Supernatural: Mamma Mia
October 24, 2016 10:18 AM - Season 12, Episode 2 - Subscribe

Dean adjusts to life in the bunker with his mom, while Castiel finally gets a lead on Sam's whereabouts. Meanwhile, Lady Antonia uses new forms of torture on Sam.
posted by cfoxhi (10 comments total)
Perhaps too much torture in these first episodes of Season 12. Having the Winchester reunions altered by captivity seemed to help Sam and Dean, by giving us something different, but made Sam's reunion with his mother less impactful somehow. Though of course it's a strange situation no matter what, since Mary doesn't know Sam and Dean as adults. They must seem like strangers who have taken the place of her babies. I'm enjoying Mary on the show.

It's not believable that Crowley could force Rowena to do much of anything, but I do love their family dynamics. Rick Springfield makes a pretty good Satan, but he has a lot to live up to following Mark Pellegrino and Misha Colllins. Incredible special effects with Luficer's face. That would be an awesome Halloween mask.
posted by cfoxhi at 10:28 AM on October 24, 2016 [3 favorites]

I guess they've run out of emotional turmoil to put the boys through so Mary is basically a hail... y'know. But I'm enjoying it! It's certainly an interesting development. They haven't had to deal with a parent figure for quite some time. And it's been so sweet of Dean trying his damnest to keep his mom alive only to have her come to their rescue twice already.
posted by numaner at 4:19 PM on October 24, 2016 [3 favorites]

Mary is certainly a different kind of character for the show, and while I'm really liking her and her weird interactions with the boys, it's kind of surprising this doesn't feel bigger. I mean, this is the lady we've been seeing in flashbacks since season one, frying on the ceiling! In terms of the show's mythology, Mary Winchester coming back from the dead should be a big, big deal! But maybe the show's been on so long, some of those old plot threads just don't feel so urgent anymore. (When Mary said it was her fault the Yellow Eyed Demon came into their lives, I had no idea how she was responsible for any of that. It's just been too long.)

But it is an interesting dynamic so far. Dean and Sam treat her with this kind of trembling awe, but there is also a distance there. They're so used to her not being there, and her being back just feels weird. Mary is raw and kind of confused, like she's recovering from a long coma or something, but you can see she's a damn tough lady. I don't know how this will play out, long-term. I can see the writers feeling like there's not much to do with her and killing her off again, but I hope they don't go that route. I kind of like the idea of her being the new Bobby, hanging out at the home base and giving the boys info on cases around the country, occasionally going out on her own hunts. Either that or maybe she'll strike out on her own, deciding she needs to hunt but she can't do it with the boys fretting over her.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 5:43 PM on October 25, 2016 [3 favorites]

Mary Winchester coming back from the dead should be a big, big deal! But maybe the show's been on so long, some of those old plot threads just don't feel so urgent anymore. (When Mary said it was her fault the Yellow Eyed Demon came into their lives, I had no idea how she was responsible for any of that. It's just been too long.)

So far I've also been really enjoying Mary's appearance. It's a nice, hopefully, positive dynamic to the show. Here's hoping she isn't killed off by the end of the episode.

As for the Yellow Eyed Demon, some part of me wants to say we learned something about the demon and Mary's family in one of the time traveling trips, maybe the one where we learn she's from a family of hunters?

Otherwise, it might be it's an omission designed to lead to a storyline/plot twist going into this season.

One thing is for sure, Dean seems to be having problems reconciling the idealized mother of his childhood with the woman who was returned to him by God/Darkness. It was kind of sad to see him staring at the photos of her at the end, obviously reflecting on those memories he possessed (her meat loaf!) with recent events in mind.

ALSO: Was that British Men of Letters super assassin killer person packing up a Colt? If so, it's another callback to the Yellow Eyed Demon storyline.
posted by Atreides at 2:09 PM on October 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

Gave in to curiosity and checked the Supernatural wiki. Apparently Mary made a deal with the Yellow-Eyed Demon to save John's life. (Warning: For a Supernatural fan that wiki is a huge potential time-sink. This show's been on so long, its mythology is dense.)
posted by Ursula Hitler at 4:40 PM on October 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

When Mary said it was her fault the Yellow Eyed Demon came into their lives, I had no idea how she was responsible for any of that. It's just been too long.

Apparently Mary made a deal with the Yellow-Eyed Demon to save John's life.

Yep, I remember that episode. Some harsh truths there, whew.
posted by numaner at 4:45 PM on October 27, 2016

I'm having a fan squeal moment over this photo. Wow! Can you recognize them all?
posted by numaner at 3:00 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Castiel: I think I may have found Sam's location. It's a farm. It appears empty, but it was rented two weeks ago to a woman with an English accent.
Dean: Did you have a look inside?
Castiel: No. No, it's – it's powerfully warded.
Dean: Powerfully warded? Okay, see, buddy, that -– that was your headline right there.
Castiel: ...
Castiel: Are we still discussing the same thing?

Mary: We should call the internet and find out as much as we can about these people.
Sam & Dean: ....
Mary: Did I say that right?
Dean: So close!
Sam: Yeah, it was close.

Mary: [to Dean, who is mowing down on pie] Could you eat that any faster?
Dean: [through a mouthful of pie] No. No, I cannot.

Mick Davies: I reckon you could finish me off without breaking a sweat. Am I right?
Castiel: I don't sweat under any circumstances.

Lucifer: Get off my furniture, squatter.
Crowley: Lucifer. Wearing Vince Vincente, second-tier star. I would've thought Bieber was your style.

Crowley: What's the bloody hold-up? He's the one and only Satan in the phonebook.
Rowena: It's witchcraft, not Google Maps. And normally I'd have a piece of hair or a belonging to lock on to. You don't even know what he looks like!
Crowley: He has an aura. Supreme evil. Lock on to that. Do I have to do everything?
Rownena: I can't believe I'm once again down some dank hole seeking the devil! When does it end? It's exactly why I'm retiring to Boca Raton. With Ben.
Crowley: Ben? Who makes oatmeal look fascinating.
Rowena: He's successful, stable, and I'll outlive him.


Vince and Tommy of Ladyheart are very likely named after the now-retired band Mötley Crüe. Vince is the lead singer of Mötley Crüe and Tommy is the drummer. Ladyheart also has Vince as lead singer, and Tommy on the drums. One guitarist also looks fairly similar to bass guitarist Nikki Sixx. Crowley also says to Lucifer-posessed Vince, "Why in hell would you want to rule over a motley, witless crew of demons?"

On her date with Ben, Rowena claims to have been a dancer with the Scottish Ballet (after first checking to make sure Ben doesn't follow ballet to be sure he couldn't call her bluff). The actress, Ruth Connell, did in fact dance with the Scottish Ballet.

Vince Vincente's aging rock band was appearing in Cleveland. This could be a reference to Spinal Tap, an aging rock band who started their stage show with "Hello Cleveland!" at every city they played -- except Cleveland.

First time in the series that Rowena wears trousers instead of a floor-length dress.

The whole "pie" moment was not originally scripted. It was something that Jensen Ackles and Jared Padalecki came up with and ran by the producer and director. Most of what we see was improvised by them and Samantha Smith.

The picture Mary finds in John Winchester's journal at the end of the episode is from "The End" (ep. 5.4), which places Dean in a potential future reality (by Zachariah) if Sam agreed to be possessed by the Devil during the Apocalypse. The image places Castiel and a wheelchair-bound Bobby at "Camp Chitaqua". This picture never came to be as Sam and Dean prevented the Apocalypse.

Crowley is reading a comic book when Vince Vicente/Lucifer enters the throne room of Hell. That comic is Superman #206 from May 1968, with the tagline "The day Superman became an assassin!".

While planning what to do about Lucifer running loose, Rowena tells Crowley that Lucifer can't be returned to the cage while he's occupying a vessel, however, that's exactly how "Swan Song" (ep. 5.22) ended. Sam, while occupied by Lucifer, jumped into a portal opened by the four Horsemen's rings and took Michael who was using Adam as a vessel with him, sealing both in the cage while still in vessels. As of this episode, Michael was still there, still within Adam's vessel.
posted by orange swan at 12:42 PM on January 8, 2022

Dean's reluctance to let his mother accompany him to rescue Sam was an emotional, not a logical decision. His mother had *just saved him and Castiel* from Toni's henchwoman. Mary had already demonstrated that she's a highly trained and experienced hunter -- she threw him to the ground within seconds of meeting him! -- and he needed backup.

I wince for Mary Winchester. Coming back to life to discover that her husband is dead and that she's missed out on her sons' lives -- and that they haven't been the kind of lives she wanted for them -- it would be so disorienting. And, as someone said above, Dean does not quite know how to deal with the schism between the idealized memory of his mother he's cherished for 33 years and the living, breathing, complex, flawed, self-willed human mom he has in front of him.

I have to wonder what makes the difference between a vessel that can contain and angel and a vessel that can't. It doesn't seem to be just physical strength.

Vince's girlfriend wears pumps with a nightgown? I suppose that's Lucifer's idea of how an attractive woman dresses.

The "eaten by sulfuric acid" makeup/prosthetics on Vince were quite impressive.
posted by orange swan at 12:44 PM on January 8, 2022

I don’t know exactly where it happened but at some point they started coloring this show like the Trickster’s zany TV parody dimension. But credit where it's due, they really went for it on the rockstar guy’s dissolving face.
posted by jameaterblues at 9:55 PM on February 20, 2022

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