured drama instead of actual character development.
They could have done this slightly differently in a way that actually made sense. PrisonCarol taught the children knife skills and wanted to toughen them up to keep them safe, and she ended up with Lizzie murdering her sister. On the other end of the spectrum we have SAHMCarol making soft little Sam cookies, and he quite predictably gets eaten by zombies. I could see her having a breakdown about her inability to help children in this world, and in some ways actively albeit unintentionally contributing to their deaths. I could buy it if she turned nihilist and felt the world was pointless if no matter what she does all the children near her end up dead. But, instead of pursuing that, the writers have her turning into miniMorgan, which feels like a non sequitur.
posted by gatorae at 11:35 AM on March 23, 2016 [8 favorites]
Maybe if she hadn't straight-up preemptively murdered Karen and the other flu victim back at the prison I could buy the conscience crises, but at this point it just seems out-of-character. Not that Carol is a monster, but she was solidly pragmatic the last few seasons, and her "code" made a lot of sense in terms of her personal history, even if you thought the whole Karen thing was immoral/unethical. Morgan proved over and over that practically speaking his philosophy of nonviolence is simply unworkable and Carol was - quite in character and based on events, quite rightly - extremely pissed at him earlier in the season. Now she has done a 360 in the span of 2-3 episodes and it just smells like manufactured drama instead of actual character development.
They could have done this slightly differently in a way that actually made sense. PrisonCarol taught the children knife skills and wanted to toughen them up to keep them safe, and she ended up with Lizzie murdering her sister. On the other end of the spectrum we have SAHMCarol making soft little Sam cookies, and he quite predictably gets eaten by zombies. I could see her having a breakdown about her inability to help children in this world, and in some ways actively albeit unintentionally contributing to their deaths. I could buy it if she turned nihilist and felt the world was pointless if no matter what she does all the children near her end up dead. But, instead of pursuing that, the writers have her turning into miniMorgan, which feels like a non sequitur.
posted by gatorae at 11:35 AM on March 23, 2016 [8 favorites]
I could buy it if she turned nihilist and felt the world was pointless if no matter what she does all the children near her end up dead.
An established character who goes full-on nihilist "what's the point?" would be an an obvious and welcome development. I mean, what are you going to say to tell them things are going to be okay? We haven't seen a single healthy and strong community yet, except for the ones the protagonists have been in and none of them have worked out yet. What do you say to someone who just gives up? It would be an especially good contrast with Rick's recent hopeful "I want to show you the work" monologue to one-eyed Coral.
In short, why the hell hasn't AMC hired some of us for the writer's room?
posted by Pater Aletheias at 12:11 PM on March 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
An established character who goes full-on nihilist "what's the point?" would be an an obvious and welcome development. I mean, what are you going to say to tell them things are going to be okay? We haven't seen a single healthy and strong community yet, except for the ones the protagonists have been in and none of them have worked out yet. What do you say to someone who just gives up? It would be an especially good contrast with Rick's recent hopeful "I want to show you the work" monologue to one-eyed Coral.
In short, why the hell hasn't AMC hired some of us for the writer's room?
posted by Pater Aletheias at 12:11 PM on March 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
Morgan proved over and over that practically speaking his philosophy of nonviolence is simply unworkable
Impractical and labour-intensive, but it at least worked on Morgan. Long term, it's the only way out of this Anarcho-Libertarian-whatever hellscape where people get shot in the face as a way of starting (or ending) a conversation.
posted by cardboard at 12:55 PM on March 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
Impractical and labour-intensive, but it at least worked on Morgan. Long term, it's the only way out of this Anarcho-Libertarian-whatever hellscape where people get shot in the face as a way of starting (or ending) a conversation.
posted by cardboard at 12:55 PM on March 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
We're supposed to think carol magically knows she inspired Sam's meltdown.
So, the show expects us to believe that characters are sometimes privy to other characters' fear-induced hallucinations? Because that's the only way she could develop that idea.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:02 PM on March 23, 2016
So, the show expects us to believe that characters are sometimes privy to other characters' fear-induced hallucinations? Because that's the only way she could develop that idea.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:02 PM on March 23, 2016
So, the show expects us to believe that characters are sometimes privy to other characters' fear-induced hallucinations? Because that's the only way she could develop that idea.
Carol knows that she spun a detailed tale of terror to a child to intimidate him into keeping his mouth shut about her misdeeds, that the child subsequently became afraid to leave the top floor of his house, and that he freaked out in the middle of a zombie hoard and got himself and his mother killed. I don't think it's a big stretch for her to imagine that her terrorising him at least partially caused his terror. (I mean, the zombies are probably at fault too, but they're not introspective enough to have a crisis of conscience about it.)
posted by misfish at 3:03 PM on March 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
Carol knows that she spun a detailed tale of terror to a child to intimidate him into keeping his mouth shut about her misdeeds, that the child subsequently became afraid to leave the top floor of his house, and that he freaked out in the middle of a zombie hoard and got himself and his mother killed. I don't think it's a big stretch for her to imagine that her terrorising him at least partially caused his terror. (I mean, the zombies are probably at fault too, but they're not introspective enough to have a crisis of conscience about it.)
posted by misfish at 3:03 PM on March 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
Rosita's ex, Foghorn Leghorn, whatever his name is
Dear neighbors. This is why I was cackling at an ungodly hour.
Dear cat. Sorry I scared you away from the treats. I'll crack up more quietly next time. (Here, have some more treats.)
posted by kythuen at 4:26 PM on March 23, 2016
Dear neighbors. This is why I was cackling at an ungodly hour.
Dear cat. Sorry I scared you away from the treats. I'll crack up more quietly next time. (Here, have some more treats.)
posted by kythuen at 4:26 PM on March 23, 2016
While I was glad to see Carol dump that mousey househusband, I'll be crushed if she's gone for good. Go get her, Daryl!
posted by MsVader at 3:06 PM on March 29, 2016
posted by MsVader at 3:06 PM on March 29, 2016
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Recaps
FoxSisters
There's like a dozen people holding the crew at gunpoint, and NONE OF THEM GET HIT? Just running around right out in the fucking open in front of automatic weapons that are clearly being fired at them, and NOBODY GETS HURT.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:03 PM on March 20, 2016 [3 favorites]