Supergirl: Solitude
March 1, 2016 5:35 AM - Season 1, Episode 15 - Subscribe
Kara travels to the Fortress of Solitude to learn how to defeat Indigo, who has a connection to Kara's past; James and Lucy's relationship comes to a crossroads.
Liked it overall.
Some thoughts:
* I too was glad they didn't drag out the lie over who killed Astra any longer, because it was dumb. Alex killing her is a whole different animal than J'onn doing it on any number of levels, and he should've known that. (For a *mind reader* blending in with humans for decades or centuries, he kinda blows at interpersonal relationships. The only reason I'm not docking that points is because they're being consistent about it - he's *always* sucked at those, and it seems plausible given his overall attitude.)
* The Superman stuff does continue to be a yawning chasm of a plot hole for me.
They probably need to just get him out of the picture entirely, but I have no idea how to do that exactly. It's a hard issue, but it needs to happen.
Agreed. I still say he should be sent on a mission to space for... the show's run. In this case, it's grating to see Non on screen, representing an entire faction of enemy Kryptonians, and hear James talk casually about how 'only a few people can lift the key to the Fortress of Solitude anyway, so why have security?' Dude, that 'few people' includes someone who promised to kill Supergirl in like a week.
* Speaking of, their laid back approach to Non & Co continues to be a problem for me. Hearing 'Kryptonians are going to war with us in two weeks' is a lot worse news than 'incoming nuclear missile,' and nobody appears to even be worrying about it. I would either be panning for Kryptonite, or putting the finishing touches on my doomsday bunker, personally. Maybe considering a bright future as a lackey? Anyway, I'd be thinking about it nonstop, personally. (Like, maybe it's time for a day trip to Oa? Hire Lobo? Something?)
* Cat's reaction to both the Not!-Ashley Madison hack and the nuclear missile were pretty great. Callista Flockheart should be on their team, damn it.
* I thought for sure Lucy figured out Kara was Supergirl, when she came to help them figure out what was going on. (To be fair, that still might be true, and I'm hoping it is. Kara's almost as bad at secret identities as Barry over on The Flash.)
* IIRC, the AV Club review compared Siobhan/Winn to Cordelia/Xander. That's exactly where my brain went too.
posted by mordax at 10:38 AM on March 1, 2016 [4 favorites]
Some thoughts:
* I too was glad they didn't drag out the lie over who killed Astra any longer, because it was dumb. Alex killing her is a whole different animal than J'onn doing it on any number of levels, and he should've known that. (For a *mind reader* blending in with humans for decades or centuries, he kinda blows at interpersonal relationships. The only reason I'm not docking that points is because they're being consistent about it - he's *always* sucked at those, and it seems plausible given his overall attitude.)
* The Superman stuff does continue to be a yawning chasm of a plot hole for me.
They probably need to just get him out of the picture entirely, but I have no idea how to do that exactly. It's a hard issue, but it needs to happen.
Agreed. I still say he should be sent on a mission to space for... the show's run. In this case, it's grating to see Non on screen, representing an entire faction of enemy Kryptonians, and hear James talk casually about how 'only a few people can lift the key to the Fortress of Solitude anyway, so why have security?' Dude, that 'few people' includes someone who promised to kill Supergirl in like a week.
* Speaking of, their laid back approach to Non & Co continues to be a problem for me. Hearing 'Kryptonians are going to war with us in two weeks' is a lot worse news than 'incoming nuclear missile,' and nobody appears to even be worrying about it. I would either be panning for Kryptonite, or putting the finishing touches on my doomsday bunker, personally. Maybe considering a bright future as a lackey? Anyway, I'd be thinking about it nonstop, personally. (Like, maybe it's time for a day trip to Oa? Hire Lobo? Something?)
* Cat's reaction to both the Not!-Ashley Madison hack and the nuclear missile were pretty great. Callista Flockheart should be on their team, damn it.
* I thought for sure Lucy figured out Kara was Supergirl, when she came to help them figure out what was going on. (To be fair, that still might be true, and I'm hoping it is. Kara's almost as bad at secret identities as Barry over on The Flash.)
* IIRC, the AV Club review compared Siobhan/Winn to Cordelia/Xander. That's exactly where my brain went too.
posted by mordax at 10:38 AM on March 1, 2016 [4 favorites]
Lucy Lane continues to spend screen time distracting me from things I care about
Often people complain about a character that I think is being played for a longer plot point. Lucy Lane is a classic example of this. Does she already know that Kara is Supergirl? I think it's quite likely. What is going on in Lucy's mind? There's a lot of potential there for an interesting, complex female character, and I'm eager to see where she goes and what she does.
That said, yes, Non is a kind of you-know-what entity, but maybe he'll pan out.
The key to the fortress of solitude thing bothered me, too. I'm starting to think that Jimmy's not that bright. Or brave. I think that's going to be a disappointing relationship for Kara (which is a way more interesting development than "Jimmy is an awesome boyfriend!!!"), and if it's not, then _I'll_ be disappointed.
posted by amtho at 11:04 AM on March 1, 2016 [4 favorites]
Often people complain about a character that I think is being played for a longer plot point. Lucy Lane is a classic example of this. Does she already know that Kara is Supergirl? I think it's quite likely. What is going on in Lucy's mind? There's a lot of potential there for an interesting, complex female character, and I'm eager to see where she goes and what she does.
That said, yes, Non is a kind of you-know-what entity, but maybe he'll pan out.
The key to the fortress of solitude thing bothered me, too. I'm starting to think that Jimmy's not that bright. Or brave. I think that's going to be a disappointing relationship for Kara (which is a way more interesting development than "Jimmy is an awesome boyfriend!!!"), and if it's not, then _I'll_ be disappointed.
posted by amtho at 11:04 AM on March 1, 2016 [4 favorites]
I think this episode has convinced me the show isn't going to get better. The things that don't work are getting worse - depressing.
posted by humans are superior! at 11:39 AM on March 1, 2016
posted by humans are superior! at 11:39 AM on March 1, 2016
Wouldn't a piece of neutron star or whatever be so dense it would fall through to the earth's core?
posted by Justinian at 1:20 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 1:20 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
"You threaten to kill me a lot"
"I was once linked to the Great Coluan cyber construct. Now I wander the same realm as Candy Crush."
"Never call me ma'am. This is not the Old West."
This show has some great quotes.
Indigo (aka Discount Mystique) was/is a good story line. Hoping for some female comic villains who don't look like they could also moonlight as victoria's secret models though. The men are all ages and body types but the women look as if they were popped out of a mold.
posted by the webmistress at 2:47 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
"I was once linked to the Great Coluan cyber construct. Now I wander the same realm as Candy Crush."
"Never call me ma'am. This is not the Old West."
This show has some great quotes.
Indigo (aka Discount Mystique) was/is a good story line. Hoping for some female comic villains who don't look like they could also moonlight as victoria's secret models though. The men are all ages and body types but the women look as if they were popped out of a mold.
posted by the webmistress at 2:47 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm starting to think that Jimmy's not that bright. Or brave. I think that's going to be a disappointing relationship for Kara (which is a way more interesting development than "Jimmy is an awesome boyfriend!!!")
... you know, I hadn't really considered that, and I don't think the show will run with it, but I would be absolutely tickled by that. Because he really doesn't seem like a good boyfriend. (Lucy Lane is pretty cool, and her dumping him tonight was a smart move.)
posted by mordax at 5:25 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
... you know, I hadn't really considered that, and I don't think the show will run with it, but I would be absolutely tickled by that. Because he really doesn't seem like a good boyfriend. (Lucy Lane is pretty cool, and her dumping him tonight was a smart move.)
posted by mordax at 5:25 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Wouldn't a piece of neutron star or whatever be so dense it would fall through to the earth's core?"
Well, of course, but that's not the right standard on which to judge this.
A better standard is that he explicitly said it weighed millions of tons and it's not very big and it's sitting there on some ice.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 6:32 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well, of course, but that's not the right standard on which to judge this.
A better standard is that he explicitly said it weighed millions of tons and it's not very big and it's sitting there on some ice.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 6:32 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
But then we might consider that Supergirl can pick up millions of tons and what that means for the combat she's engaged in, especially against other people who aren't Kryptonian. None of this makes sense. Which, by the way, is sort of the answer to mordax's complaint about Non and the Kryptonians. Superman and Supergirl and the Kryptonians generally are absurdly overpowered and so basically the show (and comics) have to sort of ignore this most of the time. It creates a lot of dissonance of the "Non is actually more threatening than a nuclear missile what are they thinking?" variety.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 6:36 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 6:36 PM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hey, they used the word "dox"!
I'm also glad they didn't let the lie about who killed Astra go on any longer.
They don't love each other, Lucy. It's a crush. A cutesy work infatuation that will crumble when any pressure is applied. I'm glad you dumped James anyway though, because you're obviously not feeling it and he seems tepid at best.
posted by ODiV at 7:05 PM on March 1, 2016
I'm also glad they didn't let the lie about who killed Astra go on any longer.
They don't love each other, Lucy. It's a crush. A cutesy work infatuation that will crumble when any pressure is applied. I'm glad you dumped James anyway though, because you're obviously not feeling it and he seems tepid at best.
posted by ODiV at 7:05 PM on March 1, 2016
None of this makes sense. Which, by the way, is sort of the answer to mordax's complaint about Non and the Kryptonians. Superman and Supergirl and the Kryptonians generally are absurdly overpowered and so basically the show (and comics) have to sort of ignore this most of the time.
That's a good point. I think the magic ingredient they're failing to add is that it only works when stories move fast and remain exciting enough to keep people too occupied to ask questions. Supergirl is having some problems with that - the tonal dissonance between her day job and the DEO is jarring on a weekly basis, and the fact that Non just doesn't have much screen presence is hurting their big story arc.
(Plus, Non giving them a specific date he was planning to hit adds a level of immediacy to the problem that they could have easily skipped. When he was just doing mysterious stuff, it made sense to go on with their day to day normally - Non has been on Earth for *years* without making a move. All they had to do was leave it be, really.)
A better standard is that he explicitly said it weighed millions of tons and it's not very big and it's sitting there on some ice.
I was willing to give them a pass on how the key worked because it's a nod to really old Superman stories, too. Plus, I'm suddenly liking the idea that Superman was pulling James' leg a bit, and James didn't catch on.
posted by mordax at 7:30 PM on March 1, 2016 [3 favorites]
That's a good point. I think the magic ingredient they're failing to add is that it only works when stories move fast and remain exciting enough to keep people too occupied to ask questions. Supergirl is having some problems with that - the tonal dissonance between her day job and the DEO is jarring on a weekly basis, and the fact that Non just doesn't have much screen presence is hurting their big story arc.
(Plus, Non giving them a specific date he was planning to hit adds a level of immediacy to the problem that they could have easily skipped. When he was just doing mysterious stuff, it made sense to go on with their day to day normally - Non has been on Earth for *years* without making a move. All they had to do was leave it be, really.)
A better standard is that he explicitly said it weighed millions of tons and it's not very big and it's sitting there on some ice.
I was willing to give them a pass on how the key worked because it's a nod to really old Superman stories, too. Plus, I'm suddenly liking the idea that Superman was pulling James' leg a bit, and James didn't catch on.
posted by mordax at 7:30 PM on March 1, 2016 [3 favorites]
Wow, where are we? Is this your fortress? How do you get in? Where's the door? Why do you call it a fortress of solitude anyway? What's that in the snow? Is that a key? It looks heavy! How much does it weigh?
posted by ODiV at 9:31 PM on March 1, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ODiV at 9:31 PM on March 1, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think this episode has convinced me the show isn't going to get better. The things that don't work are getting worse - depressing.
Eh, there's always season two.
Quite a lot of shows pick up once they figure out where they went wrong.
I'm sticking with it because there's nothing else on that night, and there is just enough to keep me interested (Team Danvers) while nothing else is competing for my attention.
(I'd be fine with ditching CatCo, or the DEO, but.... ugh, both? Does Kara even draw a salary from the DEO? Does Winn get paid?)
Apparently the Legion ring shot was used in the Flash multiverse episode, and people can see the magical Omnihedron from the Supergirl film in here somewhere.
posted by Mezentian at 1:06 AM on March 2, 2016
Eh, there's always season two.
Quite a lot of shows pick up once they figure out where they went wrong.
I'm sticking with it because there's nothing else on that night, and there is just enough to keep me interested (Team Danvers) while nothing else is competing for my attention.
(I'd be fine with ditching CatCo, or the DEO, but.... ugh, both? Does Kara even draw a salary from the DEO? Does Winn get paid?)
Apparently the Legion ring shot was used in the Flash multiverse episode, and people can see the magical Omnihedron from the Supergirl film in here somewhere.
posted by Mezentian at 1:06 AM on March 2, 2016
The rest of the quote worked too...
"Never call me ma'am. This is not the Old West. Now, let's circle the wagons...."
posted by idb at 5:38 AM on March 2, 2016
"Never call me ma'am. This is not the Old West. Now, let's circle the wagons...."
posted by idb at 5:38 AM on March 2, 2016
A better standard is that he explicitly said it weighed millions of tons and it's not very big and it's sitting there on some ice.
James Olsen said it weighs millions of tons. But of course, James can't tell the difference between 800 pounds and millions of tons, they're both just "way too heavy for me to lift". My personal headcanon is that Clark just gets a kick out of trolling James by seeing what kind of outrageous nonsense he can get him to believe.
posted by mstokes650 at 8:22 AM on March 2, 2016 [4 favorites]
James Olsen said it weighs millions of tons. But of course, James can't tell the difference between 800 pounds and millions of tons, they're both just "way too heavy for me to lift". My personal headcanon is that Clark just gets a kick out of trolling James by seeing what kind of outrageous nonsense he can get him to believe.
posted by mstokes650 at 8:22 AM on March 2, 2016 [4 favorites]
My personal headcanon is that Clark just gets a kick out of trolling James by seeing what kind of outrageous nonsense he can get him to believe.
All this talk now has me hoping for Superman to show up after all, just so that we can find out that he's actually kind of a dick.
posted by mordax at 8:30 AM on March 2, 2016
All this talk now has me hoping for Superman to show up after all, just so that we can find out that he's actually kind of a dick.
posted by mordax at 8:30 AM on March 2, 2016
No one? Alright, I'll do it.
Kara vs Kara !!!!!
Laura Vandervoort was Supergirl in Smallville
I'm surprised that with all the technology they can access from surviving Krypton stuff, that key is what he chose to open the fortress.
posted by numaner at 9:28 AM on March 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
Kara vs Kara !!!!!
Laura Vandervoort was Supergirl in Smallville
I'm surprised that with all the technology they can access from surviving Krypton stuff, that key is what he chose to open the fortress.
posted by numaner at 9:28 AM on March 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm surprised that James' nose didn't turn black and fall off.
posted by ODiV at 9:44 AM on March 2, 2016
posted by ODiV at 9:44 AM on March 2, 2016
I wish this show would acknowledge its B-movie qualities, but I don't think it is aware that it has them. I mean, Supergirl flew hundreds of miles and hour to catch up the missile, then struggles to climb the last few feet to shut it down. Why didn't she just fly those few extra feet? A subtle "we know this is ridiculous" wink to the audience every once in a while would be a big improvement.
posted by plastic_animals at 11:11 AM on March 2, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by plastic_animals at 11:11 AM on March 2, 2016 [3 favorites]
Maybe keeping a steady flying speed along side a missile sounds more ridiculous when you gotta disarm said missile?
I wonder if there's an equivalent in entertainment so far where someone has to run along side a thing and do stuff to it. But maybe flying's just different?
Bah, physics!
posted by numaner at 4:56 PM on March 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
I wonder if there's an equivalent in entertainment so far where someone has to run along side a thing and do stuff to it. But maybe flying's just different?
Bah, physics!
posted by numaner at 4:56 PM on March 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
So did going to the Fortress of Solitude actually accomplish anything? Or did they just need to use the set so they could write it off on their taxes or something?
posted by Naberius at 5:57 PM on March 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Naberius at 5:57 PM on March 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
Reluctantly, I'm going to have to fire up the search engine as I don't quite get the genealogy of this new character. Brainiac is contemporary to Superman and therefore Supergirl. Brainiac 5 of the Legion is from the 30th or 31st century. So of course I spent the whole episode trying to figure out how Indigo (as Brainiac 8) fits into the timeline and why she's blue not green.
So much of this episode felt badly constructed. Siobhan and Winn felt especially like it came out of the blue--and it should stay there. I wish they'd finally explain what Astra's super-secret plan is because the more they hint at it the less sense it makes. I really don't want to see James and Kara together. They feel like such a mismatch. Let them have their little puppy love crush and move on. also, did he think it was a smart idea to be shouting into his signal watch in the middle of the office? I think the commenters who have speculated that James isn't the brightest bulb in the chandelier are onto something.
posted by sardonyx at 7:33 PM on March 2, 2016
So much of this episode felt badly constructed. Siobhan and Winn felt especially like it came out of the blue--and it should stay there. I wish they'd finally explain what Astra's super-secret plan is because the more they hint at it the less sense it makes. I really don't want to see James and Kara together. They feel like such a mismatch. Let them have their little puppy love crush and move on. also, did he think it was a smart idea to be shouting into his signal watch in the middle of the office? I think the commenters who have speculated that James isn't the brightest bulb in the chandelier are onto something.
posted by sardonyx at 7:33 PM on March 2, 2016
"So did going to the Fortress of Solitude actually accomplish anything? Or did they just need to use the set so they could write it off on their taxes or something?"
Yeah, that's how they found out the villain's race, name, and history. The robot thing told them.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 11:58 PM on March 2, 2016
Yeah, that's how they found out the villain's race, name, and history. The robot thing told them.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 11:58 PM on March 2, 2016
James Olsen said it weighs millions of tons.
Or did he say "millions of tonnes"?
posted by Mezentian at 3:15 AM on March 3, 2016
Or did he say "millions of tonnes"?
posted by Mezentian at 3:15 AM on March 3, 2016
Yeah, that's how they found out the villain's race, name, and history. The robot thing told them.
Well sure, but so what? It's not like any of that information was useful in any way or had any real bearing on the plot. It didn't help them find her. It didn't help them figure out what she was doing. It didn't help them stop her. It was literally like "oh, and also she's got a cousin who lives in Denver and her favorite book is Little Women."
I'm assuming it was jammed in to set up the Fortress for later or - like Picard's "Captain's Yacht" in ST:TNG - they wrote it into an episode, not because they really needed it but because the producers were in a spendy mood early on, and if they didn't get the set built now, they weren't sure they'd be able to get the money for it later on.
(Of course that didn't actually work for ST:TNG while they did get the Fortress set built.)
posted by Naberius at 6:35 AM on March 3, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well sure, but so what? It's not like any of that information was useful in any way or had any real bearing on the plot. It didn't help them find her. It didn't help them figure out what she was doing. It didn't help them stop her. It was literally like "oh, and also she's got a cousin who lives in Denver and her favorite book is Little Women."
I'm assuming it was jammed in to set up the Fortress for later or - like Picard's "Captain's Yacht" in ST:TNG - they wrote it into an episode, not because they really needed it but because the producers were in a spendy mood early on, and if they didn't get the set built now, they weren't sure they'd be able to get the money for it later on.
(Of course that didn't actually work for ST:TNG while they did get the Fortress set built.)
posted by Naberius at 6:35 AM on March 3, 2016 [1 favorite]
Also, they needed something to distract Jimmy so he missed his date with Lucy. Why not take a trip to the Fortress of Solitude?
posted by ursus_comiter at 6:13 AM on March 11, 2016
posted by ursus_comiter at 6:13 AM on March 11, 2016
Also, Indigo's plan to wipe out all of humanity needed some work.
I thought she was going to launch against Russia and start a nuclear holocaust, but no. Just destroy one local city.
Seven million people. Good start. Just do that 1000 more times and you're there!
posted by ursus_comiter at 6:15 AM on March 11, 2016
I thought she was going to launch against Russia and start a nuclear holocaust, but no. Just destroy one local city.
Seven million people. Good start. Just do that 1000 more times and you're there!
posted by ursus_comiter at 6:15 AM on March 11, 2016
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Lucy Lane continues to spend screen time distracting me from things I care about, and I don't care at all about Kara's romantic storylines.
I liked seeing the Fortress of Solitude (and the Legion of Super Heroes ring was a nice tease for something), but at some point they really need to deal with the looming out of focus Superman in the background. They probably need to just get him out of the picture entirely, but I have no idea how to do that exactly. It's a hard issue, but it needs to happen.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 5:52 AM on March 1, 2016 [1 favorite]