Star Trek: Lower Decks: Trusted Sources

October 20, 2022 2:16 PM - Season 3, Episode 9

Big new initiative for the California class, a reporter shows up to embed on their away mission, and Mariner tracks what seems to be about twenty gallons of blueberry pie filling throughout the ship.

Memory Alpha is ditching the pomp:

- A couple of commenters in this thread mentioned that Buenamigo might be a bona fide Badmiral, and this ep sure adds fuel to that theory; using a real attack on the 'ritos (with what seems like at least a few casualties) just to test out a new drone ship is, well, maybe not quite as bad as being up to your gills in bodysnatching parasites, but it ain't good.

- The ep references/is a sequel to TNG's "Symbiosis" [FF thread], and I'm with Freeman and Ransom in that it's pretty flabbergasting that no one has followed up with JunkieWorld and PusherWorld until now.

- Between his Zapp-Branniganesque come-ons to the reporter and bragging about how swole he is, Ransom is definitely a redditor. I mean, I'm a redditor, but not that kind. Hopefully.

- This really felt like more of a season-ending cliffhanger, although we should still have one more ep this season.

- I guess that I sort of incorporated the Poster's Log in the comments above, but what the heck, a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds and whatnot.

"Hell yeah, let's mummy it up!"

- Number One on the good ship Loot and Scoot [not an official designation, but it's what I'm calling it until we know better]

posted by Halloween Jack (23 comments total)

Yeah, this indeed felt like a season finale, though as one of the posters whose been leery of Admiral Buenamigo, I think next week's ep will show just how much effort he put into setting up the big reveal of the Texas Class ships.

Other thoughts:

-Don't know if this is on the reporter, or on the Captain for how she was framing the narrative for "Project Swing By," but they really should have been ready to play the situation on Ornara as the best-case scenario (since it realistically was.)

-I'm one of those folks who can't watch "Symbiosis" without screaming about how Picard leaves things, so I'm very happy for the update.

-What the shit, Jennifer?
posted by Navelgazer at 3:13 PM on October 20, 2022 [3 favorites]

Mariner totally got done dirty, and yeah, boo Jennifer.
posted by Marticus at 3:44 PM on October 20, 2022 [8 favorites]

You couldn't threaten Starbase 80 all season without actually doing Starbase 80. I enjoyed the episode, but I felt bad that the frightened civilian who got disintegrated really got disintegrated, it wasn't some kind of fake-out.
posted by the antecedent of that pronoun at 5:30 PM on October 20, 2022

I like to think the Blueberry Pie Eating Contest was an homage to Breaking Bad's Badger's Star Trek Script (which he just needs to write down).
posted by mikelieman at 6:30 PM on October 20, 2022 [5 favorites]

"Why would anyone suspect bad things of the woman sliced her ship mate with a Bat'Leth; disobeyed orders to give out high tech equipment to farmers; got wasted with the klingon she was escorting to diplomatic talks; sabotages herself whenever there's a hint of career advancement; made that psychotic holodeck program where she murders nearly the entire crew; sabotaged her crewmate's assignment due to her own abandonment issues; was involved in a high-speed chase with security on Starbase 25; stole an amusement park ride in order to steal a starship; and is pretty consistently unfiltered and abrasive about how much she dislikes rank and authority would tell negative stories to a journalist when she was angry with her mom for sidelining her and disobeyed orders to go give an interview."

Mariner didn't get done dirty. Mariner got done Mariner. Don't get me wrong, I like the character, I like how she's developed, and I really like the interactions and contrasts with the other Lower Deckers in their own ways, but this is really a "Girl who cried fuck the wolf's regulations" situation. It'll be interesting to see where they go with it. Mariner realizing that nobody on that ship entirely differentiated her from the front she put up could be a big character moment for her. I've kind of thought we've seen Mariner and Boimler are kind of cancelling each other's negative traits through osmosis, and this might precipitate another big step for them both.

I definitely get that this feels like a season ending cliffhanger. It kind of feels like the inverse to Boimler joining the Titan at the end of Season 1. Where she'll be off for an episode or two until circumstances bring her back.

The ending of Symbyosis makes sense to me at least; because the alternative is basically "Take control of both planets, completely restructure both economies, probably become the space DEA, definitely have to put down a rebellion or two on Brekka.".
posted by Grimgrin at 6:41 PM on October 20, 2022

I had a feeling that the Mariner interview twist was going to happen the way it did, though I'd somehow forgotten about Archaeologist Friend from a few weeks ago!
posted by DoctorFedora at 6:42 PM on October 20, 2022

Grimgrin: the observations you made at the start of your comment are extremely similar to what I was shouting at the screen during this episode. Thank you.

I think Mariner does not actually belong in Starfleet and I would love for her to actually stay a civilian! Maybe she could talk with Kasidy Yates sometime about what her life is like and see whether it might suit her!
posted by brainwane at 8:26 PM on October 20, 2022 [1 favorite]

Petra's ship is, apparently, the Free Spirit.
posted by hanov3r at 9:56 PM on October 20, 2022 [3 favorites]

That mural about the Enterprise-D flying off before they all start to go through some shit was amazing. Getting real Hank Scorpio vibes from the Ornarans, probably from the dashing off for a fun run in the middle of a conversation.
posted by fifteen schnitzengruben is my limit at 10:13 PM on October 20, 2022 [4 favorites]

I'm about 95% certain I've seen the Texas-class design somewhere. Having GMed some Trek RPGs of various eras, I'd bet I saw it as a fan design for a noncanon ship, which may also mean it was a rejected early design of a canon ship (Defiant-class maybe) because a lot of the Trek ship design fan community draws from those.

+1 on the mural—shades of Parks and Rec.

I felt bad that the frightened civilian who got disintegrated really got disintegrated, it wasn't some kind of fake-out.

As established in DS9, the Breen are cold like that. And in other ways. Which brings up:

using a real attack on the 'ritos (with what seems like at least a few casualties) just to test out a new drone ship is, well, maybe not quite as bad as being up to your gills in bodysnatching parasites, but it ain't good.

It would look somewhat less not-good if he had chosen a lower-tier threat species (like Talarians) to use the Ritos as a lure for. That seems like an actual military-intelligence tactic, albeit one with a 31ish whiff in this context. But the friggin' BREEN? Jeez guy, why not poke a stick in the eye of the Kelvan Empire?!

I think Mariner does not actually belong in Starfleet and I would love for her to actually stay a civilian!

I am quite pleased with the character turn here, and I think the animated-comedy format allows this show to play even more freely in the universe than it heretofore has—stuff like separating the main cast for extended periods, and/or doing even entire side arcs that are non-Starfleet (not necessarily to the DS9 extent of serialization, but OTOH, why not?).

I'm on the fence, though, on the notion that Mariner doesn't belong in Starfleet. Non-Comedy Starfleet, sure, but LD Starfleet is different—Ransom, Shaxs, and Beckett arguably don't belong in live-action Starfleet either.

But some sort of Starfleet "Supplemental Training Initiative," or similarly polite phrasing, for the low-achievers and misfits who nevertheless have that core spirit of benevolence and teamwork? Yes, Mariner absolutely belongs there. She could singehandedly justify its creation. Maybe even participate in its creation…

I definitely get that this feels like a season ending cliffhanger. It kind of feels like the inverse to Boimler joining the Titan at the end of Season 1. Where she'll be off for an episode or two until circumstances bring her back.

My optimistic interpretation is that the fact that we still have one more episode means that the actual season finale will be about conveying "yes, we are making (some sort of) significant long-term change, and not just hitting the reset button right away next season." Really could go either way.
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 4:07 AM on October 21, 2022 [2 favorites]

What if the reason the Ornarans tried to shoo Starfleet away is that they had vengefully sold out Brekka to the Breen and didn't want anyone to find out?

But some sort of Starfleet "Supplemental Training Initiative," or similarly polite phrasing, for the low-achievers and misfits who nevertheless have that core spirit of benevolence and teamwork?

That's something that could absolutely be a cool Federation government-sponsored thing! But, based on the events we see in Lower Decks, Beckett Mariner does not belong in a military-type hierarchy. Mariner might thrive in a role such as forest ranger or wilderness survival instructor. Or, beyond government employment, I think Mariner would be great as a political activist, stirring up multi-species outrage on issues she cares about.

Does she actually have a spirit of teamwork? She likes socializing with her buddies, but does she actually like or have skills in collaborating with other people, negotiating respectfully when what she wants isn't something her peer-level teammates want to do, keeping teammates apprised before she goes off on her own, supporting them in coming up with creative solutions to problems, etc.?

But we are only seeing Mariner on the Cerritos. Have we ever seen Mariner work under leaders whose leadership she respects, or with teammates she wants to learn from? She doesn't want to leave the Cerritos -- as far as I can tell, solely because it's where her buddies are. But I suspect that, if there is a way Mariner can thrive in Starfleet, it's gotta be away from a ship her mother commands.
posted by brainwane at 4:59 AM on October 21, 2022 [2 favorites]

(I recognize upon rereading that I have not made the distinction you have, of comedy versus serious Trek. Maybe I should try to make that distinction and it will get me to yell at the screen less!)
posted by brainwane at 5:02 AM on October 21, 2022

As established in DS9, the Breen are cold like that.

DAMAR: I had no idea the Breen could mobilise such a large fleet so quickly.
WEYOUN: Our new allies are full of surprises, aren't they? You know those refrigeration suits they wear?
DAMAR: What about them?
WEYOUN: I'm sure you've read the intelligence reports that say that their homeworld is a frozen wasteland. Well, it's not. The climate on their planet is quite comfortable.
DAMAR: Then why do they wear refrigeration suits?
WEYOUN: They won't say. You see what I mean? They're full of surprises.

posted by Servo5678 at 5:41 AM on October 21, 2022 [6 favorites]

It would be a shame if those drone ships fell under the control of something like, say, a megalomaniacal sentient computer.
posted by 1970s Antihero at 6:29 AM on October 21, 2022 [18 favorites]

The Breen are one of the things that annoy me about DS9. They're introduced as a mysterious race, sort of like a poor man's Vorlons, and win a couple of battles. Then the Founder Lady says, "Oh, that's why the Breen wear those suits" at the beginning of a scene, and they are barely referenced again. What's the point in having a mystery if you're just going to solve it off screen?
Anyway, I could totally see Captain Freeman unloading on Mariner. The entire episode she pushed the Captain's buttons, and then going behind the Captain's back was just the cherry on top.
As for the drone ship, it would be cool if after whatever shenanigans happen to it, it decides that it doesn't want to be a warship, and instead wants to go study rocks somewhere, or something.
posted by Spike Glee at 6:32 AM on October 21, 2022 [1 favorite]

But I suspect that, if there is a way Mariner can thrive in Starfleet, it's gotta be away from a ship her mother commands.

Yeah, I had that thought too. One wonders if all this will end with her mom getting demoted or even drummed out.

Does she actually have a spirit of teamwork?

I feel like yes, based on my recent rewatch of the previous seasons, but if she does, it's definitely buried under some cumbersome personal stuff. She's like Barclay in that way (and, uh, only in that way).

(I recognize upon rereading that I have not made the distinction you have, of comedy versus serious Trek. Maybe I should try to make that distinction and it will get me to yell at the screen less!)

Heh, I mean, this show doesn't make it easy. It's an interesting tension. Trek tended quite serious pre-LD; now along comes this show to…not break the rules, to be sure, but bend them and tweak them and most of all point and laugh at them. And yet, as it should, this show has heart, treats its central characters as real people, and retains most of the key  Roddenberry  I'll just say "Trek" values. So you have those serious elements, in this very established setting that probably most LD viewers TAKE seriously, but at the same time there's a constant… undercurrent? subtext?… of "this isn't the SAME Trek," because of the often-outlandish style of comedy and (IMO to a lesser extent) because of the animation. Not to the extent that we feel it's, like, a different timeline or anything, but can we really think of it as the same? Could we truly expect a Migleemo cameo in Picard Season 3, for example?

That tension is why I sort of feared, before we knew what LD would be like, that the suits would mandate a "safer," more workplace-sitcom-ish style of comedy. I'm glad it's not that! And I'm glad that tension exists in that it keeps things unpredictable and engaging. (Though I'm also kind of glad I'm not currently running a Trek RPG campaign and having to wrestle with that tension.)

Maybe this exact tension is what the upcoming LD/SNW crossover will play with and/or elucidate.
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 6:34 AM on October 21, 2022 [2 favorites]

I always giggle when I hear Star Trek using the word "Breen", since over in Babylon 5 land, that's the Narn equivalent of Swedish meatballs, which is also Centauri Prime's Roopo balls. Apparently, in the weirdest case of parallel evolution, EVERY spacefaring civilization has created the dish.

So, is there parallel evolution in sci-fi? Does EVERY sci-fi franchise also have a Breen of some kind, even stranger Breens than meatballs or species name?
posted by mikelieman at 7:07 AM on October 21, 2022 [4 favorites]

Does EVERY sci-fi franchise also have a Breen of some kind, even stranger Breens than meatballs or species name?

Well, Patrick Breen was an actor on Galaxy Quest and Men in Black...

[recalls that someone down the hall is discarding a cork board, thinks of places to get red string]

be right back
posted by Halloween Jack at 10:52 AM on October 21, 2022 [3 favorites]

I had a link last season that T'Lyn would return this season, well, hm, let the speculation for the next episode continue!
posted by channaher at 6:57 PM on October 21, 2022 [4 favorites]

> "Mariner didn't get done dirty. Mariner got done Mariner."

I mean, to some extent, sure. But it probably didn't help that she's serving under a captain so petty, vindictive, and unprofessional that instead of giving her ensign a private dressing down before transferring her, she let the entire crew know in a way that turned them all against her, up to and including literally causing the breakup of her relationship.

Great captaining there, captain.
posted by kyrademon at 12:49 PM on October 22, 2022 [3 favorites]

So, is there parallel evolution in sci-fi?

Dunno, but I have never looked at a Breen helmet and not seen Boushh.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:46 AM on October 24, 2022

Apparently, in the weirdest case of parallel evolution, EVERY spacefaring civilization has created the dish.

"It is a curious fact, and one to which no-one knows quite how much importance to attach, that something like 85 percent of all known worlds in the Galaxy, be they primitive or highly advanced, have invented a drink called jynnan tonyx, or gee-N'N-T'N-ix, or jinond-o-nicks, or any one of a thousand variations on this phonetic theme.

The drinks themselves are not the same, and vary between the Sivolvian 'chinanto/mnigs' which is ordinary water served just above room temperature, and the Gagrakackan 'tzjin-anthony-ks' which kills cows at a hundred paces; and in fact the only one common factor between all of them, beyond the fact that their names sound the same, is that they were all invented and named before the worlds concerned made contact with any other worlds."

Douglas Adams, The Restaurant at the End of the Universe
posted by FatherDagon at 7:58 AM on October 27, 2022 [4 favorites]

My feeling is that while it's nice that Mariner said nice things to the reporter, it was still insubordination. Like, okay, she breaks the rules all the time in ways that are helpful, and sometimes that saves lives. That's good! But when the stakes are so much lower, she doesn't actually have the justification to go against orders like this.

The problem with Mariner isn't that she breaks the rules when she thinks she knows better, it's that she doesn't really think the rules apply to her in the first place. If she did, she could weigh the transgression against the potential good that could be done. But I don't think we see that happen.

It's entirely normal for a hierarchical organization of any kind to exercise control over who speaks to the media on behalf of that organization. The response was disproportionate but Mariner was still out of line, even with a full accounting of the facts.
posted by vibratory manner of working at 5:31 PM on September 15, 2023