Killing Eve: You're Mine
May 26, 2019 6:55 PM - Season 2, Episode 8 - Subscribe

 
The hot ticket at the next Emmys is the murderer section.
posted by provoliminal at 7:01 AM on May 27 [1 favorite]


eh, i thought it was OK. ending was inevitable, really and won't stick because... well - S3 is on the way. which i will watch, because it is still entertaining. but this season had some serious wobble to it. oh and - none of the article mentioned the change in the title animation, where the drip changed from the V to the K. maybe it has done that before and i just never noticed? but if it was just for this episode it was kinda cool and a hint that Eve and Villanelle have more in common now, even though Eve has realized she doesn't want it.
posted by lapolla at 2:15 PM on May 27 [1 favorite]


lapolla - the title animation changes every show
posted by evening at 3:53 PM on May 27 [1 favorite]


Eve's gonna bring the twelve down along with Konstantin and Carolyn next season.
posted by some loser at 6:45 PM on May 27


This episode made me really sad! I know that the show has been demonstrating that Eve and Villanelle are becoming more similar for the entire season, but Eve leaving Hugo and then NOT EVEN CALLING FOR HELP seemed like a turning point that I'm not sure I can come back from. I get that the point of that was to show the depths of Eve's obsession with Villanelle, that she would literally leave someone to die to help Villanelle, but I felt like there must have been other ways to accomplish that narrative development.

I had a similar reaction to the axe incident--I know that the method was chosen specifically for its awfulness and commitment, and that its purpose was to move Eve beyond a doubt on to the murder side of the murder/non-murder line. Yet that scene still felt gratuitously gruesome to me, and like the show had lost its emotional and psychological center that had made it so fun and special. Yes, Villanelle's murders could be gory, but this one felt different and not in a good way. Maybe that's the point but I'm not sure I'll watch Season 3.
posted by stellaluna at 1:18 PM on May 28


I don't think the axe was an axeident (forgive me). Raskolnikov killed with an axe, specifically as a test of his theory that he was a great man who was free to kill other people. If I'm right that it's a callback, then season 3 may be a very interesting exploration of how wrong Eve was to think she was capable of killing another person without serious psychological repercussions. I would 100% be down for a season of her falling all over herself to be caught and punished, a la the original model.

In other ways it doesn't line up but... let me have this
posted by prefpara at 3:09 PM on May 28 [6 favorites]


I’m still trying to figure out why, exactly, Eve’s pivotal realization — that Villanelle wants her fucked up, a mess, confused, destabilized, and dependent on Villanelle — didn’t feel quite earned, or didn’t land. Or what they would have done to land it for me.

I think, for me, it felt like “telling” (vs showing) because it doesn’t follow from what they’d set up earlier, that Villanelle believes Eve is like her. Manipulating Eve into killing to show her that she is like Villanelle — who definitely doesn’t think of herself as unstable or dependent on anyone — doesn’t, to me, lead to a “this is abusive” realization so much as a “oh shit you really are a psychopath” realization. Those seem like two different things, to me. Like so far Villanelle’s manipulations have mostly been ...idk external? Moving pieces around on a chessboard, sort of, in a simplistic, childlike way: manipulate et her husband into an affair, etc. Like she doesn’t have the emotional fluency to emotionally manipulate someone in the way Eve asserts she does.

And I know that generally people don’t have to be self aware to be emotionally manipulative in that way, but not when they’re otherwise, like, a void. Or a child. Villanelle’s so childlike that I feel like that realization gives her too much credit; it’s more like...Eve was just a particular fun doll, like all the other dolls, and now it’s no longer fun. Bang.

But the emotional manipulation Eve charges her with...that feels too emotionally developed for Villanelle, almost.
posted by schadenfrau at 6:37 PM on May 28 [4 favorites]


that feels too emotionally developed for Villanelle, almost.

"I hide the gun so you get over yourself and do the thing I know you want to do and can do because of course we're the same because I'm obsessed with you because you're not quite like me in that I think I can control you so I can have fun and you're enough like me that of course we understand each other."
posted by zeek321 at 9:17 PM on May 28 [2 favorites]


Yet that scene still felt gratuitously gruesome to me

it was just as gratuitous from inside the show as from outside. considering eve was just standing there frozen STARING at the blunt side of the axe handle for whole minutes before deciding to use the sharp part. she had all these chances to just whack him good in the back of the head instead of chopping him up, and she just wouldn't take them.

it was so ridiculous I thought that would be the second reveal after the gun, the way V turned the mirror back around at her. but no

it was a terrible season finale because it would have been an exquisite, a perfect series finale. but they haven't got the guts.
posted by queenofbithynia at 10:13 PM on May 28


It's a silly show but it reclaims some of the innocence of childlike cops and robbers games with it's unreality and Villanelle mostly killing baddies, season 3 should start with her on trial for Gemma. Or perhaps Eve on trial and V rescues her. Season 3 will be a success if they make Ms Comer do both a Scottish and Welsh accent episode.
posted by sammyo at 4:57 AM on May 29


I didn't think that leaving Hugo to die made sense for Eve. (I suspect he's not dead and that he was spirited away and patched up via Carolyn's cleanup crew.

I just didn't understand why Eve didn't bash whats-his-face in the head with the blunt end of the axe. Do field agents really have ZERO fight training?

I did like both Villanelle and Eve realizing they'd been used to get Peel dead.

As an aside: Why does this show refer to Villanelle as a serial killer and not as an assassin? I mean, I get it, it perpetuates a classist distinction that de-centers the murder victims, but is that shift in terminology a thing that is practiced widely now?
posted by desuetude at 7:11 AM on May 29 [2 favorites]


Do field agents really have ZERO fight training?

Well, that's the basic unreality here. Eve is not a field agent like Bill was (although he forgot all his training trailing Villanelle to the disco), she was a bored analyst promoted to field agent for an off the books mission. So the whole premise of the show is wrong. I agree though, the blunt end of the axe would've been more in character and it still would've killed him.

Still I love it, so OTT. I love it when Carolyn arranges for Eve's husband to go to Cambridge because she used to be a spelling bee champ and "it's a very supportive network." Fiona Shaw played a similar imperious, ambiguous spymaster in the mini-series Mrs Wilson, pantsuits and all. I only started the series this week after GoT ended and I intended to watch The Bodyguard but this came up and after watching the first episode I was hooked. I was gobsmacked to learn that I'd already seen Jodie Comer in another mini-series, Remember Me. She was easily the best character in it, really impressive and I would've never connected that role with this one if someone hadn't told me.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 8:02 PM on May 31 [1 favorite]


Why does this show refer to Villanelle as a serial killer and not as an assassin?

That's an interesting question aside from the show's chosen terminology: would Villanelle kill if she wasn't paid for it? Does she have a compulsion to kill? I think of serial killers as having a compulsion, so maybe that's my failure.
posted by gladly at 8:21 PM on May 31


Nobody paid her to kill Eve's husband's...friend or her Russian prison mate. So I'd say she has a compulsion.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 8:31 PM on May 31 [1 favorite]


She’s killed like 17 people just for fun or stress release in between actual jobs and she definitely seems to get off on it — like her looking into their eyes while they die and getting all anime-eyed about it is a big thing in the first season — to the point where sometimes her zest for her work has become a professional problem (the guy she strangled by holding onto his tie as his elevator ascended didn’t look SUPER accidental) so I think it’s safe to say she is a serial killer who gets paid to do what she loves
posted by schadenfrau at 4:08 AM on June 1 [1 favorite]


Why does this show refer to Villanelle as a serial killer and not as an assassin? I mean, I get it, it perpetuates a classist distinction that de-centers the murder victims, but is that shift in terminology a thing that is practiced widely now?

I'm not sure this agrees or disagrees with your point, but I suspect that it is more important that it de-emphasizes who is pulling the strings. Villanelle is referred to as a serial killer rather than an assassin because it is in Carolyn's best interest to obscure the fact that Villanelle works for The Twelve because Carolyn (and perhaps others in MI5) is too close to The Twelve to survive a deeper investigation of that organization. Or at least an investigation will be a pretty sticky situation for her. She can't ignore Villanelle but she wants to control and limit the scope of any investigation. The same reason it makes sense to her to move the investigation to an off-the-books operation.

Related: could The Twelve be the intelligence services of 12 countries that share a contract-assassin service for outsourcing off-the-books killings?

Eve is not a field agent like Bill was (although he forgot all his training trailing Villanelle to the disco), she was a bored analyst promoted to field agent for an off the books mission. So the whole premise of the show is wrong.

Maybe I am being too literal, but Eve was not promoted to field agent but simply fired as an analyst, right? Then she was taken on by Carolyn as a useful idiot who could be manipulated into doing things that MI5 employees could not do, with plausible deniability if things should go wrong. "We paid her a fee as a contractor because of the specific analyst skills she could bring to this specific case, but it turns out she was a psycho. We never trained her or had her psychologically assessed for field operations because she was never meant to be in the field. Oops."
posted by nequalsone at 7:24 AM on June 3 [4 favorites]


> Maybe I am being too literal, but Eve was not promoted to field agent but simply fired as an analyst, right?

Oh, no, you're quite right. Okay, her total lack of any fighting knowledge makes sense, then.
posted by desuetude at 9:53 AM on June 3


Villanelle is referred to as a serial killer rather than an assassin because it is in Carolyn's best interest to obscure the fact that Villanelle works for The Twelve

Or she's referred to as a serial killer because that's fundamentally what she is. She doesn't kill people because she's paid, but because she enjoys killing.
posted by happyroach at 11:57 PM on June 5


To everyone who pointed out that Villanelle is killing for fun even more than profit: you're right, point taken, and by that measure she is primarily a serial killer by any definition, moreso than an assassin.

> I'm not sure this agrees or disagrees with your point, but I suspect that it is more important that it de-emphasizes who is pulling the strings. Villanelle is referred to as a serial killer rather than an assassin because it is in Carolyn's best interest to obscure the fact that Villanelle works for The Twelve because Carolyn (and perhaps others in MI5) is too close to The Twelve to survive a deeper investigation of that organization. Or at least an investigation will be a pretty sticky situation for her. She can't ignore Villanelle but she wants to control and limit the scope of any investigation. The same reason it makes sense to her to move the investigation to an off-the-books operation.

Yeah, this was more of my thinking behind my question -- I thought it interesting to speculate whether there was an agenda within the world of this show for that language choice.
posted by desuetude at 12:16 PM on June 7


I’m still trying to figure out why, exactly, Eve’s pivotal realization — that Villanelle wants her fucked up, a mess, confused, destabilized, and dependent on Villanelle — didn’t feel quite earned, or didn’t land.

Maybe because Eve's realization is wrong. Personally, I think Villanelle likes Eve bright-eyed, surprisingly brave, and surprisingly violent. She got off so hard on seeing Eve ax that guy. Eve was like the Lumberjack killing the Big Bad Wolf and saving Little Red Riding Hood (Villanelle, in her all-red pantsuit). Violence is hot to Villanelle in general, of course she gets off on Eve doing it for her and with her. Plus, Villanelle clearly has mother issues, I doubt that she wants to be with a little weepy mess like Eve was saying. Maybe Eve was thinking of Nico when she had that realization.

Also, symbolically, Eve had to hack the guy open because it was her "birth" as a murderer. She was emerging from the womb. Or maybe the egg, like a dinosaur.

It was so dumb when Eve was like, "why didn't you shoot him?" It wasn't because Villanelle was pulling Eve into some complex emotional web, it's because Villanelle thought it would be super hot and a cool bonding experience. You know, like sex. And then when Villanelle thought that the intimacy had meant something, Eve turned cold and wanted to ghost her. Just like Eve had after sex with Hugo and just like she role-played doing with Nico. Eve is a one-night stand kind of girl, apparently, and Villanelle did NOT like that. While I don't think it's a capital offense, I don't know why Eve thinks it's an OK thing to "wham, bam, thank you ma'am" people like that. Hurtful. Hugo and Nico just sulked afterward, but obviously Villanelle was going to lash out.

I think it genuinely is pretty straightforward with Villanelle, I don't think she's trying to manipulate Eve much beyond trying to make her her partner in crime so they can have tons of fun going on murder sprees together, and I don't think her obsession with Eve is necessarily driven by anything deeper than having the hots for her. An ordinary person wouldn't find having a crush so thrilling, but Villanelle otherwise feels practically nothing and is dying from boredom because of it, so for her, the intensity of the feeling must be like water would be to a person dying of thirst. Besides, it's weird to me that the characters keep asking "why Eve?" because it's like, why not? I know plenty of people who are with partners who I think, "really, him?" This is George Michael and Egg-I-mean-Anne all over again, I guess. Who can explain love.

Anyhow, what if Eve is dead and the new protagonist is Kenny? That would be hilarious. And right now, Kenny and Carolyn are actually a much more interesting duo to me than Eve and Villanelle are. Just to be frank. And much as I love Eve and especially Villanelle.

Also, I can't remember -- do we know whether Carolyn is a member of the twelve? Because it seemed in this episode like she was. Like how she told Eve that Villanelle had been working for the twelve the whole time, and "good luck" dealing with the assassin who was coming to clean up the job (ax guy). I mean, it seemed like we were meant to think that Carolyn was just trying to look all "butter wouldn't melt in her mouth" when she was telling Eve that Villanelle had in fact been working for the twelve the whole time rather than MI-6, but that would also kind of make sense. Carolyn runs that little division like her own personal fiefdom, are we sure that it's not just another branch office for the twelve anyway and the MI-6 thing isn't just a front? (Maybe we are, I honestly don't remember).
posted by rue72 at 6:00 PM on June 13 [3 favorites]


Pheobe Waller-Ridge has announced that she will be appearing as a character in Killing Eve 3 - to be murdered by Villanelle.

In terms of the destiny of the series, I think the pattern is interesting. Normally you are supposed to be interested in the overall arc of the story; when we will find out the solution to some nagging mystery. With Killing Eve - I find myself not caring about these details at all. How are "the 12"? How is really controlling Villanelle? I don't care because the writers seems not to either - happy to treat them as McGuffin. Do we have a dead character who we'd like to see again? No problem - just bring them back to life.

On the other hand, it is the immediate details that make the series: individual scenes, clothes, lines of dialogue, supporting characters, music: I would happily sit through another season of that.
posted by rongorongo at 11:12 PM on July 1 [1 favorite]


I'm much of the same mind, rongorongo.

There have been a lot of shows in the last few years I've dubbed "lotion holders" where I am just waiting for them to get to the goddamn point but they draaaaaaaaaaaggggg it out until at some point I have literally ended up yelling, "Put the fucking lotion in the basket!" Yes, I am talking to you, Westworld. And this is not one of those shows. I'm not waiting for it to get anywhere; I'm delighting in its choice of pasta face and sartorial surprises, happy to be a passenger because the view is reliably entertaining.
posted by provoliminal at 4:06 AM on July 2


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