Star Trek: Lower Decks: The Inner Fight
October 26, 2023 9:36 AM - Season 4, Episode 9 - Subscribe
Mysterious Little Ship: now with 100% less mystery.
Memory Alpha loves you only when the fence is up:
- The people listed as possible targets for the Mysterious Little Ship are Seven of Nine, Beverly Crusher, Thomas Riker, and Nick Locarno. This is the first indication that Thomas Riker was still alive since DS9's "Defiant" and the first appearance of Locarno since TNG's "The First Duty." (Locarno is also voice-acted by Robert Duncan McNeill, the original actor, who also of course played Tom Paris on VOY.)
- Various of the alien crew members have appeared previously as abductees of the MLS, and Ma'ah appeared earlier in "wej Duj", which was also T'Lyn's first appearance.
- The appearance of the information broker in Mudds is based off of the false face for Balok, the representative of the First Federation in TOS' "The Corbomite Maneuver". The false appearance of Balok was also used as the final image in the end credits for TOS episodes.
"Teach me how to tap-dance, Beverly Crusher."
- Boimler, in his sleep
"Stupid knife rain."
- Mariner, during the glass storm
Poster's Log:
Wow, a biiiiiiiiiiig episode for Mariner; if she was in the Academy at the same time as Sito Jaxa and Nick Locarno, then she's probably in her early thirties--she may have spent more time as an ensign than Harry Kim! And she's also a Dominion War veteran. Her talk with Ma'ah was great. (As much as I like Paul F. Tompkins, Ma'ah would probably make a better counselor than Migleemo.) I totally whiffed on the identity/nature of the Mysterious Little Ship, but that's fine; the audience being able to guess plot twists ahead of time is some sort of failure on the part of showrunners, and I'll be very interested to see how this is resolved next week.
Speaking of plot twists, I was starting to guess that the mysterious masked dude wasn't Locarno by the time he was unmasked, but I sure wouldn't have guessed that it was Billups. I'm also intrigued by the idea that the 'ritos might be carrying around a non-Starfleet shuttle specifically for situations in which they run across a fuck-you-Federation-type planet and want to fake their way in, kind of like the way that Voyager would sometimes use Neelix's janky little ship.
Poster's Log, supplemental: Jippers, the drink available at Mudds, comes from a Short Trek episode featuring Rainn Wilson's version of the character Harry Mudd; "sipping jippers on a beach" figures into the denouement heavily.
Memory Alpha loves you only when the fence is up:
- The people listed as possible targets for the Mysterious Little Ship are Seven of Nine, Beverly Crusher, Thomas Riker, and Nick Locarno. This is the first indication that Thomas Riker was still alive since DS9's "Defiant" and the first appearance of Locarno since TNG's "The First Duty." (Locarno is also voice-acted by Robert Duncan McNeill, the original actor, who also of course played Tom Paris on VOY.)
- Various of the alien crew members have appeared previously as abductees of the MLS, and Ma'ah appeared earlier in "wej Duj", which was also T'Lyn's first appearance.
- The appearance of the information broker in Mudds is based off of the false face for Balok, the representative of the First Federation in TOS' "The Corbomite Maneuver". The false appearance of Balok was also used as the final image in the end credits for TOS episodes.
"Teach me how to tap-dance, Beverly Crusher."
- Boimler, in his sleep
"Stupid knife rain."
- Mariner, during the glass storm
Poster's Log:
Wow, a biiiiiiiiiiig episode for Mariner; if she was in the Academy at the same time as Sito Jaxa and Nick Locarno, then she's probably in her early thirties--she may have spent more time as an ensign than Harry Kim! And she's also a Dominion War veteran. Her talk with Ma'ah was great. (As much as I like Paul F. Tompkins, Ma'ah would probably make a better counselor than Migleemo.) I totally whiffed on the identity/nature of the Mysterious Little Ship, but that's fine; the audience being able to guess plot twists ahead of time is some sort of failure on the part of showrunners, and I'll be very interested to see how this is resolved next week.
Speaking of plot twists, I was starting to guess that the mysterious masked dude wasn't Locarno by the time he was unmasked, but I sure wouldn't have guessed that it was Billups. I'm also intrigued by the idea that the 'ritos might be carrying around a non-Starfleet shuttle specifically for situations in which they run across a fuck-you-Federation-type planet and want to fake their way in, kind of like the way that Voyager would sometimes use Neelix's janky little ship.
Poster's Log, supplemental: Jippers, the drink available at Mudds, comes from a Short Trek episode featuring Rainn Wilson's version of the character Harry Mudd; "sipping jippers on a beach" figures into the denouement heavily.
Ma'ah is the Klingon Boimler, so of course he's the one who could help Mariner figure some stuff out.
posted by Servo5678 at 11:23 AM on October 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by Servo5678 at 11:23 AM on October 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
Perhaps we should find shelter before anything is brought.
posted by wittgenstein at 3:50 PM on October 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by wittgenstein at 3:50 PM on October 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
I've never heard a definitive explanation for why Locarno became Tom Paris in Voyager, but I've always assumed it was in the service of screwing someone over for character rights.
Going my MA, "The First Duty" with Locarno and Jaxa was in 2368. Sito Jaxa's final appearance in TNG: "Lower Decks" was in 2370. This episode here of Lower Decks the series is set in 2381 or thereabouts.
For reference, and because I always have trouble keeping this straight in my own head:
2370: TNG ends.
2375: DS9 ends.
2378: Voyager ends.
2379: TNG movies end.
2380: Lower Decks starts.
2385: Short Treks: "Children of Mars"
2387: Romulus destroyed
2399: Picard starts.
posted by dumbland at 4:23 PM on October 26, 2023 [11 favorites]
Going my MA, "The First Duty" with Locarno and Jaxa was in 2368. Sito Jaxa's final appearance in TNG: "Lower Decks" was in 2370. This episode here of Lower Decks the series is set in 2381 or thereabouts.
For reference, and because I always have trouble keeping this straight in my own head:
2370: TNG ends.
2375: DS9 ends.
2378: Voyager ends.
2379: TNG movies end.
2380: Lower Decks starts.
2385: Short Treks: "Children of Mars"
2387: Romulus destroyed
2399: Picard starts.
posted by dumbland at 4:23 PM on October 26, 2023 [11 favorites]
Big time plot payoff on this episode. Wow.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 6:27 PM on October 26, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by mrjohnmuller at 6:27 PM on October 26, 2023 [3 favorites]
I've never heard a definitive explanation for why Locarno became Tom Paris in Voyager, but I've always assumed it was in the service of screwing someone over for character rights.
I heard or read somewhere (probably on The Greatest Generation?) that it was exactly that. Paris was originally going to be Locarno until they realized that the writers of "The First Duty" (specifically Ronald D. Moore and Naren Shankar) would get royalties from essentially every episode if they did that. So the character was kept largely the same, with the same performer, obvs, but the name changed. But the official line from the VOY producers is that Locarno was too "irredeemable" to work on the show (an argument that Moore and Shankar apparently disagreed with, particularly since Sito Jaxa was clearly shown to be redeemable.)
Anyway, "The First Duty" is one of my all-time favorite Trek episodes, so this revisiting of it was huge for me, and hell yes "Justice for Sito."
posted by Navelgazer at 9:12 PM on October 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
I heard or read somewhere (probably on The Greatest Generation?) that it was exactly that. Paris was originally going to be Locarno until they realized that the writers of "The First Duty" (specifically Ronald D. Moore and Naren Shankar) would get royalties from essentially every episode if they did that. So the character was kept largely the same, with the same performer, obvs, but the name changed. But the official line from the VOY producers is that Locarno was too "irredeemable" to work on the show (an argument that Moore and Shankar apparently disagreed with, particularly since Sito Jaxa was clearly shown to be redeemable.)
Anyway, "The First Duty" is one of my all-time favorite Trek episodes, so this revisiting of it was huge for me, and hell yes "Justice for Sito."
posted by Navelgazer at 9:12 PM on October 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
It was so cathartic to watch Mariner articulate my incandescent rage at what Starfleet did to Sito, and by extension, what a lot of Trek writing since DS9 has done to the show: turn it from a show about exploration into a show about fighting. I'm not really interested in aliens in giant spaceships battling each other. I don't want to see the Enterprise's medical staff shooting themselves up with Murder Drugs and punching out Klingons. I want to see people trying their best to help each other and figure out weird shit. That's what sucked us all in to this wormhole in the first place, right? Give me your holodeck conundrums, your transporter clones, your ancestral alien ghost sex candles. This show gets it, and it's the first Trek that's felt like Trek in a long, long time.
posted by phooky at 6:20 AM on October 27, 2023 [20 favorites]
posted by phooky at 6:20 AM on October 27, 2023 [20 favorites]
Metafilter: people trying their best to help each other and figure out weird shit
posted by the antecedent of that pronoun at 8:59 AM on October 27, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by the antecedent of that pronoun at 8:59 AM on October 27, 2023 [9 favorites]
So the deal is Locarno has been helping all the lower decks people on various ships mutiny and strand the officers on this planet?
posted by the antecedent of that pronoun at 10:01 AM on October 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by the antecedent of that pronoun at 10:01 AM on October 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
I love how much everyone involved in making Lower Decks loves Star Trek enough to be honest about what makes it great and when it sometimes lets us down.
posted by Molesome at 1:07 PM on October 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by Molesome at 1:07 PM on October 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
So the deal is Locarno has been helping all the lower decks people on various ships mutiny and strand the officers on this planet?
Seems to be, although I suspect he has bigger ambitions. My little theory is that he's been stealing all those ships to aquire the parts needed to travel back in time and either A) Stop himself from getting expelled, or B) Kill Wesley Crusher
posted by mrjohnmuller at 1:09 PM on October 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Seems to be, although I suspect he has bigger ambitions. My little theory is that he's been stealing all those ships to aquire the parts needed to travel back in time and either A) Stop himself from getting expelled, or B) Kill Wesley Crusher
posted by mrjohnmuller at 1:09 PM on October 27, 2023 [1 favorite]
Very cool that they want back to the original Lower Decks well. The TNG eps "The First Duty" and "Lower Decks" are shaping up to be prerequisites for this show in the same fashion that TNG: "Ensign Ro" and all the other Bajor eps are prereqs for DS9.
I totally whiffed on the identity/nature of the Mysterious Little Ship, but that's fine; the audience being able to guess plot twists ahead of time is some sort of failure on the part of showrunners
Well, yeah, but like…where'd Locarno steal that ship from? I'm sticking with the Whale Probers.
I want to see people trying their best to help each other and figure out weird shit. That's what sucked us all in to this wormhole in the first place, right? Give me your holodeck conundrums, your transporter clones, your ancestral alien ghost sex candles. This show gets it, and it's the first Trek that's felt like Trek in a long, long time.
Not that I disagree at all, but I sincerely wonder if folks who grew up on TOS have that same feeling, or if what you refer to as feeling "like Trek" really means feeling "like early Berman era Trek." I feel like TOS was less-frequently ambitious in this way—like it had a much higher proportion of fistfights and scantily-clad ladies. Maybe I'm just misremembering, and I need to do a full rewatch of TOS again.
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 6:33 AM on October 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
I totally whiffed on the identity/nature of the Mysterious Little Ship, but that's fine; the audience being able to guess plot twists ahead of time is some sort of failure on the part of showrunners
Well, yeah, but like…where'd Locarno steal that ship from? I'm sticking with the Whale Probers.
I want to see people trying their best to help each other and figure out weird shit. That's what sucked us all in to this wormhole in the first place, right? Give me your holodeck conundrums, your transporter clones, your ancestral alien ghost sex candles. This show gets it, and it's the first Trek that's felt like Trek in a long, long time.
Not that I disagree at all, but I sincerely wonder if folks who grew up on TOS have that same feeling, or if what you refer to as feeling "like Trek" really means feeling "like early Berman era Trek." I feel like TOS was less-frequently ambitious in this way—like it had a much higher proportion of fistfights and scantily-clad ladies. Maybe I'm just misremembering, and I need to do a full rewatch of TOS again.
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 6:33 AM on October 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
Well, yeah, but like…where'd Locarno steal that ship from? I'm sticking with the Whale Probers.
It looked like he built it based on the blue prints that popped up.
So the deal is Locarno has been helping all the lower decks people on various ships mutiny and strand the officers on this planet?
Maybe? Though it seems like there's a reason he's targeting different species. Maybe he's trying to prove a point about leadership and duty to said leadership, which is what screwed him over originally. Perhaps it will also show the unique difference of Starfleet versus all the other aliens/cultures involved, that the lower decks in Starfleet aren't going to just turn on their commanding officers as every other alien species/culture did.
The list of people that were being targeted seems like a big clue, but I'm not 100% sure how to weave it together. Crusher? Okay, Wesley's mom, but why - draw him out? Tom Riker? What's Riker's teleport twin going to provide to this scenario other than someone who can try and fool folks into thinking he's Riker? Seven of Nine? Borg intel? It's hard to say. Of course, Locarno's own name is there, so a deliberate plant?
Overall, I loved the final breakdown on Mariner's inner demon/guilt that has driven her behavior going forward. That it tied back to Sito was amazing. I don't know if her speech was really intended as a criticism of where Star Trek has gone, so much as another anti-war criticism that is just in line as any of the DS9 episodes were.
I want to see people trying their best to help each other and figure out weird shit. That's what sucked us all in to this wormhole in the first place, right? Give me your holodeck conundrums, your transporter clones, your ancestral alien ghost sex candles. This show gets it, and it's the first Trek that's felt like Trek in a long, long time
Strange New Worlds is right there. That show is like a modern reboot of TOS because that's basically what it is. The episodes involving the doctor and Chapel, those very much were also anti-war episodes reflecting on the aftermath of war (as well as the horrors). And I think that's true for most Trek, it's not about the glorification of war. Discovery and SNW have often delved into the weird and unusual, though more often from a different level or POV. But SNW had a whole episode dedicated to everyone being controlled by musical theater rules. That's 100% Star Trek.
posted by Atreides at 7:45 AM on October 28, 2023 [7 favorites]
It looked like he built it based on the blue prints that popped up.
So the deal is Locarno has been helping all the lower decks people on various ships mutiny and strand the officers on this planet?
Maybe? Though it seems like there's a reason he's targeting different species. Maybe he's trying to prove a point about leadership and duty to said leadership, which is what screwed him over originally. Perhaps it will also show the unique difference of Starfleet versus all the other aliens/cultures involved, that the lower decks in Starfleet aren't going to just turn on their commanding officers as every other alien species/culture did.
The list of people that were being targeted seems like a big clue, but I'm not 100% sure how to weave it together. Crusher? Okay, Wesley's mom, but why - draw him out? Tom Riker? What's Riker's teleport twin going to provide to this scenario other than someone who can try and fool folks into thinking he's Riker? Seven of Nine? Borg intel? It's hard to say. Of course, Locarno's own name is there, so a deliberate plant?
Overall, I loved the final breakdown on Mariner's inner demon/guilt that has driven her behavior going forward. That it tied back to Sito was amazing. I don't know if her speech was really intended as a criticism of where Star Trek has gone, so much as another anti-war criticism that is just in line as any of the DS9 episodes were.
I want to see people trying their best to help each other and figure out weird shit. That's what sucked us all in to this wormhole in the first place, right? Give me your holodeck conundrums, your transporter clones, your ancestral alien ghost sex candles. This show gets it, and it's the first Trek that's felt like Trek in a long, long time
Strange New Worlds is right there. That show is like a modern reboot of TOS because that's basically what it is. The episodes involving the doctor and Chapel, those very much were also anti-war episodes reflecting on the aftermath of war (as well as the horrors). And I think that's true for most Trek, it's not about the glorification of war. Discovery and SNW have often delved into the weird and unusual, though more often from a different level or POV. But SNW had a whole episode dedicated to everyone being controlled by musical theater rules. That's 100% Star Trek.
posted by Atreides at 7:45 AM on October 28, 2023 [7 favorites]
I sincerely wonder if folks who grew up on TOS have that same feeling
That's a really interesting observation. I did grow up on TOS-- I had watched perhaps a dozen TNG episodes until a couple of years ago (and thank you for those rewatch threads!)-- but fwiw I also grew up on Space:1999 which was in some ways far more ambitious. There were plenty of fisticuffs in TOS, but there wasn't in general a lot of killing.
Strange New Worlds is right there
True, and for the most part I like it a lot, but it still falls back on the "sometimes you have to do terrible things, what can you do" trope that's so prevalent in late- and post-TNG Trek. The Strange New Worlds episode referenced is interesting because everyone Has A Sad when they blow up the ship because they think their friends are aboard, but once they're found safe everything is hunky-dory. Contrast that with Balance of Terror, which is a war story soaked in melancholy from start to finish.
posted by phooky at 8:35 AM on October 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
That's a really interesting observation. I did grow up on TOS-- I had watched perhaps a dozen TNG episodes until a couple of years ago (and thank you for those rewatch threads!)-- but fwiw I also grew up on Space:1999 which was in some ways far more ambitious. There were plenty of fisticuffs in TOS, but there wasn't in general a lot of killing.
Strange New Worlds is right there
True, and for the most part I like it a lot, but it still falls back on the "sometimes you have to do terrible things, what can you do" trope that's so prevalent in late- and post-TNG Trek. The Strange New Worlds episode referenced is interesting because everyone Has A Sad when they blow up the ship because they think their friends are aboard, but once they're found safe everything is hunky-dory. Contrast that with Balance of Terror, which is a war story soaked in melancholy from start to finish.
posted by phooky at 8:35 AM on October 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
I'm grateful for these posts since, while I've seen all the trek from TNG onwards, it's pretty much blurred into one mass, so I don't recognise a character by name from decades ago.
posted by Marticus at 4:17 PM on October 29, 2023
posted by Marticus at 4:17 PM on October 29, 2023
We love that Lower Decks keeps the canon. It keeps the canon hard. There was so much in this episode! And I also love how Mariner is figuring out why she is so self-destructive — with the help of a Klingon no less!
posted by R343L at 9:13 PM on October 29, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by R343L at 9:13 PM on October 29, 2023 [3 favorites]
Paris was originally going to be Locarno until they realized that the writers of "The First Duty" (specifically Ronald D. Moore and Naren Shankar) would get royalties from essentially every episode if they did that.
When we discussed this back on the rewatch of "The First Duty", a few of us dug into these claims and I lean towards the "irredeemable" comment as actually correct. Separated rights generally devolve to the show creator, not the writer of any given episode--so Gene Roddenberry (or his estate) would get the residuals as part of the "Based on" credit he already gets.
Shankar and Moore also didn't get a credit on this episode, which presumably would have happened if they got the royalty for creating Locarno. But I could be wrong! If McMahan comes out and says, "yep, this is how it works," I'll happily own up to my misunderstanding here.
At any rate, I think that using Locarno would have been a more interesting choice for Voyager--but "Voyager makes the less interesting choice" is a pretty well-documented aspect of the series at this point.
posted by thecaddy at 9:46 AM on October 30, 2023 [6 favorites]
When we discussed this back on the rewatch of "The First Duty", a few of us dug into these claims and I lean towards the "irredeemable" comment as actually correct. Separated rights generally devolve to the show creator, not the writer of any given episode--so Gene Roddenberry (or his estate) would get the residuals as part of the "Based on" credit he already gets.
Shankar and Moore also didn't get a credit on this episode, which presumably would have happened if they got the royalty for creating Locarno. But I could be wrong! If McMahan comes out and says, "yep, this is how it works," I'll happily own up to my misunderstanding here.
At any rate, I think that using Locarno would have been a more interesting choice for Voyager--but "Voyager makes the less interesting choice" is a pretty well-documented aspect of the series at this point.
posted by thecaddy at 9:46 AM on October 30, 2023 [6 favorites]
When we discussed this back on the rewatch of "The First Duty", a few of us dug into these claims and I lean towards the "irredeemable" comment as actually correct.
I could very well be wrong! Weirdly, I work a lot in rights & clearances for TV, but not on anything dealing with WGA rights, so I'm actually fairly in the dark about that. I remember this same concept coming up in a discussion of Torchwood and whether Steven Moffatt got royalties for each episode using Capt. Jack Harkness, who first appeared in the Moffat-penned Who episode "The Empty Child," but from what I recall about that discussion, the character himself was created by Russell T. Davies (who was Executive Producer for Doctor Who at the time) so there wasn't an issue. But also, that's the U.K. and I'm not sure how accurate any of my information was about that issue either.
But I don't for a second think that Locarno was irredeemable - hell, the end of "The First Duty" has him taking the blame for the rest of the squadron, the only reason Wesley Crusher and Sito Jaxa get to remain in the academy at all. Of course, this was after he was trying to lead the cover-up all episode right up to the point that Wesley made it clear that he was going to tell the truth, but the fact that he took the responsibility in the end, I believe, definitely points towards a redemptive arc that we never got to see.
posted by Navelgazer at 1:27 PM on October 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
I could very well be wrong! Weirdly, I work a lot in rights & clearances for TV, but not on anything dealing with WGA rights, so I'm actually fairly in the dark about that. I remember this same concept coming up in a discussion of Torchwood and whether Steven Moffatt got royalties for each episode using Capt. Jack Harkness, who first appeared in the Moffat-penned Who episode "The Empty Child," but from what I recall about that discussion, the character himself was created by Russell T. Davies (who was Executive Producer for Doctor Who at the time) so there wasn't an issue. But also, that's the U.K. and I'm not sure how accurate any of my information was about that issue either.
But I don't for a second think that Locarno was irredeemable - hell, the end of "The First Duty" has him taking the blame for the rest of the squadron, the only reason Wesley Crusher and Sito Jaxa get to remain in the academy at all. Of course, this was after he was trying to lead the cover-up all episode right up to the point that Wesley made it clear that he was going to tell the truth, but the fact that he took the responsibility in the end, I believe, definitely points towards a redemptive arc that we never got to see.
posted by Navelgazer at 1:27 PM on October 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Count me aboard the idea of Locarno being on Voyager as a better decision. But, I will admit, "Tom Paris" to me, at least, is a better sounding name than "Nick Locarno." Because that clearly was the real guiding light in the matter.
True, and for the most part I like it a lot, but it still falls back on the "sometimes you have to do terrible things, what can you do" trope that's so prevalent in late- and post-TNG Trek. The Strange New Worlds episode referenced is interesting because everyone Has A Sad when they blow up the ship because they think their friends are aboard, but once they're found safe everything is hunky-dory. Contrast that with Balance of Terror, which is a war story soaked in melancholy from start to finish.
The number of times Kirk's Enterprise wraps up an episode with "back to business!" is pretty high, though. Usually with some kind of quip and a nod to heading onward to X mission or what not. It's been a number of years since my last TOS re-watch though, so I apologize for not pulling out some immediate references. That said, I appreciate the sentiment you're getting across, because there is something definitely lighter about TOS.
posted by Atreides at 1:52 PM on October 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
True, and for the most part I like it a lot, but it still falls back on the "sometimes you have to do terrible things, what can you do" trope that's so prevalent in late- and post-TNG Trek. The Strange New Worlds episode referenced is interesting because everyone Has A Sad when they blow up the ship because they think their friends are aboard, but once they're found safe everything is hunky-dory. Contrast that with Balance of Terror, which is a war story soaked in melancholy from start to finish.
The number of times Kirk's Enterprise wraps up an episode with "back to business!" is pretty high, though. Usually with some kind of quip and a nod to heading onward to X mission or what not. It's been a number of years since my last TOS re-watch though, so I apologize for not pulling out some immediate references. That said, I appreciate the sentiment you're getting across, because there is something definitely lighter about TOS.
posted by Atreides at 1:52 PM on October 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Much in the way that previous seasons have taken a few good-natured swings at other Trek entries (the first holodeck episode referencing EVERY STAR TREK MOVIE was great), I feel like this one was taking shots at the "distinguished competition" of Star Wars. The planet they visit is a wretched hive of scum and villainy and bounty hunters, the ship and buildings have that dingy Star Wars aesthetic, even the border guard are dressed like Imperial goons (plus, "Do you know how sweaty and uncomfortable a full-face helmet gets?")
That's all fun and dandy, but I think that this episode is actually digging a little deeper into Star Wars - I'm betting that Locarno is putting together a "Rebel Alliance" to take on the overbearing Emp, I mean, uh, Federation, with himself squarely in the Han Solo role (a promising young pilot who washed out of the academy and had to take any job he could to survive? Hmmm...). But this isn't Wars, it's Trek, and not only is the Federation a great deal more benevolent (note that he hasn't turned any Federation crews), but things are allowed a bit more nuance.
posted by Rudy_Wiser at 1:56 PM on October 31, 2023 [6 favorites]
That's all fun and dandy, but I think that this episode is actually digging a little deeper into Star Wars - I'm betting that Locarno is putting together a "Rebel Alliance" to take on the overbearing Emp, I mean, uh, Federation, with himself squarely in the Han Solo role (a promising young pilot who washed out of the academy and had to take any job he could to survive? Hmmm...). But this isn't Wars, it's Trek, and not only is the Federation a great deal more benevolent (note that he hasn't turned any Federation crews), but things are allowed a bit more nuance.
posted by Rudy_Wiser at 1:56 PM on October 31, 2023 [6 favorites]
Totally agree on the Star Wars riff of this episode! We were saying the same thing while we watched it.
posted by fimbulvetr at 2:52 PM on October 31, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by fimbulvetr at 2:52 PM on October 31, 2023 [2 favorites]
Yeah I was pretty sure I saw Ewan MacGregor as a young Obi-Wan in the bar in the background
posted by DoctorFedora at 11:55 PM on October 31, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by DoctorFedora at 11:55 PM on October 31, 2023 [2 favorites]
(Hey, I think I'm wrong here!
(Went down a bit of a rabbit hole--how did Munch work on SVU? what's the deal with wanting Ro Laren on DS9?--and found that there are character sequel rights separate from the main separated rights. Upshot is that if you create a character in a non-pilot episode that becomes a main character in a spin-off, you're entitled to the full residuals as if they created a sequel series fom a show you had created. A character that becomes recurring generates a payment for every episode they are in, but it's about a fifth of the sequel payment. Given the various unions' general insistence on credits, it's weird that there isn't a credit for reusing characters.
(This won't officially settle the matter one way or the other--I'm sure there are some NDAs involved--but it does lean a little more towards lawyers reading the show bible and having a realization.)
posted by thecaddy at 5:57 AM on November 1, 2023 [4 favorites]
(Went down a bit of a rabbit hole--how did Munch work on SVU? what's the deal with wanting Ro Laren on DS9?--and found that there are character sequel rights separate from the main separated rights. Upshot is that if you create a character in a non-pilot episode that becomes a main character in a spin-off, you're entitled to the full residuals as if they created a sequel series fom a show you had created. A character that becomes recurring generates a payment for every episode they are in, but it's about a fifth of the sequel payment. Given the various unions' general insistence on credits, it's weird that there isn't a credit for reusing characters.
(This won't officially settle the matter one way or the other--I'm sure there are some NDAs involved--but it does lean a little more towards lawyers reading the show bible and having a realization.)
posted by thecaddy at 5:57 AM on November 1, 2023 [4 favorites]
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posted by hanov3r at 10:09 AM on October 26, 2023 [11 favorites]